Fantasy Mercophobia vs Igneel

[Axiomus]

@WoWfan

I'm not sure how else I can articulate the point. According to you, Ignia-powered Natsu and Acnologia are on the same level. Both Igneel and Mercphobia lost their fights. The difference is Igneel was able to put up a fight for 20 minutes and crippled Acnologia by biting off an arm. Mercphobia was defeated in 4 hits and only managed to land a single tail whack on Natsu, who basically shrugged it off. When Igneel and Mercphobia fought opponents on the same level, Igneel did better.

Acnologia beat Igneel 400 years ago by stealing his soul. It wasn't nearly as easy to beat Igneel again during the Tartarus arc because he no longer had a soul to steal. Acnologia was forced to fight Igneel in the traditional manner. Igneel was able to keep up with Acnologia for 20 minutes, hit him so hard he started to cough up blood (even if you don't believe this resulted in Acnologia's knock down), and bite off his arm. Mercphobia is able to achieve none of that against Natsu, whom you consider on Acnologia's level.

Mercphobia lifting an ocean didn't accomplish anything that would imply that it would beat Igneel. Ignia is able to swim right through that ocean to save Natsu. Natsu at points was also swimming through that ocean. Igneel would swim right through this ocean too. We know Ignia held back on his attack because we know that at full power, Ignia can wipe out an entire at least a country. He has wiped out multiple countries. Elmina is only a city, and Ignia's attack did not wipe it out. Mercphobia even noted that it was a miracle that Elmina was still standing. So no, Ignia was not using up all of his magic power on the attack he used to feed Natsu. He just gave Natsu a taste of some of his power.

 

[WoWfan]

There is a key difference between the two: Igneel lost both 400 years ago and at Tartaros both at his peak and not. Merc lost because he was half strength and Natsu had the power of an DG with him. A desperate act so that the humans would use that to their advantage is hardly a show of actually beating Acnologia since he was no match for him anyway. Soul Stealing is a matter of strength and they also fighting since it has been proven that spirits can interact with physical beings as well, and vice versa, which explains Animus who was also a spirit was beaten as well. and we also saw scars on Igneel long before the fight which shows that he did fight at some point, so with all this we see, that a fight does take place back then. Igneel fought without knowing the futility of his effort to try and accomplish his goal. Acnologia fell with the effect of Face draining his magic power which is not that hard to understand. Merc lifting an ocean at half strength is far greater than anything Igneel has accomplished, which was nothing other than leaving the fight to humans. magic is equal to the strength of the caster, that is why Sting was able to match the strength of Spriggans when he ate Larcade's light, Ignia stated that it was his power, the power that surpasses a half powered DG. he never gave him a taste, that was the same as Ignia which was only temporary.

 

[LaGOAT]

I do not appreciate the name calling sir, anyway, Merc is stronger than Igneel, however at half strength that is a much more difficult fight for Merc, but since this is Tartaros Igneel, the result would be the same. We know that souls can still interact with physical people just as physical people can interact with souls, and we all know how that turned out for Animus who used the same technique after getting beaten by Acnologia. Merc lifting an ocean is greater than Tartartos Igneel who still could not beat Acno who only ripped his arm off out of desperation.

My fault sometimes I type like I talk in real life I apologize 2. Who amius? 3. Lol something that didn’t faze natsu and ignia a portion of ingia power was strong enough for natsu to beat a half power merc. That isn’t impressive as half powered igneel ripping the strongest guy in verse arm off

 

[WoWfan]

Animus is one of the dragons that would have been in the Dragon Graveyard under Crocus where Natsu and the gang discovered at the GMG, he used the Dragon Soul technique to hide his soul in the girl Sonya after being beaten to near death by Acnologia as he managed to survive while the rest of the Dragons did not, and since we did not see the bones of Animus in the graveyard, he would have already become a spirit by the time Acnologia left. Actually we did not get detail as to if Igneel was half powered as there is no real difference between spirit and body as both are connected to one's magic. For all we know Igneel still had the majority of his power in tact.

 

[Axiomus]

There is a key difference between the two: Igneel lost both 400 years ago and at Tartaros both at his peak and not. Merc lost because he was half strength and Natsu had the power of an DG with him. A desperate act so that the humans would use that to their advantage is hardly a show of actually beating Acnologia since he was no match for him anyway. Soul Stealing is a matter of strength and they also fighting since it has been proven that spirits can interact with physical beings as well, and vice versa, which explains Animus who was also a spirit was beaten as well. and we also saw scars on Igneel long before the fight which shows that he did fight at some point, so with all this we see, that a fight does take place back then. Igneel fought without knowing the futility of his effort to try and accomplish his goal. Acnologia fell with the effect of Face draining his magic power which is not that hard to understand. Merc lifting an ocean at half strength is far greater than anything Igneel has accomplished, which was nothing other than leaving the fight to humans. magic is equal to the strength of the caster, that is why Sting was able to match the strength of Spriggans when he ate Larcade's light, Ignia stated that it was his power, the power that surpasses a half powered DG. he never gave him a taste, that was the same as Ignia which was only temporary.

