Discussion The Japanese Study Thread

[Brede]

Re: The Japanese Language

erm...this has probably been asked before but i can't seem to find the answer...what does 'dattebayo' mean? is it 1 word or 2? thanks!

 

[KTFS]

Re: The Japanese Language

Dattebayo has no specific meaning. It's there to renforce the sentence body basicly an ender. It's a slang type. In the american verson they use "belive it" but it realy depens on were your from. Some places the ender would be "you heard me" or "ya damn right" just depens on where your from. In japan they use other enders like datte ('that's the way it is' or 'that's what he/she said'), yo ( reinforce the sentence) and wa (girlish ending),It's used to reinforce whatever your talking about.

It's a vague word, nonspecific and can be used in differently. If anyones ever played King of fighter Yuri uses Nandattebayo which is 4 words Nani + datte + dabe + yo. Dattebayo is used the same way combination of enders that is supposed to be Naruto's catch phrase. So, dattebayo is datte + dabe + yo slang way of saying that's the way it is (loosely). *And Americans came up with ''Believe it.* Like I said just depens where your from. Well hope that answers it I'm off to bed.

 

[Iwanin]

Re: The Japanese Language

erm...this has probably been asked before but i can't seem to find the answer...what does 'dattebayo' mean? is it 1 word or 2? thanks!

"dattebayo"

da + tteba + yo

I guess you could say that's three words... kinda... depends on what you wanna call a "word", but these three terms can be used independently, so let's say these are the words that make up the expression.

Now...

da = de aru, "to be"
tteba = teba = originally "to ieba" (although the meaning is now different).
yo = emphasis particle.

As far as tteba's concerned, this is the corresponding dictionary entry.

文末にあって種々の語に付く。じれったい気持ちをこめて、呼びかけるのに用いる。

A sentence terminator for a variety of phrases. Used to convey feelings of impatience when calling out.

「お母さん、はやくっ―」
Mom, hurry *up*!

That's where tteba comes from, but Naruto uses it for everything. Nobody in real life would use tteba as much as Naruto does, so for all intents and purposes, it's Kishimoto's creation.

Naruto's a very impatient "c'mon already!" type character, so Kishimoto decided to make it his catch phrase, thus conveying his youthful energy. He says something to that effect in one of the databooks.

I think I should point out that it's not slang per se (though it's not a particularly sophisticated sentence terminator), and that "datte" has a variety of different meanings (OK, two that I know of), none of which relate to "dattebayo". This is because it's not "dattebayo", but just "ttebayo" - of course, if the sentence carries the verb "to be", that's the way it looks like (da+ttebayo).

Listen carefully to the animé and you'll notice the "da" part is not always there (urusee ttebayo! hayaku iku ttebayo! etc)

 

[Brede]

Re: The Japanese Language

thanks KTFS and Iwanin! been wondering about the word for long time now.

 

[destinator]

Re: Japanese Learning Resources

thx for all the nice resources

http://www.thejapanesepage.com/hiraganaquiz.htm is a good way to test your hiragana knowledge or at least I found it very useful after learning all of them to test my mind xD

 

[Nihongaeri]

Re: The Japanese Language

Nobody in real life would use tteba as much as Naruto does, so for all intents and purposes, it's Kishimoto's creation.

While I certainly don't have any incredibly specific recollection of having heard someone use "ttebayo" before running into Naruto, I was reading "Hokuto No Ken" (published between 1983 and 1988) a couple months ago and one of the characters, バット, used "ttebayo" at the end of a sentence. He was also a young, somewhat misbehaved boy... Coincidence? Me thinks not. Naruto is quite possible the first example of a character where the ending became a pet phrase though...

 

[bebong]

Re: The Japanese Language

can i ask someEDIT: LOTS of things???

#Question 1
I kno everybody knows ****** as porn, but when im browsing my naruto manga volume 21 japanese, in chapter 182, page 6
panel 4, when tsunade thinks ( in jap trans okay, i can trans in jap coz of these sneaky expensive naruto jap books )"....... hoshii no wa uchiha no nouryokuga...ano hentaiyaro-ga."
in the english trans it should be like thisin my own trans ( i can translate to english..but only a little and not so accurate) "....... So he wants the uchiha ability... that abnormal."
so assuming ano- is that (which that i know), so hentaiyaro is abnormal??? because like ppls that dont know jap well assumes ****** = porn

#Question 2
and urmmm, according to nihongaeri's statement=

While I certainly don't have any incredibly specific recollection of having heard someone use "ttebayo" before running into Naruto, I was reading "Hokuto No Ken" (published between 1983 and 1988) a couple months ago and one of the characters, バット, used "ttebayo" at the end of a sentence. He was also a young, somewhat misbehaved boy... Coincidence? Me thinks not. Naruto is quite possible the first example of a character where the ending became a pet phrase though...

so ttebayo is just a phrase like that, only to add?? i wanna know what's the reason, and so kidoumaru's 'seyo' is also a pet phrase too?? coz i read the jap comics and he often ends his sentence with seyo, in example = "owatsuseyo" or "owariseyo"is there anyone else in naruto with a pet phrase? if he/she exists

#Ouestion 3
ermmmm yeah (i've been editing this for several times already.....) another question!!!
-Is the small hiragana tsu (reverse c) makes the next letter of the character double letters, like....errr dattebayo. Dattebayo has the characters da, then a small tsu there, then te, ba, and yo, and instead of only datebayo we say its dattebayo right??? And another example of this is ossu. ossu uses the o katakana letter, then a small tsu katakana letter, and a su katakana letter. So, well, in the ki system we also say ossu not just osu. I think this small tsu adds an exaggeration (?) of the word. Urmmm, I just want to confirm this LOL

 

[Iwanin]

Re: The Japanese Language

can i ask someEDIT: LOTS of  things???

