Discussion Haki Thread

[Brandish μ]

For all ongoing Haki discussion, please post here.

 

[thedude]

Who else think will be next Strawhats to have Haki in the crew? Not talking about only COC since there is thread for that, but any chances of them getting COO or COA or even Both for the rest of them as Idk if some of Strawhats can go on if they can't have Haki to help them with their future fights like Luffy, Sanji, Zoro, Jimbei, and Usopp in recent. Do you all think they be fine without Haki or want few/some of them to have it at least

Usopp is recent getting COO for himself and still training it and Idk if COA is require as his projectiles back quite a punch even without Haki added to it, but given who his father is being Yasopp and presuming his Haki is very far up to keep up as one of Shanks' top men and YCs, can see him being one of the few on the ship to have all 3 Haki Types with getting COA and might even having COC as well.

I think Franky and Brook can manage without Haki given their versatile and have abilities to harm or get past someone tricky or Haki-Enchanced with Franky's modified body and creations he can make while Brook with his DF can get past others especially his Ice capabilities, but maybe could have access to having COO, but won't be disappoint if they get COA instead or even both of them.

Robin given her abilities, think it's better she unlocks COA than COO given is very aware of her surroundings already and able to create her own eyes anywhere help being pseudo-COO to predict and see things from time to time, but to an extent of course to being comparable with COO. COA she might need to strength her attacks given her powers requires holding onto someone or hitting them their bodies with created limbs. She need ot boost her attack and defense on them if she want to be better in her fighting style to damage their bodies especially if they are tricky DF users abilities and prevent her taking damage from her limbs if they get hit.

Nami given her abilities, think COO would be ideal to her since navigation is something more prediction-wise and COO could help her on how to navigate around the seas and be prepare for unpredictable circumstances if something feels 'off'. Don't think she needs COA given how her Tempest-Weather style is very diverse in being tricky and can lead big damage onto her opponents especially elemental properties for it. Plus depending on what happens with Zeus and Big Mom situation or she get new upgrade later on parable or stronger than when she has Zeus, it can workout in space for COA to her needs quite well.

Chopper now and honestly I can see him having both of them, but more leaning on COA factor given that he needs to evolve his power more and plus COA with his new Transform can really push the power up for him and handling tricky and/or durable foes when come to facing them. Would be terrifying to see Monster Point + COA mixture as he could really level the place all around. Though COO can be good for him as being originally animal, COO can be good for his sensoring out others while smelling them out for scents, so he can be diverse around the style on having both. Feels it can work both on his character and abilities quite well.

What you all think about that?

I agree with all of those. Monster Point + CoA is a beast!

 

[kkck]

Who else think will be next Strawhats to have Haki in the crew? Not talking about only COC since there is thread for that, but any chances of them getting COO or COA or even Both for the rest of them as Idk if some of Strawhats can go on if they can't have Haki to help them with their future fights like Luffy, Sanji, Zoro, Jimbei, and Usopp in recent. Do you all think they be fine without Haki or want few/some of them to have it at least

Usopp is recent getting COO for himself and still training it and Idk if COA is require as his projectiles back quite a punch even without Haki added to it, but given who his father is being Yasopp and presuming his Haki is very far up to keep up as one of Shanks' top men and YCs, can see him being one of the few on the ship to have all 3 Haki Types with getting COA and might even having COC as well.

I think Franky and Brook can manage without Haki given their versatile and have abilities to harm or get past someone tricky or Haki-Enchanced with Franky's modified body and creations he can make while Brook with his DF can get past others especially his Ice capabilities, but maybe could have access to having COO, but won't be disappoint if they get COA instead or even both of them.

Robin given her abilities, think it's better she unlocks COA than COO given is very aware of her surroundings already and able to create her own eyes anywhere help being pseudo-COO to predict and see things from time to time, but to an extent of course to being comparable with COO. COA she might need to strength her attacks given her powers requires holding onto someone or hitting them their bodies with created limbs. She need ot boost her attack and defense on them if she want to be better in her fighting style to damage their bodies especially if they are tricky DF users abilities and prevent her taking damage from her limbs if they get hit.

Nami given her abilities, think COO would be ideal to her since navigation is something more prediction-wise and COO could help her on how to navigate around the seas and be prepare for unpredictable circumstances if something feels 'off'. Don't think she needs COA given how her Tempest-Weather style is very diverse in being tricky and can lead big damage onto her opponents especially elemental properties for it. Plus depending on what happens with Zeus and Big Mom situation or she get new upgrade later on parable or stronger than when she has Zeus, it can workout in space for COA to her needs quite well.

