Fall NFL Thread

[xi0]

The officiating at large has been suspect this entire season. Browns were unlucky this game but that was far from the only really questionable call... I guess it was "even" because we both got fucked at different times. But that play is the prime example of why you take the ball into the endzone, whether the whistle is blown or not.

What do you think about people calling for Tomlin's head again? @Jammin

 

[Jammin]

The officiating at large has been suspect this entire season. Browns were unlucky this game but that was far from the only really questionable call... I guess it was "even" because we both got fucked at different times. But that play is the prime example of why you take the ball into the endzone, whether the whistle is blown or not.

There are different types of terrible calls though. Many are excusable and some just aren't. The Browns and Steelers both got hit by those kind of calls this year.

What do you think about people calling for Tomlin's head again? @Jammin

In a word, absurd. Don't get me wrong I think there is a case to be made for a change at head coach but not for the reasons people are saying right now. Emotions are high and this is just the result. He did something stupid with that fake field goal but one bad decision is not a big deal to me.

A larger issue with Tomlin are his problems as a game day coach. He never makes half time adjustments. He always just says "we need to execute better" which is rarely the whole truth. Sometimes the gameplan needs tweaked and he just doesn't do that. The other is general sloppiness. Ever since he's been head coach, the Steelers have played down to their competition. Sometimes they just don't show up ready to play. And that's on him. The final thing is how non-confrontational he is with the refs. If it was Harbaugh getting those calls we got he'd be throwing a tantrum. Tomlin just stands there and accepts it.

Are those reasons enough to move on from a head coach though? I don't think so. There are more like flaws I would like him to address and become a better coach for us going forward. What he's done in talent development has still been outstanding for us and that's easy to forget.

 

[xi0]

There are different types of terrible calls though. Many are excusable and some just aren't. The Browns and Steelers both got hit by those kind of calls this year.

Idk, I think more and more teams can say this sort of thing every year. I forget the particulars for you guys though.

A larger issue with Tomlin are his problems as a game day coach. He never makes half time adjustments. He always just says "we need to execute better" which is rarely the whole truth. Sometimes the gameplan needs tweaked and he just doesn't do that. The other is general sloppiness. Ever since he's been head coach, the Steelers have played down to their competition. Sometimes they just don't show up ready to play. And that's on him. The final thing is how non-confrontational he is with the refs. If it was Harbaugh getting those calls we got he'd be throwing a tantrum. Tomlin just stands there and accepts it.

Working the refs is sort of a fool's errand though, and could have the opposite effect. Working yourself into a tantrum can detract from things you can control, like clock management, something John has been downright awful at at times. That seems to have improved since Jackson has started though. I'd rather have a more even-tempered coach than not. A lot of the time John is screaming at the ref when replays show the opposite.

 

[Jammin]

Working the refs is sort of a fool's errand though, and could have the opposite effect. Working yourself into a tantrum can detract from things you can control, like clock management, something John has been downright awful at at times. That seems to have improved since Jackson has started though. I'd rather have a more even-tempered coach than not. A lot of the time John is screaming at the ref when replays show the opposite.

The squeaky wheel gets the oil sometimes.

It's just hard to go from Bill Cower who was an all time great scream at the refs guy. To Tomlin who just stoically nods his head to everything.

 

[xi0]

The squeaky wheel gets the oil sometimes.

It's just hard to go from Bill Cower who was an all time great scream at the refs guy. To Tomlin who just stoically nods his head to everything.

I guess he doesn't want to work them too hard, otherwise he couldn't get away with stuff like this...

 

[Jammin]

I guess he doesn't want to work them too hard, otherwise he couldn't get away with stuff like this...

This is what happens if your suppress your emotions. They come out in a unhealthy way.

If only he knew somebody who was more adept at expressing their feelings.

That ref is scared for his life right there.

 

[xi0]

What has happened to this league and division? A Ravens and a Steelers fan advocating for eachothers head coach...

 

[Jammin]

What has happened to this league and division? A Ravens and a Steelers fan advocating for eachothers head coach...

It's a sad day.

Even more damning is that if they hooked the pair of us up to lie detectors and asked who would we rather have for the next 5 years, our current QBs or the Browns QB, what the hell would we say?

I mean, Roethlesburger is still good but father time has his hand on the guy's shoulder at this point. And you've got a running QB. You know where that road ends. Where that road always ends.

 

[gnut]

Idk....Cam turned out pretty decent

 

[xi0]

It's a sad day.

Even more damning is that if they hooked the pair of us up to lie detectors and asked who would we rather have for the next 5 years, our current QBs or the Browns QB, what the hell would we say?

I mean, Roethlesburger is still good but father time has his hand on the guy's shoulder at this point. And you've got a running QB. You know where that road ends. Where that road always ends.

I'm not that down on Jackson honestly. I think Morningwheg''s play-calling is going with what he can excel with right now. He's actually deceptively good at throwing down the middle, but designed QB runs tend to break passing rhythm regardless of how successful it's been. There's obviously a lot of room to improve, but I'll worry more a year or two down the road after a couple offseasons/training camps.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 1, 2019, Original Post Date: Jan 1, 2019 ---

Idk....Cam turned out pretty decent

Jackson is way more elusive than him, but has questionable accuracy on some throws. To my eyes, when Jackson plays he's almost always the fastest person on the field, so Vick is probably a better comparison. If Vick had the Raven's defense he'd probably have a ring, so I think Jackson can succeed in this league, just have doubts about his longevity running 15-20 times a game.

