Yeah I mean what's the difference between igneel's fire dragon king and natsu's fire dragon king. Because no way in hell is madmolle and suzaku eating igneel's fire. Madmolle for sure is getting roasted.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
Also do you believe that base natsu can use fire dragon king attacks but that doesn't mean he's in his fire dragon king mode?
The difference is that Natsu's is weaker lol, or has less magic power poured into it (making it not as potent/hot) if you want an answer that's a little more in-depth.
I also believe this to. Using fdk in base is very different from the mode. Just like how fdk attacks with dragon force are far more potent.
The moves that defeated FH Zeref and Mercphobia represent the max potential of FDK. Natsu can only reach this level with POF or eating Ignia's flames. Igneel is naturally at this level.
It was Base Natsu. He can still use FDK in Base. Not once did he mention to be in FDKM or any of his other forms.Bullshit. Base Natsu didn't fought Suzaku. He's literally one-shot material to him. We saw that in Elentir.
In their rematch, Natsu literally used FDK scales and attacked him with Destruction Fist, something Suzaku tanked fine. Suzaku is solidly FDK Natsu tier.
Suzaku never caught Erza off guard. He warned Team Natsu before his attack and Erza reacted to his attack. If you wanna argue she was weakened from fighting Yoko, then that just means Suzaku is stronger because he would oneshot Yoko.
And lol at saying Misaki's attack power is equal to Suzaku's. Nothing suggests that. I guess that regular Spriggans' attack power is equal too
That’s pure headcannon. Erza is way stronger than Fire Dragon King. In fact she is stronger than Natsu all together, by Hiro Mashima himself.
Where did he say that? Show me where Mashima says that. FDK destruction fist defeated Zeref.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
Bro it's in French. I understand what you say but this forum is English speaking
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
They didnt always exist, and arent a basic function of dragon slaying magic. Actual dragon scales are too hard to break without dragon slaying magic. Natsu doesnt get scales unless he's in dragon force. He certainly doesnt get FDK scales, which are harder. Natsu's scales would make him uncutable to any of Erza's attacks not enchanted with DS.So you just ignored the fact that the scales always existed? Dragon scales are a basic function of ds magic they just aren't always shown.
Erza's katanas can channel all her power into an attack. Erza has to channel her magic into the sword for that to happen. And her armors also increase in durability the more she channels magic into them. Neither of those happened as she wasn't expecting a fight and only reacted in the moment to block the attack. And the same is true for natsu with him getting oneshot by an unnamed attack but when he actually prepared to block he could take even Suzaku's strongest attack. Erza being able to take hours worth of damage from Suzaku's peer means she's more than capable of taking hits from suzaku.
Regular people can use them within the intended range of uses. When they are pushed above their limit they drain a lot of mp quickly as seen in the bos. Erza pushed the decorative armor to move at the high speeds wizards fight at which is definitely outside of the intended use.
Dude what? Ajeel got beat by Elfman and Lisanna while it took df Wendy and third origin Sherria to take down Dimaria. And how is getting beat by END a demerit when that's the second strongest version of Natsu in that arc? Neinhart wasn't enchanted with raw mp, he had immunity to status effects which is why Brandish's spell didn't work. Natsu beat Jacob with what was his best attack at the time. Erza could do the same to the spriggan she fought since Ajeel barely took any damage before Nakagami. If not for Marin and Mashima wanting to show off Bisca's marksmanship, the fight would have ended sooner.
Laxus was still taking most of Kirin's lightning dragon skills just fine. The purpose of that point of discussion (which seems to have flown over your head) is that Laxus has enough durability to withstand attacks from Kirin. For whatever reason you want to insist that Misaki has significantly lower attack power than her peers (without any proof). OK Fine. But Erza's durability is similar to Laxus' so if Laxus can withstand those attacks then Erza should be able to as well. You'd have to do some serious mental gymnastics to try and say that even though Kirin got serious and was doing a full assault with his lightning ds magic, that all of his hits were weaker than a casual Suzaku's unnamed attack. Also Just because Erza didn't run out of magic with her blumenblatt doesn't mean she wasn't going all out with it. The reason she ran out of magic with it against Laxus was because of everything she was doing before hand and that was just the last portion of mp she had.
Erza was definitely more prepared. She went from Suzaku having a casual friendly conversation to suddenly trying to kill them, while with Misaki she was already convicted to beating her because of what she did to her hair and had already equipped her armor and fortified her defenses with magic. There's no proof that Suzaku hits harder. Suzaku took out unguarded and unprepared opponents. The same opponents can tank his and his peers attacks when they are prepared.
This is an irrelevant point which is why I disregarded Kirin's statement to begin with. The cramped space didn't lower any of their attack power or defensive stats. Suzaku was still able to pull off his strongest attack and Natsu withstood that. If Kirin or Misaki actually had stats that were superior to Erza or Laxus, they would not have been KOed by their final attacks.
A nerfed Dragon god is not dg tier I hate to break it to you. At the point he gets nerfed the scaling reverses. Dogramag was at a certain level of power for being a full power DG. If Natsu and Suzaku got some kind of power boost and had done anything to him in that state, they'd scale up to him. but he lost the majority of his power and his new level is an unknown far below a full power DG. At that point everything he did scales to whatever stats Natsu and Suzaku have. If Suzaku can survive the stomp from Nerfed Dogramag, that means the stomp isn't enough to take out a DDSK tier. Ignia's heat was spreading all throughout the labyrinth and was affecting everyone besides her. I'd guess that her dragon attribute has something to do with it. But Suzaku being in the blast doesn't mean he's more durable for tanking it since even Natsu can fine tune his flames so that they don't do too much damage to the ones inside it. It's the reason why when he uses flames that blow up a section of a city against fodder they don't die. Ignia wasn't trying to kill Natsu so neither of them would upscale to strength of the blast.