Chopper now and honestly I can see him having both of them, but more leaning on COA factor given that he needs to evolve his power more and plus COA with his new Transform can really push the power up for him and handling tricky and/or durable foes when come to facing them. Would be terrifying to see Monster Point + COA mixture as he could really level the place all around. Though COO can be good for him as being originally animal, COO can be good for his sensoring out others while smelling them out for scents, so he can be diverse around the style on having both. Feels it can work both on his character and abilities quite well.

What you all think about that?

Realistically speaking all strawhats would benefit from it and in general I don't think haki is a skipable ability. it's the literaly core of combat in the series. There are no alternatives to it. To me its more of a matter of when they awake it, not if.

The only strawhat that kinda might get sort of a pass on it is franky because his power relies on technology. But even then IMO this is a huge stretch. Franky is about the fifth strongest member in the crew... His homologue in yonko crews would be the likes of perospero or snack... Realistically speaking even for franky haki should eventually awaken on its own for him as he gets more experienced and becomes more powerful. Otherwise even with all his technology any jackass near his tier would lord observation haki against him...

For brook in turn, the situation is even worst. He needs it, period. The guy is a swordsman.... Without haki he can't harden his blade which is a crucial skill for any swordsman. Even his blade is at risk of chipping or breaking against enemies if he doesn't get armor haki. Brook is the sixth strongest strawhat so far... his homologue in yonko crews would still be about oven/daifuku... And right now it doesn't look like brook can take on fucking peckoms...

Nami probably has little need of armor haki in general BUT it wouldn't hurt her. Even if only to protect the clima tact which she relies on... Obvervation haki probably would be of special use to her.

Chopper doesn't have as specific a need for armor haki as brook does but he definitely needs it about as much as any other plain martial artist. Which is a lot.

Observation haki is probably the more relevant haki skill for ussop but as a sniper he definitely needs armor haki as well. Projecting haki is a crucial and non-skipable skill for him. How else is he going to stop an admiral on his tracks by aiming at him in the future? His plants are cool and everything but useless against YC level people and haki users in general. Since with haki they'd see the attacks coming or even easily repel them.

 

[King Moe]

Realistically speaking all strawhats would benefit from it and in general I don't think haki is a skipable ability. it's the literaly core of combat in the series. There are no alternatives to it. To me its more of a matter of when they awake it, not if.

The only strawhat that kinda might get sort of a pass on it is franky because his power relies on technology. But even then IMO this is a huge stretch. Franky is about the fifth strongest member in the crew... His homologue in yonko crews would be the likes of perospero or snack... Realistically speaking even for franky haki should eventually awaken on its own for him as he gets more experienced and becomes more powerful. Otherwise even with all his technology any jackass near his tier would lord observation haki against him...

For brook in turn, the situation is even worst. He needs it, period. The guy is a swordsman.... Without haki he can't harden his blade which is a crucial skill for any swordsman. Even his blade is at risk of chipping or breaking against enemies if he doesn't get armor haki. Brook is the sixth strongest strawhat so far... his homologue in yonko crews would still be about oven/daifuku... And right now it doesn't look like brook can take on fucking peckoms...

Nami probably has little need of armor haki in general BUT it wouldn't hurt her. Even if only to protect the clima tact which she relies on... Obvervation haki probably would be of special use to her.

Chopper doesn't have as specific a need for armor haki as brook does but he definitely needs it about as much as any other plain martial artist. Which is a lot.

Observation haki is probably the more relevant haki skill for ussop but as a sniper he definitely needs armor haki as well. Projecting haki is a crucial and non-skipable skill for him. How else is he going to stop an admiral on his tracks by aiming at him in the future? His plants are cool and everything but useless against YC level people and haki users in general. Since with haki they'd see the attacks coming or even easily repel them.

So you expect them during course of their journey and maybe during current arc or future arc all Strawahts as well future members if they don't have it that time will unlock it towards the EOS? You think all of them will truly get Haki individually?

I do agree on your points though especially on Brook as he does need to prevent his sword from breaking if he strikes at others, but then again it didn't break down thanks to Ice abilities and in Big Mom fight, but then again she could have been holding back still, but Brook gaining COA I won't rule out about it if he needs it, but do think him and Franky can work without it if needs be given how diverse they can be with abilities and adapt, but wouldn't be bother if Oda helps them to unlock it.

Hard to imagine Nami using Hardening on her body and abilities as I think her Climactic is more than enough to make up for it, but of course COO is more essential to her in many ways especially in navigation. Might be off with her with COA, but have to see on what Oda do to develop her more.

