Discussion New Roles and New Rules Suggestion Thread

[GrySun]

Submissions for new roles need to follow the next format in order to be considered:

I. [Place Holder Name]

II. [Affiliation]

III. [Short Description]

IV. [Long Description/Idea/Premise/Scope]

V. [Priority/RoleType/Interactions/other Specifics]

Spoiler: Examples of Approved roles

I. Troublemaker

II. Town

III. Can once per game make a Day phase lynch be the top 2 voted people instead of regular 1 top voted person. Every player has 2 votes but cannot vote the same player twice.

IV. PMs the host on the night before the day he wishes to use his power on. Host announces at start of day that the 2 top voted players will be lynched.
Everyone gets 2 votes that they can use on 2 individual players. Both can be moved once like usual. Example:
!votekill1 PlayerX
!votekill2 PlayerY
!votelock2 (locks on PlayerY).

Any other format is also fine as long as players specify who they are voting and if it's a new vote or they are changing their first one.

V. Doesn't have a Priority, happens at the end of night after all other actions. Doesn't target another player. Primary role.

Since it happens at the end of a phase, the player can be both blocked and killed to prevent it happening.

I. Psychiatrist

II. Townie

III. The Psychiatrist investigates one person per night phase to see if the player has a Secondary Role. They get a "Your target has a secondary role" if that is the case, and a "Your target does not have a secondary role" if it's not. The Psychiatrist does not find out the allegiance of the target.

IV. It's a counter for scum secondaries without outright revealing them, leaving room for guess work and player reading.

V. Priority 2, Primary Role.

Current roles Approved for testing here

Rules on including those in a game:

• A host can take any of these roles and test them in their game. Depending on results from testing the role it will either be included into the Role list or need more changes/testing.
• A host at the very least has to announce in the opening post of the game that new roles are being tested, or alternatively even more specifically reveal the roles that are being tested.

Link to the last update post with the roles that are either close to approval or were not approved: here.

 

[Riku]

While I think further development is needed, I give approval to Santa Claus and Drug dealer.

 

[digitaldude]

Spoiler

While I think further development is needed, I give approval to Santa Claus and Drug dealer.

I think this one is kinda OP. I mean, with that you can know a.the sanity of a person b. ...if the person is lying or not. Also, changing sanities sounds a bit toxic imo. So... rejected.



Too similar to the insane doc to have as a separate role imo. Rejected.



Sounds fun, maybe some changes can be done tho. I like it.



I dont think mafias should have doctors... rej.



Sounds interesting but a bit broken... I like it and would like to discuss about it (maybe change it a little I dunno).



Uhm, not a fan at all of the concept tbh lol.



I really like this idea! I would totally use this if I did a game with an item shop or something. The items and thingies should be done by the host tho.



Im neutral about these ones, would like to discuss them further later.

Oh, lulz, a Council. Gonna be the good cop then, prolly [though luck for getting me in]

Shrink (Townie): Fine by me '-' But I'd take off the part that says that the person would get to know of a second time. All hail the trolls.

Paranoid Doctor (Townie): Ok, no, this one is too much D: What is injuring someone in game's terms?

Barkeeper (Townie): Sounds like a way weaker hoe^^' It would be fun if he could get someone drunk and that person would get a random target then, instead of the one he/she picked :3 I'd say yes with some fixing.

Mafia Doctor (Mafia): Cool, I'd take off the last part, though.

Mafia Lawyer (Mafia): Cool, but I'd only keep the first sentence XD

Anonymous Postman (Third Party): Jesus, no, this one gave me a brain tumor.

Blind Santa Clause (Third Party): Cool, but I dunno XD Sounds rly hard for a solo third party to survive till the end (like the SK). This dude will get killed rly easily, imo, specially 'cause people will know he's in the game. I'd say yes with some fixing.

Drug Dealer (Third Party): Ohhh this one sounds so cool XD But I dunno, I'd let him have mafia/killers as well, and I wouldn't say those people have another option, they'd be obliged to vote. I just set that they are addicted for a day or two only, and, oh well, solo third party winning conditions are always fucked up, imo.

