Fantasy Gajeel Redfox vs. Gray Fullbuster

[Axiomus]

If anything, Rufus is the weakest of Sabertooth's bunch. The only source that says Rufus was strong was the GMG stats. Those stats are known to be unreliable because it placed both Natsu as weaker than Sting and Rogue individually. Rufus' performance was pretty abysmal in the actual manga. Orga was mentioned in the guild card to be Sabertooth's strongest in terms of magical power. We also see him fighting with Laxus for a little bit, though he got oneshotted by an opponent Laxus went on to beat. Minerva was mentioned by Rufus to be Sabertooth's strongest during the GMG, and her feats seem to reflect this. She had the largest AoE with Yagdo Rigora. Sting had Minerva's approval for being the next guild master, and Rogue when faced with the prospect of beating Fairy Tail stated only Minerva and Sting stood a chance. Sting also had the best hand to hand combat feats, being able to temporarily overwhelm both Natsu and Gajeel. Rogue is hyped to be on Sting's level. Plus, come Tartarus Arc was when Sting and Rogue really shined. They managed to fend off Mard Geer. Then they later went on to kill Jiemma, who was stronger than any of the 9 demon gates.

DS, GS, and DeS slayer magics have the same basic techniques with roars, punches, etc. DS magic does not have better CQC and AoE than the other slayer magic types. Increased senses aren't particularly useful in combat, and is counteracted by motion sickness weakness. Gajeel hasn't shown dragon force and demonization is possibly the DeS equivalent of dragon force.

I have to disagree with this. Dragon Slayers gain the physical attributes of a dragon, which is naturally superior to the physical attributes of demons and gods. It doesn't help Dragon Slayers have consistently shown to occupy the top of the series. Acnologia is a dragon slayer, and he's pretty much the strongest character in the series. The #1 mage in Ishgar, God Serena, is a dragon slayer. The current strongest on the good guy's side is probably Laxus, another dragon slayer. The next strongest after Laxus is Natsu, yet another dragon slayer. What all of these characters have in common is a reliance on close quarters combat and massive destructive attacks. Now I don't agree that all dragon slayers are stronger than all slayers of other types. For example, Wendy is probably not beating up Orga. You can even make the case that Gajeel wouldn't beat Gray in this case. However, you can't deny the manga itself gives special emphasis to dragon slayer magic.

 

[Brandish μ]

Sigh, suit yourself.

If GMG ISD Gajeel was temporary like LFD then SRogue's PL literally doesn't matter in determining Gajeel's PL.

Such as...

DS, GS, and DeS slayer magics have the same basic techniques with roars, punches, etc. DS magic does not have better CQC and AoE than the other slayer magic types. Increased senses aren't particularly useful in combat, and is counteracted by motion sickness weakness. Gajeel hasn't shown dragon force and demonization is possibly the DeS equivalent of dragon force.

- Idk what you mean by doesn't matter, we know Gajeel is around Natsu level. And we know that SRogue handled him with ease.

- Any fight is what I meant. Mainly the ones where he goes all out.

- Please refer to Axiomus post where reasons for why DS would be better (and also for the ST feats stuff). Demonizing would be the DeS equivalent in terms of 'becoming a demon' like DF is 'becoming a dragon', but coz Dragons are stronger DF should be a better mode. Senses can be useful, like against Jellal Natsu closed his eyes and used touch/smell/hearing to try and tag Jellal while he was in Meteor and actually got close to hitting him by doing this. Motion sickness is a weakness but in the manga it's usually a gag level weakness.

 

[iDooom]

If anything, Rufus is the weakest of Sabertooth's bunch. The only source that says Rufus was strong was the GMG stats. Those stats are known to be unreliable because it placed both Natsu as weaker than Sting and Rogue individually. Rufus' performance was pretty abysmal in the actual manga. Orga was mentioned in the guild card to be Sabertooth's strongest in terms of magical power. We also see him fighting with Laxus for a little bit, though he got oneshotted by an opponent Laxus went on to beat. Minerva was mentioned by Rufus to be Sabertooth's strongest during the GMG, and her feats seem to reflect this. She had the largest AoE with Yagdo Rigora. Sting had Minerva's approval for being the next guild master, and Rogue when faced with the prospect of beating Fairy Tail stated only Minerva and Sting stood a chance. Sting also had the best hand to hand combat feats, being able to temporarily overwhelm both Natsu and Gajeel. Rogue is hyped to be on Sting's level. Plus, come Tartarus Arc was when Sting and Rogue really shined. They managed to fend off Mard Geer. Then they later went on to kill Jiemma, who was stronger than any of the 9 demon gates.

