Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2018] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[Leoat12]

And just because you like a series, or think it has its good points, doesn't stop other people from disliking it. What's your point?

His point is that people cannot criticize what he likes. People these days thinks it is easier just complain about people's opinions instead of proving them wrong by adding their own arguments. Why Black Clover is not bad? List your arguments, put some technical arguments on the table and we will listen. People come with fanboyism and get mad when we laugh.

 

[Tarot]

His point is that people cannot criticize what he likes. People these days thinks it is easier just complain about people's opinions instead of proving them wrong by adding their own arguments. Why Black Clover is not bad? List your arguments, put some technical arguments on the table and we will listen. People come with fanboyism and get mad when we laugh.

I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion but that's not what his post meant. He misinterpreted the earlier discussion and was basically saying people can like BC even if it's cliche and generic.

 

[iceemperor]

I don't think it's fair to judge whether Black Clover's a success or not based on how Toriko did. Toriko was airing next to One Piece and had a far greater exposure than Black Clover. WT is a much more apt comparison and correct me if I'm wrong but its sales didn't increase much until the anime was halfway through.

World Trigger had actually grown quite a bit by the time it reached the halfway point of its anime. The entire run went from Fall 2014 to Winter 2016. That puts the halfway point around the end of Spring 2015 to mid Summer 2015. This is the transition from beginning to the halfway point to the end of Summer 2015:
│*69982 (3)│114309│------│------│------┃*,114,309 (*10)┃2014/10｜ワールドトリガー 8
│153824 (7)│185799│******│211593│------┃*,361,399 (322)┃2015/01｜ワールドトリガー 9
│156001 (5)│206563│229063│******│257245┃*,371,416 (264)┃2015/03｜ワールドトリガー 10
│167149 (4)│227858│254340│269102│------┃*,350,637 (172)┃2015/06｜ワールドトリガー 11
│147368 (3)│241891│272018│292349│------┃*,325,690 (*80)┃2015/09｜ワールドトリガー 12

You can see by the end of Summer 2015 it had grown quite a bit from the beginning back in Fall 2014. This is the remaining of its anime run:
│146833 (3)│243294│273241│292706│------┃*,392,138 (353)┃2015/12｜ワールドトリガー 13
│156433 (3)│257631│289571│******│319631┃*,381,789 (262)┃2016/03｜ワールドトリガー 14

and this is post anime:
│159437 (3)│264097│295120│313678│------┃*,375,944 (171)┃2016/06｜ワールドトリガー 15
│143333 (3)│250253│282655│304311│------┃*,344,137 (*80)┃2016/09｜ワールドトリガー 16
│133843 (3)│243575│277049│******│310657┃*,357,667 (171)┃2016/12｜ワールドトリガー 17
│137262 (3)│241796│275748│------│------┃*,332,766 (*80)┃2017/03｜ワールドトリガー 18
Keep in mind that towards vol 17, it had already entered hiatus but it didn't grow too much after the halfway point. This is true for most series. The biggest boost tends to be at the beginning and it slowly tapers from there. Few series are able to keep the height of the initial boost throughout the entire run, especially for a run longer than 1 cour. I've only seen AOT keep the full momentum throughout its entire run.

 

[Obitooooo]

I do not like getting into these fights, I'll just leave my point about the sales of black clover: According to my research Black clover is doing better than World trigger at the time (Not much better but if better l 3 - 4 million is my bet for the end of the year ).

I promise to do comparisons vs other series ( half year - End year ) - Relax please u.u

 

[ShenGao]

I do not like getting into these fights, I'll just leave my point about the sales of black clover: According to my research Black clover is doing better than World trigger at the time (Not much better but if better l 3 - 4 million is my bet for the end of the year ).

I promise to do comparisons vs other series ( half year - End year ) - Relax please u.u

Really, because my research tells me Black Clover is doing way worse than World Trigger at this point.

