One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[Brandish μ]

Luffy is better at COO because he's used the advanced form of it, imo.

Zoro is poorest among COO users and that is canon.

This is untrue - or unproven.

I'm not into this use of headcanons as a means to demean people, but canon = manga/Oda, so proof is needed.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Perhaps its my memory, but I can't recall Zoro being better than Luffy in any type of haki.

Its because he isn't. Zoro was even given CoA haki a few arcs ahead of Luffy and once Luffy focused on CoA, not only did he learn the flow type, but the higher version which is internal damage. It's just more of Zoro fans trying to save face

--- Double Post Merged, May 24, 2020, Original Post Date: May 24, 2020 ---

Luffy is better at COO because he's used the advanced form of it, imo.



This is untrue - or unproven.

I'm not into this use of headcanons as a means to demean people, but canon = manga/Oda, so proof is needed.

And better CoA now that he has the more advanced version of Advnced Haki

 

[Brandish μ]

And better CoA now that he has the more advanced version of Advnced Haki

I tend to think they are both going to be at similar stages, as in mastering or being highly skilled at Ryo.

 

[King Moe]

Luffy is better at COO because he's used the advanced form of it, imo.



This is untrue - or unproven.

I'm not into this use of headcanons as a means to demean people, but canon = manga/Oda, so proof is needed.

Well not saying he below everyone, but he isn't among top COO users who can have FS and Sanji who shown many COO feats as much as Luffy if not more. Saying Zoro is better than them in COO and others who are better or equal to them is more headcannon and ignorance when latest chapters proves nothing on Zoro doing better COO at all when even he said he couldn't predict or know attack was like. Just saying is all.

--- Double Post Merged, May 24, 2020, Original Post Date: May 24, 2020 ---

I tend to think they are both going to be at similar stages, as in mastering or being highly skilled at Ryo.

Not really, Zoro has nothing like Luffy on Adv. COA. His Haki still on Armament Haki phase as much as Sanji now who has improve his COA greatly for awhile. Though I do see Sanji and Zoro reaching Luffy's levels of COO and COA, but still difference in level though.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Do tells us what we dont understand and how you plan to save Luffy's face in an impossible situation.

I have already told you, just because Luffy has FS doesn't mean he can block/dodge everything he sees.

IN THE CHAPTER neither Zoro or Luffy know how they are being attacked. So how does seeing the attacks before hand help?

Your choosing to ignore that.

I tend to think they are both going to be at similar stages, as in mastering or being highly skilled at Ryo.

As the WSS it should be like that. Zoro needs to be able to cut anything.

I don't think the gap is outrageously big, but there is a gap.

Luffy's growth rate is just ridiculous in this respect.

And like I said previously. This stems from the fact that some people either not understand how particular haki's work or just chosing to ignore it.

It a difficult subject to debate because so many are misinformed.

 

[goldb]

Perhaps its my memory, but I can't recall Zoro being better than Luffy in any type of haki.

I think besides FS, we've not been shown for certain that either of them have any haki superior to the other. I've always like the idea that Zoro had superior CoA and that Sanji had the better CoO, whereas Luffy would have near enough but be a balanced version of those two. Early on the timeskip, a case could be made of that, with Sanji even using CoO while in Nami's body to find ( I think) Kinemon's body in the frozen water.

We'll need to see more from the trio, hopefully this arc will give us some clarity by showing them using haki against the same opponents and we'll be able to gauge.

 

[nik87]

Only sound I hearing is you complaining you can't denied what Zoro verbally said 'He can't predict or understand his attack' which your denying what latest chapter said. You have nothing to push after that. Your headcannons are not valid no does it prove anything. Zoro is poorest among COO users and that is canon.

Show us how Luffy is predicting and understanding the same attack because "his CoO is better." You will never post better feats than Zoro's.

Luffy is better at COO because he's used the advanced form of it, imo.

Using advanced form isnt a proof of better Haki...
Breath of all things is advanced CoO too, sensing emotions is advanced CoO too. Zoro is the one setup against invisible opponent where CoO will be a major factor if Shiryu can hide even his aura. Future Sight is of no help there, BOAT on the other hand is.

I have already told you, just because Luffy has FS doesn't mean he can block/dodge everything he sees.
IN THE CHAPTER neither Zoro or Luffy know how they are being attacked. So how does seeing the attacks before hand help?
Your choosing to ignore that.

I am not asking him to block/dodge, I am asking him to see it, which he didnt. You are choosing to ignore that.
Katakuri kept seeing the things he couldnt handle, it didnt prevent him from seeing them. Luffy's FS up-time is close to 0.