If you really think that Sting is stronger than Rufus and Orga, fine. Sting overwhelming Natsu and Gajeel doesn't mean anything as they weren't trying. Mard Geer wasn't trying either and he beat up Natsu, Sting, and Rogue. Jiemma was not stronger than the strongest demon gate (Kyoka), he was stronger than the average demon gate. When someone says <individual> is stronger than <group>, it doesn't mean that the <individual> is stronger than everyone in the <group>. For example, Jose said Gajeel was stronger than the Element 4 when quite clearly Aria > Gajeel. Jiemma showed no feats that put him above all the 9DG.

I have to disagree with this. Dragon Slayers gain the physical attributes of a dragon, which is naturally superior to the physical attributes of demons and gods. It doesn't help Dragon Slayers have consistently shown to occupy the top of the series. Acnologia is a dragon slayer, and he's pretty much the strongest character in the series. The #1 mage in Ishgar, God Serena, is a dragon slayer. The current strongest on the good guy's side is probably Laxus, another dragon slayer. The next strongest after Laxus is Natsu, yet another dragon slayer. What all of these characters have in common is a reliance on close quarters combat and massive destructive attacks. Now I don't agree that all dragon slayers are stronger than all slayers of other types. For example, Wendy is probably not beating up Orga. You can even make the case that Gajeel wouldn't beat Gray in this case. However, you can't deny the manga itself gives special emphasis to dragon slayer magic.

Whether or not the series focuses on DS doesn't say anything about the power of a specific DS. God Serena became a DS most likely because he wanted to kill Acno, not because DS is inherently superior (especially 2nd gen DS). If dragon slayers aren't automatically stronger than other slayers, then the type of slayer magic is irrelevant because the effect of DS magic is already counted in the character's feats and PL.

- Idk what you mean by doesn't matter, we know Gajeel is around Natsu level. And we know that SRogue handled him with ease.

- Any fight is what I meant. Mainly the ones where he goes all out.

- Please refer to Axiomus post where reasons for why DS would be better (and also for the ST feats stuff). Demonizing would be the DeS equivalent in terms of 'becoming a demon' like DF is 'becoming a dragon', but coz Dragons are stronger DF should be a better mode. Senses can be useful, like against Jellal Natsu closed his eyes and used touch/smell/hearing to try and tag Jellal while he was in Meteor and actually got close to hitting him by doing this. Motion sickness is a weakness but in the manga it's usually a gag level weakness.

You said "GMG ISD Gajeel is a short lasting power" like Tenrou LFD Natsu. This means that GMG ISD Gajeel's feats are irrelevant when considering Tartaros ISD Gajeel (who would be considerably weaker) and on. Gajeel doesn't get to eat SRogue's shadows in this fight and get an MP boost. Not to mention, you still have yet to prove that SRogue is even close to Laxus level.

Name a specific fight for Natsu and Gray (in the same arc) where Natsu is obviously superior.

It didn't actually work because his reactions and speed weren't increased. DS senses have been about as useful in combat as motion sickness has been a weakness.

 

[Brandish μ]

You said "GMG ISD Gajeel is a short lasting power" like Tenrou LFD Natsu. This means that GMG ISD Gajeel's feats are irrelevant when considering Tartaros ISD Gajeel (who would be considerably weaker) and on. Gajeel doesn't get to eat SRogue's shadows in this fight and get an MP boost. Not to mention, you still have yet to prove that SRogue is even close to Laxus level.

Name a specific fight for Natsu and Gray (in the same arc) where Natsu is obviously superior.

It didn't actually work because his reactions and speed weren't increased. DS senses are not useful in combat.