'-'

Meh I dont accept the Drug Dealer and Mafia Doctor who commits suicide nah you better say against to theese two for me

Read through the new batch of James' suggestions, all of them need more development, but not all of them have potential to actually add something new and interesting.
That said, my approval votes go for

+Santa Claus
+Bar Keeper
+Drug Dealer (and Junkies)

Uf so here I replied to you James but I don't really LOVE any of those. Some are ok and some are not But thats just one woman's opinion




Day action and picks a target at night, wth? How is that a day action then? I don't see a point there besides fcking up with other players. For example, a sane doctor protecting an imporant role (mafia target lets say) and this Shrink guy changes it then boom important role gone. I don't like it



Wait so he never protects but always kills? Or well what do you mean by "injury"? What happens to the injured player? Meh I don't like it



So Barkeeper invites 3 players via pm to the host or how? And the drunk knows about him being one? When he becomes a drunk then he is one for the rest of the game? Hmm I guess xD



I think that suicide thing is a BS. I mean if he has no killing power then he is as good as dead so why not let him live I think it's okay



Bleh some more confusion. I don't like it



I'd quite like this one if it was a normal townie talking between townies. He can send a letter every day and the person gets it the next day right? Well if it was a townie role I like it but I don't see why it should be a 3rd party. Anyway I like it



He gives presents randomly? I mean he says the player name and then what present he gives or the present is random? I think I like it



I dont get that B part But let's say it doesn't exist and I might like it

[bene]tl;dr :3[/bene]

Go away you cheater!

I reject this Figuring out one's sanity is already enough challenge in Day 1 or Day 2. No need for a Shrink to make it more complicated.



I reject this Almost identical to Insane Doctor. And I prefer Insane Doctor over this one.



I reject this Killjoy of Night Activity.



I reject this No need for the Mafia to have a Doctor in their side.



I reject this A Shrink in Mafia's side.



I reject this Too corny IMO. Doesn't feel like a Mafia Game Role.



I reject this I don't like items in the game.



I reject this Mentor and Mentee is way better.

Please remember that Mafia Game is about outnumbering or killing all of those who are not on your side. And roles should either give the specific faction an advantage by having certain roles in their side (Prostitute/Escort, Detective/Mafia Detective, Bulletproof/Strongman etc.) or disadvantage (Freeman/Burden, Unskilled Mafia)

Maintaining junkies, giving gifts or anonymous letters so you can win is not Mafia Game-like at all.

Third Party Roles should ideally be derived from the Serial Killer role.

I imagine the gifts as one day only add ons for the player like...

penalty vote for the dayphase or -1 vote at the start so it takes one more vote to lynch you.

---------- Post added at 06:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:03 PM ----------

Shrink (Townie)
For: 1 Against: 2
Can be used to confirm a lot of people and would be too powerful, like hypnotist level powerful.
Paranoid Doctor (Townie)
For: 0 Against: 3
Same as insane doctor.
Barkeeper (Townie)
For: 3 Against: 1
Now this one has gotten more interesting I'll think about it.
Mafia Doctor (Mafia)
For: 1 Against: 2
I agree with faust no need for a doctor on Mafia side.
Mafia Lawyer (Mafia)
For: 0 Against: 1
I am against this role as it currently stand,s but maybe if the mafia lawyer doesn't change people sanitys but just finds them out.
Anonymous Postman (Third Party)
VETOED. My least favourite suggestion.
Blind Santa Clause (Third Party)
For: 1* Against: 1
*I don't like it as is because it's too powerful but if he was a townie, then maybe it could work and make the game more fun.
Drug Dealer (Third Party)
For: 1 Against: 2
It sounds hardy to win with him than the lovers... needs more work.

Shrink (Townie)
For: 2 Against: 5
Paranoid Doctor (Townie)
For: 0 Against: 7
Barkeeper (Townie)
For: 5 Against: 2
Mafia Doctor (Mafia)
For: 2 Against: 5
Mafia Lawyer (Mafia)
For: 2 Against: 5
Anonymous Postman (Third Party)
VETOED. My least favourite suggestion.
Blind Santa Clause (Third Party)
For: 6* Against: 1
Drug Dealer (Third Party)
For: 3 Against: 3

Blind Santa seems to be the favorite.




---------- Post added at 01:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:53 PM ----------

While I think further development is needed, I give approval to Santa Claus and Drug dealer.

You reject the rest?

 

[Riku]

Actually, after read thorough, I also approve bar keeper, though I think the 50/50 fail chance could also be a santas present.

The rest I reject, I don't get the points of roles, or find them too complex.

 

[digitaldude]

But doesnt barkeep sound like a weaker prostitute?