What your thoughts on what I said about Robin? You agree or you have something in mind on how Haki will work for her?

Chopper for sure will need Haki if he going to be a 'Monster' in bulldoze down everything around him, so COA is quite important for him to keep up in a fight along with COO could be helpful for his animal side in sensing out others and being a doctor if someone is injured he can go rushing to them to heal them as well. He can be one of those who can have both on his end.

Usopp is a special case as given his bloodline and where he could be heading, he could be one of the few on the ship to have access to all 3 Haki Types like Luffy, Sanji, Zoro, and maybe Jimbei (Though Jimbei seems like he past his prime or at it, so if he did have COC, would have use it by now, so think someone else will have in the crew). Though his projectiles are diverse even in elemental and tricky side, so do you expect him to later to gain COA to help power of his projectiles too or how you think he can work his Haki into how he fights?

 

[kkck]

So you expect them during course of their journey and maybe during current arc or future arc all Strawahts as well future members if they don't have it that time will unlock it towards the EOS? You think all of them will truly get Haki individually?

I do agree on your points though especially on Brook as he does need to prevent his sword from breaking if he strikes at others, but then again it didn't break down thanks to Ice abilities and in Big Mom fight, but then again she could have been holding back still, but Brook gaining COA I won't rule out about it if he needs it, but do think him and Franky can work without it if needs be given how diverse they can be with abilities and adapt, but wouldn't be bother if Oda helps them to unlock it.

Hard to imagine Nami using Hardening on her body and abilities as I think her Climactic is more than enough to make up for it, but of course COO is more essential to her in many ways especially in navigation. Might be off with her with COA, but have to see on what Oda do to develop her more.

What your thoughts on what I said about Robin? You agree or you have something in mind on how Haki will work for her?

Chopper for sure will need Haki if he going to be a 'Monster' in bulldoze down everything around him, so COA is quite important for him to keep up in a fight along with COO could be helpful for his animal side in sensing out others and being a doctor if someone is injured he can go rushing to them to heal them as well. He can be one of those who can have both on his end.

Usopp is a special case as given his bloodline and where he could be heading, he could be one of the few on the ship to have access to all 3 Haki Types like Luffy, Sanji, Zoro, and maybe Jimbei (Though Jimbei seems like he past his prime or at it, so if he did have COC, would have use it by now, so think someone else will have in the crew). Though his projectiles are diverse even in elemental and tricky side, so do you expect him to later to gain COA to help power of his projectiles too or how you think he can work his Haki into how he fights?

To me it's just hard to imagine the strawhat crew holding its own against fellow.... emperor crews without all of them becoming monsters. Sure, right now the strawhats are taking on kaido but the fight is by no means even. Or even close to it. Zoro, sanji, jinbe, franky, brook, ussop, robin, choper and nami are basically luffy's executives... And the strawhat crew is currently basically fodder next to a yonko crew, executive to executive. I don't really hold the topo robi in particularly high regard but based on what we have seen so far if we had the six of them against franky, brook, ussop, robin, chopper and nami the fact is the strawhats wouldn't come out on top. The situation is even more dire against their big mom homologues who seem far more threatening.

I am not sure that broke's ice abilities enhance his sword that way. There are not direct references that it works like that anyways, so far it just applies a chilling effect... I don't rule it out but to me its questionable at best that brook's chill would replace haki. Maybe him not having haki due to having died before would justify that.

Age wise it makes sense that jinbe is at about his prime and more like the type to follow others.... I don't think he will be a COC user.

The issue with ussop is that his current fighting style is fundamentally gimmicky. His plants are useful obviously but.... can you imagine a yonko commander being tickled by them? Or alternative ussop having in his pocket something that would wreck a yonko commander? Most of the stuff he has shown I would argue can be easily blocked by armor haki.... Poisons and other such things could be available to him I suppose... But ultimately at higher tiers he would need haki imbued projectiles alongside his other gimmicks to be competitive at the yonko commander tier. Along with the tactical advantage observation haki would grant a sniper. Realistically speaking van auger from part one seems far more threatening than even current ussop.

 

[King Moe]

To me it's just hard to imagine the strawhat crew holding its own against fellow.... emperor crews without all of them becoming monsters. Sure, right now the strawhats are taking on kaido but the fight is by no means even. Or even close to it. Zoro, sanji, jinbe, franky, brook, ussop, robin, choper and nami are basically luffy's executives... And the strawhat crew is currently basically fodder next to a yonko crew, executive to executive. I don't really hold the topo robi in particularly high regard but based on what we have seen so far if we had the six of them against franky, brook, ussop, robin, chopper and nami the fact is the strawhats wouldn't come out on top. The situation is even more dire against their big mom homologues who seem far more threatening.

