Discussion The Goddess Clan Thread

Demonspeed

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I just read about the episode but I did find the development with mel straight up killing a goddess unusual. What was the prophecy?
Galan's apparition at Camelot. All the 6 Sins hear it from Bartra at the castle. Ban and King are missing when it happens in the manga, and there is the stuff about the Pleiades, Balor's Eye etc.
 

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I think Mael is male and the queen of the Goddesses was sealed in the Horn of Cernunnos; it just feels right.
Besides, it makes little sense for her to be sealed in Excalibur as having a good portion of Arthur's power be dependent on an enemy of Meliodas' would be a tad odd.
 

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I think Mael is male and the queen of the Goddesses was sealed in the Horn of Cernunnos; it just feels right.
Besides, it makes little sense for her to be sealed in Excalibur as having a good portion of Arthur's power be dependent on an enemy of Meliodas' would be a tad odd.
Well, the most likely scenario around excalibur is that it simply works as a sacred treasure would. I wouldn't expect it to make up a significant portion of arthur's power in the same way the other sacred treasures don't make up a significant portion of the sin's powers. I mean, meliodas only uses the clones to play around or when they wouldn't make a difference anyways, basically they are a parlor trick. The scenarios in which they would be legitimately useful to mel seem limited at best since they would only do something useful when they have the chance to full counter something. King's so far only releases his power but it doesn't seem to actually add anything to him. Escanor unleashes power the treasure absorbs but it seems to not be a lot of power in relation to what he could otherwise release at more convenient times. He weakened but didn't kill 2 commandments after all. Now, if excalibur was indeed sent by the goddess clan then perhaps we have to deal with the prospect of whatever the treasure is meant to do. Perhaps they plan to make use of arthur's innate magic which is considerable even compared to the commandments of archangels.

I have been wondering on the goddess clan loosing their bodies for 3000 years... This whole thing does not make too much sense at all. What could have plausibly happened that left the goddess clan without bodies for 3000 years? If anything, if they use up their magic then they should remain at zero magic rather than vanish. I am thinking that the goddess clan having corporeal form might be dependent on some yet unknown factor. Perhaps they lost their bodies because the connection to the goddess realm was lost?
 

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Well, the most likely scenario around excalibur is that it simply works as a sacred treasure would. I wouldn't expect it to make up a significant portion of arthur's power in the same way the other sacred treasures don't make up a significant portion of the sin's powers. I mean, meliodas only uses the clones to play around or when they wouldn't make a difference anyways, basically they are a parlor trick. The scenarios in which they would be legitimately useful to mel seem limited at best since they would only do something useful when they have the chance to full counter something. King's so far only releases his power but it doesn't seem to actually add anything to him. Escanor unleashes power the treasure absorbs but it seems to not be a lot of power in relation to what he could otherwise release at more convenient times. He weakened but didn't kill 2 commandments after all. Now, if excalibur was indeed sent by the goddess clan then perhaps we have to deal with the prospect of whatever the treasure is meant to do. Perhaps they plan to make use of arthur's innate magic which is considerable even compared to the commandments of archangels.

I have been wondering on the goddess clan loosing their bodies for 3000 years... This whole thing does not make too much sense at all. What could have plausibly happened that left the goddess clan without bodies for 3000 years? If anything, if they use up their magic then they should remain at zero magic rather than vanish. I am thinking that the goddess clan having corporeal form might be dependent on some yet unknown factor. Perhaps they lost their bodies because the connection to the goddess realm was lost?
Because Meliodas and Escanor are so powerful that a weapon makes no difference whatsoever, in addition to Rhitta's special ability being terrible.
I have to disagree on King - Chastiefol significantly increases his overall battle power; that, however, is not something to be discussed here.
If Excalibur acts anything like Basquias or Chastiefol, then it can add a good chunk of power to Arthur's arsenal. Still, that's not even what I'm trying to base my argument on - the point is that it would be odd to have Excalibur, a weapon associated with Arthur, be under the influence of a goddess with presumably malevolent ideals.
 

