One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[Fox666]

Spoiler

Agree on the bounty part but rank in a crew described power hierarchy

Spoiler

Not necessarily. Example is Blackbeard when he was part of the Whitebeard Pirates.

Besides, wasn't Apoo a spy on the aliance with Kid and Hawkins? He could't have a higher rant

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Spoiler

Not necessarily. Example is Blackbeard when he was part of the Whitebeard Pirates.

Besides, wasn't Apoo a spy on the aliance with Kid and Hawkins? He could't have a higher rant

BB is exception. I was talking for most cases on pirate crew

 

[Fox666]

Spoiler

BB is exception. I was talking for most cases on pirate crew

Spoiler

Apoo is also an exception. How is he going to be an All-Star or Flying Six, and still act as an double agent on the alliance with Kid?

Besides Apoo may be relatively new to the crew like Hawkins.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Spoiler

Apoo is also an exception. How is he going to be an All-Star or Flying Six, and still act as an double agent on the alliance with Kid?

Besides Apoo may be relatively new to the crew like Hawkins.

or, he became double agent coz he didn't have a shot to become all-star and thus he was assigned to different role
at this point, it's just guessing game. But i just don't think he is YC-tier. His bounty should be way higher than his current bounty if he is YC tier (increased strength 99% of all times means increased bounty)

 

[Fox666]

Spoiler

or, he became double agent coz he didn't have a shot to become all-star and thus he was assigned to different role
at this point, it's just guessing game. But i just don't think he is YC-tier. His bounty should be way higher than his current bounty if he is YC tier (increased strength 99% of all times means increased bounty)

Spoiler

As the author explained, the Yonko commanders bounties increase with their captain, since it's hard to assign individual bounties. That means their bounties are inflated.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Robin, Blueno, Moriah, Kuma, Law, Blackbeard, Fujitora, Oven and Shiryu

Plus Aokiji can freeze the entire place instantly

All require PHYSICAL movement/action that can be dodged, non of them work....

 

[Fox666]

But Oven can use Amaterasu

 

[Pirate Queen]

But Oven can use Amaterasu

Lol what? Can he really?

 

[Mwhitt]

And i just answered ur question.
I only answered that part because that was the only part i was interested to talk about.
How is it headcanon when Apoo isn't a YC and had bounties not even reaching 500 millions? Please try to use proper logic next time so you don't embarass yourself like this, okay?

My post continue to be deleted. Let me change this one. You literally ask how it is head cannon then proceed to head cannon your way to yet another incorrect conclusion? But "logic" right. Yeah we done here, plus my post would probably be deleted again any way.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

My post continue to be deleted. Let me change this one. You literally ask how it is head cannon then proceed to head cannon your way to yet another incorrect conclusion? But "logic" right. Yeah we done here, plus my post would probably be deleted again any way.

Your post being deleted should be a reflection for you to create more proper posts.
Anyway, you should explain back to why it's a "headcanon" then, rather than just being angry towards other user.
Now, my initial point is that i find it weird for luffy to have difficulties against apoo because current luffy should be YC1 tier at least. Not only he could not detect any of the attacks, but he also got knocked out temporarily from two hits. I know this is just a way to hype apoo, though, i just don't think this is the proper way.

 

[Mwhitt]

Your post being deleted should be a reflection for you to create more proper posts.
Anyway, you should explain back to why it's a "headcanon" then, rather than just being angry towards other user.
Now, my initial point is that i find it weird for luffy to have difficulties against apoo because current luffy should be YC1 tier at least. Not only he could not detect any of the attacks, but he also got knocked out temporarily from two hits. I know this is just a way to hype apoo, though, i just don't think this is the proper way.

They are proper post and I'm not angry did you actually see the post or you guessing what they could be? Guess the mods find it a little dry maybe whatever.
Do you not know the definition of head cannon? I've posted multiple post of what it can be, how you are doing it they are just a couple pages back. You said in a previous post where you ignored all of it to focus on a question I was asking because you weren't "interested " in the rest. I thought maybe you just saw the error of your ways and decided to drop it as you moved on from.