I am not sure that broke's ice abilities enhance his sword that way. There are not direct references that it works like that anyways, so far it just applies a chilling effect... I don't rule it out but to me its questionable at best that brook's chill would replace haki. Maybe him not having haki due to having died before would justify that.

Age wise it makes sense that jinbe is at about his prime and more like the type to follow others.... I don't think he will be a COC user.

The issue with ussop is that his current fighting style is fundamentally gimmicky. His plants are useful obviously but.... can you imagine a yonko commander being tickled by them? Or alternative ussop having in his pocket something that would wreck a yonko commander? Most of the stuff he has shown I would argue can be easily blocked by armor haki.... Poisons and other such things could be available to him I suppose... But ultimately at higher tiers he would need haki imbued projectiles alongside his other gimmicks to be competitive at the yonko commander tier. Along with the tactical advantage observation haki would grant a sniper. Realistically speaking van auger from part one seems far more threatening than even current ussop.

Hmmm...You have good point there especially thinking about future fights later when eventuality they will have to deal with enemies in Elbaf if it goes into fighting with the Giants (Though honestly Giants don't see too much trouble given how Oda show them, but you never know about NW Giants, so let's see), World Government in facing and their top Marines and Gorosei added and probably near EOS or at it, they face Blackbeard Pirates and individual they are all major threats, so they would have to be stronger individual themselves in handling their respectful fights. Also can't forget Imu-Sama and his forces against them especially Gorosei if they don't face them during WG situation. So they would need to evolve a lot to get to point of beating all these enemies in the future and be able to keep up with Luffy on his growth.

Which why I said Wano could be start of that in facing tougher fights and overcoming them with their power developing and growing in the fights. As like Rayleigh said, harder the fight, they stronger your Haki can grow from it, so we have to see what happens here and future arcs forward.

Well again can see him having COA combine with his Ice to make it even harder, but his DF power especially tricky nature of it have ways getting past enemies under their skin perhaps?

Yeah same here, if he did had COC, we would have seen it by now with his age and doesn't make sense why he doesn't do it around fodders and doesn't do it himself even talking about it.

I mean not just about tickle as he has powerful ones like Impact Wolf that can be very strong blow among others he could potential have like it. I suppose him learning COA too won't be farfetch if he need to pierce through their Haki, but might have something in his bag of tricks to overcome opponents like that too. Though depends how his father, Yasopp fights as well Van Auger as I would presume they do a lot more than just shoot you, so maybe it could be COA like you said to have bullets do damage on you or something that works on why they are top tiers threats in NW. Got see how development Oda goes for him in current arc and later as having him being first to unlock his Haki before others push Oda has plans for Usopp being among major threats of the crew down the line.

 

[kkck]

Hmmm...You have good point there especially thinking about future fights later when eventuality they will have to deal with enemies in Elbaf if it goes into fighting with the Giants (Though honestly Giants don't see too much trouble given how Oda show them, but you never know about NW Giants, so let's see), World Government in facing and their top Marines and Gorosei added and probably near EOS or at it, they face Blackbeard Pirates and individual they are all major threats, so they would have to be stronger individual themselves in handling their respectful fights. Also can't forget Imu-Sama and his forces against them especially Gorosei if they don't face them during WG situation. So they would need to evolve a lot to get to point of beating all these enemies in the future and be able to keep up with Luffy on his growth.

Which why I said Wano could be start of that in facing tougher fights and overcoming them with their power developing and growing in the fights. As like Rayleigh said, harder the fight, they stronger your Haki can grow from it, so we have to see what happens here and future arcs forward.

Well again can see him having COA combine with his Ice to make it even harder, but his DF power especially tricky nature of it have ways getting past enemies under their skin perhaps?

Yeah same here, if he did had COC, we would have seen it by now with his age and doesn't make sense why he doesn't do it around fodders and doesn't do it himself even talking about it.

I mean not just about tickle as he has powerful ones like Impact Wolf that can be very strong blow among others he could potential have like it. I suppose him learning COA too won't be farfetch if he need to pierce through their Haki, but might have something in his bag of tricks to overcome opponents like that too. Though depends how his father, Yasopp fights as well Van Auger as I would presume they do a lot more than just shoot you, so maybe it could be COA like you said to have bullets do damage on you or something that works on why they are top tiers threats in NW. Got see how development Oda goes for him in current arc and later as having him being first to unlock his Haki before others push Oda has plans for Usopp being among major threats of the crew down the line.

