Not that they would be wiped out by Gustangs dirty tactics because the amount of freedom allowed to him by Traum to do that nonsense in the first place won't fly with someone like Arie Hon who's a no bullshit person.
PBs were weak asf except for Dumas and Tiara. Gussy himself killed 2 of the strongest BLs in 552. Bellerire tactics couldn't subdued BLs so Gussy intervened and forced them to play the game in 596. As for hon, if plot demands, he will play into the hands just like Rei.
Well that is true but if U look at it from another perspective, will they even follow his orders? We already know Ha family, possibly Yurin herself was upset with how Yuri was being treated by Jahad family. From what we saw in HF, I doubt Edahn takes the orders from the king. We don't know much about hon. The only FL who follows the king unconditionally is Rei.
How that contradicts the reason? It's because they are strong that he will wipe them himself, not all but strong guys. After the war, both sides are affected. Just look at this current war, no more LPBs and PBs. Even if one of the top family fights another family, the rankings will definitely drop.
I think Ur talking from BPs. Nowhere it states hon is way stronger than Gussy who will dogwalk Gussy. On the contrary, JH mentioned all FLs are equal in 549 which is canon btw.
Are you mentioning to this words? View media item 29702
I don't think Jinsung said that the FHs are equal (he clearly didn't say that).
From my understanding, Jinsung meant that once the 10 families fight, the ones who decide the winner or loser are the FHs, the imbalance between the families doesn't matter.
think Ur talking from BPs. Nowhere it states hon is way stronger than Gussy who will dogwalk Gussy. On the contrary, JH mentioned all FLs are equal in 549 which is canon btw.
It never even states that as Lonatian above already cleared with the quote, flat out states that in terms of sheer power the Hon, Edhuan and Ha family are above.
Eurasia herself has the power to wipe out both Gustang and his family combined off the face of existence, even someone like Adori can wipe out Gustangs family and she's absolute trash compared to a FH let alone one like Arie Hon himself.
Are you mentioning to this words? View media item 29702
I don't think Jinsung said that the FHs are equal (he clearly didn't say that).
From my understanding, Jinsung meant that once the 10 families fight, the ones who decide the winner or loser are the FHs, the imbalance between the families doesn't matter.
Well Ur not wrong, even I thought the same back then when the chapter was released. But we now know FLs don't fight each other. It literally said ten families are relatively balanced because each FL have similar powers. Powers that are so overwhelming that makes the existence of separate families non-existent. We literally saw Gussy correcting the imbalance of the power between PBs and LPBs in this war.
Yes families not individuals. IIRC, in White's flashback hon says only ha and Khun families compare with Arie not that only Edahn and Yurin compared with him.
Well Ur not wrong, even I thought the same back then when the chapter was released. But we now know FLs don't fight each other. It literally said ten families are relatively balanced because each FL have similar powers. Powers that are so overwhelming that makes the existence of separate families non-existent. We literally saw Gussy correcting the imbalance of the power between PBs and LPBs in this war.
Jinsung's words only confirmed three things:
1. Arie, Khun, and Ha families were stronger than the other families.
2. No matter how strong the three families were, they were still maintain balance with the other families thanks to the FHs. For example, if the Arie family attacked the Lo Po Bia family, the entire Arie family could not defeat Traumerei unless Hon personally came forward.
3. Jinsung considered Baam to be a worthy advantage for the families besides their FHs.
However, the war between Lo Po Bia and Po Bidau proved a few things.
1. There was a promise between the FHs not to hurt each other. Gustang was the first to break that promise.
2. The battle between Lo Po Bia members (Lobadon and his army) and Po Bidau members (Proust and his army) did not affect anything. Traumerei and Gustang were the ones who decided.
3. Baam did not really give any advantage to either side. Traumerei and Gustang were on their own.
4. Blossom was clearly stronger than Traumerei/Gustang.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
Whether the FHs are equal or not is another matter. You can discuss that in a new post to see what people think (but I don't believe everyone will think they are equal).