You can have the last say on here

- You asked me that if I thought SRogue was around Laxus level than GMG ISD Gajeel could beat Laxus and I gave a response. I did not at any point say that this is Tartarus ISD Gajeel so good try, but I actually added in 'GMG' in front of the ISD to make this known because I thought you were trying to bait me when you wrote 'ISD Gajeel > Laxus, yes?'. Just for clarification Tartarus ISD Gajeel is around the same as Tartarus LFD Natsu.

- Fantasia arc if you want one with lopsided Natsu > Gray feats, or this arc. But every arc Natsu is superior is my point, Tartarus is about as close as they get.

- It's true Natsu's speed/reactions aren't increased, but it's mainly that Meteor is ridiculously fast. DS smell can be used well, e.g say against Ajeel's sandworld. That's gotta be useful right? To be able to track an enemy in a Spriggan's best spell...

 

[iDooom]

You can have the last say on here

- You asked me that if I thought SRogue was around Laxus level than GMG ISD Gajeel could beat Laxus and I gave a response. I did not at any point say that this is Tartarus ISD Gajeel so good try, but I actually added in 'GMG' in front of the ISD to make this known because I thought you were trying to bait me when you wrote 'ISD Gajeel > Laxus, yes?'. Just for clarification Tartarus ISD Gajeel is around the same as Tartarus LFD Natsu.

- Fantasia arc if you want one with lopsided Natsu > Gray feats, or this arc. But every arc Natsu is superior is my point, Tartarus is about as close as they get.

- It's true Natsu's speed/reactions aren't increased, but it's mainly that Meteor is ridiculously fast. DS smell can be used well, e.g say against Ajeel's sandworld. That's gotta be useful right? To be able to track an enemy in a Spriggan's best spell...

If GMG Gajeel's power is temporary, then why bring up SRogue in the first place? His power is irrelevant.

In Fantasia arc, Natsu and Gajeel got destroyed by Laxus and only got a draw because Laxus was fighting sloppily and wasted a ton of MP on stuff like Fairy Law. Whereas Bickslow used a cheap trick to beat Gray. What exactly is this supposed to show?

Natsu never fought Ajeel in Sand World so we don't know if it would have done anything. And motion sickness allowed Ajeel to trash Natsu, lol.

 

[Axiomus]

If you really think that Sting is stronger than Rufus and Orga, fine. Sting overwhelming Natsu and Gajeel doesn't mean anything as they weren't trying. Mard Geer wasn't trying either and he beat up Natsu, Sting, and Rogue. Jiemma was not stronger than the strongest demon gate (Kyoka), he was stronger than the average demon gate. When someone says <individual> is stronger than <group>, it doesn't mean that the <individual> is stronger than everyone in the <group>. For example, Jose said Gajeel was stronger than the Element 4 when quite clearly Aria > Gajeel. Jiemma showed no feats that put him above all the 9DG..

Mard Geer said Jiemma wields power that far outstrips any of the 9 Demon Gates.

Spoiler

Jose said that Gajeel was the strongest man in my entire guild

Spoiler

Whether or not the series focuses on DS doesn't say anything about the power of a specific DS. God Serena became a DS most likely because he wanted to kill Acno, not because DS is inherently superior (especially 2nd gen DS). If dragon slayers aren't automatically stronger than other slayers, then the type of slayer magic is irrelevant because the effect of DS magic is already counted in the character's feats and PL.

....And in Serena's attempt to kill Acnologia, he just happened to become the best mage in Ishgar. When the Ishgar Saints turned the situation around, Dragon Slayer magic was Serena's trump card. Where does Acnologia's power come from? Dragon Slaying Magic. When Zeref wanted Natsu to become strong enough to kill him, what did he have Natsu learn? Dragon Slayer magic. 400 years ago, human were fodders for dragon until they got...you guessed it, dragon slayer magic.

I'm not saying that Dragon Slayers are better than God or Devil Slayers of the same level. A stronger Devil/God Slayer should rightfully beat a weaker Dragon Slayer. If they are off the same level, they should stalemate. What I'm saying is that Dragon Slayers have the potential to reach a higher level altogether. At it's highest level, dragon slayers wield the power of the dragons. This is the same way a devil slayers wield the power of a demon and god slayers wield the power of gods. It just happens to be that Fairy Tail portrays dragons as the strongest of the bunch.