World Trigger Volumes 10 to 14:
│156001 (5)│206563│229063│******│257245┃*,371,416 (264)┃2015/03｜ワールドトリガー 10
│167149 (4)│227858│254340│269102│------┃*,350,637 (172)┃2015/06｜ワールドトリガー 11
│147368 (3)│241891│272018│292349│------┃*,325,690 (*80)┃2015/09｜ワールドトリガー 12
│146833 (3)│243294│273241│292706│------┃*,392,138 (353)┃2015/12｜ワールドトリガー 13
│156433 (3)│257631│289571│******│319631┃*,381,789 (262)┃2016/03｜ワールドトリガー 14

Black Clover volumes 10 to 14:
│*66723 (3)│121879│140385│------│------┃*,140,385 (*17)┃2017/03｜ブラッククローバー 10
│107704 (6)│136682│150383│------│------┃*,150,383 (*20)┃2017/05｜ブラッククローバー 11
│*69741 (3)│128256│149552│------│------┃*,149,552 (*17)┃2017/08｜ブラッククローバー 12
│100937 (5)│144506│165512│180954│194163┃*,194,163 (*33)┃2017/10｜ブラッククローバー 13
│140431 (7)│182561│203018│222412│238929┃*,238,929 (*35)┃2017/12｜ブラッククローバー 14

 

[Tamil]

I do not like getting into these fights, I'll just leave my point about the sales of black clover: According to my research Black clover is doing better than World trigger at the time (Not much better but if better l 3 - 4 million is my bet for the end of the year ).

I promise to do comparisons vs other series ( half year - End year ) - Relax please u.u

It's time to stop BC fans

 

[SharkBait]

Its unfair and offensive to me, a BLack Clover fan (one of the only three in the thread i think)) that BLack Clover opponents continue to push the fiction that it is not doing well.

Like why is v10 to v14 of wt being used, seems arbritrary.

 

[Franz]

But so difficult to talk about the manga in question in the appropriate topic?

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 18, 2018, Original Post Date: Feb 18, 2018 ---

Really, because my research tells me Black Clover is doing way worse than World Trigger at this point.

As always, would not it be better to wait for the real rankings?

When the year-end standings come out, we will know if they have had considerable increases or not.

 

[ShenGao]

As always, would not it be better to wait for the real rankings?

When the year-end standings come out, we will know if they have had considerable increases or not.

What for? You can see that BC's volumes 10 to 14 are selling worse than WT's by a considerable amount. Why should anybody give BC another 10 months to acknowledge this?
Will BC's volume 15 sell better than WT's volume 15? Maybe, but highly unlikely considering it would need to sell 160k in 3 days and so far it's highest sold number is 140k in 7 days.

 

[Franz]

What for?
.

To see if sales increase perhaps?

Three more volumes will be released and the first season of the anime will end, let's see how much it infects on sales and how much .....

You can see that BC's volumes 10 to 14 are selling worse than WT's by a considerable amount.

And so?
Ok I understand Black Clover sucks, but this attitude is beginning to tire me ....

What then I do not understand based on q logic classrooms should have reached its peak ....

Why should anybody give BC another 10 months to acknowledge this?
.

I do not know, maybe:

1) Maybe because he has an anime still in progress?

2) Perhaps because they evidently believe in the project as they have in mind a video game, a comic spin-off and publicize it a lot?

And this means a lot because if something does not work in Giappone, do not they give us a reason to cut it off?

I close it here, I just say that this absolute belief that Black Clover can never grow more than comicnia to bother me.

Ok I understand that sucks, is a copy of Naruto / Bleach bla bla bla, but do not clog the topic, please ....

We await the sales year-end ranking and see results.

 

[Tanzo]

 

[ShenGao]

To see if sales increase perhaps?

Three more volumes will be released and the first season of the anime will end, let's see how much it infects on sales and how much .....



And so?
Ok I understand Black Clover sucks, but this attitude is beginning to tire me ....

What then I do not understand based on q logic classrooms should have reached its peak ....


I do not know, maybe:

1) Maybe because he has an anime still in progress?

2) Perhaps because they evidently believe in the project as they have in mind a video game, a comic spin-off and publicize it a lot?

And this means a lot because if something does not work in Giappone, do not they give us a reason to cut it off?

I close it here, I just say that this absolute belief that Black Clover can never grow more than comicnia to bother me.

