Fantasy Mard Geer VS Ajeel

[Arjuna]

Memento Mori IS featless. Can you tell me exactly what it does or how it works? Can you tell me on who it works or its potency? No, you can't, because all we had was Mard stating it would do something and then seeing it fail. This means that it's featless. Until we see Memento Mori actually do something to anyone, it will remain restricted to versus thread.

Saying that it's one year later literally makes no sense. That's like saying that GMG Erza was stronger than Phantom Jose because Erza was 7 years ahead of Jose.

The Best Thing for Mard will be too fly high up in the Air and Wait till the Sand Storm Subsides.Sand Storm can't reach a particular fight.And Then attack Ajeel and finish him.

 

[Cosmicstar]

You can't scale Marde geer to the Celestial spirit King because Marde Geer couldn't compete with the CSK in power, all he could do was dodge the CSK attacks. Marde Geer is at best building level. He has never done anything city level, let alone town level.

Ajeel would win this battle. Marde Geer is agile not powerful. Marde Geer attack power sucks.

 

[Arjuna]

You can't scale Marde geer to the Celestial spirit King because Marde Geer couldn't compete with the CSK in power, all he could do was dodge the CSK attacks. Marde Geer is at best building level. He has never done anything city level, let alone town level.

Ajeel would win this battle. Marde Geer is agile not powerful. Marde Geer attack power sucks.

Mard Geer was dominating CSK in his Human Form.He didn't even use EF.
His Dea Yggdrasil and Thorn Attacks were City Level.

 

[Cosmicstar]

Mard Geer was dominating CSK in his Human Form.He didn't even use EF.
His Dea Yggdrasil and Thorn Attacks were City Level.

His thorns were not city level. What are you talking about? Where is the evidence?

CSK isn't as big as a city.
Tartarous castle isn't as big as a city.

Also he wasn't dominating the CSK as the CSK countered all his attacks with something better.

Marde Geer used Plutogrim, CSK came in and destroyed it within seconds.
Marde Geer used Algeria, CSK broke it with Galaxia Blade.
Marde Geer Pierces the CSK with thorns that don't even scratch him, CSK uses Meteor Blade which splits the earth in two for miles.

 

[Arjuna]

His thorns were not city level. What are you talking about? Where is the evidence?

CSK isn't as big as a city.
Tartarous castle isn't as big as a city.

Also he wasn't dominating the CSK as the CSK countered all his attacks with something better.

Marde Geer used Plutogrim, CSK came in and destroyed it within seconds.
Marde Geer used Algeria, CSK broke it with Galaxia Blade.
Marde Geer Pierces the CSK with thorns that don't even scratch him, CSK uses Meteor Blade which splits the earth in two for miles.

Mard Geer didn't even for a moment showed Fear.He was smirking against CSK.

 

[Coné]

His thorns were not city level. What are you talking about? Where is the evidence?

CSK isn't as big as a city.
Tartarous castle isn't as big as a city.

Also he wasn't dominating the CSK as the CSK countered all his attacks with something better.

Marde Geer used Plutogrim, CSK came in and destroyed it within seconds.
Marde Geer used Algeria, CSK broke it with Galaxia Blade.
Marde Geer Pierces the CSK with thorns that don't even scratch him, CSK uses Meteor Blade which splits the earth in two for miles.

Do you even know how scaling works? Mard fought on par with CSK, that's all it matters. Did he overpower him? No. Was he overpowered? No. So scaling is allowed.

 

[Axiomus]

Still, that doesn't mean Mard's vines are city scaled.

 

[Brandish μ]

Mard Geer was dominating CSK in his Human Form.He didn't even use EF.
His Dea Yggdrasil and Thorn Attacks were City Level.

Using the calcs you put on the last page that would but thorns and Dea Yggdrasil in the same class as Natsu's FDK roar? Makes these DC calcs seem ridiculous (I don't put any stock in them anyway).