 

[Arjuna]

If Gajeel uses DF then gray will lose as he hasn't shown anything equivalent to Demon Force.

 

[Axel Stone]

If Gajeel uses DF then gray will lose as he hasn't shown anything equivalent to Demon Force.

You are seriously joking right? Gajeel hasnt shown DF yet. Youre using an assumption by making such a ridiculous claim. Gray isnt losing to some imaginary powerup.
Prove Gajeel has shown to use DF.

Its akin to me saying Gajeel will lose when Gray uses demon force.

Anyway Grays demon force is a clear counter to one who uses Gajeels imaginary DF in arguments

 

[Arjuna]

You are seriously joking right? Gajeel hasnt shown DF yet. Youre using an assumption by making such a ridiculous claim. Gray isnt losing to some imaginary powerup.
Prove Gajeel has shown to use DF.

Its akin to me saying Gajeel will lose when Gray uses demon force.

Anyway Grays demon force is a clear counter to one who uses Gajeels imaginary DF in arguments

I Said "if". Sure He hasn't shown DF but If We assume "if" He has DF(Which seems Very likely as Wendy can do it Too) Then gray Have No Chance Unless He Can Show Something equivalent To Demon Force.Even Then We have to See Which is more Powerful.

 

[Axel Stone]

I Said "if". Sure He hasn't shown DF but If We assume "if" He has DF(Which seems Very likely as Wendy can do it Too) Then gray Have No Chance Unless He Can Show Something equivalent To Demon Force.Even Then We have to See Which is more Powerful.

Yes, and considering this is a VS thread, you can't use speculative hype arguments. Since Gajeel has not shown anything equivalent of Demon Force,then Gajeel stands no chance., see how this goes both ways?

 

[SirSamuel016]

I don't see why Dragon Force and Demon Force are coming into this as they are purely speculation and Demon Force might not even exist. So those are out of the picture altogether. What you're left with is Gajeel with his Iron Dragon-Slayer Magic and Iron-Shadow Dragon Mode, and Gray with his Ice Make Magic and Ice Devil Slaying Magic. And given that, I'd still say Gajeel would win, even though there have been some good arguments here for why Gray could win.

Gray's DeS won't do as much to Gajeel as what it did to the Tartarus demons because Gajeel isn't a demon, so its damage output would be significantly decreased, and in the end damage output is what will win this fight. Gray could try and use ice clones to do a feint attack, but Gajeel's high sense of smell would be able to sniff out the real Gray as its highly unlikely the Ice would share the same scent a Gray, and thus Gajeel could tell where the real one is as he should realise from smell that something isn't right.

Given that Gajeel's Iron Shadow mode would enable him to not get hit by some attacks until Gray figures out its constitution (like what Gajeel did to Rogue in their fight in the GMG), that'd be enough time for Gajeel to gain the upper hand in the battle if he hadn't gained it already. So I'd still give this to Gajeel mid-high difficulty.

 

[Axel Stone]

I don't see why Dragon Force and Demon Force are coming into this as they are purely speculation and Demon Force might not even exist. So those are out of the picture altogether. What you're left with is Gajeel with his Iron Dragon-Slayer Magic and Iron-Shadow Dragon Mode, and Gray with his Ice Make Magic and Ice Devil Slaying Magic. And given that, I'd still say Gajeel would win, even though there have been some good arguments here for why Gray could win.

Gray's DeS won't do as much to Gajeel as what it did to the Tartarus demons because Gajeel isn't a demon, so its damage output would be significantly decreased, and in the end damage output is what will win this fight. Gray could try and use ice clones to do a feint attack, but Gajeel's high sense of smell would be able to sniff out the real Gray as its highly unlikely the Ice would share the same scent a Gray, and thus Gajeel could tell where the real one is as he should realise from smell that something isn't right.

Given that Gajeel's Iron Shadow mode would enable him to not get hit by some attacks until Gray figures out its constitution (like what Gajeel did to Rogue in their fight in the GMG), that'd be enough time for Gajeel to gain the upper hand in the battle if he hadn't gained it already. So I'd still give this to Gajeel mid-high difficulty.