And Mercphobia in his human form lost to both Skullion as well as Natsu. Skullion isn't even anywhere close to Acnologia's level. Natsu with Igneel's power during the Alvarez arc would have steamrolled Skullion.

Obviously Mercphobia lost because he was half strength. That's not an excuse because this thread is pitting half strength Mercphobia against Tartarus arc Igneel.

Of course Igneel has many scars. He was around during the Dragon Civil War, and he would have been the a major player because he was a king of a group of dragons. That doesn't really imply anything. Igneel was not a spirit. Igneel was never a spirit. Animus is not a spirit either. Igneel and all the other dragons who sealed themselves inside humans with the dragon soul technique have physical bodies. It was their soul that was stolen from them, not their bodies. The fact remains that when Igneel got the chance to fight Acnologia without having to worry about his soul getting stolen, he was strong enough to tear off an arm. Mercphobia couldn't do anything to Natsu. If Natsu and Acnologia were on the same level, like you so claimed, then Igneel had the far better performance. It's as simple as that.

Ignia never stated he used all of his power in that attack. He had enough magic to transform into a human to talk to Natsu and stopped one of Natsu's attacks without any effort, and then still had enough magic power to transform back into a dragon to fly away. It was pretty clear from the implication of Mercphobia's statements that Ignia held back his attack so as to not destroy the entire city.

 

[WoWfan]

Merc did not even go all out, where as he only had half his power compared to Dragon God level Natsu with Ignia's flame. I do not doubt that it would steam role Skullion but that is hardly relevant as igneel is not on the same level as Acno nor DGs. and with that, even at half strength, Merc would still be enough to defeat Igneel at that time. Igneel had no better performance as as he could not defeat Acno and Acno beat him twice in full and partially weakened state. NAtus had the full powers of a DG so that is uncomparable to Igneel. Those scars were recent as he did not have them when he met with Zeref and was given Natsu. That implies relevance that leads to this point. You have forgotten that Merc was at half strength and Natsu was full power DG level which outmatches even Igneel at prime. He did not even state it was partially his power, it's not the manner of how much effor he put in, it is the level of his power which is already DG. It was not implied he held back, it was simply a miracle, again that is based on assumptions.

 

[LaGOAT]

Merc did not even go all out, where as he only had half his power compared to Dragon God level Natsu with Ignia's flame. I do not doubt that it would steam role Skullion but that is hardly relevant as igneel is not on the same level as Acno nor DGs. and with that, even at half strength, Merc would still be enough to defeat Igneel at that time. Igneel had no better performance as as he could not defeat Acno and Acno beat him twice in full and partially weakened state. NAtus had the full powers of a DG so that is uncomparable to Igneel. Those scars were recent as he did not have them when he met with Zeref and was given Natsu. That implies relevance that leads to this point. You have forgotten that Merc was at half strength and Natsu was full power DG level which outmatches even Igneel at prime. He did not even state it was partially his power, it's not the manner of how much effor he put in, it is the level of his power which is already DG. It was not implied he held back, it was simply a miracle, again that is based on assumptions.

What makes u think natsu with ignias power is on acno lvl?

 

[WoWfan]

simple, Ignia stated that he gave Natsu the chance to eat his power via his flames, and that it has been stated multiple times that DG are on Acno's level and that Ignia was using his top tier power by Merc who was stated it was a miracle that Elima is still standing, no indication that he was holding back

 

[Axiomus]

Merc did not even go all out, where as he only had half his power compared to Dragon God level Natsu with Ignia's flame. I do not doubt that it would steam role Skullion but that is hardly relevant as igneel is not on the same level as Acno nor DGs. and with that, even at half strength, Merc would still be enough to defeat Igneel at that time. Igneel had no better performance as as he could not defeat Acno and Acno beat him twice in full and partially weakened state. NAtus had the full powers of a DG so that is uncomparable to Igneel. Those scars were recent as he did not have them when he met with Zeref and was given Natsu. That implies relevance that leads to this point. You have forgotten that Merc was at half strength and Natsu was full power DG level which outmatches even Igneel at prime. He did not even state it was partially his power, it's not the manner of how much effor he put in, it is the level of his power which is already DG. It was not implied he held back, it was simply a miracle, again that is based on assumptions.

Mercphobia had a far worse fight against Skullion than Igneel-powered Natsu had against Zeref.