 

[nik87]

They were posted in past posts which you ignore them like Lexus said in you ignoring posts of others when they prove you wrong. You either accept them or use headcannon to twist to your agenda that you think Zoro is stronger when he isn't. You have nothing going for you after latest chapter at all.

Post them again just to show proof that they have better CoO than Zoro.
Also, Zoro will be the strongest in the verse, it is inevitable.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Will sanji ever improve his CoO to FS? I think it will be boring to have 2 FS users. Sanji might make up for his regular CoO with the power of RS

 

[McNuss]

Will sanji ever improve his CoO to FS? I think it will be boring to have 2 FS users. Sanji might make up for his regular CoO with the power of RS

Sanji dodged Katakuri's shot. I don't think how that should be possible without future sight.

It is in SBS vol. 71 that Luffy specializes in CoC, Zoro specializes in CoA, and Sanji specializes in CoO.

 

[nik87]

Sanji dodged Katakuri's shot. I don't think how that should be possible without future sight.

Why not? Picking up a projectile is the most basic CoO.

 

[King Moe]

Why not? Picking up a projectile is the most basic CoO.

Not when he dodged a guy who couldn't hit him even with FS. He literally outpredict Kakaturi like Luffy while Zoro got hit by Apoo with ease and even said he couldn't predict him at all.

--- Double Post Merged, May 25, 2020, Original Post Date: May 25, 2020 ---

Post them again just to show proof that they have better CoO than Zoro.
Also, Zoro will be the strongest in the verse, it is inevitable.

Nah he be only Mihawk level which is weaker than Yonkos and Admirals while YC lvl opponents put him to a struggle.

 

[M3J]

There's no point in playing the comparison game. Zoro getting hit by Apoo while Sanji avoided Katakuri's attack means absolutely nothing and doesn't indicate superiority or inferiority. This is a stupid logic, especially when you consider the different situations. Sanji was expecting to be attacked, while Luffy and Zoro weren't expecting anything less than physical attacks.

 

[King Moe]

There's no point in playing the comparison game. Zoro getting hit by Apoo while Sanji avoided Katakuri's attack means absolutely nothing and doesn't indicate superiority or inferiority. This is a stupid logic, especially when you consider the different situations. Sanji was expecting to be attacked, while Luffy and Zoro weren't expecting anything less than physical attacks.

Nah Sanji wasn't expecting Kakaturi strike him, only the priest and still dodge the attack. Zoro went into fighting with enemies knowing they strike back. You can't say you didn't enemies to attack from different angles when they are around you. COO should been use on that case if he knew going in would be bad before their respective fights.

 

[M3J]

No, he was expecting to get attacked, so he was using CoO. Zoro wasn't expecting to get hit by Apoo in a mysterious way, and neither was Luffy. Projectile is easier to detect and dodge, while whatever Apoo used isn't.

 

[King Moe]

No, he was expecting to get attacked, so he was using CoO. Zoro wasn't expecting to get hit by Apoo in a mysterious way, and neither was Luffy. Projectile is easier to detect and dodge, while whatever Apoo used isn't.

Yes, but priest more than Kakaturi. He wasn't expecting him and still able to dodge it especially FS too. That still big feat on Sanji.

Still they have guns and weapon projectiles. You can't say whether trick powers or not, they should expect projectiles coming their way during brawl with them.

 

[goldb]

Still they have guns and weapon projectiles. You can't say whether trick powers or not, they should expect projectiles coming their way during brawl with them.

In your opinion how does Apoo's ability work in relation to haki?

 

[McNuss]

By the way, I do think that Luffy, Zoro and Sanji have future sight. Future sight is just a pretty basic application of CoO. The Skypea priests could do it, anyone except the untrained like Aisa can.

The point of Luffy's improvement with CoO was to replicate what Katakuri did, looking further ahead into the future, which he managed to do with a lot of concentration.

 

[King Moe]

In your opinion how does Apoo's ability work in relation to haki?

It's a bit tricky, but it is projectile like you need to really use FS more or look at Apoo's movement to understand his attack pattern since it's not a straightforward. You need to be high level with your COO for someone like him since it's more Sound-Based.

 

[nik87]

By the way, I do think that Luffy, Zoro and Sanji have future sight. Future sight is just a pretty basic application of CoO. The Skypea priests could do it, anyone except the untrained like Aisa can.

The point of Luffy's improvement with CoO was to replicate what Katakuri did, looking further ahead into the future, which he managed to do with a lot of concentration.

Bruh...
There is a clear difference between watching a tape of future and sensing intent...
Only Luffy has FS but his problem is inconsistency.