Gajeel's high sense of smell has not proven to sniff out clones. So that argument doesn't exactly work.

Gray is most likely going to figure out the constitution as he better feats in that regard as opposed to someone like Gajeel.

Gajeel's ISD attacks aren't all that impressive as they were shown to be tanked by Etherious Torafusa, and that's the only feats his ISD attacks have been used against. Gray's durability is good enough to tank a strong slayer art, and his endurance is good enough to witshstand blows, piercing damages and a sword stabbed through the chest/organ area and keep fighting.

Either way saying it's mid-high diff is ridiculous based on protrayal and feats.
Most likely Gray is the victor and winner for plethora of reasons, and even more so if they fight in the manga.

 

[SirSamuel016]

Gajeel's high sense of smell has not proven to sniff out clones. So that argument doesn't exactly work.

Gray is most likely going to figure out the constitution as he better feats in that regard as opposed to someone like Gajeel.

Gajeel's ISD attacks aren't all that impressive as they were shown to be tanked by Etherious Torafusa, and that's the only feats his ISD attacks have been used against. Gray's durability is good enough to tank a strong slayer art, and his endurance is good enough to witshstand blows, piercing damages and a sword stabbed through the chest/organ area and keep fighting.

Either way saying it's mid-high diff is ridiculous based on protrayal and feats.
Most likely Gray is the victor and winner for plethora of reasons, and even more so if they fight in the manga.

I never said Gray wouldn't figure out the constitution of the shadows, but rather I implied that it would take an amount of time for Gray to figure the constitution of the shadows out and then attack accordingly. I'd rather not speculate on the time, but its fair to say it'd be a couple of minutes.

Until Etherious Torafusa beefed up his defense, Gajeel was having a fairly even fight against him. And it should be noted that Torafusa has the highest defence of the nine demon gates, so attacks not doing anything to him with beefed up defense isn't too surprising. There's also the question of whether Gajeel retained his Steel Dragon Mode, but I'm not counting that as it was likely only a temporary power-up. The point still stands however that Gajeel did manage to beat the demon gate with the highest defence, so thats pretty impressive.

As for the sense of smell thing regarding clones, Gajeel has proven his strong sense of smell in the Alvarez arc sniffing out enemies in the midst of Ajeel's sand world, so there is nothing stopping him sniffing out the real Gray there. Its not known if clones also share the same scent as the one they are modeled off or if they smell like Ice, but its likely they'd smell like ice rather than anything else as it hasn't been indicated that they'd smell any different.

 

[Arjuna]

Gajeel's high sense of smell has not proven to sniff out clones. So that argument doesn't exactly work.

Gray is most likely going to figure out the constitution as he better feats in that regard as opposed to someone like Gajeel.

Gajeel's ISD attacks aren't all that impressive as they were shown to be tanked by Etherious Torafusa, and that's the only feats his ISD attacks have been used against. Gray's durability is good enough to tank a strong slayer art, and his endurance is good enough to witshstand blows, piercing damages and a sword stabbed through the chest/organ area and keep fighting.

Either way saying it's mid-high diff is ridiculous based on protrayal and feats.
Most likely Gray is the victor and winner for plethora of reasons, and even more so if they fight in the manga.

I Believe Gajeel Can Smell Because The Clones will not have Scent like Real Gray.Moreover He has Superior Hearing Ability.

 

[XXEliteXXAceXX]

Until Etherious Torafusa beefed up his defense, Gajeel was having a fairly even fight against him. And it should be noted that Torafusa has the highest defence of the nine demon gates, so attacks not doing anything to him with beefed up defense isn't too surprising. There's also the question of whether Gajeel retained his Steel Dragon Mode, but I'm not counting that as it was likely only a temporary power-up. The point still stands however that Gajeel did manage to beat the demon gate with the highest defence, so thats pretty impressive.

As for the sense of smell thing regarding clones, Gajeel has proven his strong sense of smell in the Alvarez arc sniffing out enemies in the midst of Ajeel's sand world, so there is nothing stopping him sniffing out the real Gray there. Its not known if clones also share the same scent as the one they are modeled off or if they smell like Ice, but its likely they'd smell like ice rather than anything else as it hasn't been indicated that they'd smell any different.