We are looking at the strength of the members of the 10 great families, clearly the three families Khun, Ha and Arie are rated the highest.
It is really absurd that Dumas who comes from a weaker family is rated higher than the members of the three families above.
The whole reason why Rei wanted Night in his family because FLs have made a promise to not hurt each other. Assuming no FLs break the promise, the family which will have another irregular will be superior incase they fight. That's what JH confirmed. Rei never wanted a full fight much less fight to death. Ascensio and Goruro have explicitly mentioned they(both king and Rei) wanted proxy war in 515 and 570.
The battle between Lo Po Bia members (Lobadon and his army) and Po Bidau members (Proust and his army) did not affect anything. Traumerei and Gustang were the ones who decided.
The thing is if Rei never wanted Night in his family and had they fought back in LPB battleship, many things would have changed. Even in 647, when V took a glance at the fight between FLs, he was in the blind spot of Gussy not Rei. V not attacking Rei would have also changed the outcome.
Whether the FHs are equal or not is another matter. You can discuss that in a new post to see what people think (but I don't believe everyone will think they are equal).
We are looking at the strength of the members of the 10 great families, clearly the three families Khun, Ha and Arie are rated the highest.
It is really absurd that Dumas who comes from a weaker family is rated higher than the members of the three families above.
The whole reason why Rei wanted Night in his family because FLs have made a promise to not hurt each other. Assuming no FLs break the promise, the family which will have another irregular will be superior incase they fight. That's what JH confirmed. Rei never wanted a full fight much less fight to death. Ascensio and Goruro have explicitly mentioned they(both king and Rei) wanted proxy war in 515 and 570.
And they are still the strongest when FH's are considered too.
There's a balance, but it's not because they're equal in power as Jinsung flat out stated.
it's because FH's are gods and as we have clearly discovered this arc, there exists a large chasm of power even between these gods as Urek and Blossom clearly demonstrated to us this arc because of these two people can one shot a lower tier FH if they so wanted.
The balance is wonky, it's not because the top Family heads are scared of dying against Gustang or Traum and losing their families, it's simply because they're just in a time of peace relatively speaking of course.
But they clearly know that if FH dies, their families will be destroyed. They are forced to join with all their might in the hope of putting pressure on the remaining FH. Both Lobadon and Proust know this very well. This battle depends on the 2 FHs, not them. You can refer to Lobadon's words in chapter 553.
Since Blossom's power can counter 3D Disconnect, she is stronger.
Right now we don't know what powers Eduan, Hon and Yurin have, how do you know they can't counter Blossom's power?
The thing is if Rei never wanted Night in his family and had they fought back in LPB battleship, many things would have changed. Even in 647, when V took a glance at the fight between FLs, he was in the blind spot of Gussy not Rei. V not attacking Rei would have also changed the outcome.
???
Traumerei only needed Baam to deal with Bel while Gustang was trying to stop him.
He didn't tell Baam to join forces with him to attack Gustang.
What Jinsung said and Traumerei's original intention did not come true. Is it wrong when I say Baam did not really have any influence on the battle between the two of them?
He definitely knows them better. The fact that they are in balance even after all these years. Who knows Yurin might have said about the promise to him. Then again this is hc. But we can infer it from the fact that FLs have never been in war with each other for so long. The balance will definitely shift if an irregular joins a family. For instance if Night were to join the PB family, it wouldn't be outrageous to say they might beat AkH families provided FLs don't battle in this war.
But they clearly know that if FH dies, their families will be destroyed. They are forced to join with all their might in the hope of putting pressure on the remaining FH. Both Lobadon and Proust know this very well. This battle depends on the 2 FHs, not them. You can refer to Lobadon's words in chapter 553.