I understand your original point. I responded to it multiple times, you saw it and moved on yet you are reposting it again?

You said it your self that you didn't like what happened that part is fine you can disagree with it as its your opinion. But you then say power scaling is all over the place when its really not. You continued bringing up Katakuri fight saying he couldn’t do what Apoo could in two hits when that's irrelevant.

This was my response to your Katakuri issue and response to your power level trainwreck comment that I will repost below:

Spoiler

Take in the context of the situation this wasn't Apoo vs Luffy. Luffy is an idiot he jumped in the middle of an army and started throwing punches. A worst gen supernova who you should see as decently powerful (as Oda has been saying since their introduction hey these guys are strong) jumps out attacks Luffy. You know what a supernova is, the worst generation iteration have been especially troublesome and seen as the creme of the crop with the future leader of piracy speculated to hail from its ranks according to Shakky. If people haven't head cannon'ed them as super inferior then what Apoo did shouldn't be shocking. Luffy is fine the scene was to highlight Apoo's attack power as strong which he should have been speculated to be the entire time. A supernova showing he is strong doesn't make the manga inconsistent it just shows the people surprised disregarded them from their own speculation

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

They are proper post and I'm not angry guess the mods find it a little dry maybe.
Do you not know the definition of head cannon? I've posted multiple post of what it can be, how you are doing it they are just a couple pages back. You said in a previous post where you ignored all of it to focus on a question I was asking because you weren't "interested " in the rest. I thought maybe you just saw the error of your ways and decided to drop it as you moved on from.

I understand your original point. I responded to it, you saw it and moved on yet you are reposting it again?

You said it your self that you didn't like what happen that part is fine you can disagree on it as its your opinion. But you then say power scaling is all over the place when its really not. You continued bringing up Katakuri fight saying he couldn’t do what Apoo could in two hits when that's irrelevant.

This was my response to your Katakuri issue and response to your power level trainwreck comment that I will repost below:

Spoiler

Take in the context of the situation this wasn't Apoo vs Luffy. Luffy is an idiot he jumped in the middle of an army and started throwing punches. A worst gen supernova who you should see as decently powerful (as Oda has been saying since their introduction hey these guys are strong) jumps out attacks Luffy. You know what a supernova is, the worst generation iteration have been especially troublesome and seen as the creme of the crop with the future leader of piracy speculated to hail from its ranks according to Shakky. If people haven't head cannon'ed them as super inferior then what Apoo did shouldn't be shocking. Luffy is fine the scene was to highlight Apoo's attack power as strong which he should have been speculated to be the entire time. A supernova showing he is strong doesn't make the manga inconsistent it just shows the people surprised disregarded them from their own speculation [Spoiler/]

No need to be so angry. Just make a reference to your post then. You already did it here, I don't know why it's so hard for you to do that.
I never said apoo is not strong, don't jump into your own conclusion like that. I just find it weird how luffy seemed to not be durable enough to tank an attack from apoo (it's not even his best attack. Apoo talked about a bass drop so that probably will be even a bigger attack). The first hit was luffy being caught off guard... dunno what happened to his FS but i will give it a pass, but luffy should not job hard to the second attack (either luffy avoid or tank the explosion)

 

[Pirate Queen]

No need to be so angry. Just make a reference to your post then. You already did it here, I don't know why it's so hard for you to do that.
I never said apoo is not strong, don't jump into your own conclusion like that. I just find it weird how luffy seemed to not be durable enough to tank an attack from apoo (it's not even his best attack. Apoo talked about a bass drop so that probably will be even a bigger attack). The first hit was luffy being caught off guard... dunno what happened to his FS but i will give it a pass, but luffy should not job hard to the second attack (either luffy avoid or tank the explosion)

It seems you don't understand how Apoo's attacks work and even with FS it couldn't be avoided im this instance.

Also sound base attacks can affect your senory system. Disorientation is a common effect of sound based attacks.