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Because Meliodas and Escanor are so powerful that a weapon makes no difference whatsoever, in addition to Rhitta's special ability being terrible.
I have to disagree on King - Chastiefol significantly increases his overall battle power; that, however, is not something to be discussed here.
If Excalibur acts anything like Basquias or Chastiefol, then it can add a good chunk of power to Arthur's arsenal. Still, that's not even what I'm trying to base my argument on - the point is that it would be odd to have Excalibur, a weapon associated with Arthur, be under the influence of a goddess with presumably malevolent ideals.
Thing is, chastiefol does not work like that. Chastiefol is a release, which has the implication that before using the release it is, well, unreleased. It does not actually add to king's power. It simply releases power that is otherwise sealed. Basically it's a crappy supplementary ability which will actually become irrelevant once king becomes stronger. Like with gloxinia, he carries it around in it's most advanced form without any stamina issues whatever. Heck, we can't even rule out baskias not having the release bit. In that regard, there is no sacred treasure so far that actually adds to PL in the way you suggest excalibur could add to arthur's power.

I don't think it would be odd. I mean, this is nakaba's take on the arthurian legend. It would be a change comparable to ban's role in the story or whatever other character that is not exactly the same as in the arthurian legend. In any case, for me it would be weird if a sword that literally fell from the sky has no relation to the goddess clan. And given what we know of the goddess clan, it would be a stretch if the intentions behind that are not at least to some point less than benevolent. They are not straight up enemies but they are also not friends either, specially to meliodas.
 

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Thing is, chastiefol does not work like that. Chastiefol is a release, which has the implication that before using the release it is, well, unreleased. It does not actually add to king's power. It simply releases power that is otherwise sealed. Basically it's a crappy supplementary ability which will actually become irrelevant once king becomes stronger. Like with gloxinia, he carries it around in it's most advanced form without any stamina issues whatever. Heck, we can't even rule out baskias not having the release bit. In that regard, there is no sacred treasure so far that actually adds to PL in the way you suggest excalibur could add to arthur's power.

I don't think it would be odd. I mean, this is nakaba's take on the arthurian legend. It would be a change comparable to ban's role in the story or whatever other character that is not exactly the same as in the arthurian legend. In any case, for me it would be weird if a sword that literally fell from the sky has no relation to the goddess clan. And given what we know of the goddess clan, it would be a stretch if the intentions behind that are not at least to some point less than benevolent. They are not straight up enemies but they are also not friends either, specially to meliodas.
Adding to one's power does not necessarily imply adding power level - none of the Sacred Treasures "add" power level, but they do increase battling capabilities by a good margin.
Again, I disagree on Chastiefol - it will never become irrelevant. The Spirit Spears we have seen greatly influence power, although they rely on drawing out magic or strength.

It's a bit too holy to be influenced by someone with malevolent intentions, if you ask me. Excalibur being a divine sword/from the Goddesses' Realm is something I can see, but not its hosting a potentially hazardous person.
Well, they want Meliodas dead, so that goes against every protagonist in this series, even though they're not "enemies."
 

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Adding to one's power does not necessarily imply adding power level - none of the Sacred Treasures "add" power level, but they do increase battling capabilities by a good margin.
Again, I disagree on Chastiefol - it will never become irrelevant. The Spirit Spears we have seen greatly influence power, although they rely on drawing out magic or strength.

It's a bit too holy to be influenced by someone with malevolent intentions, if you ask me. Excalibur being a divine sword/from the Goddesses' Realm is something I can see, but not its hosting a potentially hazardous person.
Well, they want Meliodas dead, so that goes against every protagonist in this series, even though they're not "enemies."
Well, what good would sealing chastiefol do if king can fully control it without straining himself? The point of the ability is not to enhance power, it's to suppress it. Beyond that it does not seem to do anything nor have any relevance.

No concept is too holy for this manga, at least not in the way you suggest. I mean, the seven deadly sins are the good guys and the ten commandments are the bad guys. And then you have the goddess clan whose holy light is outright consistently genocidal and murderous in spite of it being exceptional at healing and purging darkness which is not always evil. Excalibur isn't holier than any of the concepts nakaba has already twisted. You could be right and excalibur is an inherently benevolent weapon for good. But nakaba would take no issue whatever with turning the thing into a tool for goddesses to screw over measly humans.
 

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Well, what good would sealing chastiefol do if king can fully control it without straining himself? The point of the ability is not to enhance power, it's to suppress it. Beyond that it does not seem to do anything nor have any relevance.