The majority of giants so far don't seem particularly powerful. The strongest ones so far appear to be the one at dressrosa who struggled with one of doflamingo's mid tier fighters (at best) and the vice admiral one.. Though beyond that the race hasn't exhibited anything exceptional.

Part of the problem with the strawhats getting to this point is time. Considering luffy, zoro and sanji... The 3 of them spent 2 years training their haki. Luffy mastered the basic versions of the two main types of haki. As in CoA up to hardening and CoO to the point where he could reliably predict attacks and feel people. Zoro in turn mastered CoA up to projection, a step ahead of luffy, and had presumably inferior CoO to luffy, but still usable. Sanji in turn learned the basics of CoA, he has never displayed hardening let alone the other more advanced techniques, and presumably developed his CoO a fair bit considering he dodged katakuri's mochi bullet. Now, when it comes to yonko commanders they are generally new world veterans at least. With the plausible exception of the topo robi who seem consistently younger than most commanders. And now... take ussop, the only non monster trio strawhat who has displayed haki... Shouldn't he be at least a year away from usable haki of any kind? Or is he so talented that his haki can become usable within months? what about the other strawhats who have not even begun to display any sort of haki? Haki wise it ends up looking like the strawhats need an extra two year timeskip so that the lesser ones can get their shit together...

Yassop has been a pirate for.... ten years or so? the guy has had quite some time to develop....

 

[King Moe]

The majority of giants so far don't seem particularly powerful. The strongest ones so far appear to be the one at dressrosa who struggled with one of doflamingo's mid tier fighters (at best) and the vice admiral one.. Though beyond that the race hasn't exhibited anything exceptional.

Part of the problem with the strawhats getting to this point is time. Considering luffy, zoro and sanji... The 3 of them spent 2 years training their haki. Luffy mastered the basic versions of the two main types of haki. As in CoA up to hardening and CoO to the point where he could reliably predict attacks and feel people. Zoro in turn mastered CoA up to projection, a step ahead of luffy, and had presumably inferior CoO to luffy, but still usable. Sanji in turn learned the basics of CoA, he has never displayed hardening let alone the other more advanced techniques, and presumably developed his CoO a fair bit considering he dodged katakuri's mochi bullet. Now, when it comes to yonko commanders they are generally new world veterans at least. With the plausible exception of the topo robi who seem consistently younger than most commanders. And now... take ussop, the only non monster trio strawhat who has displayed haki... Shouldn't he be at least a year away from usable haki of any kind? Or is he so talented that his haki can become usable within months? what about the other strawhats who have not even begun to display any sort of haki? Haki wise it ends up looking like the strawhats need an extra two year timeskip so that the lesser ones can get their shit together...

Yassop has been a pirate for.... ten years or so? the guy has had quite some time to develop....

Oda push how important they were to Big Mom as she stated Army of Giants are very dangerous to the world and can make one PK, so feel there more high tier fighters to see later, but yeah Giants thus far haven't been too much of a serious obstacles, but we have to see on their lands as it could be different.

Actually Sanji already display COA in good measure on his end as doubt he isn't evolving his COA otherwise able to hurt T6H wouldn't matter much if he isn't developing as well tanking ship destroying attacks. Zoro as well looks to be improving his COO, but I wouldn't say usable given he gets hit easily by many even having his guard down cause he lack flexibility unlike Luffy and Sanji who are good using Haki during as they fight more. Though no doubt the duo will get stronger on their Haki all around and potentially unlocking COC later on respectively.

Depends as we don't know how long it took for the 3 for it be usable of their Haki, so Usopp could be in same patterns as them, but given he is very awareness, it could help boost him getting it down the line as series goes on. Also there is a factor that Luffy, Sanji, Zoro, and Jimbei could be teachers to the rest of Strawhats to help boost them getting hang of it faster during progress of the story which can help with how they get it faster more. If Oda expect them to gain Haki and use it later, that could be sound reason on why they be able to know how it works more if their crewmates help teach them around which wouldn't be farfetch about it.

 

[M3J]

All of the Straw Hats will have and should have haki of some sort, they'll need it. I can see Nami mastering/needing Color of Observation, especially as a navigator.

 

[kkck]

Oda push how important they were to Big Mom as she stated Army of Giants are very dangerous to the world and can make one PK, so feel there more high tier fighters to see later, but yeah Giants thus far haven't been too much of a serious obstacles, but we have to see on their lands as it could be different.