 

[Arjuna]

Using the calcs you put on the last page that would but thorns and Dea Yggdrasil in the same class as Natsu's FDK roar? Makes these DC calcs seem ridiculous (I don't put any stock in them anyway).

Now Don't compare Natsu's FDK Roar and Mard 's Thorns as same.Natsu's Roar is Much Devastating and Stronger.

 

[Brandish μ]

Now Don't compare Natsu's FDK Roar and Mard 's Thorns as same.Natsu's Roar is Much Devastating and Stronger.

Roar is much stronger just don't know how you can call thorns city level when the roar is also called city level.

 

[Arjuna]

Roar is much stronger just don't know how you can call thorns city level when the roar is also called city level.

Just Imagine The Size of CSK.He was of the Mountain Size and His Sword Covered many miles.Now Mard's Thorns covered CSK.Mountain Size Means City Level.So Hos Thorns can be of city level.

 

[Brandish μ]

Just Imagine The Size of CSK.He was of the Mountain Size and His Sword Covered many miles.Now Mard's Thorns covered CSK.Mountain Size Means City Level.So Hos Thorns can be of city level.

You're not using that scaling thing on the last page right?

On pure size CSK is not a mountain. He is like a building. He's probably 30m tall. Mard's thorns can grow longer than CSK is tall. How big is a city level in metres/kilometres/miles? Is any thorn Mard made that big?

 

[Arjuna]

You're not using that scaling thing on the last page right?

On pure size CSK is not a mountain. He is like a building. He's probably 30m tall. Mard's thorns can grow longer than CSK is tall. How big is a city level in metres/kilometres/miles? Is any thorn Mard made that big?

You are right.But The Scaling on the last page is pretty much accurate.It is based on Scientific method.You can see the Size of The City There.

 

[Brandish μ]

The calcs are not really scientific because of the quality of data. The methods are sound enough, though I've seen some calcs displayed that weren't but some are pretty good considering the poor level of data. Basically due to the poor level of data it is almost a waste of time to do calcs you can just look at it and make a pretty sound observation.

 

[Coné]

The CSK basically destroyed Plutogrim, which was more or less of the size of Magnolia, just by going through it. Compare with Erza's Cube piercing feat, which was calced at town level, and CSK's feat was much bigger and more effortless. If you don't want to compare this with the FDK roar, then compare Meteor Blade with it. Besides, there's a clear difference between the roar and the slash, which is that the slash destroyed all the are while the roar just pulverized one part of the area. Even if Mard doesn't have thorns or physical feats that have destroyed an area this big, it's assumed that they could because they stopped the CSK.

 

[Brandish μ]

Pluto was like Cathedral size, like this

Spoiler

You're saying that CSK has 'town level' damage output. And then giving thorns 'town level' damage output because it pierced CSK who has 'town level' output. That doesn't make sense. Idk why can't you look at thorns and just say 'they can grow probably 100m long and he has made about a football field or more quite quickly', rather than try and do these comparisons which only make it more erroneous. I get that scaling is attempting to standardize things just seems a very exhaustive process considering the results would be riddled with huge error bounds. Easy just to have a look and make reasonable judgement's.

 

[Coné]

Pluto was like Cathedral size, like this

Spoiler

You're saying that CSK has 'town level' damage output. And then giving thorns 'town level' damage output because it pierced CSK who has 'town level' output. That doesn't make sense. Idk why can't you look at thorns and just say 'they can grow probably 100m long and he has made about a football field or more quite quickly', rather than try and do these comparisons which only make it more erroneous. I get that scaling is attempting to standardize things just seems a very exhaustive process considering the results would be riddled with huge error bounds. Easy just to have a look and make reasonable judgement's.

Cube's side was calced at around 2000 metres long, which isn't very accurate, and then they used calc stacking, so this is an overinflated calc, but you could say this is at least a large town feat (it was solid City level according to the calc). Then you still have the Meteor Blade feat, which should also be around this level.
No, scaling is fine if the calcs/feats are fine. As CSK had more than one city-scaled attack and as Mard fought on par with him (if he didn't overpower him, that is), it's enough to show us that he has the ability to create city-level thorns (energy levels, can't say they would destroy a city) and that he has city-level durability.