 

[Evil3ye]

Cool. Bar keeper and Santa approved then. we can now work on its mechanics.

But doesnt barkeep sound like a weaker prostitute?

we can change it to redirecting, like farfalla mentioned, or getting to know someone's role (for some reason james left that aspect out this time)

---------- Post added at 03:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:05 PM ----------

Barkeeper (Townie)
For: 5 Against: 2
Blind Santa Clause (Third Party)
For: 6* Against: 1

Spoiler

Barkeeper - Townie who is owner of a bar. He can give out a free drink during the day per pm and get said person to drunk to do anything during the night.
Or
He can open his bar and 5 random people will walk in and drink a beer, the Barkeeper finds out during that time that one of those 5 got a role but does not know who it got.

Barkeeper could know prostitute and be able to give her the hint as prostitute could the problem that she has no source of information network when she distracts somebody. With the 5 guys invite and a random role shown, the barkeeper can tell the 5 names and the random role and thus give the prostitute a smaller target amount than usual. I mean 25+ possible targets is HUGE and risky to have targeted the wrong one if also very huge. With the barkeeper working together with the prostitute, the barkeeper himself has some way to play as a random prostitute with his drinks while finding out some roles one of those 5 might have helping out the prostitute to be a tiny bit more reliable.
Not sure if Barkeeper and Prostitute should know each other or not or if something happens if one of them dies. But I think it would be a very interesting combo as the prostitute on her own is a pretty fatal weapon till she survives long enough to get an idea who might be a dangerous mafia in the night.

Barkeeper (Townie)
Day action - can invite 3 player into his bar. Gets one of the 3 randomly drunk; the drunk player has a 50/50 chance to be unable to perform a night action.

Blind Santa Clause (Third Party)
Night Action - Sends pm to GM which player will get a present this night, everyone can receive gifts as Santa is blind. All "crazy good" or "f@cking bad" presents will appear as "crazy good" presents to the gifted person. If the to be gifted player dies at the night, Santa keeps the gift. If Santa gets killed at night while delivering a present, the killer takes the present.
Santa has 5 presents at the start of the game and wins the game if he delievers all 5 of them succesfully and survives till the end of the game.

Spoiler

"Crazy good gifts"

Spoiler

First aid kit - gives user one time ability to act as a sane doctor at night
Bulletproof vest - gives user bulletproof ability at the night he tells GM he puts it on, then the vest is destroyed
Pistol - gives user one time ability to shoot once somebody at night
Sunglasses - gives user one time ability to act as bodyguard at night
Magnifier - gives user one time ability to investigate one person at night as sane detective
Bottle Whiskey - gives user one time ability to give Whisky to one player at night to get said person drunk -> 50/50 chance to be unable to perform a night action
Sexy underwear - gives user one time ability to act as prostitute at night
Poison pill - gives user one time ability to poison somebody during the night who will die the next night
1000$ - gives user one time ability to change and lock somebody's vote per pm to GM.

"F@cking bad gifts"

Spoiler

Expired First Aid Kit - gives user one time ability to act as an insane doctor at night
Cheap Bulletproof Vest - does not give the bulletproof ability when put on
Rusty Pistol - gives user one time ability to shoot somebody at night, 50/50 change it explodes thus killing the user
Mafia Sunglasses - gives user Guilty status for the night he puts them on, no bodyguard ability
Broken Magnifier - gives user one time ability to investigate as insane detective at night
Bottle bad Milk - gives user a stomachache thus unable to vote the next day if he decides to use it as the Whisky Bottle he see it to be
Dirty Underwear - cannot vote the next day due health issues
Poison Gas - gives user a 50/50 chance to poison somebody at night to die the next night, while giving himself a 50/50 chance that he gets himself poisoned
Fake 1000$ - if user tries to use it as 1000$ to change somebody's vote, his own vote will be added to the person the target has voted for.

Okay, good. So barkeeper and Drug Dealer are ideas that might work well with the game and Drug Dealer certainly has gained its little fanclub.^^

Barkeeper (Townie)
Knows Prostitute, can invite 5(20+ players in-game)/3(20- players in-game) into his bar. Gets one of the 5/3 randomly drunk; the drunk player is unable to perform a night action. Finds out a role of the 5, does not know to who it belong; role can be found out from somebody who isn't the drunk player.

