One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[Rein Avara]

Seems like we turned this around to have a somewhat productive discussion, good job me

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 4, 2023, Original Post Date: Apr 4, 2023 ---

but Kaido is the stronger swordsman.

But Kaido isn't trained in the way of the blade nor does he honor it he's by all means a barbarian can we truly call him a swordsman?

Are swordsman for you guys anyone that wields a blade? So Say Luffy could use a blade in a fight and win would that then just qualify him to be a swordsman?

Me personally I feel that one needs to have the same dedication as the likes of Mihawk, Vista and Zoro in order to be truly classified as a swordsman, but hey ho it all falls down to personal interpretation.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 4, 2023 ---

Btw I'm not 100% sold on shanks being stronger than Mihawk just to clear up some confusion, I'm just not in the camp of Mihawk = WSS = Stronger than Shanks my pride will not allow me to believe that.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Seems like we turned this around to have a somewhat productive discussion, good job me

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 4, 2023, Original Post Date: Apr 4, 2023 ---

Btw I'm not 100% sold on shanks being stronger than Mihawk just to clear up some confusion, I'm just not in the camp of Mihawk = WSS = Stronger than Shanks my pride will not allow me to believe that.

I'm just in the camp that I know Shanks is stronger and if somehow it's proven Mihawk is stronger overall, I'll just take my L and adjust my debate accordingly.

 

[Ricko]

I think Mihawk can beat Shank without being "stronger" than him.

For exemple, against monster like Kaido, you need to have a hell of powerfull CoC haki.
We know that Shank got it, with is interaction with Greenbull, but it may not be the case of Mihawk.

In an human confrontation, Skill, battle IQ and speed may be more important than CoC.
That's why Mihawk is maybe superior to Shank and can win their duel.
But the same Mihawk will have difficulty against inhuman opponent (Kaido, Big Mom, Jozzu's ability, Buggy's ability...)
And Shank with his CoC mastery would deal with them easily, and make him overall stronger.

 

[M3J]

Mihawk > Shanks when it comes to swordsmanship
Shanks > Mihawk when it comes to overall fighting

That's how I interpret the titles and hypes.

For example, if Zoro and Luffy had a pure swords fight, Zoro would win because he's a master with swords. If Zoro and Luffy had a no-weapon fight, Luffy would win with some difficulty because he's excellent at brawling. If Zoro and Luffy had a all-out fight, it'd be a difficult fight for Luffy because his weakness is swords, and Zoro's haki can compete with Luffy's. Though Luffy's hella fast, how long can he keep up that speed, especially against Zoro's durability?

 

[Gangster Gastino]

Moria gonna come back to the story with his power level back to when he challenged Kaido

 

[albertwv]

Mihawk > Shanks when it comes to swordsmanship
Shanks > Mihawk when it comes to overall fighting

That's how I interpret the titles and hypes.

For example, if Zoro and Luffy had a pure swords fight, Zoro would win because he's a master with swords. If Zoro and Luffy had a no-weapon fight, Luffy would win with some difficulty because he's excellent at brawling. If Zoro and Luffy had a all-out fight, it'd be a difficult fight for Luffy because his weakness is swords, and Zoro's haki can compete with Luffy's. Though Luffy's hella fast, how long can he keep up that speed, especially against Zoro's durability?

This! Thank you.
Mihawk fans refuse to acknowledge that swordsmanship is a thing in OP.
I never claimed Mihawk was YC level but I stated facts that on screen manga best feat for Mihawk has been clashing with a YC (Vista).

We should stop using titles, narrative, and "EoS" as a way to scale characters.

 

[Fox666]

Mihawk clashing with Vista is something that fans have to ignore.

We always knew that Mihawk's powerlevel would be plotholish.

It's not different from Crocodile you know the rest.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Mihawk clashing with Vista is something that fans have to ignore.

We always knew that Mihawk's powerlevel would be plotholish.

It's not different from Crocodile you know the rest.

It's not even close to the Crocodile situation. Croc was retconned.

Vista is a proven elite swordsmen explained both within the manga and source materials. Mihawk himself acknowledged Vista as worthy of respect

 

[albertwv]

Mihawk clashing with Vista is something that fans have to ignore.

We always knew that Mihawk's powerlevel would be plotholish.

It's not different from Crocodile you know the rest.

They ignore it because its an inconvenience for them and makes their beloved Mihawk look weaker than he should be. Mihawk vs Vista isn't the same as Crocodile vs Mihawk.

I can see Mihawk being Admiral level

 

[Fox666]

It's not even close to the Crocodile situation. Croc was retconned.

No it wasn't

At the end of Arabasta, the Gorosei and everyone else acted like Crocodile's arrest meant the WG lost a world-tier asset

Crocodile's featS in Marineford are consistent with that

 

[M3J]

Can't we agree that Mihawk so far has not been serious? At least, up to Marineford? Doesn't indicate he's weak just because he didn't one-shot some named characters like Vista and Zoro.

 

[HereNThere]

"Interpretation" really is the magic word when it comes to Mihawk and Shanks. Even with the new information, we each still have a different way of dissecting it. If this was Oda's intent with the two, it looks like he's done a damn good job.

Mihawk clashing with Vista is something that fans have to ignore.

We always knew that Mihawk's powerlevel would be plotholish.

It's not different from Crocodile you know the rest.