 

[Axiomus]

The calcs make too much assumptions to be considered scientific. Especially in stuff like explosions in which mechanical force, heat, and even wasted energy in the form of light all play a huge role in total kinetic energy. The way they assume there is a difference whether the damage was "completely destroyed" or "just pulverized" is not scientific at all. Think about it: Natsu displayed fire that could melt rocks in the GMG before. Why would you come to the conclusion that the rocks were merely pulverized instead of melted? That and sometimes I see obvious scaling errors. It's not hard to see when an attack is city level or town level. It destroys an area on the level of a city/town. Some attacks are so obviously not capable of leveling a town it's not even funny.

CSK was nowhere near the size of a mountain. I won't go over this in detail, but the area where they are fighting in has mountains. CSK obviously wasn't as large as those. Cube was not the size of Magnolia Town. You can actually see the difference in size between the two as the cube hovers over Magnolia. I can grant cube small town status (like the one Gildarts fell on), but realize that Magnolia in it's whole is huge. Magnolia is easily larger than a mountain. It's actually surrounded by a mountain range. Capital cities like Crocus (the only true city in the sense of a modern city-scale), can possibly contain multiple Magnoliga's.

Spoiler

AoE also isn't everything. Ikusa-Tsunagi's slash is the largest attack in this series, covering the span of multiple towns in length. Natsu was able to shatter Ikusa-Tsunagi and his sword with demolition fist. In a head on collision, demolition fist would likely be stronger than Ikusa-Tsunagi's slash, despite being smaller in scale. I didn't get the same sense with thorns and meteor blade though. In a head on collision, meteor blade would hack away at thorns. Weaker people like Natsu, Sting, Rogue, and Gray have all hacked away at thorns. Obviously if Sting and Rogue can cut through thorn brambles, then it's not some sort of super durable substance. Obviously thorn brambles have never been used to destroy an area on the scale of a city. So why should we even consider it being on the level of FDK roar? Think about it: Head on collision between the two, FDK roar would likely swallow all the thorns whole and incinerate them.

Likewise, I can believe CSK's slash will blow away some of Ajeel's sands even though Ajeel's sandstorm is obviously larger than any attack in his arsenal. And make no mistake, Ajeel's sand world is bigger. Ajeel's attack swallows the entirety of Magnolia and then some. I mean, it should be somewhat obvious that Ajeel's sands world should be able to swallow BOTH Magnolia and Cube.

Spoiler

However, I don't think the same can be said for Mard's thorns. It's never been used in a fashion wherre it downright blows away an incoming attack. It's incredible that we can still be arguing whether or not thorn bramble (an attack never shown to cover an area any larger than the chambers within the cube) can be scaled to sand world (an attack that might as well be able to swallow cube and Magnoliga whole) in terms of size. It obviously can't. Even if I grant thorn brambles city-scale feats, I'd have to grant sand world a higher status (state-level? Province level?) simply to keep consistent.

 

[Brandish μ]

Well whoever calculated cube = 2km didn't use the cathedral panel.

The calcs can be fine (formula wise and math wise) but it comes down to data. Anything using scientific method the resolution of your calculations has to be comparable to the resolution of your data. Like if I used a 200mL beaker with graduations every 50mL I cannot with any reliability measure a volume of liquid to be 33.55mL. Interpretation of panels equals poor resolution imo so any result from calcs should be given huge error bands, enough to make the process seem a waste of time.

Size of attacks and their calculated power by using calcs doesn't give me more information than how much injury I can see from an attack to me that matters more.

