Discussion Sanji Discussion Thread

[MakMatik]

Is this not Sanji's first must win fight post TS? Or at least pos FI. Unless it was fodder we've only really had clashes that didn't need him to push himself and were never taken to completion. Much in the same way we can take Apoo KOing Luffy and Zoro in a singular instance and say they lost. They then go on to have sick feats at the rooftop.

 

[Prince13333]

Black Maria really made an impression on this thread.....Sanji was never getting out of that Black Maria situation,For the simple fact that Black Maria was not only a women but her webs were fire proof................. Fire is literally 90% of Sanjis offensive abilities. I know its hard for people to accept but this is the truth of that situation. Even if people want to say he's had bad character moments, don't think Post time skip Sanji is gonna go down as a bad character, especially as we head towards the end.

 

[XXGenesis]

What I’m gathering..:Sanji has many haters..which is Oda’s fault…Because even if you don’t like Sanji, especially PTS where his character is by far the worst out of the SH’s…But he’s coming around….

Ok so Sanji used his RS to peep on his crew mates….typical pervy Sanji; not like able by all still shouldn’t hate him it’s a gag

Sanji embarrassed himself in front of Black Maria & everybody lol, ok very in likeable moment. Oda IMO didn’t set that up to be received as SHP Rely on each other no matter what. It just made Sanji look stupid, during a serious situation.

But I will stand to defend him now that Oda seems to have a good purpose for him again. It’s tired let’s stop beating up on Sanji and find the glimmers of light about his character…He’s been hell of cold he’s finally heating up…lmfao see what I did there lmao

 

[Ellenate]

The hate sanji is getting for not liking his raid suit is overblown...

He has a legitimate reason to be upset and it has seemingly awakened whatever was in him (they didn't even tell him that could happen).

yeah the power up has terrible build up but it's less bs than luffy's and more creative than just giving him a stat stick *cough* enma *cough* zeus *cough*

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

The hate sanji is getting for not liking his raid suit is overblown...

people have different opinion, not everyone would be satisfied with the writing here. In fact, some of the critiques for raid suit comes from sanji fandom itself
also, you already gave the examples by yourself

yeah the power up has terrible build up but it's less bs than luffy's and more creative than just giving him a stat stick *cough* enma *cough* zeus *cough*

luffy, zoro, nami also got hate on them....even though their timeskip training were very related to what they got

 

[Rein Avara]

yeah the power up has terrible build up but it's less bs than luffy's and more creative than just giving him a stat stick *cough* enma *cough* zeus *cough*

I wouldn't say its less or more bs than luffy's. Luffy simply applied an existing ability he had in a different way than normal, it's really not that far fetched, especially given his training with Ryuo, him learning about the flow of haki it makes sense.

 

[XXGenesis]

I wouldn't say its less or more bs than luffy's. Luffy simply applied an existing ability he had in a different way than normal, it's really not that far fetched, especially given his training with Ryuo, him learning about the flow of haki it makes sense.

Luffy’s power up makes tons more sense than Sanji’s & Zoro….

Sanji showed his limit during WCI & he ain’t even have a significant fight.

Enter Wano, he throws on the RS, seems even with a Tobi Roppo, Raid Suit saves him from King; Then he’s kicking around Queen & gets a power up with only 2-3 chapters of previous foreshadowing

His Rival Zoro never struggled except against an Admiral, gets magic sword, trains for a few days and can hurt Kaido to a degree & is now fighting King getting over powered but fighting back…

While Luffy actually went through multiple fights and training

 

[HereNThere]

I don't care for the direction, but I'd say it's more poorly paced than BS. Oda should have had Sanji be forced to use the RS initially in WCI (maybe when he was rescuing Luffy) and then show him feeling weird throughout Wano as the changes take place.

 

[Ellenate]

people have different opinion, not everyone would be satisfied with the writing here.

Looking at all the power ups we've gotten-

I wouldn't say its less or more bs than luffy's. Luffy simply applied an existing ability he had in a different way than normal, it's really not that far fetched, especially given his training with Ryuo, him learning about the flow of haki it makes sense.

Sanji got the best.

Luffy's always comes out of nowhere.
Zoro/nami's undercut their growth.

Sanji's builds off his origins, gives depth to his character, and (maybe) explains past oddities with him. It's the kind of development that i'm sure we all expected out of most of the crew going into the timeskip.

...even the spotty build up is offsetted by the "wow factor" of seeing him eat attacks/pop himself back into place. I imagine it's what oda thinks he accomplishes by doing a**pulls with luffy.


---
sanji hyping/wanking
---

Luffy FINALLY hurts kaido : were we suppose to be hyped? the mofo has to BEAT him. i assumed, going into the arc, he could hurt him...

Zoro cuts kaido : with people theorizing he was going to kill him; ending up with just a scratch is kind of disappointing.

Sanji eats a sword attack/repairs broken bones... like it's nothing! : real shit?!


---
pessimistic
---

Oda is going to ruin it... i just know he is.

 

[Core D. Roy]

I wouldn't say its less or more bs than luffy's. Luffy simply applied an existing ability he had in a different way than normal, it's really not that far fetched, especially given his training with Ryuo, him learning about the flow of haki it makes sense.

I just want haki in general to be more concretely defined by Oda directly, even if he doesn't spell it out in the text. The whole debate about exactly what "ryuo" is has been a pretty big debacle. It's unclear if it's just what weapon-users normally do just applied to the enemy's body directly in a destructive way. But if it's such a basic technique learned in a week by Luffy, how the hell has nobody in the Marines been able to execute Kaidou? Surely there's SOMEBODY that can do what seems like a fundamentally simple haki technique to Kaidou one of the XX number of times he was successfully captured and put up on the executioner's platform.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 10, 2021, Original Post Date: Oct 10, 2021 ---

I don't care for the direction, but I'd say it's more poorly paced than BS. Oda should have had Sanji be forced to use the RS initially in WCI (maybe when he was rescuing Luffy) and then show him feeling weird throughout Wano as the changes take place.

