Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2017] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[TyVip]

Dr Stone is getting more enjoyable to read.

 

[ShenGao]

No, what I was getting, and got, is that you're saying you left Toei because of things that don't make much sense. Or you saw everything of the series, and so the two first things didn't really killed the series and the studio for you. Or you saw everything and only gave up of the series and studio due to the last 3(or around that) episodes. I gave you the benefit of the doubt, and assumed you watched everything.

So the main infringement was the censorship for you, OK. Still remember that more people were willing to follow the less Graphic and Gore version than the one that had all of that. A lot of people in general doesn't like Gore and Blood, and majority of Toriko fans are Kids and always were(Either you like it or not, that is a fact) and obviously parents will not want their sons to see that amount of Gore, Violence and Blood.
And Adaptation isn't a exact copy and there are things more important than even adapting everything correctly!

I don't remember it that vivedly, with was a good 3 years, 2014, but Toriko didn't defeated Joa because he ate all the food until the Four Beasts. The temporary powerup he got in the manga against starjun, in the anime it was bigger and he got a power-up transformation. In that transformation he used the gormet cells of the creatures he had consumed and used those creatures attacks.
The problem of the last episodes, wasn't even Toriko against Joa, that stuff was done better, in terms of power-ups, than the final of the manga. Where They were able to fight against Joa, Neo, Acacia, and the evolved versions of Neo and Acacia. And that all with multiple powerups.
No, the problem of the last episodes was how they treated Granny Tetsuno and Jirou. They made them loosing against Teppei.

Other than that, the other problem was expecting to see what was in the manga and getting original content that highly diverged of the source material, basically a notice that the series was ending and the possibility of returning was almost zero.

I watched until Ice Hell and saw how bad the adaptation is. I dropped it at that point. I heard from others how bad it got beyond Ice Hell and saw on Youtube videos about the anime's state beyond Ice Hell. If something is bad why should i continue following it? What's so hard to understand about that?

I don't know one person who said they like the censoring. You say the majority of Toriko fans are kids, but that means they would be ok with the gore and violence. These things didn't appear after 100 chapters, they were there since the 2nd chapter when Toriko cut the Galala Crocodile's head off.

Spoiler

That's gorier than most WSJ battle manga reach during their whole lifetime.

And why is Toriko censored but other WSJ manga adaptations aren't? Gon lost his arm, Deku's limbs turn into bloody pulps over and over again, Ichigo mutilated Ulquiorra, Naruto showed the bloody death of Jiraiya. Do all these manga not have children as their majority fanbase? Why didn't their anime adaptations get censored, but Toriko did? Because of Toei.

According to you it's ok that an adaptation isn't faithful, got it. I guess you are also ok with Toei altering the story about how Zeff lost his leg in One Piece. In the manga he ate his leg to survive, but according to Toei he sacrificed it to save Sanji as you can see here:

Spoiler

Can't wait when Toei alters more One Piece moments like Big Mom's origin story, because it's too cruel for children to see what she did.

The problem of the ending is that it's anime original in the worst possible way. Making Joa the main antagonist although it couldn't be wronger, saying Toriko's Infinity Kugi Punch is the epitome of his strength, and then just ending there. So much stuff didn't appear and never will, but maybe that's better because Toei certainly would have butchered things like Toriko vs Heracles, or NEO killing every creature on a planet the size of Jupiter.

 

[Newkerzy]

I watched until Ice Hell and saw how bad the adaptation is. I dropped it at that point. I heard from others how bad it got beyond Ice Hell and saw on Youtube videos about the anime's state beyond Ice Hell. If something is bad why should i continue following it? What's so hard to understand about that?

I don't know one person who said they like the censoring. You say the majority of Toriko fans are kids, but that means they would be ok with the gore and violence. These things didn't appear after 100 chapters, they were there since the 2nd chapter when Toriko cut the Galala Crocodile's head off.

Spoiler

That's gorier than most WSJ battle manga reach during their whole lifetime.

And why is Toriko censored but other WSJ manga adaptations aren't? Gon lost his arm, Deku's limbs turn into bloody pulps over and over again, Ichigo mutilated Ulquiorra, Naruto showed the bloody death of Jiraiya and Obito skewering Mist ninja fodders and literally bathed in their blood. Do all these manga not have children as their majority fanbase? Why didn't their anime adaptations get censored, but Toriko did? Because of Toei.

Added an additional example for Naruto.

 

[Bigivelfhq]

I watched until Ice Hell and saw how bad the adaptation is. I dropped it at that point. I heard from others how bad it got beyond Ice Hell and saw on Youtube videos about the anime's state beyond Ice Hell. If something is bad why should i continue following it? What's so hard to understand about that?

I don't know one person who said they like the censoring. You say the majority of Toriko fans are kids, but that means they would be ok with the gore and violence. These things didn't appear after 100 chapters, they were there since the 2nd chapter when Toriko cut the Galala Crocodile's head off.

Spoiler

That's gorier than most WSJ battle manga reach during their whole lifetime.

And why is Toriko censored but other WSJ manga adaptations aren't? Gon lost his arm, Deku's limbs turn into bloody pulps over and over again, Ichigo mutilated Ulquiorra, Naruto showed the bloody death of Jiraiya. Do all these manga not have children as their majority fanbase? Why didn't their anime adaptations get censored, but Toriko did? Because of Toei.

According to you it's ok that an adaptation isn't faithful, got it. I guess you are also ok with Toei altering the story about how Zeff lost his leg in One Piece. In the manga he ate his leg to survive, but according to Toei he sacrificed it to save Sanji as you can see here:

Spoiler

Can't wait when Toei alters more One Piece moments like Big Mom's origin story, because it's too cruel for children to see what she did.

