One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[kkck]

The cuffs were not properly explained

But it was clear that it's not just a matter of strength or speed, internal destruction is essential in removing the cuffs

There's even a panel of Rayleigh removing Camie's necklace with his hand coated in black Haki

I think the internal destruction damages the components of the cuffs that detect if they were removed or not, delaying the explosion

As I said to hannibal... luffy is too dumb to do something like that on purpose. Luffy doesn't know how cuffs or explosions work. He is however a competent haki user who can be quick. Luffy and rayleigh quickly destroying the explosives and throwing them away nigh instantly is a perfectly reasonable explanation for what we saw that doesn't require luffy to have known how stuff works.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 14, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 14, 2021 ---

Luffy ability to learn new combat techniques and utilize them in various scenarios have been highlighted over the course of 1000 chapters.

He's a battle genius

Battle genius? Sure, why not. But luffy intentionally targeting the mechanism of the cuffs? Lol no, that's laughable.

 

[Pirate Queen]

As I said to hannibal... luffy is too dumb to do something like that on purpose. Luffy doesn't know how cuffs or explosions work. He is however a competent haki user who can be quick. Luffy and rayleigh quickly destroying the explosives and throwing them away nigh instantly is a perfectly reasonable explanation for what we saw that doesn't require luffy to have known how stuff works.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 14, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 14, 2021 ---

Battle genius? Sure, why not. But luffy intentionally targeting the mechanism of the cuffs? Lol no, that's laughable.

Luffy can learn to predict future events that not even Yonko have been shown capable of doing (learning I. In half a day) but sensing something in an explosive device is where you draw the line of unbelievability?

Interesting

 

[kkck]

Luffy can learn to predict future events that not even Yonko have been shown capable of doing (learning I. In half a day) but sensing something in an explosive device is where you draw the line of unbelievability?

Interesting

But.. observation haki has literally nothing to do with this situation. If CoO could help predict or sense anything about the collar then sure but that's not something CoO does so far in the story. And luffy is an actual moron who can't plan stuff, is baffled by even simply concepts and never sticks to plans. It is absurd that luffy would know to target the mechanisms within a collar, it's entirely out of character and way beyond the smarts luffy usually shows...

 

[Fox666]

Ok, I could buy that rayleigh would be able to pull that off. As in, him targeting the components in the cuffs to slow down the mechanism and throw them away... but luffy? REAAALLY? Are you telling me luffy did this on purpose at least once (I am conceding dumb luck could be plausible on the first try but not the time he removed yamato's cuffs)? The first time we saw this at the auction house the gang could not even see what happened. One moment rayleigh grabbed the necklace and in an instant it exploded elsewhere. Luffy is a blunt instrument. He isn't going to target the mechanism which controls the explosion to delay it. The bit with the exploding necklace and cuffs is super simple. Break them, throw them away super fast.

Luffy doesn't have to understand what he did, he was just copying Rayleigh.

Luffy knew Rayleigh did something with Haki to deal with the explosives.

 

[Pirate Queen]

But.. observation haki has literally nothing to do with this situation. If CoO could help predict or sense anything about the collar then sure but that's not something CoO does so far in the story. And luffy is an actual moron who can't plan stuff, is baffled by even simply concepts and never sticks to plans. It is absurd that luffy would know to target the mechanisms within a collar, it's entirely out of character and way beyond the smarts luffy usually shows...

So Luffy can't use FS to predict the right place to grab the collar without it detonating prematurely?

In life or death situations Luffy, Luffy > Anyone in One Piece.

You kniw what they say, in 1 v 1 collar, always bet on luffy

 

[Ellenate]

He's a battle genius

He's not, he merely employs brute-force, and his dumb luck sees him through.

Luffy ability to learn new combat techniques and utilize them in various scenarios have been highlighted over the course of 1000 chapters.

Apoo: Future sight says what?

Luffy: What-

*Boom*

 

[Pirate Queen]

He's not, he merely employs brute-force, and his dumb luck sees him through.






Apoo: Future sight says what?

Luffy: What-

*Boom*

He would have never learned fs if he wasn't a battle genius.

He had learned 3 forms of the rarest forms of haki through the course of vigorous battles. The only character in all of One Piece to have mastered 3 forms of advanced haki. At only 19 years old.

Even the Yonko can't boast such an accomplishment.

Luffy getting blindsided because he didn't know how Apoo attacked is understandable. FS doesn't show you how to dodge, it give you options. You can't avoid an attack when you have no idea where it's coming from. That you use the only example in which FS can't help with is proof enough you know exactly why this is the case and your just playing dumb lol

Luffy didn't learn Ryou, CoC coating, or future sight through brute force.

No one is calling Luffy smart, but in battle his combat prowess and growth rate is the greatest in the manga

 

[kkck]

Luffy doesn't have to understand what he did, he was just copying Rayleigh.