Even if I give you that Ignia-powered Natsu is on Acnologia's level and stronger than Igneel, that still doesn't change the fact that Igneel out-performed Mercphobia. Igneel had the best performance anyone has ever had against Acnologia. He ripped off an arm and crippled him. This was one of the things that allowed Natsu to beat him later on. No other dragon or opponent has managed to do this type of damage to Acnologia's dragon form before or since. Half-powered Mercphobia lost against Natsu, which means he would lose against Acnologia too. Mercphobia couldn't so much as scratch Natsu, much less inflict a crippling injury. When you put Igneel and Mercphobia up against the same level of opponent, Igneel puts up a better fight.

 

[LaGOAT]

simple, Ignia stated that he gave Natsu the chance to eat his power via his flames, and that it has been stated multiple times that DG are on Acno's level and that Ignia was using his top tier power by Merc who was stated it was a miracle that Elima is still standing, no indication that he was holding back

That doesn’t make sense how is a pinch of flames enough for natsu to be at ancologia level? 2. It was only stated to by the old guy which again I have doubt with. If that is really a top attack by ignia(which I doubt it was) that isn’t close to a ancologia tier attack a half powered merc was able wash most of it away

 

[Samael Morningstar]

Merc wasn't just at 50℅ of his powers but at the same time was also not in his right mind

 

[WoWfan]

Merc was not even 50% in his fight with Skullion, we know he wasn’t at his full power against Skullion, he was definitely stronger in his berserk state which is 50%. Igneel did not outperformed Merc as he failed to kill Acnologia both times. Mer and the other DGs could very well have been able to do such a thing since they are at the same level as base Acno. Ignia Powered Natsu was the same level as a DG as Ignia stared that he gave him his power temporarily, Natsu would develop on his own. Merc lost because he was not at his top tier power. Merc would go either way with Acno at his full power, Igneel at full power lost before.

Laxus[/USER]], Any spell no matter how large or small has their own level of effectiveness which can be determined through scaling. Just like how top tier FT members have defeated large country level characters

 

[LaGOAT]

Merc wasn't just at 50℅ of his powers but at the same time was also not in his right mind

Neither is the 2/3 of fairy tail by ur logic of natsu beat gajeel it’s because gajeel isn’t in his “right mind” being mind control doesn’t change ur strength prowess

 

[WoWfan]

That could likely be the case as magic is powered through emotions or feelings or focused through a particular mental state

 

[Axiomus]

Merc was not even 50% in his fight with Skullion, we know he wasn’t at his full power against Skullion, he was definitely stronger in his berserk state which is 50%. Igneel did not outperformed Merc as he failed to kill Acnologia both times. Mer and the other DGs could very well have been able to do such a thing since they are at the same level as base Acno. Ignia Powered Natsu was the same level as a DG as Ignia stared that he gave him his power temporarily, Natsu would develop on his own. Merc lost because he was not at his top tier power. Merc would go either way with Acno at his full power, Igneel at full power lost before.

Laxus[/USER]], Any spell no matter how large or small has their own level of effectiveness which can be determined through scaling. Just like how top tier FT members have defeated large country level characters

You say that Igneel failed to kill Acnologia, but Mercphobia hasn't actually beaten anyone either. He couldn't kill Skullion and he couldn't kill Natsu. Mercphobia couldn't even lay a scratch on Ignia-powered Natsu. How is he going to tear an arm off from Acnologia, whom you say is the same level as Natsu with Ignia's flames? Igneel could at least fight Acnologia for 20 minutes before being defeated. Mercphobia lasted like 5 minutes against Natsu after he ate the flames. Igneel could bloody up Acnologia during the fight. Mercphobia couldn't do any significant damage to Natsu. Igneel went down taking an arm from Acnologia. Mercphobia just went down.

 

[WoWfan]

Merc is clearly stronger than anyone else even while 50% though, while Ignia is at full power, it is only with his power for Natsu that allowed him to have the strength to beat a half strength Merc though. there is a diference between 1/2 and full, you can't simply go to one extreme or another. Igneel's battle is based on futility that he cannot defeat Acnologia. Again, Merc is 1/2 strength when Ignia is at full strength, there is a huge difference. yet Igneel could not defeat Acnologia. Merc was also not in the right mind unlike Igneel was when he was in character, there is another difference as well.

 

[Arjuna]

Merc was clearly at the same or weaker than Ignia who is turn is the biological son of Igneel

so Prime Igneel > Merc,not to mention he tore off Acnologia's arm even in half dead state,definitely above any feat of Merc.

 

[WoWfan]

Dragon Gods = Base Acnologia > Prime Igneel based on that he was defeated before 400 years ago, Ignia clearly got stronger as he was alive to become so.

 

[Arjuna]

Lol no Igneel never fought Acnologia in the past

Otherwise Metalicana would not have been so surprised at Igneel failing to defeat Acnologia in the present if Prime Igneel had already fought Acnologia in the past.

Spoiler

 

[WoWfan]

you are forgetting that Igneel has scars in his face in the present when we have never seen scars in the past, especially not even before taking Natsu in an during his training and raising him. He never showed any surprise which implied that this was not the first time he fought him.