#Question 1
I kno everybody  knows ****** as porn, but when im browsing my naruto manga volume 21 japanese, in chapter 182, page 6
panel 4, when tsunade thinks ( in jap trans okay, i can trans in jap coz of these sneaky expensive naruto jap books )"....... hoshii no wa uchiha no nouryokuga...ano hentaiyaro-ga."
in the english trans it should be like thisin my own trans ( i can translate to english..but only a little and not so accurate) "....... So he wants the uchiha ability... that abnormal."
so assuming ano- is that (which that i know), so hentaiyaro is abnormal??? because like ppls  that dont know jap well assumes ****** = porn

Yes, ****** means abnormal.

hen = change, wierd.
tai = condition, demeanor.

So essentially, the word points to someone who's nature deviates from the norm.

Look the word up in the dictionary and you'll find more than one entry. The main entry is, precisely, "abnormal":

1)形や状態が変わること。また、その変わった形や状態。

To change* shape or condition. Also, said condition.

*I should stress that this "change" has strong connotations of "to become abnormal", especially when the verb is used in the past and progressive tenses as a noun modifier.

(2)「変態性欲」の略。また、その傾向のある人。

Abreviated form of "hentaiseiyoku" (abnormal sexual desire). Also, the person with tendencies described by this term.

So basically, "******" describes people or thing with deviant sexual desires.

It should be noted that the term "pervert" also stems from the latin "to change direction."

In the case of "ano ****** yarou"... well, I guess Tsunade's referring to Orochimaru's... maybe to his "corrupted desire for power", and at the same time, to the fact that he's a wierdo....   [br]Posted at: May 10, 2006, 10:44:03 AM_________________________________________________

#Question 2
and urmmm, according to nihongaeri's statement=so ttebayo is just a phrase like that, only to add?? i wanna know what's the reason, and so kidoumaru's 'seyo' is also a pet phrase too?? coz i read the jap comics and he often ends his sentence with seyo, in example = "owatsuseyo" or "owariseyo"is there anyone else in naruto with a pet phrase? if he/she exists

I should probably wait for Nihongaeri on this one, but as far as I know, "se yo" is like an archaic imperative (se + yo for emphasis). So it's just a way of sounding really grandiose when you say "do this or that". I think.

But as for pet phrases... like dattebayo, no, although certain characters have particular speech styles that reflect or are meant to mimic different regional dialects. Orochimaru sounds like a girl, for instance.

[br]Posted at: May 10, 2006, 02:23:03 PM_________________________________________________

#Ouestion 3
ermmmm yeah (i've been editing this for several times already.....) another question!!!
-Is the small hiragana tsu (reverse c) makes the next letter of the character double letters, like....errr dattebayo.  Dattebayo has the characters da, then a small tsu there, then te, ba, and yo, and instead of only datebayo we say its dattebayo right???

Right.

And another example of this is ossu. ossu uses the o katakana letter, then a small tsu katakana letter, and a su katakana letter. So, well, in the ki system we also say ossu not just osu. I think this small tsu adds an exaggeration (?) of the word. Urmmm, I just want to confirm this LOL

Yes, something like that. At the end of a sentence, the small "tsu" is the equivalent of an exclamation mark. Although they also use exclamation marks. Go figure. 

 

[bebong]

Re: The Japanese Language

oh thanx iwanin *writes it in a book*

hey, i still got lots of questons
why say me like boku and watashi, or ore

whats the difference??

and why the ha-ha for uchiha is read like-wa

because we already got wa but japanese also pronounce it-wa

 

[Nihongaeri]

Re: The Japanese Language

I should probably wait for Nihongaeri on this one, but as far as I know, "se yo" is like an archaic imperative (se + yo for emphasis). So it's just a way of sounding really grandiose when you say "do this or that". I think.

Not sure how "archaic" sounding "seyo" really is though... That is, you certainly here it used out there a lot more than you do say "thou" and "thee" in English. But yeah, "seyo" is basically just an imperative form with a really authoritative effect...

But I would make note that Kidomaru's pet phrase is actually "zeyo". This is just another emphasis marker (at least in terms of how you typically see it used). It again isn't REALLY archaic as far as I know, although it is used a lot less than "seyo" is. I remember them having Hijikata saying "zeyo" quite a bit in the Taiga Drama of Shinsengumi a couple years ago.

 

[Rampages]

Re: The Japanese Language

Did japanese people adopt the word "lucky" or is it just some type of slang ?