The compressed timeline of Wano has been a problem in general. It's so hard to imagine that this entire arc has been less than a month in-universe.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 10, 2021 ---

While Luffy actually went through multiple fights and training

I mean if you simplify Luffy's powerups to the same degree you did with Sanji and Zoro, he basically developed the ability to see the future after musing out loud to Brulee "Huh, I wonder if I can do that too, better just **try to see the future**". Ryuo is a similar problem- haki is whatever it needs to be so Luffy can struggle and win. "Haki blooms in battle" is about as narratively convenient as "saiyans level up after battling to near death".

 

[Rein Avara]

I just want haki in general to be more concretely defined by Oda directly, even if he doesn't spell it out in the text. The whole debate about exactly what "ryuo" is has been a pretty big debacle. It's unclear if it's just what weapon-users normally do just applied to the enemy's body directly in a destructive way. But if it's such a basic technique learned in a week by Luffy, how the hell has nobody in the Marines been able to execute Kaidou? Surely there's SOMEBODY that can do what seems like a fundamentally simple haki technique to Kaidou one of the XX number of times he was successfully captured and put up on the executioner's platform.

I agree, I wouldn't even mind if once in a while we'd gotten a page at the end of a chapter thoroughly explaining the mechanics of certain concepts within one piece. I personally would have been fine with something like that.

Oda does a lot of things for the sake of hype and less for the sake of consistency, which is a shame because if haki and other things such as DF awakenings were more fleshed out one piece truly would be peak IMO.

 

[Core D. Roy]

Oda does a lot of things for the sake of hype and less for the sake of consistency

I mean that's basically Kaidou's entire character right there defined to a T. Sure he is living up to the "always bet on Kaidou in a 1v1" hype going through wave after wave of fights, but trying to fit the square peg of Kaidou's introduction narration to the round hole of, well, Akainu punching a hole through Ace for execution and doing the damage he did to Whitebeard... it just seems kinda silly that nobody could kill Kaidou, let alone damage him on the execution platform. His body isn't like Big Mom's, who to this day seems to have only ever received a scrape to the knee as direct damage.

 

[Fox666]

I mean that's basically Kaidou's entire character right there defined to a T. Sure he is living up to the "always bet on Kaidou in a 1v1" hype going through wave after wave of fights, but trying to fit the square peg of Kaidou's introduction narration to the round hole of, well, Akainu punching a hole through Ace for execution and doing the damage he did to Whitebeard... it just seems kinda silly that nobody could kill Kaidou, let alone damage him on the execution platform. His body isn't like Big Mom's, who to this day seems to have only ever received a scrape to the knee as direct damage.

We have seen Big Mom get hit a few times too. Law used Gamma Knife on her, she was worried about Enma's power, and Kidd also slammed her...

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Looking at all the power ups we've gotten-





Sanji got the best.

Luffy's always comes out of nowhere.
Zoro/nami's undercut their growth.

Sanji's builds off his origins, gives depth to his character, and (maybe) explains past oddities with him. It's the kind of development that i'm sure we all expected out of most of the crew going into the timeskip.

...even the spotty build up is offsetted by the "wow factor" of seeing him eat attacks/pop himself back into place. I imagine it's what oda thinks he accomplishes by doing a**pulls with luffy.


---
sanji hyping/wanking
---

Luffy FINALLY hurts kaido : were we suppose to be hyped? the mofo has to BEAT him. i assumed, going into the arc, he could hurt him...

Zoro cuts kaido : with people theorizing he was going to kill him; ending up with just a scratch is kind of disappointing.

Sanji eats a sword attack/repairs broken bones... like it's nothing! : real shit?!


---
pessimistic
---

Oda is going to ruin it... i just know he is.

Ah, of course....the guy who ranted about "overblown hate", is the same guy who bashes at other characters

 

[Ellenate]

Ah, of course....the guy who ranted about "overblown hate", is the same guy who bashes at other characters

I'm sure whoever it was (...there's so many i've bashed; it's hard to keep track) they had it coming.

---

If you can't give sanji his roses for that moment, i don't know what you're still reading for. So far, it's the best moment of the arc...

now-

him actually losing the encounter could've been stressed more but in this arc- what comes close to it?

I don't know how you could hate...

 

[Core D. Roy]

I agree, I wouldn't even mind if once in a while we'd gotten a page at the end of a chapter thoroughly explaining the mechanics of certain concepts within one piece. I personally would have been fine with something like that.

Oda does a lot of things for the sake of hype and less for the sake of consistency, which is a shame because if haki and other things such as DF awakenings were more fleshed out one piece truly would be peak IMO.

Wait why was this part of the conversation moved to the Sanji thread? We weren't even talking about Sanji.

 

[XXGenesis]

Overall it’s the execution of these power ups. We have vary taste, but quality writing should critique to a format…

Sanji’s power up happened in 3 chapters.
Zoro’s was a sudden build up because we all know a new sword is a power up for him

Luffy , regardless if it was during the fight…flashbacks were used to explain it, also the context of the fight was used to show Luffy is trying & growing during the fight….Same as Enies

 

[Rein Avara]

Wait why was this part of the conversation moved to the Sanji thread? We weren't even talking about Sanji.

Not my doing, I don't know

 

[afromarco005]

After this power up I expect Sanji to finally accept the fact that he is a vinsmoke.

"I am Vinsmoke sanji!" Could be a dope moment.

 

[hokageji]

whats so dope about Vinsmokes though???? other than smoke