One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[Pirate Queen]

I think it was somewhat implied that Big Mom sends her weakest commander to take care of intruders. First she sent Snack, then Cracker.

I think it was somewhat implied that Big Mom sends her weakest commander to take care of intruders. First she sent Snack, then Cracker.

Huh, I didnt get that impression. I though Smoothie was just in charge of the treasure room because BM knew Luffy was there.

Okay then.

 

[M3J]

It's weird, but it was mostly a set up for a joke. Mainly Queen's reaction when Big Mom returned to normal.

Not totally sure. From what we've seen, she has to physically squeeze something to get the juices out. She probably can't grasp air, unless, of course, has an awakened DF. Then she's probably could use an ability like that.

Oh, and her sword can dehydrate whatever it cuts. I think that was in a databook or SBS.

That's dumb.

Oh, that's confusing. Whatever, I guess we'll wait to see how Smoothie does in the manga.

 

[albertwv]

I personally dont like the fact that Jimbei joined the Straw Hats, I dont think he fits the profile, how every other SH had a childhood loss, so far as we know , Jimbei doesnt. Also him being in the SHs messes up the power scale among the Monster Trio, but we will most likely find out where he stands after this Arc.
I wish Oda wouldve just kept the original crew matchups like Enies Lobby instead of introducing all these new characters (Fleet Allies). I didnt like how Dressrosa matchups were made, I wish it wouldve been SHs vs. Doffy Family. We need to go back and see real fights from Usopp, Nami, Chopper, Robin, etc. Fishman Island does NOT count, that was trash. So hopefully this arc is like Enies Lobby.

Anyways, we should (if you havent already) just ignore Nik when it comes to Zoro just like we ignore Moe regarding Sanji. Nik has lost sense and gives a bad name to all Zoro fans. Im not even going to rebuttal his arguments anymore.

Regarding Smoothie, I agree with whoever said that she is the YC2 of the Big Mom Pirates. I know bounties dont typically equal strength, but I think it shows a ranking system within the crew. I put her above Jimbei because I dont think Jimbei is above YC level, yes he managed to push back Big Mom but that was it. I mean G3 Luffy managed to knock down Dragon form Kaido but we know that didnt do shit but managed to piss him off.

 

[M3J]

There's a difference between knocking down someone who didn't expect an attack and blocking a punch from a person who went berserk and pushing her back

 

[goldb]

I think it was somewhat implied that Big Mom sends her weakest commander to take care of intruders. First she sent Snack, then Cracker.

Big Mom did send Cracker after Urouge once he defeated Snack. Their bounties seem to a reflection of their strength. So there's a definite hierarchy among them.

Nothing has been officially confirmed besides us knowing that Katakuri is the strongest, but an educated guess would put Smoothie at no.2.

Oh, and her sword can dehydrate whatever it cuts. I think that was in a databook or SBS.

Yeah vol 89 SBS.

It's not the sword itself, to say it doesn't have any special abiltiies itself but yes It seems she transfer her ability to her weapon somehow.

There's a difference between knocking down someone who didn't expect an attack and blocking a punch from a person who went berserk and pushing her back

What are you referring to?

 

[nik87]

Except Blackbeard?

And we have characters like Garp, Sengoku, Chinjao.

Or, you know, the series protagonist.


Was that not only in the anime?

Spoiler

Blackbeard has a weapon but since he is setup for Luffy, conveniently he forgets about it.
Chinjao is small fry.
Garp and Sengoku have indeed fought a swordsman but it was off paneled, of course. Whenever barehanded vs swordsman happens it is off paneled, I have yet to see how that works on panel.
The series protagonist fights non-swordsmen always and when he does fight a swordsman, he eats biscuits.

Not anime, manga material, Zoro has shattered steel before Mr1 effortlessly.

Two Requests cover pages show us how barehanded vs swordsman looks like? I expected an actual battle...
@jaymizzo did you forget what flip-flops are?

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

It's not the sword itself, to say it doesn't have any special abiltiies itself but yes It seems she transfer her ability to her weapon somehow.

It means she is most likely awakened.

 

[M3J]

I put her above Jimbei because I dont think Jimbei is above YC level, yes he managed to push back Big Mom but that was it. I mean G3 Luffy managed to knock down Dragon form Kaido but we know that didnt do shit but managed to piss him off.

^^

What are you referring to?

Better than what Luffy did, all he and Sanji could do was stop her attacks but that was about it.