 

[Nihongaeri]

Re: The Japanese Language

Did japanese people adopt the word "lucky" or is it just some type of slang ?

If I might rephrase the question... "Is the Japanese word that is derived from the English word "lucky" a mainstream expression, or is it merely a slang expression used by a select few groups?" ... Something along those lines, right? I suppose the answer is still "both" though... It's a common enough expression in Japanese today that virtually anybody with a reasonable amount of connection to the mainstream has heard and is aware of it. Still, it's more of an informal expression than other more native Japanese expressions available.

 

[karasu]

Re: The Japanese Language

oh thanx iwanin *writes it in a book*

hey, i still got lots of questons
why say me like boku and watashi, or ore

whats the difference??

and why the ha-ha for uchiha is read like-wa

because we already got wa but japanese also pronounce it-wa

boku, watashi, ore, atashi, ora (haha, son gokou)
their difference lies in usage.. formal use, gender, etc..
i'm not too sure myself.
boku is informal general use.. (like "gue" in indo)
watashi is general formal use.. (like "saya" / "aku" in indo)
atashi is for girls.. informal..
ore is a for boys.. informal..
and ora... 
anyone wanna confirm / correct me, feel free to do so
and while you're at that...confirm me the differences between kimi, teme, anata, anta, omae etc...

i thought ha in uchiha is read as ha?
ha  は　is read as wa　わ　only when they're used as a 'to-be', right? like is/are and so on?
as in 私は。。。　is read as watashi wa
konnichiwa too.. こんにちは。。。 coz konnichiwa is a short for something much longer i've forgotten about it.. but i remember my lecturer was talking about it sometime ago.. something like "today, i hope you well" or around that line..
they cut it into "today is.."
apparently nobody uses the longer term anymore.. it's so old...

but answering to that question.. other cases of は　is still read as ha....
はこ　(hako) is read as hako and not wako..
はな　(hana) is read as hana and not wana..

in similar cases:
へ　'he'  (indicating location) is also read as 'e'
but other cases like へへへへ。。。 (laughing: hehehehe) is still read as 'he'
を　'wo' (indicating actions) is also read as 'o'
wo is not used as anything else other than this.. i believe..

ヲ　wo in katakana has never been used for anything i guess....

 

[NeoShweaty]

Re: The Japanese Language

Ore and Boku are both exclusively male, while watashi is for both but my japanese teacher says that it leans to more of a girly way of saying I but i havent found that to be very true.

The kimi, teme, anata, anta and omae stuff is just different levels of saying you (although these are largely derrogatory, it seems) i think it ranges from, in this list, anata being the most formal and teme being the most informal, derrogatory one, but i am no expert.

 

[Rampages]

Re: The Japanese Language

If I might rephrase the question... "Is the Japanese word that is derived from the English word "lucky" a mainstream expression, or is it merely a slang expression used by a select few groups?" ... Something along those lines, right? I suppose the answer is still "both" though... It's a common enough expression in Japanese today that virtually anybody with a reasonable amount of connection to the mainstream has heard and is aware of it. Still, it's more of an informal expression than other more native Japanese expressions available.

ohh thanks. I saw a lot of people use that word in animes, so I was wondering.

 

[karasu]

Re: The Japanese Language

do genders play a part in the usage of kimi/omae/anata/anta?
i thought anta was supposed to be used by girls only...

 

[Iwanin]

Re: The Japanese Language

Well, techincally, all first person terms are gender neutral. This means they can be used by both men and women.

So, for instance, you'll hear one of the female employee's at the bathhouse in Sen to Chihiro use Ore. You'll  hear the tomboish Utena say Boku. You'll hear gay male characters use Atashi.

Watashi/Watakushi are more or less gender neutral in their usage.

As for the rest...

Ore - informal, "tough" male form.
Boku - more-informal-than-not male form.
Atashi - cute "girlish" form.

There are, however, lots and lots more ways to refer to yourself. These are only the most common. And let's not forget Ware and Wa (ga), the, er, classical alternatives.

As for how to refer to someone you're talking to, here's a partial list of (to my knowledge) the most common alternatives, from most formal to most vulgar:

Third person (i.e, calling someone by his or her name, etc).
Kimi
Anata
Anta
Omae
Temee

Actually, it's really common to address someone in the third person. Really common. In fact, it's advisable you know the person and have some sort of relationship with him or her before you try using any of the direct terms (from Kimi to Temee).

As for usage by men and women, the second person pronouns aren't as restricted by gender as the first person pronouns. Still, men are far more likely to use the more vulgar alternatives.

 

[NeoShweaty]

Re: The Japanese Language

is ora an actual way to refer to one's self or is that just goku? where in japan do they say that, if it is used, because i would assume it is a dialect thing?

 

[Iwanin]

Re: The Japanese Language

is ora an actual way to refer to one's self or is that just goku? where in japan do they say that, if it is used, because i would assume it is a dialect thing?

It's an actual first person term. It's basically a variation of ore/oira.

 

[NeoShweaty]

Re: The Japanese Language

All these varieties. I think ill refer to myself as ora from now on. I want to see if my japanese teacher thinks it is wierd.