In not getting into the power scaling of this but atheist I cane inform you on the method of attack

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

It seems you don't understand how Apoo's attacks work and even with FS it couldn't be avoided im this instance.

Also sound base attacks can affect your senory system. Disorientation is a common effect of sound based attacks.

In not getting into the power scaling of this but atheist I cane inform you on the method of attack

Thing is, there isn't even any indication for FS to detect the attacks. Luffy should at least know what's going to happen. And luffy can move really fast. He escaped from a point blank explosion by CC gas.

 

[Mwhitt]

No need to be so angry. Just make a reference to your post then. You already did it here, I don't know why it's so hard for you to do that.
I never said apoo is not strong, don't jump into your own conclusion like that. I just find it weird how luffy seemed to not be durable enough to tank an attack from apoo (it's not even his best attack. Apoo talked about a bass drop so that probably will be even a bigger attack). The first hit was luffy being caught off guard... dunno what happened to his FS but i will give it a pass, but luffy should not job hard to the second attack (either luffy avoid or tank the explosion)

Have you read any of my post? There's like 8-12 paragraphs of responses that are on the two previous pages. Its to much I'm not reposting it again so I'll just shortly respond to what's here.

Ok so you are choosing to drop your power level trainwreck point as its not present here cool. Now you say just because it's an unnamed attack Luffy should tank it despite by your words you believe Apoo was strong right?

What is the name of Apoo's fruit? How does it work? How does one combat against it? Doesn't that attack Apoo used Luffy and Zoro look eerily similar to the pre time skip attack that cut Kizaru's arm and floored his torso?

Thats what headcannon is you somehow powerscaled in your mind and declared the attack weak simply because it doesn't have a name when we really know nothing of Apoo. Apoo used the same attack to hit Kizaru you think he would use a weak attack to try and down an admiral? Context should tell you if he believes it can harm an admiral in all their power he would believe it would harm his peers Luffy and Zoro. Apoo has a df that can cause damage that you can’t see coming so even if FS worked how would Luffy defend when he can't see whats hitting him? Once again this scene was simply to highlight Apoo not to demean Luffy he is fine, him being 1, 2'ed is his consequence for being reck less not the results of him being weak.

I said shortly didn't I? Lol

 

[Pirate Queen]

Thing is, there isn't even any indication for FS to detect the attacks. Luffy should at least know what's going to happen. And luffy can move really fast. He escaped from a point blank explosion by CC gas.

Apoo's sound waves HAVE to hit before the attack let's off, unless we are shown otherwise, and we haven't.

I don't think we are going to get a special panel each time Luffy uses FS, just like in Udon. Luffy wasn't expecting an attack. FS Isn't passive. If he would have seen something coming his way he could have dodged but you can't see AirWaves. 8 think you under the impression Luffy HAS to use FS, but that hasn't seemed to be the case...

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Have you read any of my post? There's like 8-12 paragraphs of responses that are on the two previous pages. Its to much I'm not reposting it again so I'll just shortly respond to what's here.

Ok so you are choosing to drop your power level trainwreck point as its not present here cool. Now you say just because it's an unnamed attack Luffy should tank it despite by your words you believe Apoo was strong right?

What is the name of Apoo's fruit? How does it work? How does one combat against it? Doesn't that attack Apoo used Luffy and Zoro look eerily similar to the pre time skip attack that cut Kizaru's arm and floored his torso?

Thats what headcannon is you somehow powerscaled in your mind and declared the attack weak simply because it doesn't have a name when we really know nothing of Apoo. Apoo used the same attack to hit Kizaru you think he would use a weak attack to try and down an admiral? Context should tell you if he believes it can harm an admiral in all their power he would believe it would harm his peers Luffy and Zoro. Apoo has a df that can cause damage that you can’t see coming so even if FS worked how would Luffy defend when he can't see whats hitting him? Once again this scene was simply to highlight Apoo not to demean Luffy he is fine, him being 1, 2'ed is his consequence for being reck less not the results of him being weak.