No concept is too holy for this manga, at least not in the way you suggest. I mean, the seven deadly sins are the good guys and the ten commandments are the bad guys. And then you have the goddess clan whose holy light is outright consistently genocidal and murderous in spite of it being exceptional at healing and purging darkness which is not always evil. Excalibur isn't holier than any of the concepts nakaba has already twisted. You could be right and excalibur is an inherently benevolent weapon for good. But nakaba would take no issue whatever with turning the thing into a tool for goddesses to screw over measly humans.
Oh, you meant the regular form? Of course. But the true form is still a Sacred Treasure which adds to his power.

I wouldn't say so. Arthur's destined to do great things, and he already has Cath. Adding a goddess to the equation, and that inside a sword (which, from what we've seen, cannot be willingly controlled by the goddess, so it adds no power whatsoever) is a bit too... redundant. Arthur already has his "sidekick", if you will, so another one is not needed, especially if it requires Arthur's body as a host. I'd be far happier with its being a divine sword meant for Arthur, the pure and handsome boy.
We've seen too much corruption already.
 

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Oh, you meant the regular form? Of course. But the true form is still a Sacred Treasure which adds to his power.

I wouldn't say so. Arthur's destined to do great things, and he already has Cath. Adding a goddess to the equation, and that inside a sword (which, from what we've seen, cannot be willingly controlled by the goddess, so it adds no power whatsoever) is a bit too... redundant. Arthur already has his "sidekick", if you will, so another one is not needed, especially if it requires Arthur's body as a host. I'd be far happier with its being a divine sword meant for Arthur, the pure and handsome boy.
We've seen too much corruption already.
Sacred treasures don't add to the power of the user, at the early stages of the manga they simply allowed the user to draw out more. And even that concept is almost scrapped considering we have seen plenty of people who are able to draw out their full power without weapons. At the very least a weapon is not needed for the sins to draw out their full power currently as was the case in the early stages of the manga. And more importantly, weapons of the same quality as the sacred treasures are not that weird. Even holy knights had them by the byzel arc. Basically at the moment sacred treasures are high quality weapons which can basically withstand the sin's powers and also have secondary supplementary abilities.

Can you imagine the goddess clan simply sending a sword down to earth for a human to use it? That seems uncharacteristic of the goddess clan at this stage considering that so far their behavior is at least questionable. Certainly not all goddess clan members are evil but clearly the upper ranks are about as bad as the ten commandments. And we are supposed to believe they would just send a sword down to earth out of the goodness of their heart? Maybe that would make sense if there was a divine non goddess factor at play but at this point that does not seem to be a thing. Given what we know, I would call shenanigans on any gift the goddess clan suddenly sends out of the "goodness" of their heart.
 

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Sacred treasures don't add to the power of the user, at the early stages of the manga they simply allowed the user to draw out more. And even that concept is almost scrapped considering we have seen plenty of people who are able to draw out their full power without weapons. At the very least a weapon is not needed for the sins to draw out their full power currently as was the case in the early stages of the manga. And more importantly, weapons of the same quality as the sacred treasures are not that weird. Even holy knights had them by the byzel arc. Basically at the moment sacred treasures are high quality weapons which can basically withstand the sin's powers and also have secondary supplementary abilities.

Can you imagine the goddess clan simply sending a sword down to earth for a human to use it? That seems uncharacteristic of the goddess clan at this stage considering that so far their behavior is at least questionable. Certainly not all goddess clan members are evil but clearly the upper ranks are about as bad as the ten commandments. And we are supposed to believe they would just send a sword down to earth out of the goodness of their heart? Maybe that would make sense if there was a divine non goddess factor at play but at this point that does not seem to be a thing. Given what we know, I would call shenanigans on any gift the goddess clan suddenly sends out of the "goodness" of their heart.
Call it adding to their power or drawing out their hidden power, it positively reflects on the Sins' ability to fight. Meliodas could barely fight an Albion without Lostvayne, whereas he managed to immediately chop its arm off with the sacred treasure. You're undermining STs far too much - Chastiefol and Basquias are proof of how immense their influence in battle is.