Prostitute (Townie)
The Prostitute/Role Blocker chooses one player per Night to distract. That player will be prevented from performing his Night Choice, if he has one. It doesn't matter if the chosen player is a Townie or Mafia.
Prostitute knows Barkeeper, can receive information from him during the day.

Added Prostitute to add the Barkeeper extra as the two would work well as a team, not too OP but better than on their own. Added the 5/3 change as it would be too strong if the Barkeeper could keep inviting 5 players every night and thus, depending on the situation, ends up with 4-5 Mafia guys in night 5 when only 12 people are remaining due the past nights invites. With 5 people when more than 20 players are alive and 3 when less than 20 are alive the barkeeper is still an interesting role without having too much power.

Blind Santa Clause (Third Party)
Can "gift" one player per night a present via GM, everyone can receive gifts as Santa is blind and cannot see the naughty people. If the to be gifted player dies at the night where he is supposed to receive said gift, Santa keeps the gift for the next night. If Santa gets killed at night while delivering a present, the killer keeps said present. Santa has 5 presents and wins the game if he delievers all 5 of them succesfully and survives till the end of the game.
Santa cannot use presents himself.
Presents:

Spoiler

First aid kit - gives user one time ability to act as a doctor at night
Bulletproof vest - gives user bulletproof ability at night till hit, then the vest is destroyed
Pistol - gives user one time ability to shoot once somebody at night
Sunglasses - gives user one time ability to act as bodyguard at night
Magnifier - gives user one time ability to investigate one person at night
Bottle Whiskey - gives user one time ability to give Whisky to one player at night to get said person drunk, thus unable to perform a night action
Sexy underwear - gives user one time ability to distract one player at night
Poison pill - gives user one time ability to poison somebody during the day
1000$ - gives user one time ability to secretly change somebody's vote during the day, following the Politican rules.
(Postage Stamp (in case Postman and Santa gets accepted at the same time) - gives user a one time ability to deliever a letter from one person to the other, following the Postman rules)

Present
If you got a present just write the GM, who has given you the present to keep Santa's player secret, what present you want to use and well, use it accordingly to what it does.

Depending on added roles, Santa might get more presents than those nine/ten ones in the future.
I am pretty proud of my Blind Santa Clause tbh.
I listened to Hardy's critics and took out the complciated sell and pay stuff, which lets be honest we have no real chance to control, as well as the 50/50 stuff. Instead here we got 9/10/1X pretty useful but possible also pretty harmful as well one time presents that Santa tries to gift the players to win the game for himself at the end if he survives.

I was thinking that perhaps Santa gets his present back if the player gets killed/Lynched before making use of the present. So that Santa is like "fuck, I just gave that guy a present and he died before using it up, that idiot!".
I also thought about making Santa die if he brings a present to a mafia, but that felt stupid, so I added the "BLind" aspect so that Santa gets away with gifting anybody. However I keep thinking that I might add a "Santa kills himself once he receives a given gift from a killed mafia" rule.
Aka that Blind Santa can't keep living with himself anylonger as he had given a "naughty" a gift meant for a "good" person. Which he can only do now knowing with the return of the gift as the identity of the killed person is then clear.
Imagine what a deep breath the Santa must take if the person he wanted to give a gift to died that very night and it turns out that guy was a mafia. XD
Also the Mafia, if they receive a gift, might want to think to keep that gift in case of the gifted Mafia member getting lynched/killed so that they could take down Santa with them instead of using up the gift and thus freeing Santa from his suicide rule.

Bar Keeper (Townie) The Bar Keeper has the ability to invite 3-5 players to his bar every night. One random player of the chosen batch ends up being the drunkest and either reveals his role to the Bar Keeper, fails to perform his night action, or uses it on a random player. The Bar Keeper doesn't get to know the identity of the drunkest visitor.

Santa Claus (Third Party)

 

[digitaldude]

Lets pray this role doesnt end up in the hands of a noob...

---------- Post added at 02:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:41 PM ----------

How is it determined if he uses it on random player or just doesnt use it?

---------- Post added at 02:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:42 PM ----------

We should decide on website to use for randomizer same as the one for roles?

 

[Kat]

Oh please Why Santa 3rd party? Wouldnt it be better if he was a Townie?

 

[digitaldude]

Oh please Why Santa 3rd party? Wouldnt it be better if he was a Townie?

Yeah that was the only reason I agreed to santa.