Luffy knew Rayleigh did something with Haki to deal with the explosives.

Yes, sure. But what rayleigh did was simply break the necklace using haki and then throwing it away in the blink of an eye using both his superhuman reflexes and speed. There is literally no reason for us to think rayleigh or luffy were using haki to someone tamper with the devices mechanism. As in, why even think this when what we saw is plain as day? There are no plot holes there.

 

[Fox666]

Yes, sure. But what rayleigh did was simply break the necklace using haki and then throwing it away in the blink of an eye using both his superhuman reflexes and speed. There is literally no reason for us to think rayleigh or luffy were using haki to someone tamper with the devices mechanism. As in, why even think this when what we saw is plain as day? There are no plot holes there.

But the fact is, they did

Apparently speed is not enough to remove the collar. If Rayleigh couldn't do it without internal destruction, probably nobody could.

 

[kkck]

But the fact is, they did

Apparently speed is not enough to remove the collar. If Rayleigh couldn't do it without internal destruction, probably nobody could.

But... rayleigh did use internal destruction. That image doesn't show otherwise.

 

[Ellenate]

He would have never learned fs if he wasn't a battle genius.

he didn't learn it, he was born with it.

He had learned 3 forms of the rarest forms of haki through the course of vigorous battles.

born with... what factor skill plays if any is highly questionable.

The only character in all of One Piece to have mastered 3 forms of advanced haki

Only character in all of One Piece to face haki backlash.

...he's a jack of all trades but master of none.

Has his COC even knocked out any fodder during the raid like BM's?

Even the Yonko can't boast such an accomplishment.

Luffy's luck is the only thing exceptional about him.

Luffy getting blindsided because he didn't know how Apoo attacked is understandable.

There wasn't even an attempt at using FS...

which contradicts your claim of "learn new combat techniques and utilize them in various scenarios".

---

Apoo is a god in this verse, that's undeniable, but-

Luffy could have seen he was being attack, with fs, learned apoo's location. Then either attack apoo or give zoro a heads up to his location.

That you use the only example in which FS can't help with is proof enough you know exactly why this is the case and your just playing dumb lol

It's only been an established skill of luffy since Queen's prison training arc... there really aren't that many battle moments to pull from.

but-

...could've used it to see momo getting kidnapped
...could've used it to avoid queen munching on him and zoro (on their way to the roof)
...could've used it to avoid most of the stuff with ulti
...could've used it to catch shinobi when king threw her (luffy is a monster)


[bonus] ...could've used coc to take out fodder

Luffy didn't learn Ryou, CoC coating, or future sight through brute force.

Cause he was born with it.

No one is calling Luffy smart, but in battle his combat prowess and growth rate is the greatest in the manga

What combat prowess are you even talking about, he was charging at kaido getting flung back.... and just kept doing it.

he rarely if ever thinks in battle.
with don krieg he punched through his metal spiked cloak.

#bruteforceluffy


---

Also, ichigo s**** on him for growth.






---


Luffy is without question the most inconsistent least dependable shounen Mc of all time. He hasn't won a major fight straight up since arlong (and even that was touch and go).

 

[Pirate Queen]

he didn't learn it, he was born with it.






born with... what factor skill plays if any is highly questionable.






Only character in all of One Piece to face haki backlash.

...he's a jack of all trades but master of none.

Has his COC even knocked out any fodder during the raid like BM's?






Luffy's luck is the only thing exceptional about him.






There wasn't even an attempt at using FS...

which contradicts your claim of "learn new combat techniques and utilize them in various scenarios".

---

Apoo is a god in this verse, that's undeniable, but-

Luffy could have seen he was being attack, with fs, learned apoo's location. Then either attack apoo or give zoro a heads up to his location.






It's only been an established skill of luffy since Queen's prison training arc... there really aren't that many battle moments to pull from.

but-

...could've used it to see momo getting kidnapped
...could've used it to avoid queen munching on him and zoro (on their way to the roof)
...could've used it to avoid most of the stuff with ulti
...could've used it to catch shinobi when king threw her (luffy is a monster)


[bonus] ...could've used coc to take out fodder






Cause he was born with it.







What combat prowess are you even talking about, he was charging at kaido getting flung back.... and just kept doing it.

he rarely if ever thinks in battle.
with don krieg he punched through his metal spiked cloak.

#bruteforceluffy


---

Also, ichigo s**** on him for growth.






---


Luffy is without question the most inconsistent least dependable shounen Mc of all time. He hasn't won a major fight straight up since arlong (and even that was touch and go).

Well I thought you went back to being serious for a moment. I guess not

Okay then

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 14, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 14, 2021 ---

I'm so confused about this collar thing discussion

 

[Fox666]

Luffy is without question the most inconsistent least dependable shounen Mc of all time. He hasn't won a major fight straight up since arlong (and even that was touch and go).

