One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Katakuri may have been more versatile with future sight during the fight but by the time it was done luffy was clearly stronger. Luffy with any future sight beats katakuri which he had by the end of the fight.

Nah it was clear that during the fight that kata was essentially luffy 2.0 , harder armament, better mastery of his fruit , better Gatlings
Plus he was still drawing with snake man really

however I do agree that start of wnao luffy was YC1 level

 

[albertwv]

I'm not downplaying Katakuri at all. Again, I am address how YC1's each have a special ability that kept them apart from other YC's and Luffy was missing that. An ability to keep them in a fight longer than run of the mill fighters.

Marco has regen
King got his wings
Katakuri has FS

To address that Luffy was barely a YC1 at Udon just isn't right.

Despite Katakuri winning, if you placed Luffy with the skills he developed throughout the fight, at 100% and Katakuri at 100% Luffy would have won outright. Their fight was very, very, close despite there being a clear winner.

If you disagree overall we are just going to have to agree to disagree. All good

Yeah but even without his FS Kata could still be YC1, his strong COA and mastery of DF is something we havent seen anyone else use outside of ACoA.
King's specialty will be his fire I believe not his wings.

100% Luffy vs 100% Kata will still have Kata being the winner. Their fight was NOT close. We have all been explaining that to you but you are ignoring all that. The little FS that Luffy learned during their fight was NOT enough to defeat Kata. Luffy managed to dodge like 1/5 hits with his new FS but it was not enough. Luffy's CoA was inferior to Katas CoA.

Please go reread the fight and you will see Luffy has a clear disadvantage throughout the whole fight.
Luffy would have been slaughtered if Brulee wasnt there, if Gats and the Gladiators were not there, if Nami wasnt there, etc. Luffy was never YC1 level until Udon.
I can argue that even Beginning Wano Luffy is close but lower than Kata's level. Can you say Luffy's CoA was superior to Kata's when he arrived to Wano or even his FS?

Luffy's will won him that fight not his strength.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Yeah but even without his FS Kata could still be YC1, his strong COA and mastery of DF is something we havent seen anyone else use outside of ACoA.
King's specialty will be his fire I believe not his wings.

100% Luffy vs 100% Kata will still have Kata being the winner. Their fight was NOT close. We have all been explaining that to you but you are ignoring all that. The little FS that Luffy learned during their fight was NOT enough to defeat Kata. Luffy managed to dodge like 1/5 hits with his new FS but it was not enough. Luffy's CoA was inferior to Katas CoA.

Please go reread the fight and you will see Luffy has a clear disadvantage throughout the whole fight.
Luffy would have been slaughtered if Brulee wasnt there, if Gats and the Gladiators were not there, if Nami wasnt there, etc. Luffy was never YC1 level until Udon.
I can argue that even Beginning Wano Luffy is close but lower than Kata's level. Can you say Luffy's CoA was superior to Kata's when he arrived to Wano or even his FS?

Luffy's will won him that fight not his strength.

Honestly this is the first time I encountered more than 1 person saying Luffy wasn't YC1 level after the Katakuri fight.

I'm honestly surprised

 

[albertwv]

Honestly this is the first time I encountered more than 1 person saying Luffy wasn't YC1 level after the Katakuri fight.

I'm honestly surprised

Initially I believed Luffy was YC1 after WCI, but with current events, I bumped him down to YC2 during his first fight with Kaido.
Plus as I mentioned I dont see Luffys CoA or FS defeating Kata until Luffy learned AdCoA.

Another thing is, I dont see Kaido one shotting King, Katakuri, and Marcos who all are YC1.
Big Mom two shotted Queen a YC2. But could not do the same to Marcos.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Initially I believed Luffy was YC1 after WCI, but with current events, I bumped him down to YC2 during his first fight with Kaido.
Plus as I mentioned I dont see Luffys CoA or FS defeating Kata until Luffy learned AdCoA.

Another thing is, I dont see Kaido one shotting King, Katakuri, and Marcos who all are YC1.
Big Mom two shotted Queen a YC2. But could not do the same to Marcos.

Yeah I recalled us agreeing he was YC1 a while ago so I was pretty confused. You aren't the only one that bumped him down apparently

 

[Ellenate]

You aren't the only one that bumped him down apparently

I mean...

His performance during wci was shockingly bad.

G4 proved to be even LESS useful than during it debut
He got stonewalled by cracker
Katakuri out classing him


...and Wano has been nothing but a "knockout luffy" fest.

 

[grey matter]

I mean...

His performance during wci was shockingly bad.

G4 proved to be even LESS useful than during it debut
He got stonewalled by cracker
Katakuri out classing him


...and Wano has been nothing but a "knockout luffy" fest.