 

[Kat]

Bar Keeper (Townie) The Bar Keeper has the ability to invite 3-5 players to each bar every night. One random player of the chosen batch ends up being the drunkest and reveals his role to the Bar Keeper, fails to perform his night action, or uses it on a random player. The Bar Keeper doesn't get to know the identity of the drunkest visitor.

What do you mean every night? Like 1 per night? then when will he get the drunkest one at the end of the game?

 

[Evil3ye]

Lets pray this role doesnt end up in the hands of a noob...

---------- Post added at 02:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:41 PM ----------

How is it determined if he uses it on random player or just doesnt use it?

---------- Post added at 02:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:42 PM ----------

We should decide on website to use for randomizer same as the one for roles?

33% revealing role/not using/wrong target. one of those three will occure. and random player can be assigned by random.org /ists

Oh please Why Santa 3rd party? Wouldnt it be better if he was a Townie?

Yeah that was the only reason I agreed to santa.

dunno, thought it's pretty interesting if it's a role of its own. with the goal to get rid of all of the gifts. at least one third party that has actually chances of winning. (if its not like 10 gifts aka surviving 10 nights)

What do you mean every night? Like 1 per night? then when will he get the drunkest one at the end of the game?

every night his bar is filled and every night one gets wasted. there should be a limit though what the least amount of the invits has to be though, like he cannot invite only one person and gets to know his exact role.

 

[digitaldude]

If santa wins does the game stop?

---------- Post added at 03:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:02 PM ----------

33% revealing role/not using/wrong target. one of those three will occure. and random player can be assigned by random.org /ists



dunno, thought it's pretty interesting if it's a role of its own. with the goal to get rid of all of the gifts. at least one third party that has actually chances of winning. (if its not like 10 gifts aka surviving 10 nights)


every night his bar is filled and every night one gets wasted. there should be a limit though what the least amount of the invits has to be though, like he cannot invite only one person and gets to know his exact role.

Minimum of 3 people and he can't invite the same 3 people two nights in a row.
If he does then he cant use his role that night.

 

[Kat]

every night his bar is filled and every night one gets wasted. there should be a limit though what the least amount of the invits has to be though, like he cannot invite only one person and gets to know his exact role.

So each night somebody else is wasted? like each night one random from 3 ?

 

[Riku]

If santa wins does the game stop?

I like that he is 3rd party. And I'd say no. The game is played to the end. Not sure on my opinion if Santa needs to survive after giving out the presents. Or does he just leave the game as a winner.

 

[Evil3ye]

I think if Third Party wins the game should end, yeah. Just as the game ends when the first (townies) or second (mafia) party wins...

then the mafia and townies lost to the santa. /end. tu dun dun

 

[digitaldude]

I think if Third Party wins the game should end, yeah. Just as the game ends when the first (townies) or second (mafia) party wins...

then the mafia and townies lost to the santa. /end. tu dun dun

Maybe the host could be santa, gives presents to players.

 

[Evil3ye]

wat. no.

just think the list of super fucking awsome and super shit gifts needs some workout. and the usability, like some gifts have to be used instantly or something (thinking of vests, sunglasses and stuff like that, that dont require targeting someone).

 

[Kat]

Let's have a Santa's little helper role ... I like the name

 

[digitaldude]

wat. no.

just think the list of super fucking awsome and super shit gifts needs some workout. and the usability, like some gifts have to be used instantly or something (thinking of vests, sunglasses and stuff like that, that dont require targeting someone).

Vests and sunglasses? where on the avatar? I hate this role now.

 

[James Rye]

I think if Third Party wins the game should end, yeah. Just as the game ends when the first (townies) or second (mafia) party wins...

then the mafia and townies lost to the santa. /end. tu dun dun

I made Santa third party for the same reason Postman was third party, because if Santa is townie and wins with townies he could easily use his presents to gather a team around him, same way with the Postman. I forgot who told me to do so to prevent townies to build strong teams too fast, but I think it might have been digitaldude.

Now first let me thank you all for your critics and your help!
Good to see that some roles find fans here.^^

To the three roles that sort of seems to have gotten through, yeah, they need some changes, definetly. Hope you can help me figuring out what would fit them best.