Jinbei feels like he can compete with a Yonkou commander, but I'm going by hype along with him showing his capability in the war.

 

[jaymizzo]

@jaymizzo did you forget what flip-flops are?

Like I've said many times, you are too predictable. If you don't like an outcome it's "plot element".

You clinged onto whiskey peak as some measure to Luffy and Zoro... Now you disregard it because it doesn't serve your argument.

Really can't take you seriously.

 

[Fox666]

Blackbeard has a weapon but since he is setup for Luffy, conveniently he forgets about it.
Chinjao is small fry.
Garp and Sengoku have indeed fought a swordsman but it was off paneled, of course. Whenever barehanded vs swordsman happens it is off paneled, I have yet to see how that works on panel.
The series protagonist fights non-swordsmen always and when he does fight a swordsman, he eats biscuits.

What exactly is your point? Swordsmen are stronger than everyone?

They aren't. We have seen swordsman fighting non-swordsman multiple times.

Not anime, manga material, Zoro has shattered steel before Mr1 effortlessly.

Could you please post the page?

Two Requests cover pages show us how barehanded vs swordsman looks like? I expected an actual battle...

Ok, what is the excuse for these pages?

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

 

[XXGenesis]

@nik87 You arent wrong that. Weapon users are naturaly much more of a threat, than a non weapon user. However just because your a weapon user in One Piece doesnt make you unbeatable or a problem for everyone.

Plenty of swordsman and weapon users still get they ass handed to them, by a unarmed combatant. Who's martial arts skill trumps their weapon skills...

Their are 3 main fighting styles in OP. DF powers, H2H, Weapons....Swords & Guns are the most common weapons, only notable swordsman have really been a threat. H2H combat still reigns supreme as well as DF powers.

 

[nik87]

Like I've said many times, you are too predictable. If you don't like an outcome it's "plot element".

Nah Mizzo-kun, It is definitely not plot element, flip-flops are known tool which stops swords.

What exactly is your point? Swordsmen are stronger than everyone?
They aren't. We have seen swordsman fighting non-swordsman multiple times.

My point is that barehanded combatants have never been shown fighting their equals who are swordsmen.

Could you please post the page?

Spoiler: as you wish

@nik87 You arent wrong that. Weapon users are naturaly much more of a threat, than a non weapon user. However just because your a weapon user in One Piece doesnt make you unbeatable or a problem for everyone.
Plenty of swordsman and weapon users still get they ass handed to them, by a unarmed combatant. Who's martial arts skill trumps their weapon skills...
Their are 3 main fighting styles in OP. DF powers, H2H, Weapons....Swords & Guns are the most common weapons, only notable swordsman have really been a threat. H2H combat still reigns supreme as well as DF powers.

I am not saying that swordsmen are unbeatable, I am saying that Oda pairs swordsmen with those who use weapons. We dont have a single full-fledged battle from start to finish, a battle to the death, between a barehanded combatant and a swordsman. Such battles only exist off-panel.
If we look how many figures are swordsmen it is pretty much safe bet to assume that Swordsmen reign supreme: Rocks, Shiki, Roger, Rayleigh, Shanks, Mihawk. All big names who have been fought against through weapons on panel and without weapon strictly off-panel. Coincidence? Not for me.

Ok, what is the excuse for these pages?

1. pedro vs tamago - is that a flying slash? Rankyaku?
2. luffy's way of dealing with swords is for swordsmen to place their swords on luffy's shoulder so he can grab it and break it? ok...
3. how is striking a biscuit helping you here?
4. zoro's zombie is just blocking a kick
5. i cant see what's happening in moriah vs jinbe but jinbe is so far above him that it doesnt matter (tashigi vs vergo)
6. chinjao's drill is just so much above Cabbage(another tashigi vs vergo)
7. jinbe's feat is pretty impressive but all he did was try to block single hit, imagine taking a barrage of such slices...
8. croc clashed with mihawk's weapon with his weapon, how is this helping you?
9. kizaru avoided one hit and zapped a almost dead wb

Do we have a single fight on panel, from start to finish, among ~equals and that they are barehanded and a swordsman?

 

[jaymizzo]

Spoiler: as you wish

Bruh, we know that sword grades make a massive difference in sword fights... The page you used explained why Zoro shattered Hachis sword...

 

[Sachsenhesse]

Bruh, we know that sword grades make a massive difference in sword fights... The page you used explained why Zoro shattered Hachis sword...