Actually Sanji already display COA in good measure on his end as doubt he isn't evolving his COA otherwise able to hurt T6H wouldn't matter much if he isn't developing as well tanking ship destroying attacks. Zoro as well looks to be improving his COO, but I wouldn't say usable given he gets hit easily by many even having his guard down cause he lack flexibility unlike Luffy and Sanji who are good using Haki during as they fight more. Though no doubt the duo will get stronger on their Haki all around and potentially unlocking COC later on respectively.

Depends as we don't know how long it took for the 3 for it be usable of their Haki, so Usopp could be in same patterns as them, but given he is very awareness, it could help boost him getting it down the line as series goes on. Also there is a factor that Luffy, Sanji, Zoro, and Jimbei could be teachers to the rest of Strawhats to help boost them getting hang of it faster during progress of the story which can help with how they get it faster more. If Oda expect them to gain Haki and use it later, that could be sound reason on why they be able to know how it works more if their crewmates help teach them around which wouldn't be farfetch about it.

I think giants play into how OP handles foot soldiers. Realistically speaking all parties in the series are doing their absolute best to have the strongest foot soldiers they can get their hands on. Marines gathered however many elite marines they could at marineford, kaido has gathered 500 smile users, big mom tried to get her hands on germa's clones.... If you army is as strong as your weakest soldier then giants are actually game changers. But hoards of them don't necessarily stand a chance against a single yonko commander...

My point was that sanji has specifically not shown hardening. Of course he has displayed CoA plenty of times but merely at the lowest level we know of.

But still, the trio trained for 2 years to get to where they were at post timeskip. Granted that their haki was usable earlier than that but the 3 of them were all probably prodigies to begin with. That probably won't be the case for their older or lesser strawhats. Any amount of time it can take the strawhats to get usable haki is ultimately too long for the story. It'd be different if we had 10 years and 8 arcs of OP left but that doesn't appear to be the case.

 

[King Moe]

I think giants play into how OP handles foot soldiers. Realistically speaking all parties in the series are doing their absolute best to have the strongest foot soldiers they can get their hands on. Marines gathered however many elite marines they could at marineford, kaido has gathered 500 smile users, big mom tried to get her hands on germa's clones.... If you army is as strong as your weakest soldier then giants are actually game changers. But hoards of them don't necessarily stand a chance against a single yonko commander...

My point was that sanji has specifically not shown hardening. Of course he has displayed CoA plenty of times but merely at the lowest level we know of.

But still, the trio trained for 2 years to get to where they were at post timeskip. Granted that their haki was usable earlier than that but the 3 of them were all probably prodigies to begin with. That probably won't be the case for their older or lesser strawhats. Any amount of time it can take the strawhats to get usable haki is ultimately too long for the story. It'd be different if we had 10 years and 8 arcs of OP left but that doesn't appear to be the case.

Guess could be that, but you never know as there could be strong fighters in there than just army status one as think of Giants using COO and COA while demolishing around the area as those certain individual would be very dangerous to face against.

Actually there are points of him using Hardening and you can't have low level if your kicks can leave an Ancient Zoan and T6H and All-Star Candidate screaming in pain with each kick you give him. His Haki shows on his body as wouldn't get far with his enemies if it was too low to mess with them. Haki can overpower someone and enemies do use it, so for Sanji to block and damage, shows his Haki isn't really that low. If you mean Adv. COA like Luffy, then I agree on that as have to see until further notice on his development.

We going to have to see then on what Oda does to give them Haki and how they be able to learn it in due time. He either going to have them work together in them all learning Haki or another timeskip happens for them be more prepare with it. Though again all just theories as Oda could even maybe give few without Haki given their abilities, but have to see about that.

 

[kkck]

Guess could be that, but you never know as there could be strong fighters in there than just army status one as think of Giants using COO and COA while demolishing around the area as those certain individual would be very dangerous to face against.

Actually there are points of him using Hardening and you can't have low level if your kicks can leave an Ancient Zoan and T6H and All-Star Candidate screaming in pain with each kick you give him. His Haki shows on his body as wouldn't get far with his enemies if it was too low to mess with them. Haki can overpower someone and enemies do use it, so for Sanji to block and damage, shows his Haki isn't really that low. If you mean Adv. COA like Luffy, then I agree on that as have to see until further notice on his development.

We going to have to see then on what Oda does to give them Haki and how they be able to learn it in due time. He either going to have them work together in them all learning Haki or another timeskip happens for them be more prepare with it. Though again all just theories as Oda could even maybe give few without Haki given their abilities, but have to see about that.

Ah, there definitely are strong fighters somewhere in there. Supposedly there is a country of warrior giants so it checks out there would be actual powerhouses in there, at least occasionally. But.... they'd still be just one more strong person. Yonko crews have commanders and affiliated captains... The marines have tons of VAs...