Not against main villains, but he defeats several villains through the arcs

 

[Ellenate]

Not against main villains, but he defeats several villains through the arcs

name some

 

[Fox666]

name some

In Wano arc alone, Luffy defeated:

Urashima
Holdem
Dobon
Madilloman
Goki

Does Page One count too?

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

he didn't learn it, he was born with it.






born with... what factor skill plays if any is highly questionable.






Only character in all of One Piece to face haki backlash.

...he's a jack of all trades but master of none.

Has his COC even knocked out any fodder during the raid like BM's?






Luffy's luck is the only thing exceptional about him.






There wasn't even an attempt at using FS...

which contradicts your claim of "learn new combat techniques and utilize them in various scenarios".

---

Apoo is a god in this verse, that's undeniable, but-

Luffy could have seen he was being attack, with fs, learned apoo's location. Then either attack apoo or give zoro a heads up to his location.






It's only been an established skill of luffy since Queen's prison training arc... there really aren't that many battle moments to pull from.

but-

...could've used it to see momo getting kidnapped
...could've used it to avoid queen munching on him and zoro (on their way to the roof)
...could've used it to avoid most of the stuff with ulti
...could've used it to catch shinobi when king threw her (luffy is a monster)


[bonus] ...could've used coc to take out fodder






Cause he was born with it.







What combat prowess are you even talking about, he was charging at kaido getting flung back.... and just kept doing it.

he rarely if ever thinks in battle.
with don krieg he punched through his metal spiked cloak.

#bruteforceluffy


---

Also, ichigo s**** on him for growth.






---


Luffy is without question the most inconsistent least dependable shounen Mc of all time. He hasn't won a major fight straight up since arlong (and even that was touch and go).

He kinda defeats enel lucci hody and Caesar straight up tho

 

[Ellenate]

In Wano arc alone, Luffy defeated:

Urashima
Holdem
Dobon
Madilloman
Goki

Does Page One count too?

tbh i was just curious. i don't remember him ever defeating anyone outside of big bads and fodder.

The one time i can recall is blueno

He kinda defeats enel lucci hody and Caesar straight up tho

hody was fodder and fmi was filler

lucci... i guess but that fight being on the highlight reel speak volumes. It was drawnout and lucci just stood there while luffy got a 30 minute motivational speech instead of finishing him off.

Enel, even at the disadvantage of his fruit being ineffective, toyed with luffy (it's one of the more memorable fights in the series but people don't recall it correctly. Luffy was indeed immune but it was an up hill battle the whole time. The fight basically ended with enel walking away.)

Caesar was fodder... who somehow still managed to knock luffy out

---

Almost all of his encounters see the big bad (who sometimes aren't that big) low dif him.

 

[Dabanagaga]

he didn't learn it, he was born with it.






born with... what factor skill plays if any is highly questionable.






Only character in all of One Piece to face haki backlash.

...he's a jack of all trades but master of none.

Has his COC even knocked out any fodder during the raid like BM's?






Luffy's luck is the only thing exceptional about him.






There wasn't even an attempt at using FS...

which contradicts your claim of "learn new combat techniques and utilize them in various scenarios".

---

Apoo is a god in this verse, that's undeniable, but-

Luffy could have seen he was being attack, with fs, learned apoo's location. Then either attack apoo or give zoro a heads up to his location.






It's only been an established skill of luffy since Queen's prison training arc... there really aren't that many battle moments to pull from.

but-

...could've used it to see momo getting kidnapped
...could've used it to avoid queen munching on him and zoro (on their way to the roof)
...could've used it to avoid most of the stuff with ulti
...could've used it to catch shinobi when king threw her (luffy is a monster)


[bonus] ...could've used coc to take out fodder






Cause he was born with it.







What combat prowess are you even talking about, he was charging at kaido getting flung back.... and just kept doing it.

he rarely if ever thinks in battle.
with don krieg he punched through his metal spiked cloak.

#bruteforceluffy


---

Also, ichigo s**** on him for growth.






---


Luffy is without question the most inconsistent least dependable shounen Mc of all time. He hasn't won a major fight straight up since arlong (and even that was touch and go).

You've got to be trolling...

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 14, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 14, 2021 ---

Not against main villains, but he defeats several villains through the arcs

Wouldn't make a good story for a kid getting out of the island and beating everyone cleanly 1v1
Even since the beggining, he knew that he couldn't become the Pirate King by himself

This whole discussion is absolutely irrelative, so don't answet to the guy's retarded blabbing

Also
>Complaining about hax abilities and story telling

It takes brains to be this stupid, Ellenate

 

[Ellenate]

You've got to be trolling...

if you found that post "triggering", you need therapy...

 

[LaGOAT]

yamato right now is in-between zoro and sanji lvl at the end of wano if she joins she would be the 4th strongest