 

[Coné]

The calcs make too much assumptions to be considered scientific. The only thing scientific are the equations. Even the way they assume there is a difference whether the damage was "completely destroyed" or "just pulverized" is not scientific at all. Think about it: Natsu displayed fire that could melt rocks in the GMG before. Why would you come to the conclusion that the rocks were merely pulverized instead of melted? That and sometimes I see obvious scaling errors. It's not hard to see when an attack is city level or town level. It destroys an area on the level of a city/town. Some attacks are so obviously not capable of leveling a town it's not even funny.

Also, to clarify a few things: CSK was nowhere near the size of a mountain. I won't go over this in detail, but the area where they are fighting in has mountains. CSK obviously wasn't as large as those. Cube was not the size of Magnolia Town. You can actually see the difference in size between the two as the cube hovers over Magnolia. I can grant cube small town status (like the one Gildarts fell on), but realize that Magnolia in it's whole is huge. Magnolia is easily larger than a mountain. It's actually surrounded by a mountain range. Capital cities like Crocus (the only true city in the sense of a modern city-scale), can possibly contain multiple Magnoliga's.

Spoiler

AoE also isn't everything. Ikusa-Tsunagi's slash is the largest attack in this series, covering the span of multiple towns in length. Natsu was able to shatter Ikusa-Tsunagi and his sword with demolition fist. In a head on collision, demolition fist would likely be stronger than Ikusa-Tsunagi's slash, despite being smaller in scale. I didn't get the same sense with thorns and meteor blade though. In a head on collision, meteor blade would hack away at thorns. Weaker people like Natsu, Sting, Rogue, and Gray have all hacked away at thorns. Obviously if Sting and Rogue can cut through thorn brambles, then it's not some sort of super durable substance. Obviously thorn brambles have never been used to destroy an area on the scale of a city. So why should we even consider it being on the level of FDK roar? Think about it: Head on collision between the two, FDK roar would likely swallow all the thorns whole and incinerate them.

Ok, so the calcs make too many assumptions to be considered 100% accurate, but that still doesn't take back the fact that the energy values are around those levels.
If you use melting instead of pulverization, the value still won't be above City level.
It doesn't matter if they have enough AoE to level a town. What matters the most is energy content. For example, Orga's lightning attack in the fight against Jura was Small Town level, but it didn't have anywhere near the AoE to destroy a town. Why? Because it had enough energy to bust a small town and that's what matters.
I didn't say it was as big as Magnolia. I said it was around the same size and that picture doesn't show me anything because Cube is far from Magnolia, thus Magnolia looks much bigger than the Cube.

Ikusatsunagi's slash is probably stronger than the demolition fist because DC =/= durability.

CSK's durability is city level due to him being in the center of his wn attacks (Plutogrim's destruction) and Mard managed to damage him. This should say enough about Mard's thorns and they focus on speed, so if they're not moving, the energy content will be logically much lower, meaning that it shouldn't be that difficult for Sting and Rogue to cut through them if the thorns weren't moving. Besides, the attacks Mard used against the CSK aren't exactly the same he used against Sting, Rogue, Gray and Natsu. This should be enough proof that Mard can cast city level thorns.

Well whoever calculated cube = 2km didn't use the cathedral panel.

The calcs can be fine (formula wise and math wise) but it comes down to data. Anything using scientific method the resolution of your calculations has to be comparable to the resolution of your data. Like if I used a 200mL beaker with graduations every 50mL I cannot with any reliability measure a volume of liquid to be 33.55mL. Interpretation of panels equals poor resolution imo so any result from calcs should be given huge error bands, enough to make the process seem a waste of time.

Size of attacks and their calculated power by using calcs doesn't give me more information than how much injury I can see from an attack to me that matters more.

The cathedral panel is inconsistent drawing. Of course the calc is not that accurate, but it shouldn't be that far from the truth: calc here.

The CSK calc shouldn't be that far from what Hiro wanted to show us because he then showed us another city-scaled attack (Meteor Blade).

Their calculated power is the damage they give to the opponent though. If X attack damages X character, then X attack is scaled to X's durability, meaning its energy content is equal to X's durability.