No reason to ignore it. The two of them had a slight scuffle to test the waters against a fellow swordsman. It's unlikely that Vista is anywhere near Mihawk overall, but he's clearly talented enough to garner respect from him, enough so that he was interested in settling their duel another time. For all we know, Vista's comparable to Marco, who could hold off Big Mom for a brief period. Doesn't prove that he's on the level of a Great Pirate/Yonkou, but the two are decent enough to put in some work.

Can't we agree that Mihawk so far has not been serious? At least, up to Marineford? Doesn't indicate he's weak just because he didn't one-shot some named characters like Vista and Zoro.

I don't think anyone here thinks he's weak. We've only had one poster that is no longer here that didn't believe Mihawk wasn't among the strongest characters. Everyone just has their own opinions of where he ranks among that handful at the pinnacle.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Can't we agree that Mihawk so far has not been serious? At least, up to Marineford? Doesn't indicate he's weak just because he didn't one-shot some named characters like Vista and Zoro.

No one is saying he is weak because he couldn't one shot Vista. What I'm saying is that Vista is an elite swordsman said to have the swordskill that rival or may even surpass Mihawk's.

This hypes up Vista, not downplays Mihawk

Swordplay is simply another form of fighting in the One Piece world and both Mihawk and Vista are at the pinnacle of that form of combat

 

[1Sneeze1Kill]

Can Luffy actually defeat Garp? Garp seems he might be portrayed by Oda as strong as Kaido. Shanks is in the same league, there's no clear way to decide a winner between the 3: Shanks, Garp, Kaido

Does Oda ever reveal true power levels? Somewhat like Dragon Ball Z?

 

[Rein Avara]

Can Luffy actually defeat Garp? Garp seems he might be portrayed by Oda as strong as Kaido. Shanks is in the same league, there's no clear way to decide a winner between the 3: Shanks, Garp, Kaido

Does Oda ever reveal true power levels? Somewhat like Dragon Ball Z?

I think Luffy still wins, but it'll be a High to Extreme diff fight for him.
I don't imagine garp can consistently output that level of power for very long.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 5, 2023, Original Post Date: Apr 5, 2023 ---

Mind you I think Luffy will be able to take away alot from garp to apply to his own combat style (given that they both use fists to fight)

 

[kkck]

Can Luffy actually defeat Garp? Garp seems he might be portrayed by Oda as strong as Kaido. Shanks is in the same league, there's no clear way to decide a winner between the 3: Shanks, Garp, Kaido

Does Oda ever reveal true power levels? Somewhat like Dragon Ball Z?

Probably? Garp is old, even if he has aged better than WB odds are that he can't keep his full strength for long.

 

[Fox666]

Does Oda ever reveal true power levels? Somewhat like Dragon Ball Z?

Did it ever worked in Dragon Ball?

The entire point behind the Scouters was that they were not reliable, since Earthlings could control their power, and every time a character relied on them they got wrecked

 

[DeadlyBeast]

No one is saying he is weak because he couldn't one shot Vista. What I'm saying is that Vista is an elite swordsman said to have the swordskill that rival or may even surpass Mihawk's.

This hypes up Vista, not downplays Mihawk

Swordplay is simply another form of fighting in the One Piece world and both Mihawk and Vista are at the pinnacle of that form of combat

This actually reminds me that Ideo from SH Grandfleet is a boxing champion. Unlike the other World titles this had an actual tournament so its a lot more sports like. I think one can maybe argue that Ideo is the world's best boxer. But we clearly know he is not that strong compared to a lot of characters.

 

[Rmstorm]

I think Luffy still wins, but it'll be a High to Extreme diff fight for him.
I don't imagine garp can consistently output that level of power for very long.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 5, 2023, Original Post Date: Apr 5, 2023 ---

Mind you I think Luffy will be able to take away alot from garp to apply to his own combat style (given that they both use fists to fight)

Yes, chapter 955, 1026 and 1048 with Barjung Gun

Luffy is truly a hakiman. He has every single haki feat besides Observation haki killing.

955 below. That was with Adv CoA emission alone+ Internal destruction.

With Adv CoC added to that move, he could do what has done

Chapter 955 - He uses a flying fist

Chapter 1026- Uses it on Kaido's face

Luffy is truly a hakiman. He has every single haki feat besides Observation haki killing.

He even showed what did in chapter 955.

Luffy did long range communicaiton with haki in chapter 1015, like Shanks in chapter 1055

Luffy showed Wifi haki in chapter 1044, like Shanks did in chapter 1055.

One Piece Chapter 1044 | TCB Scans

onepiecechapters.com

Conquerors Haki -Can uses CoC haki while unconcious. Knock out many people at once, Can use it to tame animals. Can use it as a barrier for attack and defense.

Observstion haki- Can use Future Sight, normal haki precog, aura sensing, and emotion sen

 

[Fallou]

Can Luffy actually defeat Garp? Garp seems he might be portrayed by Oda as strong as Kaido. Shanks is in the same league, there's no clear way to decide a winner between the 3: Shanks, Garp, Kaido

Does Oda ever reveal true power levels? Somewhat like Dragon Ball Z?

I would say Luffy is at a level where if the story requires, he can beat anyone, regardless of the actual level of that person.

We’ve now passed the point where Oda had to make Luffy lose and be overpowered because otherwise the major players would have felt like jokes.

There was a point in the story where Luffy couldn’t be anything but helpless in front of an admiral, FI. I mean, just the barrier of them being logia’s was too much to overcome…

Now what barrier is there?
None.
He has all the necessary tools at his disposal: advanced kind of every haki sort and an awakened legendary DF. He can overcome any challenge.