Against Cracker was because of lack of intel.
Luffy was about to one shot him with KKG but conveniently ran out of time just when he got rid of the biscuit warriors and was about to land the final blow.
With intel, Luffy would've won R1 against Cracker mid-high diff

No shame getting stomped by Katakuri. In fact it builds up hype for YC1. Luffy closed the gap by the end of the arc anyway, so it's a W for Luffy.

Getting KO'd by the strongest character in the verse. Why would that be disappointing?
Also, that one shot of G4 Luffy is an outlier. Kaido can't seem to one shot anyone with Thunder Bagua in the raid

 

[Ellenate]

Against Cracker was because of lack of intel.
Luffy was about to one shot him with KKG but conveniently ran out of time just when he got rid of the biscuit warriors and was about to land the final blow.
With intel, Luffy would've won R1 against Cracker mid-high diff

No shame getting stomped by Katakuri. In fact it builds up hype for YC1. Luffy closed the gap by the end of the arc anyway, so it's a W for Luffy.

Getting KO'd by the strongest character in the verse. Why would that be disappointing?
Also, that one shot of G4 Luffy is an outlier. Kaido can't seem to one shot anyone with Thunder Bagua in the raid

Getting owned back-to-back doesn't build confidence...

If luffy hadn't looked like a chump for the past 2 arcs people would place him higher.

it's not even an opinion, it's just basic psychology.

---

as far as disappointment goes-

EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. of those loses were a mistake on Oda's part. Especially when he has him going up against the likes of kaido not too shortly after.


Cracker should've been an easy clap though exploiting his water weakness.
Katakuri should've been left to sanji (where then this germa/RS nonsense could've been pulled)
with luffy holding off (...not fighting/winning) against a crazed big mom

 

[Crimson Ice]

Luffy was on Katakuri's level at the end of their fight. Katakuri started damn near coaching him and flat out even says he doesn't think Luffy was that much weaker than him at one point, and IIRC that was before the very end. To say Luffy wasn't ON HIS LEVEL is pretty egregious. One of the goals of that fight was for Luffy to legitimately overcome Katakuri, sure, Katakuri's resolve in beating Luffy arguably wavered towards the end, but the intent was clear. Luffy was "YC1" level at the end of Whole Cake.

 

[albertwv]

Luffy was on Katakuri's level at the end of their fight. Katakuri started damn near coaching him and flat out even says he doesn't think Luffy was that much weaker than him at one point, and IIRC that was before the very end. To say Luffy wasn't ON HIS LEVEL is pretty egregious. One of the goals of that fight was for Luffy to legitimately overcome Katakuri, sure, Katakuri's resolve in beating Luffy arguably wavered towards the end, but the intent was clear. Luffy was "YC1" level at the end of Whole Cake.

I disagree. Luffy was not on Katas level after their fight. Its like saying Luffy is now on Kaidos level. Nope. We know he is not on Kaidos level because Kaido is tired and not fresh after fighting so many powerful foes.

Katakuri still outclassed Luffy's DF, Haki, and FS even when Luffy reached Wano. Not until Luffy learned Advanced CoA could Luffy actually beat Kata and it would still be a mid diff fight maybe even high diff. Katakuri would still have the upper hand on Kuri/Wano Luffy.

How do people fail to see that WCI Luffy was no way near Kata even in the end. Luffy in Snakeman was still getting outpaced by Kata, Luffys CoA was still no match for Katas
Here are a few examples of their fight, since people have forgotten how bad Luffy was being beaten.

These scenes show how much Katakuri beat down Luffy even after Luffy learned a bit of FS, as you can see Luffys haki was no match for kata's AND Kata clearly puts out more damage than Luffy

Now Snakeman vs Kata

Kata gets hit but you can see he still defends quickly and with CoA, showcasing that even in Snakeman, Kata is faster

Kata quickly figured out Snakeman, yeah sure Luffy "outclasses" Kata...lol

here it looks like they are equal but its just a straight brawl, though you can see near the end, Kata's CoA punch hurts Luffy's inferior punch

and finally we see Kata stop himself from falling forward choosing to let Luffy win because of Luffys resolve and let himself fall backwards.

Do take in account that Kata heavily injured himself with his trident to give Luffy a handicap, and yet even like that Luffy could not overpower Kata.
So then imagine a fresh round 2, with Luffy knowing a little bit more of FS, but CoA is still the same. Kata's attack power would still stomp Luffys AND his speed would still be able to dodge Snakemans attacks.

 

[Aki1991]

Katakuri was amazing

Better character than all other beast pirates

However, it seems that King might be even stronger, but I am not sure

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Man I think people think one piece is dbz where they want straight out our classing once someone is even a bit superior that sounds so boring

 

[Idkwhatanameis]

Luffy fighting kata again at 100% with the little bit of fs he knows puts him as the winner. His growth trumps every character for anyone saying kata would still be the winner just think about it if oda gave luffy and kata a break even if it’s just 12 hours making them 100 percent luffy would still come out the winner his fs would overlap kata’s for sure. So for the people saying kata would still win your wrong. His coa is strong but g4 still puts out enough power to put him out like a dead dog. Luffy didn’t use future sight at all with g4 if he did kata would be fodderized. People say the plot saved luffy but in reality the plot saved kata.
Btw start of wano luffy is essentially end of this fight luffy.