I know he mentioned FLs death. But he also said a war like never before. Had this been a proxy war, they wouldn't have said this. That's why the king ordered destruction of PB families, didn't name Gussy. The king clearly knows as long as Gussy is alive PBs will never cease to exist. He just wanted to punish Gussy. Even Rei that's why he was surprised when Gussy broke the promise. To Rei and the king, it definitely felt like a time pass at the first glance and they tagged along.
I believe it's what makes the balance. There is no stronger or weaker FLs imo. One power is countered by others. Like the five elements U know. But we definitely need to see more of it to confirm. How will your view change if let's say Yurin can't counter Rupture in the GFLs vicinity?
Rei is an idiot in helping Night too. The thing is had Gussy utilised his powers against Night after he became LPB, he would have lost the match right there. But the plot is there. That's why Gussy didn't attack V.
And they are still the strongest when FH's are considered too.
There's a balance, but it's not because they're equal in power as Jinsung flat out stated.
it's because FH's are gods and as we have clearly discovered this arc, there exists a large chasm of power even between these gods as Urek and Blossom clearly demonstrated to us this arc because of these two people can one shot a lower tier FH if they so wanted
Idk why Ur bringing UM in this, him and king are different. We are talking about FLs not irregulars.
Also, we are supposed to believe in hc and not what's highlighted several times in the webtoon?
The balance is wonky, it's not because the top Family heads are scared of dying against Gustang or Traum and losing their families, it's simply because they're just in a time of peace relatively speaking of course.
Well top 3 families haven't been used because they don't accept the orders from the king. It's simple as that. It's just used as an excuse as it's early for them to act. Even others don't accept it only Rei does as Robadon said in 580. Like I said before even LPBs were too strong for PBs but Gussy corrected the imbalance before the war even began. He could do that to other families too.
Idk why Ur bringing UM in this, him and king are different. We are talking about FLs not irregulars.
Also, we are supposed to believe in hc and not what's highlighted several times in the webtoon?
Because Arie Hon fought Urek to a standstill at some point in his climb during floor 100 test.
Even if Urek was revealed by Hon to have held back after, it's still a so much more greater feat than anything Gustang and Traum combined came close to accomplishing even with Eurasias flames in play.
The top FH's are very different, Gustang and Traum are not treated with anywhere near the same reverence the story gives Arie Hon, Edhuan and Yurin.
Of course, if Yurin can't counter Rupture, she'll be weaker than Traumerei. That also means she can't defeat the purple flame, she'll be weaker than Blossom.
As for me, I believe she's stronger than Blossom, so I believe she'll defeat Traumerei.
This isn't a roundabout, it's a one-way street.
Because Arie Hon fought Urek to a standstill at some point in his climb during floor 100 test.
Even if Urek was revealed by Hon to have held back after, it's still a so much more greater feat than anything Gustang and Traum combined came close to accomplishing even with Eurasias flames in play.
The top FH's are very different, Gustang and Traum are not treated with anywhere near the same reverence the story gives Arie Hon, Edhuan and Yurin.
Well this is from BPs. Not that this can't be true but SIU can definitely change it if he feels like it. So, we should take this as a grain of salt. Tho I doubt it any of them will get a season dedicated like Rei got.
Well this is from BPs. Not that this can't be true but SIU can definitely change it if he feels like it. So, we should take this as a grain of salt. Tho I doubt it any of them will get a season dedicated like Rei got.
I feel we, quite normally, are seeing more and more powerful chars. First, we were hyped of rankers, then, we see FUG slayers and some elders-blue holes, then, high rankers, then corps commanders, then, so-called regents, with the last chapter it is likely that now we will see Zahard Princesses a lot. I believe after these princesses, we will see lots of FHs. Then, probably admins, then enryu and stuff.
Just a humble prediction
Of course, if Yurin can't counter Rupture, she'll be weaker than Traumerei. That also means she can't defeat the purple flame, she'll be weaker than Blossom.
As for me, I believe she's stronger than Blossom, so I believe she'll defeat Traumerei.
This isn't a roundabout, it's a one-way street.