Hardening is the specific technique where your limbs or weapon turn black. I am not saying sanji hasn't displayed regular old invisible haki. Just the blackened version of it.

 

[King Moe]

Ah, there definitely are strong fighters somewhere in there. Supposedly there is a country of warrior giants so it checks out there would be actual powerhouses in there, at least occasionally. But.... they'd still be just one more strong person. Yonko crews have commanders and affiliated captains... The marines have tons of VAs...

Hardening is the specific technique where your limbs or weapon turn black. I am not saying sanji hasn't displayed regular old invisible haki. Just the blackened version of it.

We going to have to see if Big Mom stated they would be so dangerous in a fight as I don't expect Yonko lvl Giant, but they could be compare similar to Wano Samurais or a bit more that you can get at least YC lvl Giants of certain characters.

Actually they can be seen on him when facing Daifuku blocking his Giant Genie's blade when he try to cut the ship and when he went to protect Nami from Kanjuro's ship destroying attack. Kinda hard for him to show since naturally he wears black pants and flames can obscure him able to harden his body around his legs too, but doubt he get far with the enemies thus far if he couldn't at least Harden his own body since only so much Invisible side could lead you.

 

[kkck]

We going to have to see if Big Mom stated they would be so dangerous in a fight as I don't expect Yonko lvl Giant, but they could be compare similar to Wano Samurais or a bit more that you can get at least YC lvl Giants of certain characters.

Actually they can be seen on him when facing Daifuku blocking his Giant Genie's blade when he try to cut the ship and when he went to protect Nami from Kanjuro's ship destroying attack. Kinda hard for him to show since naturally he wears black pants and flames can obscure him able to harden his body around his legs too, but doubt he get far with the enemies thus far if he couldn't at least Harden his own body since only so much Invisible side could lead you.

My point is that giants are probably worth more as foot soldiers though. It's not about individual giants (though I'd assume they'd be welcomed).

None of those instances actually show hardened haki's normal color though. The bit against daifuku makes sanji's leg hard to see at all given the genie's sheer size... Sanji does those things with the standard invisible haki is not far fetched though. The wikia does not list any confirmed instance of sanji being seeing with hardened haki not does it list the ability as something sanji has either.

 

[King Moe]

My point is that giants are probably worth more as foot soldiers though. It's not about individual giants (though I'd assume they'd be welcomed).

None of those instances actually show hardened haki's normal color though. The bit against daifuku makes sanji's leg hard to see at all given the genie's sheer size... Sanji does those things with the standard invisible haki is not far fetched though. The wikia does not list any confirmed instance of sanji being seeing with hardened haki not does it list the ability as something sanji has either.

True, but still could be individuals who are stronger than soldiers to lookout for.

They are as you can see many stated he use Haki about that and doubt you can do everything just Basic lvl of COA given Genie is Fully Body COA Hardening. Thought we can't use wikia sites as proof of canon given it's fanbase website and still changing things about it? You can't use that as proof especially when those events happen, fans backed it him using Hardening along even Anime during Sanji vs Daifuku showcase Hardening just same example when to clear Luffy uses Hardening when he kick Katakuri. Plus wasn't like that last time I check on the wikia about his Haki abilities.

I highly doubt he going into major fights without improving his Haki as again shouldn't doubt things from past arcs or think they haven't develop since then. If we going by that Law shouldn't be apart facing main forces due to his performance with Doflamingo, but Oda still push him equal running with Luffy and Kidd as major ones to take out Kaido from Alliance. Oda push narrative that everyone got stronger each arc later, so it make sense to list Sanji capable of COA Hardening by now. You can't do the things in damaging your enemy if your Haki is lower than theirs. Basic COA lvl wouldn't do that to what he did prior.

 

[kkck]

True, but still could be individuals who are stronger than soldiers to lookout for.

They are as you can see many stated he use Haki about that and doubt you can do everything just Basic lvl of COA given Genie is Fully Body COA Hardening. Thought we can't use wikia sites as proof of canon given it's fanbase website and still changing things about it? You can't use that as proof especially when those events happen, fans backed it him using Hardening along even Anime during Sanji vs Daifuku showcase Hardening just same example when to clear Luffy uses Hardening when he kick Katakuri. Plus wasn't like that last time I check on the wikia about his Haki abilities.