It doesn't have to be an intentional "gift" to the humans. It could just have "fallen" there accidentally, and to everyone's surprise, a human was deemed worthy of wielding it.
And like you mentioned, it doesn't even have to be of divine origin - nothing but the fact that it apparently was said to be "holy" supports the argument, really.
 

Demonspeed

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A ST-tier weapon is never useless. Outside of their special abilities which have been revealed only in the second saga, they are basic amplifiers, weapons of the highest quality. Meliodas was unable to cut Dale until he got Liz's sword and the same thing happened against Albion, I think the potential of Physical Clone and Full Counter is insane, especially with Meliodas's multiple transformations. Escanor would be much less effective without Rhitta, which is a weapon able to absorb and channel his Sunshine. Charge & Fire is his ultimate attack.

Excalibur might host a Goddess but it should not actually affect his PL. He managed to take the sword because he was special: Merlin saw something in him, his PL is 40K, he was able to match Hendrickson in swordsmanship during his first real swordfight and through training he manifested a magic pet who has a PL of 5K already. He is abnormal.

If there is a Goddess in Excalibur she will leave it, but it should not affect the quality and powers of the weapon.
 

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Call it adding to their power or drawing out their hidden power, it positively reflects on the Sins' ability to fight. Meliodas could barely fight an Albion without Lostvayne, whereas he managed to immediately chop its arm off with the sacred treasure. You're undermining STs far too much - Chastiefol and Basquias are proof of how immense their influence in battle is.

It doesn't have to be an intentional "gift" to the humans. It could just have "fallen" there accidentally, and to everyone's surprise, a human was deemed worthy of wielding it.
And like you mentioned, it doesn't even have to be of divine origin - nothing but the fact that it apparently was said to be "holy" supports the argument, really.
Well, my point was that it did not have that effect anymore as the sins are clearly able to draw out their full power without weapons nowadays. Hence things like diane being able to match dolor's golems when in the past she could not match guila while unarmed. Right now diane uses gideon not because she needs it to draw her power but rather simply because she prefers fighting with a weapon than without one. Quality wise the manga points to sacred treasures not being that much better than weapons available to holy knights at least. Rather than quality the difference between sacred treasures and normal weapons is the abilities they have. Basically, the effect sacred treasures have in battle has been diminished since the manga started. Not to mention that chastiefol and basquias specifically work different from other sacred treasures in that they are made from the sacred tree. And even then, basquias does not necessarily have nor gloxinia needs chastiefol's sealed form. In fact, he hangs around with his spear in its true form and it does not even vaguely strain him. Basically, even if basquias had the same ability as chastiefol, it wouldn't do much difference to him.

Well, that is plausible but I am not so sure that would make for a good story. Imagine the sword was accidentally dropped by a leprechaun with a pot of fake gold on a cloud by accident. It's plausible but so is anything else really. In any case, if the weapon is holy in a manner relevant to stuff we know then it's almost certainly related to the goddess clan in which case it is completely reasonable to call shenanigans. And if the manga aims to be consistent meliodas knows the sword, it's original owners and what the shenanigans imply and simply failed to mention it until it is too late.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
A ST-tier weapon is never useless. Outside of their special abilities which have been revealed only in the second saga, they are basic amplifiers, weapons of the highest quality. Meliodas was unable to cut Dale until he got Liz's sword and the same thing happened against Albion, I think the potential of Physical Clone and Full Counter is insane, especially with Meliodas's multiple transformations. Escanor would be much less effective without Rhitta, which is a weapon able to absorb and channel his Sunshine. Charge & Fire is his ultimate attack.

Excalibur might host a Goddess but it should not actually affect his PL. He managed to take the sword because he was special: Merlin saw something in him, his PL is 40K, he was able to match Hendrickson in swordsmanship during his first real swordfight and through training he manifested a magic pet who has a PL of 5K already. He is abnormal.

If there is a Goddess in Excalibur she will leave it, but it should not affect the quality and powers of the weapon.
I am not suggesting they are useless, I am saying simply that sacred treasure quality weapons are available to virtually everyone at this point. As I said earlier, even guila and jericho had that quality of weapons. Rhitta is meant to suppress escanor's power. I am not sure it really makes that much of a difference output wise beyond that. Without it his power would likely increase and go out of control much faster than it does now.