As for barkeeper, I really enjoy Lala's idea with the "redirecting night action (if target has one)". Just imagine the target to be the serial killer or the mafia member who has to do the kill and suddenly he kills somebody else because he was drunk. This would confuse both mafia and townies. Mafia would wonder why two people died but none of them being their target so they start to worry about a killer, an insane doctor and other such possibilities, while townies will do their usual thing whereas the barkeeper himself doesn't know yet that he had direct a kill from the mafia/serial killer.^^

So either we could make this straight forward:

Barkeeper
Day Action - gets a player drunk. The player's night action will hit a random target if he uses one tonight.

or we keep the random thing due him being a Barkeeper with lots of costumers

Barkeeper
Night Action - tells GM which 5 players he invites in his bar; gets one randomly drunk who's night action will hit a random target if he uses one. The barkeeper gets told the drunk's night action if he has one. Doesn't know who the drunk one is.

I think it would be better than to use "night actions" instead of roles as then both a prostitute and mafia escort would appear as "blocking" if he happens to get one of them in his costumer line. This way the barkeeper knows that one of the five did a block tonight, but not who it was, the prostitute or the mafia escort.

So if we make the barkeeper a straight forwad "redirect action" role he should be a day action but if he should also have some sort of investigative role, in this case "hearing his drunk costumer talk about what he/she gonna do tonight" then he should be a night action as then he can be blocked and prevented to both find something out = randomly investigate an action and redirect an action of the drunk person.

Santa Clause (or Blind Santa^^)
I thought that maybe a limition of "crazy good" presents could make him work more and make him more of a nuiance the townies want killed before he gets all of his presents away. For example:
Blind Santa gets only ONE crazy good present to give away but has 4 f@cking bad presents to give people to win the game.
This way Blind Santa is a risk for the townies, as at beginning and middle the game they are way more than mafia and more likely to get a present then. And since 4/5 of the presents are no good you would not want them.

Of cource, nobody forces you to use a present and if you got a night action anyway you probably won't make use of the present anyway.

But imagine if you were a plain townie who just got a magnifier and could do an investigate action this night. You totally would take the risk that you might have a broken magnifier and act like an insane detective for a night, as long as you can do "something" in this game instead to write 3 pms and vote and wait for the next phase to start or to get recurited by somebody.

Same if somebody gets the pistol. A mafia with the pistol would be like "holy crap guys, we could get two kills today! Santa just gave me a gun!", but the pistol could be a f@cking bad one with the risk of killing yourself so the mafia gotta ask themselves if they take the risk believing they got a crazy good pistol or that they get lucky with the rusty one or if they do not take the risk.

If I had such a pistol as last mafia with Blind Santa giving it to me, I would totally use it to get two kills even if it puts me at risk of dying. Same for a plain townie who has a strong suspicen who could be Mafia and who has no problem going down if he can take down a mafia as well.

The Blind Santa should be a risky support role with his own agenda to not get killed till he has given out all his presents. And him as possible role would make plain townies and plain mafia be more outspoken at begin of the game with "hey, santa! I am plain gimme a present!" in hopes to receive a gift and be able to do something instead to sit and wait around and point fingers while the detectives, doctors, blockers and mafia members have all the fun.

And in that case we might made Blind Santa truly blind as that he himself doesn't know what present is what. After all if you were a third party Blind Santa would you give away a crazy good gift that gives somebody an action that could be used against you? Heck no, you wouldn't!
So Santa himself can't have an idea if now the sexy underwear or the pistol is the real deal or the bad deal.

And ofc we can make him a Townie who only wins if the Townie side wins. We just gotta make sure he is not too awesome of a townie magnet to form a strong townie party after 4-5 nights. And the bad presents could just be for that.

Well, that's what I think about this role after the critics.

As for Drug Dealer and Junkies, yeah this needs to be toned down a bit with the junkie control. It is too much and complicated. I think perhaps make it that Drug Dealer can have 2/3 Junkies max and that he can force them only ONCE to change their vote to his liking. After all we have seen with Demonspeed changing his vote to save Holt that such a move really makes you suspect. Also the withdrawal syndrom is far too complicated, we should keep it out. Sorry for thinking so twisted.^^;
It could look like this then:

Drug Dealer
Night Action - ability to drug people with 50/50 chance to turn them into Junkies. Can once per game tell his Junkies who to votelock for at day per pm to GM. Can have maximal three junkies. The Drug Dealer wins the game if he stays alive with at least two Junkies at the end of the game.