I said shortly didn't I? Lol

If you need 8-12 paragraphs just to explain about 1-2 arguments here, that means you cannot explain your idea properly and clearly. Wall of text does not improve your argument (especially since majority of it is just you being angry towards other user)
Did i say his attacks are weak? How did you know his attacks are impervious to FS? Ironically these were your headcanon.....
I just think luffy should have done better in the short clash

 

[Mwhitt]

If you need 8-12 paragraphs just to explain about 1-2 arguments here, that means you cannot explain your idea properly and clearly. Wall of text does not improve your argument (especially since majority of it is just you being angry towards other user)
Did i say his attacks are weak? How did you know his attacks are impervious to FS? Ironically these were your headcanon.....
I just think luffy should have done better in the short clash

My points are crystal clear you are the only one missing it. It doesn't take 8-12 paragraghs normally but this seems to be a special case. This is why I said shortly originally everything is flying over your head.

You are dropping point after point after what you are saying gets address. No most of my wall of text aren't me being angry unless you consider disagreement anger as I touch on all of your points you respond to 1-2 of mine. Even those aren't responses you really aren't making ground on any of your points and just furthering the convo, hence walls of text.

Context, context, CONTEXT! You said it wasn't even his strongest attack still knowing nothing of Apoo. Not saying it is his strongest attack but context and common sense would tell you if he thought an attack would take down an admiral he would have no reason to think it wouldn't harm Luffy and Zoro and he was right it did.

I answered the FS thing it could have worked we don't even know if it did or didn't Luffy had no earthly idea what hit him nor do we know 100% how Apoo delivers his attacks. Have you never seen something coming and failed to prevent it? Better yet have you just been straight up hit by something you didn't see? FS isn't omnipotence its a future from the users point of view. The manga has told us next to nothing of Apoo yet you confidently make statements about things that have yet to be address in the manga you don't know what level of attack that was from Apoo context tell you its pretty strong if he thought it would harm Kizaru. You think Luffy should tank a hit just cause Luffy right? And even then he was fine. Head cannon central.

Ok you believe Luffy should have performed better I have said over and over again your opinion is fine. The issue is you don't simply leave it as your opinion. You critique the manga based on your head cannon when context conveys otherwise. All the answers to your questions and disputes are in the manga thats how I can address them. Now if you choose to accept it or ignore it is on you.

Once again opinion is fine but critique of the manga with just your speculation isn't valid. I'm not mad at you I'm trying to help you.

 

[King Moe]

And i just answered ur question.
I only answered that part because that was the only part i was interested to talk about.
How is it headcanon when Apoo isn't a YC and had bounties not even reaching 500 millions? Please try to use proper logic next time so you don't embarass yourself like this, okay?

--- Double Post Merged, May 23, 2020, Original Post Date: May 23, 2020 ---

How did sanji match drake when he never could land a clean hit against drake? Drake won that round

Drake barely got hit in the fight and Sanji still didn't take him seriously? What you reading? It ended inconclusive. Drake struggle to get him even when he had Toko in his arms.

--- Double Post Merged, May 23, 2020 ---

Spoiler

And? In this chapter even luffy with advanced CoO could not sense the attack. This chapter didn't really mean anything much in terms of CoO proficiency, whether u like it or not

You can't simple predict and dodge Sound. It has no straight path. What you talking about? Plus COO you need to be calm and concentrate. Luffy didn't even use it yet and got surprise.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Drake barely got hit in the fight and Sanji still didn't take him seriously? What you reading? It ended inconclusive. Drake struggle to get him even when he had Toko in his arms.

--- Double Post Merged, May 23, 2020 ---

You can't simple predict and dodge Sound. It has no straight path. What you talking about? Plus COO you need to be calm and concentrate. Luffy didn't even use it yet and got surprise.

Sanji could not land a clean hit, drake won against sanji in the clash. RS sanji might be a more fair fight. Sanji ran away from the fight with wounds.