 

[Jammin]

Idk....Cam turned out pretty decent

Different type of runner and passer. Like xio said, Lamar is more like Vick or RGIII. Which is always a nail biter because they burn really bright, right up until they burn out. That's the problem with running QBs. A little bad luck on the injury front and they are just done.

 

[xi0]

All of these guys are greater risks than usual, Newton included. You can look to someone like Roethlisberger as an example - big target, probably going to take a lot of punishment, will need extra detergent for his uniform every Sunday. Ben plays hurt though, maybe because more tends to be on the line with his team. I'm not sure if Cam is quite as durable, and he definitely had issues leaving himself open for hits too.

To compare Jackson to Vick though, Vick only had one really significant injury in his NFL career though. Missed two seasons due to jail time, etc. If he had stayed in Atlanta, who knows where his career could have gone. Although, I guess I shouldn't put much faith in their ability to build a defense to compliment their offense and really do a lot in the postseason, since aside from 2016 all of the talent they've had on the offensive side of ball has been pretty squandered. Another thing that gets mostly overlooked with Vick is that he was left-handed, which can also have an effect on someone's productivity if the personnel/scheme isn't handled very well. Not really an issue there with Jackson.

But who knows, maybe the league will adjust to Jackson eventually and he'll be the guy throwing multiple picks every game, I don't know. All I know is that these last 6 games have been a huge pickmeup for this team. It might have saved Harbaugh his job (though I have my doubts Bisciotti would have fired him so soon given how long he put up with Biliick's shit).

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 1, 2019, Original Post Date: Jan 1, 2019 ---

Wtf is with Pittsburgh and headcase wide receivers though? I know they don't seem to put paying them as a high priority, but jeez

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 1, 2019 ---

Also, I think the RGIII comparison is a bit off as well. Sure, Griffin was a track star, but he was a sprinter. I never saw the same sort of lateral explosion that Jackson has or Vick had honestly.

 

[Jammin]

Wtf is with Pittsburgh and headcase wide receivers though? I know they don't seem to put paying them as a high priority, but jeez.

Diva players. Raven's don't really have that problem because, no offense, but your wide receivers are usually pretty terrible. Steelers has such good spotting talent development on offense that these guys get to be to be pro bowlers and it goes to their head. Over and over. I feel like it's just a natural cycle.

Also, I think the RGIII comparison is a bit off as well. Sure, Griffin was a track star, but he was a sprinter. I never saw the same sort of lateral explosion that Jackson has or Vick had honestly.

That's fair. RGIII was also a better thrower of the football too though he just couldn't read a defense very well.

 

[xi0]

Diva players. Raven's don't really have that problem because, no offense, but your wide receivers are usually pretty terrible. Steelers has such good spotting talent development on offense that these guys get to be to be pro bowlers and it goes to their head. Over and over. I feel like it's just a natural cycle.

We've had too many good ones for me to label them terrible as a group. But there is definitely a trend with us drafting busts in the first round - Travis Taylor, Mark Clayton, Breshad Perriman. I would say that's Ozzy Newsome's one shortcoming as a GM, he never really drafted well at that position. Torrey Smith wasn't a first round pick, and he did have some impact on our Super Bowl run. But he's not really the kind of lasting talent you see at WR on other teams either. I guess the position is a risk to commit first round money too, but it would be nice to finally draft a stud at that position one year lol.

Otherwise we'll sign middle of the road free agents (like our current group of Crabtree, Brown, and Snead) or older veterans like Derrick Mason, Anquan Boldin, Steve Smith, Mike Wallace, etc.

 

[Jammin]

How bad does this have to get @xi0 before you want to see Harbaugh tap Flacco on the shoulder? 3 turnovers? 4?

Your defense is playing amazing right now but Lamar was just killing you guys in the first quarter. Which sucks because I want the Ravens to advance because I think the Patriots are terrified of your team more than any other.

 

[xi0]

How bad does this have to get @xi0 before you want to see Harbaugh tap Flacco on the shoulder? 3 turnovers? 4?

Your defense is playing amazing right now but Lamar was just killing you guys in the first quarter. Which sucks because I want the Ravens to advance because I think the Patriots are terrified of your team more than any other.

Yeah, he picked the worst time ever to play like a rookie... after 8 weeks.

The line had their hands tied a lot as well, and he was taking sacks that he usually would avoid. Like he suddenly became human or something, I don't know. I think if Harbaugh was open to benching Jackson it should have happened at halftime and no later really.

 

[Jammin]

Yeah, he picked the worst time ever to play like a rookie... after 8 weeks.

The line had their hands tied a lot as well, and he was taking sacks that he usually would avoid. Like he suddenly became human or something, I don't know. I think if Harbaugh was open to benching Jackson it should have happened at halftime and no later really.

Amazing defensive performance though. Just keeping them in the game with that kind of QB play is an achievement. They really did everything you could ask of them.

 

[M3J]

Fuck the Pats. THat was a great game though.

 

[Jammin]

That.. was the worst Superbowl I've ever seen.

I'm a fan of defensive play too but that was just an abomination. You really got to feel bad for Saints fans right now. They would have won this game. I feel very certain of that.

 

[xi0]

Yeah, I dozed off during halftime