One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[jaymizzo]

Context bud.

Attack missing is the key which some of you don't seem to grasp and can't distinguish from "I missed".

Attacking missing can mean both failure to aim accurate and opponent evading depending on context.

I missed doesn't have that, I missed simply means one failed to aim accurately. When one says "I", in any context, they're referring to themselves in relation to the verb.

The very fact it says "I" "missed" implies missing is the fault of the attacker, not the opponent being aimed at or the attack.

It's really not rocket science.

Only reason I'm having to dissect it is because the nuances are not well understood despite it being so obvious.

Huge difference between "I missed" and "It missed/attack missed".

The fact that you are going to such depth makes it seem like it's rocket science.

I missed, attack missed, someone dodged, are the same.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

That being said I think the rooftop supernovas can only be stopped by commanders(yc1 and yc2) admirals and yonkous after this battle
And probably going to have to be a team up of commanders for them

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

The fact that you are going to such depth makes it seem like it's rocket science.

I missed, attack missed, someone dodged, are the same.

Nope, they're not the same. This is why in the English language, there are "synonyms" which mean the same in general, but have subtle differences.

Nodding and saying Yes could mean the same thing, difference however is one is a physical action and one is speech, mean the same, yet have differences.

There's also this thing called context and people don't seem to grasp that.

I missed and someone dodging are not exactly the same thing, there are still differences and more so within context.

 

[XXGenesis]

Zoro would own Queen.
King would be more difficult.
Zoro easily without Enma and pushed to his limit was VC3 , close to V2 hands down.

Probably slightly weaker than Doffy, but would deal with Cracker a 1 trick Pony.

With Enma He’s V1+, his power output able to damage Yonkou, Block & endure 2 Yonkou’s attack, and still preform shortly after.

Even Luffy would have a hard time defeating Zoro. Luffy is above The commander lv

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

It's been a while, Hannibal. I hope you're doing well : ) I see your point, but Kaido could have moved back to his position after the dodge

However, there's no evidence he moved meaning he simply missed.

There's no Sound effect to indicate a change in direction, there's no line or trail to show movement or change in position and there's no statement to claim a change in direction.

More so, Kaido's perspective or point of view is the same. There's nothing really suggesting Kaido moved back to the same position and it wouldn't make much sense either.

 

[goldb]

There's been a lot of time spent on this particular topic and I can't help but think it really isn't that deep lol.

I'm sure there are better things to discuss, so let's stop there. I especially don't want to see any insults or trolling.

 

[jaymizzo]

Nope, they're not the same. This is why in the English language, there are "synonyms" which mean the same in general, but have subtle differences.

Nodding and saying Yes could mean the same thing, difference however is one is a physical action and one is speech, mean the same, yet have differences.

There's also this thing called context and people don't seem to grasp that.

I missed and someone dodging are not exactly the same thing, there are still differences and more so within context.

We grasp context, it's just that digging into those differences is not necessary. For most, they will mean the same thing because they can be interchangeable.

 

[I Am Atomic]

We grasp context, it's just that digging into those differences is not necessary. For most, they will mean the same thing because they can be interchangeable.

Would disagree on this. Context does matter in this particular case, purely because he is using Enma!
If Kaido dodged as many claim, then Zoro hasn't done anything wrong.
If Zoro missed, then its due to his lack of control of Enma. So, Zoro still need to get his haki under control.

So, depending on what you believe happened, there are 2 different conclusions to it.

 

[Rmstorm]

Zoro would own Queen.
King would be more difficult.
Zoro easily without Enma and pushed to his limit was VC3 , close to V2 hands down.

Probably slightly weaker than Doffy, but would deal with Cracker a 1 trick Pony.

With Enma He’s V1+, his power output able to damage Yonkou, Block & endure 2 Yonkou’s attack, and still preform shortly after.

Even Luffy would have a hard time defeating Zoro. Luffy is above The commander lv

No, Luffy is a bad match up for Zoro. He would have an easy time against Zoro.

He would struggle more with Sanji than Zoro, as Sanji has got extreme speed, flight and good observation haki + agility.

Zoro is very slow, has no mobility and lack agility.


He has also got bad endurance when he is attacked directly on his body.

He needs to work on his other attributes.
It is why he cannot hit kaido while attacking him point blank range and oda gives him slow big opponents.

Zoro is all attack power but lacks a lot in the other apsects.

Luffy mid diffs Zoro at the most, more than likeoy low diffs him.

Especially if he uses Gear 4 Snakeman with Future sight and Internal destruction haki.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

We grasp context, it's just that digging into those differences is not necessary. For most, they will mean the same thing because they can be interchangeable.

It is necessary because we have people claiming Kaido dodged without evidence.

For example, Kaido shot a blast at Luffy.
It didn't hit.
Is it because Kaido missed? No.
The attack was accurate, and because Luffy dodge...

• THE attack missed.
• Kaido didn't miss.

And if one were to say Kaido missed just to get technical, they'd have to add Kaido missed BECAUSE Luffy dodged it.

Context is very important.

As Zoro said... "I missed" without saying anything about Kaido, we know he missed simply due to the fact Enma's a Sword he's not mastered and it uses more power than required when not controlled properly.

 

[Monox D. I-Fly]

I missed doesn't have that, I missed simply means one failed to aim accurately. When one says "I", in any context, they're referring to themselves in relation to the verb.

Guys, if we're talking about words, can someone just show the original Japanese version and asks them about its interpretation viewed by Japanese language? Though unfortunately, my Japanese isn't good enough for that. But as far as I remember, the Japanese language rarely uses subjects in their sentences.