Well, if it hosts a goddess then it should work similarly to the sword that held nerobasta. However if it does that it means arthur would die after summoning the goddess once assuming the process is similar to what denzel did before. To me however that does not sound like a likely development for obvious reasons. I guess this also depends on why exactly arthur is not currently using the weapon. As for possibilities for why he is not using the sword I would guess that he tried using it but couldn't for whatever reason or perhaps merlin straight up told him not to use it.
 

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I think Mael is male and the queen of the Goddesses was sealed in the Horn of Cernunnos; it just feels right.
Besides, it makes little sense for her to be sealed in Excalibur as having a good portion of Arthur's power be dependent on an enemy of Meliodas' would be a tad odd.
Why does it feel right to you?
 

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Why does it feel right to you?
Her tone made it sound so. Ludociel has been hinted to be at the top of the four archangels, so Mael shouldn't be someone who influences Meliodas heavily. Elizabeth's mother, however, is a completely different story, seeing her daughter's and the demon's relationship.

Mael could still have a major impact on the arc, but it would be a bit... outlandish, if you will (mainly because he's never been brought up).
 

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I don't think Ludociel is the leader of the AA, but he is most likely their main representative in Stigma and the leader of the alliance. Sariel and Tarmiel didn't seem to treat him as their superior, and Karmadios was calling Meliodas, the previous leader of the TC, 'Lord Meliodas'(must be -sama in Japanese). The two Archangels only that honorific for Elizabeth.

Even if he is the leader of the AA I am certain that Mael is the strongest. Mael could be male but I would prefer at least a female member among them. It would give more weight to the name of their race.

Well, if it hosts a goddess then it should work similarly to the sword that held nerobasta. However if it does that it means arthur would die after summoning the goddess once assuming the process is similar to what denzel did before. To me however that does not sound like a likely development for obvious reasons. I guess this also depends on why exactly arthur is not currently using the weapon. As for possibilities for why he is not using the sword I would guess that he tried using it but couldn't for whatever reason or perhaps merlin straight up told him not to use it.
Excalibur seems more special than that but he would not be the one to do the incantation I think. And with Merlin at his side there must be plenty of ways to deal with it.
 

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I don't think Ludociel is the leader of the AA, but he is most likely their main representative in Stigma and the leader of the alliance. Sariel and Tarmiel didn't seem to treat him as their superior, and Karmadios was calling Meliodas, the previous leader of the TC, 'Lord Meliodas'(must be -sama in Japanese). The two Archangels only that honorific for Elizabeth.
They obeyed to his orders (at least initially) by replying with "YES SIR!" - it's pretty clear that he's slightly superior to them in the current situation.
Mael can also be said to be equal to Ludo or under his command precisely because Ludo said "Call Mael!" and not "lord" or "sir" Mael.
The latter might be stronger, but that doesn't really mean anything in the end.
 

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Does the goddess clan even have a second, more powerful form (lol super saiyan) form they can use? The demons have Indura but only those over 50k power level could use it, so not many. I think Ludociel might have had one but not for Sariel or Tarmiel.
 

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Does the goddess clan even have a second, more powerful form (lol super saiyan) form they can use? The demons have Indura but only those over 50k power level could use it, so not many. I think Ludociel might have had one but not for Sariel or Tarmiel.
People assume it might be the case because of their relationship with the Demon clan.
 

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The Goddess Queen is definetly the strongest in the Goddess Clan.

She might have been the one who in the Holy war stood and fought Demon King.



Though i am curious about Elizabeth's position.Due to her wing's size she seemed a very top tier Goddess and and other Goddesss Clan members also respect her.


What if she is the daughter of the Goddess Queen.This will parallel Meliodas who is the son of the Demon King.
 

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The Goddess Queen is definetly the strongest in the Goddess Clan.

She might have been the one who in the Holy war stood and fought Demon King.



Though i am curious about Elizabeth's position.Due to her wing's size she seemed a very top tier Goddess and and other Goddesss Clan members also respect her.


What if she is the daughter of the Goddess Queen.This will parallel Meliodas who is the son of the Demon King.
It's pretty safe to say the Goddess Queen is the strongest goddess and Elizabeth mother. I'm more interested in when Nakaba actually gonna introduced her in the story. Even just a name drop like he does with the Demon King will do me.
 
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