Her giving a statement about how it might be interesting for her to lose to her sons sword doesn't tell you anything? She was dominating the entire fight before hand. Then she says she's going to end it with her next attack. That attack never happens because she's interrupted by the all the hands awakening. Then she announces that it'd be a good twist if she were to lose there. Once she finds out about Georg her plan is solidified. She even admits that her loss was on purpose so the idea some of you have that she was genuinely overpowered and only decided on her plan after she lost is false.. The rest of what she said has been proven to be lip service to Suzaku. He was completely outclassed in everyway by the 2 human form DGs he came across afterwards. In fact the difference between someone on Suzaku's tier and a full power human DG is so vast that even if everyone in the labyrinth ( including people that beat people on Suzaku's tier) were to gang up on Dogramag, they wouldn't have been able to do any damage to him.
Jiemma wasn't stronger than Etherious Kyoka. Again strengthening every second. But yeah Erza probably wouldn't beat Mard Geer since it was seemed they only way for them to take him out at that point was Gray's devil slaying magic. I don't think Natsu standing at that point of the fight means he has better durability. Everyone was repeatedly getting knocked down and getting back up and it just so happened that Natsu was the last one to be attacked in the sequence. And it's not like they were KOed as everyone was up a few pages later shouting encouragement to Natsu. And when Acnologia did that explosion and we see Natsu still standing after the dust clears, we can see on the same page that Wendy was already enchanting him. This is why Acno was so confused about we Natsu wasn't affected because that was an attack that normally would have put him down for a bit.
Erza's last attack against Misaki wasn't really a "cut" either but it still used a blade. And how is meteor enchant weaker than what Suzaku has tanked when it oneshot someone on the same level as him? Where are you getting this from?
It's funny to me how you say this. You say that Selene's praise towards suzaku is lip service and you disregard suzaku's feat entirely but the same you always say character statements is important. Gray has no feats showing he can contend with suzaku but according to you because character statements said natsu=gray you said anything natsu can do gray can do. Tbh I don't know who wins this fight but the way you switch up is really weird to me. Carla might just be doing lip service when she said gray=natsu. And also you ignore the fact that selene said suzaku is stronger than her human form there's literally no statement that contradicts this. Suzaku>human selene is canon statement but because this time it's not fitting your agenda you switch up to using feats and saying lip serviceHer giving a statement about how it might be interesting for her to lose to her sons sword doesn't tell you anything? She was dominating the entire fight before hand. Then she says she's going to end it with her next attack. That attack never happens because she's interrupted by the all the hands awakening. Then she announces that it'd be a good twist if she were to lose there. Once she finds out about Georg her plan is solidified. She even admits that her loss was on purpose so the idea some of you have that she was genuinely overpowered and only decided on her plan after she lost is false.. The rest of what she said has been proven to be lip service to Suzaku. He was completely outclassed in everyway by the 2 human form DGs he came across afterwards. In fact the difference between someone on Suzaku's tier and a full power human DG is so vast that even if everyone in the labyrinth ( including people that beat people on Suzaku's tier) were to gang up on Dogramag, they wouldn't have been able to do any damage to him.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
Erza heavenly body enchant scales far higher than her regular katanas. Like someone said before the only reason her katana seems so strong is because she chants all her magic into them. Just like when Erza chanted all her magic power in her amudura fairy armor when she fought Eldoes Erza and that blew up an entire island. Erza heavenly body enchant seems Erza strongest attack at the moment. Since her attacks was so strong it started overpowering Gildarts level magic power.
I already made a post on this topic in the power ranking thread.Her giving a statement about how it might be interesting for her to lose to her sons sword doesn't tell you anything? She was dominating the entire fight before hand. Then she says she's going to end it with her next attack. That attack never happens because she's interrupted by the all the hands awakening. Then she announces that it'd be a good twist if she were to lose there. Once she finds out about Georg her plan is solidified. She even admits that her loss was on purpose so the idea some of you have that she was genuinely overpowered and only decided on her plan after she lost is false.. The rest of what she said has been proven to be lip service to Suzaku. He was completely outclassed in everyway by the 2 human form DGs he came across afterwards. In fact the difference between someone on Suzaku's tier and a full power human DG is so vast that even if everyone in the labyrinth ( including people that beat people on Suzaku's tier) were to gang up on Dogramag, they wouldn't have been able to do any damage to him.
That wasn't Base Natsu. It was FDK Natsu. He literally had to defend himself with the Fire Dragon King's scales and used a Destruction Fist against him but you're still claiming that it was Base Natsu. I guess Natsu was in Base when he beat Hades or Jackal even though he used an LFD attack. I guess Natsu took Jacob more seriously than Mercphobia or Madmole because he didn't yell FDK Mode when he attacked them
Base Natsu gets oneshot by Suzaku as we saw in Elentir.
It was shown. Suzaku took down Erza in one hit. Misaki doesnt, but her damage is enough to take down Erza. Misaki isnt just as strong as Suzaku without accounting for the effects of her magic. She simply isnt. I mean, it shouldnt even need to be stated that they are only equals if you account for their magic.
I know that, I was talking about the Jacob fight.
I don't seriously think that, I was saying that ironically. Jko seems to believe that the Dark Knights have equal attack power because they were stated to be equal in strength, and Spriggans were also stated to be equals, so that would mean that, according to his logic, Lucy has better durability than Erza because she tanked Jacob's attacks better than Erza tanked Ajeel's hits.
I believe Lucy can tank hits from Spriggans. She's already showed she could in the manga. But she obviously doesn't have better durability than Erza.