Junkies (secondary role)
Junkies do not know the Drug Dealer or other Junkies. They do not know they are Junkies till told by GM that they are Junkies and their Dealer forces them to votelock for a specific person. Cannot reoppose the Dealer's Order.

So basically toned down the control of the Drug Dealer while giving Junkies more freedom, as them havign no syndroms preventing them to vote or do actions, but them losing their freedom for a single day and be forced to vote for their Dealer's liking.

So basically the Drug Dealer would be like a dark/evil Mentor/recruiting Mason who stays hidden and who has control over his followers for once in the game. So basically a "Third Party Cult".

That is all to those three roles, will write more later.^^

---------- Post added at 06:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:36 PM ----------

Now to the not so popular roles.

Yeah, Shrink is too OP, he should stay simpler. So how about this?

Shrink (Townie)
Day action - picks a target, gets told target's sanity: Normal, Sane, Insane, Naive, Paranoid.

We could "maybe" add that once per game he can change a sanity which is not normal into its opposite.

Or we create an "Insane" Shrink who gets told the opposite of what the San Sjrink gets told. And ofc they do not know their own sanity. But as we have seen an Insane Detective/Doctor can still be good for the townies once he figured out his own sanity, same could be for a Shrink.
The idea behind the Shrink was to investigate the sanity. I mean if we do have sanity with sane, insane, naive and paranoid and none of those = normal then why not make use of them and have a role that looks for such people?
After all once a Shrink finds somebody who is not normal he knows he has found a detective and doctor no matter what role that person claims on the thread, he jsut knows his sanity though and cannot be sure if it is the real sanity as he might be Insane himself.

So could look like this:

Sane Shrink (Townie)
Day action - picks a target, gets told target's sanity: Normal, Sane, Insane, Naive, Paranoid. Doesn't know his own sanity.

Insane Shrink (Townie)
Day action - picks a target, gets told target's sanity: Normal, Sane->Insane, Insane->Sane, Naive->Paranoid, Paranoid->naive. Doesn't know his own sanity.

Naive Shrink (Townie)
Day action - picks a target, always gets told his target's sanity is: Normal. Doesn't know his own sanity.

Basically a medical investigator who acts at day unlike the detectives and doctors who act at night. Added naive Shrink because the thought of a shrink believing he might be sane/Insane but curses his misfortune to only get normals at the beginning of the game is quite fun. Plus if somebody claims detective and he says "false! I diagnosed that guy! He is a normal, he cannot be a detective!" he could be either a risk for real detectives, thus them not wanting to come out too soon, or for mafia members who tries to get a paranoid detective role but do not have "Paranoid" as sanity when the shrinks look at them. XD

Hope Shrinks look more fun now as they are toned down in power and have a bit more diversity to them.

Now to Paranoid Doc.
Yeah, he is too strong/dangerous even with Injury rule (and I will rewrite that rule to see if I cannot get 5-6 people to like it to give it a try for more active townie/mafia/third party roles!!!), but if we do find Shrinks more acceptable with the changes I put them under, then a paranoid Doctor would be useful as else the Shrinks would know immidately that the paranoid person they found is a detective... or a Paranoid Gun Owner. Totally forgot about that guy. XD

However, if we got a Mafia Detective (who should appear "Sane" to Shrinks, similar to how Mafia Boss appears "innocent" to detectives) then we should have a Mafia Doctor as well, albeit a weaker version of it.

So how about we merge the two roles into one and create the

Paranoid Mafia Doctor (Mafia)!!!

Paranoid Mafia Doctor (Mafia)
Night Action - Can once per game protect somebody as an Insane Doctor.

The Idea behind the Mafia Doctor is either for him to be like an Insane one all the time but then that could put too much killing power into the mafia hands if the paranoid doctor always lands on the lucky 50s side to get a kill. So I thought to reduce him similar to Strongarm to a Once per game doctor. I am not too sure though if it should be sane or insane, leading towards Insane.
This way the Mafia can decide to either use him as a 50/50 kill chance or him acting as doctor to get people to trust him.

The other Idea is for the Paranoid Mafia Doctor to be an "extra kill" but with the expense that the Mafia Doctor will be revealed the next day by the GM together with the doctors kill. Basically the Mafia would get two kills but at the expense of one of their member's life in the next day lynch phase.

Paranoid Mafia Doctor (Mafia)
Night Action - Can once per game kill somebody. After the kill his role will be revealed by the Host.