The points regarding Torafusa having the best defense doesn't really give us hardcore proof that Gajeel is strong. Remember that Gray was able to defeat Mard Geer using DeS attacks. Am I saying Tartaros Gray > Mard Geer? No. In fact, Mard Geer takes it Medium-High Difficulty. What I'm trying to prove here is that Gray's damage output is extraordinarily high whether you claim it is slayer advantage or not. Because Mard Geer had really high defense compared to Torafusa, I would expect Gray to use about 5-10 DeS magic attacks to defeat him. But that was not the case. So although slayer magic boosted his attack, he still had equal damage output to Gajeel or greater. Gajeel did struggle against Torafusa for a while but he managed to get through. As for defense, Tempesta isn't too far off compared to Torafusa despite looks which are misleading. Gray one-shotted Tempesta with slayer advantage, but even without it, this would put him near the performance of how Natsu fared against him. Also, Gajeel does not have Steel Mode and I think that should be pretty clear.

Smelling out the clones would be an assumption. If we were to use that logic, then I can also say that Gray's DeS is just as effective on humans as we've seen with DS magic because we have no proof otherwise and it should be fairly similar to magics of its own type.

 

[SirSamuel016]

Smelling out the clones would be an assumption. If we were to use that logic, then I can also say that Gray's DeS is just as effective on humans as we've seen with DS magic because we have no proof otherwise and it should be fairly similar to magics of its own type.

It should be a given that Gajeel could tell the difference between a clone and Gray via smell. I mean, is the ice going to smell like ice or is it somehow going to take on the exact same scent of Gray? I believe as it is ice, it would smell like ice, and there is no real way for it to smell like Gray.

Now I never said DeS magic would do less than DS magic, I only said it would do less to a human opponent than it would like one of the Tartarus demons. Its like Dragon Slayer magic vs Other magic in the GMG when the mages were fighting Dragons, only DS magic was able to damage the Dragons, and its effectively the same thing with DeS magic vs Tartarus Demons except for the Tartarus Demons being weaker than Dragons and other magic was able to effect the demons, but not on the same scale that DeS could. As both Gajeel and Gray are human, their slayer magic should theoretically do the same damage to the other not accounting for magic power which determines the power of techniques used.

 

[Brandish μ]

What I'm trying to prove here is that Gray's damage output is extraordinarily high whether you claim it is slayer advantage or not.

Why are you trying to prove that his DC is so high? It's pretty high, like Gajeel/Natsu level.

Personally I think you're ignoring the efficacy in which DeS can drop demons. There are so many indicators that DeS is like kryptonite to demons. Claiming the slayer advantage is the only reasonable thing to do. We know for a fact that a DeS secret art can do more damage to Mard than a Dragon Force secret art. This means that DeS allows Gray to possess offensive capabilities ABOVE dragon force Natsu against demons.

Magically Gray is no stronger than Gajeel or Natsu. Magically he uses arguably a lesser magic than dragon slaying magic. Lets assume they are equals magically in MP and magic type. A secret art from Gray would likely do the SAME damage as a secret art from Gajeel or Natsu. So if Gray fought Gildarts instead of Natsu at the end of Tartarus it is likely that Gildarts tanks the secret art in the same way (I do acknowledge Gray's attack is a piercing one so idk it might cut Gildarts??).

Off-topic: I actually hope DeS is different from dragon slayer magic (even though it seems like slayer magics all have a similar action, that is they are designed to be more offensive to slay their counterparts). Maybe if there is a demon force there can be a difference. Like demons seemed to have a lot of hax going for them (Franmalth, Kyouka etc). Gray already used some absorption on Momento Mori, so something like that is what I would prefer to see, rather than Rage/Zeroth sword. IM-Silver is cool though.

 

[XXEliteXXAceXX]

Why are you trying to prove that his DC is so high? It's pretty high, like Gajeel/Natsu level.

Personally I think you're ignoring the efficacy in which DeS can drop demons. There are so many indicators that DeS is like kryptonite to demons. Claiming the slayer advantage is the only reasonable thing to do. We know for a fact that a DeS secret art can do more damage to Mard than a Dragon Force secret art. This means that DeS allows Gray to possess offensive capabilities ABOVE dragon force Natsu against demons.