Man I think people think one piece is dbz where they want straight out our classing once someone is even a bit superior that sounds so boring

Idk where you get that from. I honestly think luffy wins extreme diff no out classing. You guys say kata would still beat luffy with fs. Show me a panel of g4 using future sight against kata. If g4 was enough to beat a generous katakuri I think future sight g4 would fix his plumbing with extreme difficulty
Btw those panels that the other guy showing katakuri dodging g4 snakeman was future sight it doesn’t mean he’s faster. He’s clearly defending at certain times cause he’s not faster

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

I disagree. Luffy was not on Katas level after their fight. Its like saying Luffy is now on Kaidos level. Nope. We know he is not on Kaidos level because Kaido is tired and not fresh after fighting so many powerful foes.

Katakuri still outclassed Luffy's DF, Haki, and FS even when Luffy reached Wano. Not until Luffy learned Advanced CoA could Luffy actually beat Kata and it would still be a mid diff fight maybe even high diff. Katakuri would still have the upper hand on Kuri/Wano Luffy.

How do people fail to see that WCI Luffy was no way near Kata even in the end. Luffy in Snakeman was still getting outpaced by Kata, Luffys CoA was still no match for Katas
Here are a few examples of their fight, since people have forgotten how bad Luffy was being beaten.

These scenes show how much Katakuri beat down Luffy even after Luffy learned a bit of FS, as you can see Luffys haki was no match for kata's AND Kata clearly puts out more damage than Luffy

Now Snakeman vs Kata

Kata gets hit but you can see he still defends quickly and with CoA, showcasing that even in Snakeman, Kata is faster

Kata quickly figured out Snakeman, yeah sure Luffy "outclasses" Kata...lol

here it looks like they are equal but its just a straight brawl, though you can see near the end, Kata's CoA punch hurts Luffy's inferior punch

and finally we see Kata stop himself from falling forward choosing to let Luffy win because of Luffys resolve and let himself fall backwards.

Do take in account that Kata heavily injured himself with his trident to give Luffy a handicap, and yet even like that Luffy could not overpower Kata.
So then imagine a fresh round 2, with Luffy knowing a little bit more of FS, but CoA is still the same. Kata's attack power would still stomp Luffys AND his speed would still be able to dodge Snakemans attacks.

Man you have an amazing understanding of the battle very few people did.

One most obvious thing people fail to notice is without the trident stab, Katakuri wasn't going down. Oda really had to end that fight as it was dragging on for too long and the Luffy beat down was bordering unbearable.

Remember Jimbe even said Luffy was "fighting for his life". He wasn't winning that.

Quick request: Where do you read the coloured these days? Wasn't able to anymore since my goto site back then (Kissmanga) got wiped off the internet.

 

[I Am Atomic]

but g4 still puts out enough power to put him out like a dead dog.

Kata quickly figured out Snakeman, yeah sure Luffy "outclasses" Kata...lol

Albert already answered you. G4 was overpowered by Katakuri's haki. I will explain so you can understand.
Luffy G4 and Katakuri both punch each other, but Luffy screams out in pain. What does that say? Katakuri hits harder (simple).

Also as an example, count how many times Luffy gets punched Vs Katakuri does get hit.

 

[Idkwhatanameis]

Man I think people think one piece is dbz where they want straight out our classing once someone is even a bit superior that sounds so boring

overpowered lmao funny guy. Yeah it hurt luffy because he’s not used to it but no where does it show it overpowered. Head canon

 

[Fox666]

Albert already answered you. G4 was overpowered by Katakuri's haki. I will explain so you can understand.
Luffy G4 and Katakuri both punch each other, but Luffy screams out in pain. What does that say? Katakuri hits harder (simple).

Also as an example, count how many times Luffy gets punched Vs Katakuri does get hit.

It seems to me they were equal.

Katakuri's arm exploded, so his Logia-esque ability protected him from damage.

Otherwise, I assume he would also feel pain?

 

[I Am Atomic]

It seems to me they were equal.

Katakuri's arm exploded, so his Logia-esque ability protected him from damage.

Otherwise, I assume he would also feel pain?

I am not going to argue about our perspective because each of us see instances differently.

But can you tell me where Katakuri's arm exploded? I think I might have missed that.

 

[Idkwhatanameis]

It's after the impact of the punch where both snakeman and katakuri made contact

 

[I Am Atomic]

It's after the impact of the punch where both snakeman and katakuri made contact

That's his right arm. It doesn't explode?

The exploded arm is the left arm, which he shoots off to punch Luffy. Katakuri has to shoot off his arm to reach Luffy since he couldn't match Luffy's speed otherwise.