Swordgrades didnt matter in this scene, since two of the blades were fron yosaku and johnny.

 

[nik87]

Bruh, we know that sword grades make a massive difference in sword fights... The page you used explained why Zoro shattered Hachis sword...

That is Zoro breaking steel effortlessly and not doing shit to Mr1 but Luffy breaking steel apparently can do something to Mr1...

 

[Pirate Queen]

Bruh, we know that sword grades make a massive difference in sword fights... The page you used explained why Zoro shattered Hachis sword...

Not sure why the arguement eve matters, but in this scene in particular "weight" was being used in a figurative matter.

But Wado was most likely a higher grade than all those swords, I just don't think it was an issue at that particular time

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 5, 2020, Original Post Date: Apr 5, 2020 ---

Luffy would wreck Mr. 1 far quicker than Zoro did

 

[nik87]

Luffy would wreck Mr. 1 far quicker than Zoro did

Because he broke steel before Alabasta?

 

[XXGenesis]

Nah Mizzo-kun, It is definitely not plot element, flip-flops are known tool which stops swords.


My point is that barehanded combatants have never been shown fighting their equals who are swordsmen.

Spoiler: as you wish

I am not saying that swordsmen are unbeatable, I am saying that Oda pairs swordsmen with those who use weapons. We dont have a single full-fledged battle from start to finish, a battle to the death, between a barehanded combatant and a swordsman. Such battles only exist off-panel.
If we look how many figures are swordsmen it is pretty much safe bet to assume that Swordsmen reign supreme: Rocks, Shiki, Roger, Rayleigh, Shanks, Mihawk. All big names who have been fought against through weapons on panel and without weapon strictly off-panel. Coincidence? Not for me.


1. pedro vs tamago - is that a flying slash? Rankyaku?
2. luffy's way of dealing with swords is for swordsmen to place their swords on luffy's shoulder so he can grab it and break it? ok...
3. how is striking a biscuit helping you here?
4. zoro's zombie is just blocking a kick
5. i cant see what's happening in moriah vs jinbe but jinbe is so far above him that it doesnt matter (tashigi vs vergo)
6. chinjao's drill is just so much above Cabbage(another tashigi vs vergo)
7. jinbe's feat is pretty impressive but all he did was try to block single hit, imagine taking a barrage of such slices...
8. croc clashed with mihawk's weapon with his weapon, how is this helping you?
9. kizaru avoided one hit and zapped a almost dead wb

Do we have a single fight on panel, from start to finish, among ~equals and that they are barehanded and a swordsman?

1. Bro we already established Swords & Guns are the #1 weapon for anybody...

2. Your stance is that H2H ppl haven't fought strong swordsman...Bro Swordsman get owned all the time. Why do you act as if there is no counter for fighting against a swordsman.

3. Overall what is your stance and point you are trying to drive home are adamantly standing on? Swords are the #1 used/most effective weapon...Still yet there are stronger H2H or DF users.

Any opponent with a weapon is dangerous. Swords are the most common strongest reliable weapon . Doesnt stop swordsman from getting their ass kicked

 

[nik87]

1. Bro we already established Swords & Guns are the #1 weapon for anybody...
2. Your stance is that H2H ppl haven't fought strong swordsman...Bro Swordsman get owned all the time. Why do you act as if there is no counter for fighting against a swordsman.
3. Overall what is your stance and point you are trying to drive home are adamantly standing on? Swords are the #1 used/most effective weapon...Still yet there are stronger H2H or DF users.
Any opponent with a weapon is dangerous. Swords are the most common strongest reliable weapon . Doesnt stop swordsman from getting their ass kicked

Who fights with guns?
Who is owning those swordsmen? People much stronger than them?
Who are those stronger H2H/DF users than Swordsmen?

As I said, we have yet to see a swordsman getting their ass kicked by ~equal opponent, on panel.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Because he broke steel before Alabasta?

Steel isn't nearly as impressive in One Piece as some people make it out to be... breaking steel is not even something Luffy has to do to defeat Mr 1, though he's show he certainly can. All he has to do is damage steel, with is easily enough to do for someone who can punch as strong as Luffy.

If you slammed a sledgehammer into a solid steel beam, you are going to see far more damage than if you swung a sword at it with the same force.

Final piece that I'm sure someone will down play, if Mr. 1 is impervious to formed of blunt damage, why does he even bother to dodge Mr. 2?