That would be the more extreme version of the Paranoid Mafia Doctor.
And this way the Shrinks cannot be too sure if they really found the paranoid detective (or gun owner lolz) or if it is the paranoid mafia doctor. Or in case of the insane one who might believe he has found the naive doctor/detective.^^

Mafia Lawyer, I really like that role as I think mafia has a role to block and investigate and strongkill someone and have somebody disappear after a kill but not a role that could "protect" against investigations (which are like next day kills for the mafia as seen with Holt) like the Townies have with doctors to protect against kills.

So I will try to weaken down the Mafia Lawyer, either as an Investigation trickster="protector" or as a vote changing role:

Mafia Lawyer (Mafia)
Night Action - Can change somebody's guilty/innocent status into its opposite for this night phase.

Mafia Lawyer (Mafia)
Day Action - Can take away a vote from somebody at the lynch voting.

Something like that, in both cases the Mafia Lawyer will try to keep Mafia's either safe from Investigators or from getting lynched at votings. However, the latter only works in close calls, like that 4-4-4 one at day 1, against odds where one happens to get 8 votes the Mafia Lawyer is helpless. So I dunno about the 2nd type Mafia and am thinking to actually change that into the TOWNIE LAWYER!!!

Mafia Lawyer (Mafia)
Night Action - Can change somebody's guilty/innocent status into its opposite for this night phase.

Lawyer (Townie)
Day Action - Can take away a vote from somebody at the lynch voting.

Like this. This way in close calls the Lawyer can either make sure only one dies (if there are two tieing) or can get two people lynched by taking away one vote from the one who is just one vote above the 2nd placed vicitm. So in cases of ties and people knowing that there is a Lawyer, which they will realizes as votes go missing, they will both plead and beg for the Lawyer to save themselves. So I can see the Townie Laywer to be a fun one, especially if we do some overworks on it and make it that he can not only take away but add that vote somewhere else, albeit then he is basically like a politican role that way.

And the Mafia Lawyer can only "protect" one status of his gang and since they never know who gets investigated that willl be hard.
However if they try to find detectives and know their sanity and tries to get them to look at a certain member of theirs then the Mafia Lawyer can bring great confusion into the mix which might give the Mafia a day or a night's breather.
Ofc the Mafia Lawyer becomes the strongest if there are only two of them, him and another member. But the moment he gets found out the past investigations will be questioned and without the Lawyer the last Mafia member will have a hard standing.

So yeah, if I had a saying I would prefer those two Lawyer types, one for Mafia as a night action changing statuses either to protect own members or to frame other Townies to be guilty and the other one to act as a "Lawyer" for one of the accused who are about to by lynched to change the votes a bit in the favor of his client.

I forgot who but somebody told me that some roles should have a counterpart, like how there is the prostitute and the mafia escort how the strongarm to counter the bulletproof townie, etc.

So I thought after reading about Assassin (superstrong role) and Daytime Vigilante (As we have seen can be damn dangerous to mafia if they slip up) - why do we have no role that "might" be able to prevent a day action?

So here are my thoughts, against the Assassin a Police Officer/Inspector is needed to arrest the Assassin and look if he got the real deal and against Daytime Vigiliante (or any other townies who might act at day) we need a Mafia Kidnapper.
This is how they could look like to counte rAssassin and Daytime Vigiilante:

Police Inspector
Day Action - Can arrest a person for the day phase. Arrested person is not allowed to do a day action.

Mafia Kidnapper
Day Action - Can kidnap a person for the day phase. Kidnapped person is not allowed to do a day action.

Other idea would be to make both roles a bit stronger but then only "Once per game" type of roles, like this:

Police Inspector
Day Action - Can arrest somebody for this day and the next night phase. Person is not allowed to do any action, vote and to write in the day phase. If the arrested person is a Mafia member, he will be hanged after the night phase expect the Inspector gets killed.

Mafia Kidnapper
Day Action - Can kidnap somebody for this day and the next night phase. Person is not allowed to do any action, vote and to write in the day phase. If the arrested person if a Townie that can kill, he will be found dead after the night phase expect the Kidnapper gets killed.

And with that I think I will take a pause. Doubt all those roles will make it, just throwing ideas out to see what you guys can see as a fun or good addition to the game. Hope some are to your likings and if not, please let me know why.^^

 

[Kat]

tl;dr

---------- Post added at 06:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:44 PM ----------

I will read it late tho! cuz you put some effort there :3