I highly doubt he going into major fights without improving his Haki as again shouldn't doubt things from past arcs or think they haven't develop since then. If we going by that Law shouldn't be apart facing main forces due to his performance with Doflamingo, but Oda still push him equal running with Luffy and Kidd as major ones to take out Kaido from Alliance. Oda push narrative that everyone got stronger each arc later, so it make sense to list Sanji capable of COA Hardening by now. You can't do the things in damaging your enemy if your Haki is lower than theirs. Basic COA lvl wouldn't do that to what he did prior.

Yes, though I don't think they are relevant to that specific issue. Much like how the Vinsmokes weren't relevant to big mom's interest in the germa army for instance.

The wiki is not proof of course. BUT it's a case where neither I nor however many people edit the wiki have found any instance of confirmed hardened haki on sanji's part. Add to that that there have been plenty of instances where using it would have been beneficial. Against vergo, doflamingo, daifuku... If sanji hasn't shown it in the manga at this point then we should assume he can't. Until he does.

Well, I've made the case that it's extremely unlikely that luffy's supernova peers have kept up with him. Gear 4 alone is a rather insane and on top of that luffy has had insane haki boosts... He is probably the only supernova that has improved armor and observation haki to their max known levels. Sure, all characters grow stronger every arc but luffy's peers going through the same or comparable BS to what luffy went through sounds pretty damn unlikely.

 

[HereNThere]

Hardening is the specific technique where your limbs or weapon turn black. I am not saying sanji hasn't displayed regular old invisible haki. Just the blackened version of it.

Chapter 976, Page 8. It's small, but you can see the Hardening shading on Sanji's neck and cheek as he protects Nami.

 

[kkck]

Chapter 976, Page 8. It's small, but you can see the Hardening shading on Sanji's neck and cheek as he protects Nami.

https://i5.imggur.net/one-piece/976/one-piece-13512265.jpg

This one? I am pretty sure that is just sanji's hair over his cheek. Add to that it's pointless for him to harden his cheek in that scenario. And if he was doing full body hardening (which is the only reasonable explanation for him to harden his cheek) then there would be more evidence of it.

 

[HereNThere]

https://i5.imggur.net/one-piece/976/one-piece-13512265.jpg

This one? I am pretty sure that is just sanji's hair over his cheek. Add to that it's pointless for him to harden his cheek in that scenario. And if he was doing full body hardening (which is the only reasonable explanation for him to harden his cheek) then there would be more evidence of it.

Sanji's hair isn't cheek length.

It's pointless, but he did it apparently. I think it's pretty cut and dry. It's the same style of shading of black on his face and neck with white highlights to show the sheen. It's not his hair and it can't be shadows because Oda tends to use hatching to show that.

Plus, he's using his entire body to protect Nami, so full body hardening would make sense in that context. He's completely unharmed in any subsequent panels.

 

[King Moe]

Sanji's hair isn't cheek length.

It's pointless, but he did it apparently. I think it's pretty cut and dry. It's the same style of shading of black on his face and neck with white highlights to show the sheen. It's not his hair and it can't be shadows because Oda tends to use hatching to show that.

Plus, he's using his entire body to protect Nami, so full body hardening would make sense in that context. He's completely unharmed in any subsequent panels.

Exactly, just like argument about if Luffy Harden his foot when he hit Katakuri awhile ago, this is similar case as we can see instances of same shading of Armament Hardening. Plus it's illogical for Sanji to be able to do what he does in damaging stronger threats if his COA wasn't up to the task. We shouldn't underestimate he wouldn't improve his Haki more as time went on.

 

[kkck]

Sanji's hair isn't cheek length.

It's pointless, but he did it apparently. I think it's pretty cut and dry. It's the same style of shading of black on his face and neck with white highlights to show the sheen. It's not his hair and it can't be shadows because Oda tends to use hatching to show that.

Plus, he's using his entire body to protect Nami, so full body hardening would make sense in that context. He's completely unharmed in any subsequent panels.

Well, no, but that is clearly a badly drawn frame with weird hair. All of it is pointy and longer than usual. I mean, the bit clearly extends from his hair and over his cheek. At least if you zoom on it it doesn't like like hardening at all.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 14, 2020, Original Post Date: Aug 14, 2020 ---

Exactly, just like argument about if Luffy Harden his foot when he hit Katakuri awhile ago, this is similar case as we can see instances of same shading of Armament Hardening. Plus it's illogical for Sanji to be able to do what he does in damaging stronger threats if his COA wasn't up to the task. We shouldn't underestimate he wouldn't improve his Haki more as time went on.

When has sanji damaged stronger threats? The page one bit was ultimately not all that clear, he didn't deal lasting damage on oven, got wrecked by doflamingo and vergo broke his leg... Sanji's armor haki has rarely, if ever, held up in this regard.