Magically Gray is no stronger than Gajeel or Natsu. Magically he uses arguably a lesser magic than dragon slaying magic. Lets assume they are equals magically in MP and magic type. A secret art from Gray would likely do the SAME damage as a secret art from Gajeel or Natsu. So if Gray fought Gildarts instead of Natsu at the end of Tartarus it is likely that Gildarts tanks the secret art in the same way (I do acknowledge Gray's attack is a piercing one so idk it might cut Gildarts??).

Off-topic: I actually hope DeS is different from dragon slayer magic (even though it seems like slayer magics all have a similar action, that is they are designed to be more offensive to slay their counterparts). Maybe if there is a demon force there can be a difference. Like demons seemed to have a lot of hax going for them (Franmalth, Kyouka etc). Gray already used some absorption on Momento Mori, so something like that is what I would prefer to see, rather than Rage/Zeroth sword. IM-Silver is cool though.

The point of my post was to provide a fair argument for Gray vs. Gajeel. Besides Axel Stone, everyone seems to use Gajeel feats against Torafusa without acknowledging Gray's own feats. Saying Torafusa has the highest defense of all the demon gates is true but quite misleading too. Basically, you'd be saying that Torafusa has the highest defense but by just a little bit since there are plenty of other ones that are comparable to him like Tempesta. Yes, Gray has a slayer advantage but to one-shot a demon gate that is similar to Torafusa in defense yet kill another demon in a couple of hits who is around 2-3 times stronger than any of the other demon gates is quite noteworthy too. Once again, slayer advantage does not enable you to one-shot anybody unless you're talking about someone like Lamy. Other than her, to one-shot somebody of the Nine Demon Gates' caliber, it takes some serious power. I'm not saying Gray is stronger than Natsu or Gajeel. But, honestly, Gajeel has no feats to put him above Gray.

I still don't think there will be much of a difference between how DeS and DS works. I also don't see why anybody wouldn't want to see Gray's DeS attacks. Absorbing curses like Momento Mori is not that exciting and it is generally useless in battle. I would like to see cool attacks just like slayer secret arts.

 

[Axel Stone]

I Believe Gajeel Can Smell Because The Clones will not have Scent like Real Gray.Moreover He has Superior Hearing Ability.

This makes zero sense. Care to re-read what you typed? Hearing ability has irrelevant in this case. It's not like Gajeel has cobra type hearing.

I never said Gray wouldn't figure out the constitution of the shadows, but rather I implied that it would take an amount of time for Gray to figure the constitution of the shadows out and then attack accordingly. I'd rather not speculate on the time, but its fair to say it'd be a couple of minutes.

Until Etherious Torafusa beefed up his defense, Gajeel was having a fairly even fight against him. And it should be noted that Torafusa has the highest defence of the nine demon gates, so attacks not doing anything to him with beefed up defense isn't too surprising. There's also the question of whether Gajeel retained his Steel Dragon Mode, but I'm not counting that as it was likely only a temporary power-up. The point still stands however that Gajeel did manage to beat the demon gate with the highest defence, so thats pretty impressive.

As for the sense of smell thing regarding clones, Gajeel has proven his strong sense of smell in the Alvarez arc sniffing out enemies in the midst of Ajeel's sand world, so there is nothing stopping him sniffing out the real Gray there. Its not known if clones also share the same scent as the one they are modeled off or if they smell like Ice, but its likely they'd smell like ice rather than anything else as it hasn't been indicated that they'd smell any different.

This is the problem. At times, real life clones don't exactly have a sense of smell contrast to the original. Let's say the clone smells like Ice, and Gray covers the main portion of the land in ice where the terrain of the battle starts. How would Gajeel able to sense where the clones are moving when the whole portion is consisted and composed of ice? His smelling instincts are good, but he doesn't exactly have the feats to decipher the clones from the frozen portion. In this case, Gajeel would be majorly disadvantageous.

Sure, Gajeel's feats are impressive against Torafusa, but it still remains to be seen whether how effective his ISD attacks truly are. The only reason Gajeel's steel mode was useful against Torafusa agains wasn't because of a powerup, it was a bi-product of a weakness toward Torafusa's water/poison scales composed of excessive carbon. All we seen for is Gajeel's ISD attacks being tanked from a laughing Torafusa.