Ok I understand that sucks, is a copy of Naruto / Bleach bla bla bla, but do not clog the topic, please ....

We await the sales year-end ranking and see results.

What's tiring me is your attitude to think that whenever people say something you don't like about BC it automatically makes them a hater. I gave you sale numbers of two manga, nothing more. The sale numbers of one manga are higher than the sale numbers of the other manga. You don't need to hate or like one of these two manga to see that.
And the current topic is about sale numbers of WSJ manga. How does that clog the topic?

 

[tirakai]

Didn't WT's anime start a few volumes earlier in the series than BC's did? I'm sure WT probably still does quite a bit better by comparison but it seems slightly unfair to compare the same numbers of volumes when WT got it's anime boost a lot earlier.

 

[Franz]

What's tiring me is your attitude to think that whenever people say something you don't like about BC it automatically makes them a hater.


I gave you sale numbers of two manga, nothing more. The sale numbers of one manga are higher than the sale numbers of the other manga. You don't need to hate or like one of these two manga to see that.

Only for BC I see this hate. Nothing personal, but why so much hate ?

And i didn't understand the comparison..as uf the manha cannot increase his sales...

 

[Leoat12]

Didn't WT's anime start a few volumes earlier in the series than BC's did? I'm sure WT probably still does quite a bit better by comparison but it seems slightly unfair to compare the same numbers of volumes when WT got it's anime boost a lot earlier.

It's not that unfair. By volume 10 World Trigger anime was in episode 20, the same as Black Clover right now. It would be good to have the sales from volume 8 from both though, World Trigger anime started when volume 8 was released.

 

[ShenGao]

It's not that unfair. By volume 10 World Trigger anime was in episode 20, the same as Black Clover right now. It would be good to have the sales from volume 8 from both though, World Trigger anime started when volume 8 was released.

Volume 8 WT:
*69982 (3)│114309│------│------│------┃*,114,309 (*10)┃2014/10｜ワールドトリガー 8

Volume 8 BC:
*98616 (6)│129115│------│------│------┃*,129,115 (*13)┃2016/10｜ブラッククローバー 8

BC had 3 more days to sell, but at the end of it's second week it only sold 15k more than WT.

 

[tirakai]

I mean wouldn't it make more sense to compare World Trigger's first couple volumes released after the anime started to Black Clover's first couple volumes released after its anime started? Since that way lets you directly compare the effect of the anime's boost.

 

[Leoat12]

I mean wouldn't it make more sense to compare World Trigger's first couple volumes released after the anime started to Black Clover's first couple volumes released after its anime started? Since that way lets you directly compare the effect of the anime's boost.

For Black Clover, it is from 13th to 15th and for World Trigger it is from 8th to 10th. I would do that, but I have no idea where people pick these numbers so...

 

[101nemesis]

I mean wouldn't it make more sense to compare World Trigger's first couple volumes released after the anime started to Black Clover's first couple volumes released after its anime started? Since that way lets you directly compare the effect of the anime's boost.

Sure. But some are already saying BC is bigger than WT and some even say Toriko.
So that's why volume sales between the same volume numbers are being brought into the discussion to show how said volume sales prove BC is still nowhere near as high as Toriko was or even WT for that matter, let alone Naruto.

Volume sales peak that BC needs to beat to be termed bigger than said series, at least in sales;
WT - 400-430k
Soma - 550k
Toriko - 590k
Gintama - 650k
Reborn - 650k
MHA - 770-800k
Haikyuu!! - 1 million
KnB - 1 million
Prince of Tennis 1.11 million
Bleach - 1.3 million
Naruto - 1.6 million (could be higher)

If you tell BC is bigger than Kimetsu, Dr. Stone, HZ, Saiki, We Never Learn etc.? I'd agree with you.
But BC maybe touches 300k at the very most now. That's assuming the volumes sell 70k after going off the chart. So no, not even close guys. Not hating on the series. Just stating facts here.

 

[Franz]

But BC maybe touches 300k at the very most now. That's assuming the volumes sell 70k after going off the chart. So no, not even close guys. Not hating on the series. Just stating facts here.

What I do not understand is why you insist on considering current sales without calculating future ones ....