Things don't work that way, having an ability that cancels out someone else's ability doesn't necessarily make you stronger. Traumerei is worried about Blossom's flame, not because of its raw power, but because her flame is perfect for canceling out his Shinsoo ability. If Blossom has an ability that cancels out Traumerei's ability, Traumerei's ability cancels out Bloodmadder's, for example, and Bloodmadder's ability cancels out Blossom's, who would be stronger then? I think Blossom is stronger than Traum or Gustang, but it's not because of the flame.
Things don't work that way, having an ability that cancels out someone else's ability doesn't necessarily make you stronger. Traumerei is worried about Blossom's flame, not because of its raw power, but because her flame is perfect for canceling out his Shinsoo ability. If Blossom has an ability that cancels out Traumerei's ability, Traumerei's ability cancels out Bloodmadder's, for example, and Bloodmadder's ability cancels out Blossom's, who would be stronger then? I think Blossom is stronger than Traum or Gustang, but it's not because of the flame.
I'm not sure why people want it to be a "loop (?)". It's simply their strongest technique.
For example, Blossom-Traumerei-Gustang's case. Gustang is weaker than Traumerei because he can't handle the 3D disconnect by himself. Traumerei is weaker than Blossom because the 3D Disconnect was destroyed by a purple spark.
Do you believe that Gustang can counter that flame? So how can I believe that they can counter each other?
Also we're comparing who is stronger.
For example,
I think Yuri is stronger than Blossom meaning that even if Yurin can't destroy her flame, she can still block it and attack with a technique that Blossom can't block.
I think BM is weaker than Blossom meaning that even if he blocks her flame, he can't beat Blossom with his strongest technique.
Who is stronger includes attack and defense, even if it's a duel, it's still about whose attack is stronger.
(Note: I'm not saying that the purple flame is Blossom's strongest technique, and I don't know how strong Yurin and BM are.)
Jinsung's words only confirmed three things:
1. Arie, Khun, and Ha families were stronger than the other families.
2. No matter how strong the three families were, they were still maintain balance with the other families thanks to the FHs. For example, if the Arie family attacked the Lo Po Bia family, the entire Arie family could not defeat Traumerei unless Hon personally came forward.
3. Jinsung considered Baam to be a worthy advantage for the families besides their FHs.
However, the war between Lo Po Bia and Po Bidau proved a few things.
1. There was a promise between the FHs not to hurt each other. Gustang was the first to break that promise.
2. The battle between Lo Po Bia members (Lobadon and his army) and Po Bidau members (Proust and his army) did not affect anything. Traumerei and Gustang were the ones who decided.
3. Baam did not really give any advantage to either side. Traumerei and Gustang were on their own.
4. Blossom was clearly stronger than Traumerei/Gustang.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
Whether the FHs are equal or not is another matter. You can discuss that in a new post to see what people think (but I don't believe everyone will think they are equal).
We are looking at the strength of the members of the 10 great families, clearly the three families Khun, Ha and Arie are rated the highest. It is really absurd that Dumas who comes from a weaker family is rated higher than the members of the three families above.
I agree with everything you said but this. The strongest families are the strongest overall. Dumas being a Po Bidau doesn't mean he can't be more talented members of the other families.
If numbers were the game to play here rather than individual strength then Edhuan would have the strongest family by far amongst his peers.
Eitherway it's a matter of blood, Arie Hon's blood created a super monster like Adori even before she received Zahards blood.
and didn't Zahard state that the Arie, Khun and other higher families were too strong to bring anyone of them into the game hence why it settled on Traum as the best option?.
Number is obviously a factor when it comes to strength. But quality and quantity both matter. Adori is talented but she and Enne are in their own world. And Enne is not a Khun, Arie or Ha.
I agree with everything you said but this. The strongest families are the strongest overall. Dumas being a Po Bidau doesn't mean he can't be more talented members of the other families
Dumas may be more talented than most members of the three families Khun, Arie and Ha.
But he cannot be more talented than the most talented members of those three families.
That's what I mean.
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