 

[Deleted member 169696]

Guys, if we're talking about words, can someone just show the original Japanese version and asks them about its interpretation viewed by Japanese language? Though unfortunately, my Japanese isn't good enough for that. But as far as I remember, the Japanese language rarely uses subjects in their sentences.

It doesn't really matter, but it says the same thing: I missed or it (the attack) missed.

As to why it doesn't matter:

Big Mom's words in the panel before Zoro says that he missed:

"You really underestimated him (Zoro)."

Why would she say that? Because Kaido didn't even try to dodge the attack. He stayed in the same exact position.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Big Mom's words in the panel before Zoro says that he missed:

"You really underestimated him (Zoro)."

This was a translation error by the spoiler provider which is a zoro fan boi.

She says, "We've underestimated THEM" not HIM(Zoro)

 

[Deleted member 169696]

This was a translation error by the spoiler provider which is a zoro fan boi.

She says, "We've underestimated THEM" not HIM(Zoro)

It's the same thing in Japanese though. No pronouns mentioned in that panel. It literally says "underestimated".

But either way I'm not trying to exalt Zoro here. Just saying that with the context that we have it was Zoro who missed and Kaido didn't even try to dodge the attack.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

So in the end, Kaido hasn't been worried about getting damaged until now while facing Luffy in a breif one on one.
Even more noteworthy is the fact that Kaido is in his hybrid form. He's been damaged well in his human form, and then some more in his dragon form. If this doesn't work for Kaido, he'll likely lose this battle (especially as Big Mom won't be around anymore).
He's in full time serious mode now. No more free hits especially for Luffy.

I'm really hoping Zoro isn't too badly damaged (he almost committed suicide trying to save his captain). He's already bleeding from his nose and mouth. He's done fantastically well only second to Luffy in terms of damage output.

Law has been balling so good he hasn't taken a single real damage. He's done well not to overexert himself but I feel now is the time he'll have to do even more as Kaido will be looking to crush them all. It's hard to say who's more reliable between Law and Zoro. But Law has the edge due to that wizardry df of his.

Kidd and Killer still have to show some more stuff but they've really been impressive. I'm expecting more from this duo.

 

[XXGenesis]

So in the end, Kaido hasn't been worried about getting damaged until now while facing Luffy in a breif one on one.
Even more noteworthy is the fact that Kaido is in his hybrid form. He's been damaged well in his human form, and then some more in his dragon form. If this doesn't work for Kaido, he'll likely lose this battle (especially as Big Mom won't be around anymore).
He's in full time serious mode now. No more free hits especially for Luffy.

I'm really hoping Zoro isn't too badly damaged (he almost committed suicide trying to save his captain). He's already bleeding from his nose and mouth. He's done fantastically well only second to Luffy in terms of damage output.

Law has been balling so good he hasn't taken a single real damage. He's done well not to overexert himself but I feel now is the time he'll have to do even more as Kaido will be looking to crush them all. It's hard to say who's more reliable between Law and Zoro. But Law has the edge due to that wizardry df of his.

Kidd and Killer still have to show some more stuff but they've really been impressive. I'm expecting more from this duo.

After the damage Luffy & Zoro has taken. I think they may sit out for a while......If not Luffy. Definitely Zoro.

Luffy I hope with the other captains pull out a combo on Kaido, Those last 2 atttacks should make him more serious cause he caught the last one without blocking

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

After the damage Luffy & Zoro has taken. I think they may sit out for a while......If not Luffy. Definitely Zoro.

Luffy I hope with the other captains pull out a combo on Kaido, Those last 2 atttacks should make him more serious cause he caught the last one without blocking

Yeah we don't know the situation with Luffy yet. It'll be really underwhelming if he and Zoro are out for even a short period. They've done the most work so far. I can understand Zoro being out shortly but Luffy is the key to defeating Kaido as it stands. It'll only spell doom if he too gets badly damaged.

 

[M3J]

So in the end, Kaido hasn't been worried about getting damaged until now while facing Luffy in a breif one on one.
Even more noteworthy is the fact that Kaido is in his hybrid form. He's been damaged well in his human form, and then some more in his dragon form. If this doesn't work for Kaido, he'll likely lose this battle (especially as Big Mom won't be around anymore).
He's in full time serious mode now. No more free hits especially for Luffy.

I'm really hoping Zoro isn't too badly damaged (he almost committed suicide trying to save his captain). He's already bleeding from his nose and mouth. He's done fantastically well only second to Luffy in terms of damage output.

Law has been balling so good he hasn't taken a single real damage. He's done well not to overexert himself but I feel now is the time he'll have to do even more as Kaido will be looking to crush them all. It's hard to say who's more reliable between Law and Zoro. But Law has the edge due to that wizardry df of his.

Kidd and Killer still have to show some more stuff but they've really been impressive. I'm expecting more from this duo.

I think Zoro and Luffy can still keep going though, it usually takes a lot more damage for them to go down during a fight, and they usually finally conk out after fights or when they think others are safe.

Though resting out of exhaustion... maybe that's a different story.

 

[LaGOAT]

zoro is really the goat this man might be reached admiral tier for ppl that are upset about luffy able to hurt kaido did yall not forget that he first hit on kaido was able to hurt him ? i mean it isnt surprising that kaido had to dodge it plus he trained for 2 weeks

 

[neomaster121]

Zoro can fight 1vs 1 against an admiral. tbh think he could have 1vs 1 kaido