Also I don't put too much into titles like Torafusa has the strongest defense in Tartaros. Gemma was considered to be above the 9DG, and he got fodderized by a severally exhausted Base Sting and Rogue. Tempesta was noted to have the fastest speed, and he wasn't exactly shown to be a speedster.

The point of my post was to provide a fair argument for Gray vs. Gajeel. Besides @Axel Stone, everyone seems to use Gajeel feats against Torafusa without acknowledging Gray's own feats. Saying Torafusa has the highest defense of all the demon gates is true but quite misleading too. Basically, you'd be saying that Torafusa has the highest defense but by just a little bit since there are plenty of other ones that are comparable to him like Tempesta. Yes, Gray has a slayer advantage but to one-shot a demon gate that is similar to Torafusa in defense yet kill another demon in a couple of hits who is around 2-3 times stronger than any of the other demon gates is quite noteworthy too. Once again, slayer advantage does not enable you to one-shot anybody unless you're talking about someone like Lamy. Other than her, to one-shot somebody of the Nine Demon Gates' caliber, it takes some serious power. I'm not saying Gray is stronger than Natsu or Gajeel. But, honestly, Gajeel has no feats to put him above Gray.

I still don't think there will be much of a difference between how DeS and DS works. I also don't see why anybody wouldn't want to see Gray's DeS attacks. Absorbing curses like Momento Mori is not that exciting and it is generally useless in battle. I would like to see cool attacks just like slayer secret arts.

Thanks for the objectivity.

Attacks like IM Silver, Zero Destruction Bow, Demon's rage are pretty cool doe

 

[Brandish μ]

The point of my post was to provide a fair argument for Gray vs. Gajeel. Besides @Axel Stone, everyone seems to use Gajeel feats against Torafusa without acknowledging Gray's own feats. Saying Torafusa has the highest defense of all the demon gates is true but quite misleading too. Basically, you'd be saying that Torafusa has the highest defense but by just a little bit since there are plenty of other ones that are comparable to him like Tempesta.

Well it doesn't provide a fair point. You're using a slayer advantage to make your point that Gray > Gajeel. Torafusa may have better defence than Tempesta, it just means that Gajeel needed more offense to beat Torafusa than he would Tempesta. But it's clear that Gray is more effective in his victory.

I think if someone made the claim that Wendy was stronger than Jura at the GMG on the basis of her hurting a dragon (not damage just hurt) then you'd probably see the reasoning behind slayer advantage.

Yes, Gray has a slayer advantage but to one-shot a demon gate that is similar to Torafusa in defense yet kill another demon in a couple of hits who is around 2-3 times stronger than any of the other demon gates is quite noteworthy too. Once again, slayer advantage does not enable you to one-shot anybody unless you're talking about someone like Lamy. Other than her, to one-shot somebody of the Nine Demon Gates' caliber, it takes some serious power. I'm not saying Gray is stronger than Natsu or Gajeel. But, honestly, Gajeel has no feats to put him above Gray.

Rhe bold: why???? If Mashima makes slayer magic this effective then it IS that effective. Correct me if I am wrong to assume this of you, but I get the feeling that you view 'slayer advantage' as something that demotes Gray's power. I totally understand that it's annoying when people say it's featless against humans. To be fair it should be given roughly the same power as dragon slayer magic (just a little less). It would be bias to give it much more power than that wouldn't you agree?

I still don't think there will be much of a difference between how DeS and DS works. I also don't see why anybody wouldn't want to see Gray's DeS attacks. Absorbing curses like Momento Mori is not that exciting and it is generally useless in battle. I would like to see cool attacks just like slayer secret arts.

I do agree that DeS and DS will ultimately be very similar, it's easier that way. @bold and especially underline - you're kidding with that, right??????

If Gray can demonise I truly doubt he gets something like DF. Basically the notion is that DF makes slayers become more like a dragon; so if this applies to demons than Gray just becomes more like one. Given that demons aren't anywhere near the powerhouses dragons are, I'd say Gray gets some hax like absorption.