The problem of the ending is that it's anime original in the worst possible way. Making Joa the main antagonist although it couldn't be wronger, saying Toriko's Infinity Kugi Punch is the epitome of his strength, and then just ending there. So much stuff didn't appear and never will, but maybe that's better because Toei certainly would have butchered things like Toriko vs Heracles, or NEO killing every creature on a planet the size of Jupiter.

I read all of Toriko manga, and watched all of Toriko anime. I know about when the gore appeared. But why do you think that the volumes of Toriko never really jumped in popularity that much compared with the anime viewership? Even in the Magazine the series was mega popular, but in volumes while highly popular, never reached 500k before leaving the charts.

The argument of why the other are different. Is an argument that many people make, and they seem to think they are doing a pretty good argument, but is a pretty horrible one. The answer is pretty simple. Because the only single thing that connect those series is that they came from the same magazine. Everything else is different. Different author, Different Animation Studio, Different Producers, Different Television Station, Different Timeslot. Even Different audiences sometimes.
Also saying that those other series weren't censored is completely wrong. Mainly because just taking one example that maybe escaped censorship isn't the same as the series not being censored. Than you have various forms of censorship. Like how Attack on Titan Anime is highly censored. Oh, it doesn't seem like, but go read the manga and watch the anime and you will see that a lot of things are not really shown.

I'm seeing you're a purist. Anything other than 100% pure is 100% crap! Got It! Such critic flexibility!


At the time the anime ended, Joa could in fact be the main villain. The arc and the part ended with her in the focus of the main villain group, and it semi-desvilified the Bishokukai.
Note that the infinite kugi punch appeared for the first time in the anime. Yep, the manga only showed that attack in the second part. During that time the manga had nothing stronger nor anything closer to that.

 

[ElJin]

The shoseki was updated with 8/4. I'm really really happy for Kimetsu and Bokutachi They're doing really well.

 

[Tamil]

The shoseki was updated with 8/4. I'm really really happy for Kimetsu and Bokutachi They're doing really well.

What were the rankings?

 

[razerxs]

What were the rankings?

1 - One Piece
2 - Haikyu
4 - Black Clover
5 - Kimetsu no Yaiba
9 - We Never Learn
16 - Samon
42 - Aharen-san
80 - Poro
131 & 140 - U19

 

[Doughboy]

Dr Stone is getting more enjoyable to read.

Real shit, it seriously has. This series was truly trash until around chapter 17 when Kohaku showed up. Legit made a 180 in my eyes. The recent chapter was probably the funniest thing I read all week.

Should mention WNL had a good chapter as well, it was fine for me but I can understand why it stagnated for some. The teacher and Takemoto are officially best girls. But Furuhashi got some good screentime two chapters ago so when it comes to best girl I'm like ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Leoat12]

We still have to see the real numbers, but I'm satisfied with "We Never Learn" position for its first day. With some luck, it can appear in the second week, but I doubt. It is really a bad schedule from Shueisha, they should release the volumes only on Mondays. XD

 

[shoyoboyo]

It's hard to choose best girl in WNL. None of them are annoying so far, even though there's been like 5 introduced as recurring characters. I still want Uruka to win though because I feel bad for her.

 

[Scruffy8642]

Im actually surprised to see Aharen so low considering it's been dominating the Jump Plus rankings for upwards of 6 months since it started. Won't even rank at this rate.

But yeh, colour me surprised, Dr Stone isn't complete trash anymore. Inagaki should find a way to stuff the other 3 out of the story or find a bigger threat. I am totally dreading their return and they gave no additional value to the series.

 

[Tanzo]

2000人達成！
副音声verムービー近日公開！！

For Kimetsu's website getting over 2,000 visitors, there will be a 2nd version of the PV released including voice acting soon. The visitor count is now over 7k.

The website may also be temporary, since it's part of a promotional campaign lasting until Aug 13th.

 

[shoyoboyo]

Is 7000 even a lot? Doesn't seem like that big of a deal. That's like less than 10% of the people who buy the volumes.

 

[Leoat12]

It's hard to choose best girl in WNL. None of them are annoying so far, even though there's been like 5 introduced as recurring characters. I still want Uruka to win though because I feel bad for her.

Well, she loves him for a longer time than the others, I don't feel bad for her because of that, it happens. I root for her because she is the cutest and somewhat who is being more assertive currently. Her friends are helping as well... Looking forward to the next chapter.

 

[SkerllyFC]

For what you're saying you kept until the ending of the anime. So certainly the censoring of the violence and the permanent anime original character weren't that bad. And the shitty ending, was just what ... 3 episodes, so basically "the end".

I cannot say much because I saw only the first 5 episodes of Toriko, but I liked it, censoring and all. It at least maintained the sense of adventure it was trying to sell. Not much can be done with the argument that it was heavily censored, because the manga fans were at least expecting a 1:1, copy-every-panel adaptation with all the blood included, but then again arguments like this happen because of purists. Almost every Disney Princess movie is based on a classic and old tale, and those tales are very graphic, have profanity, and feature some WTF moments you wish no child would see, yet Disney made those movies the most sanitized they could, and they´re some of the best animated movies ever.

Of course, the Toriko anime never got any big success, but it wouldn´t last 145 episodes if at least didn´t earned an audience, and you can´t obligate the audience to read the manga because "it´s the right version". Not even the manga was that successful. I would love if western anime viewers these days learned to see every anime adaptation as it´s own product(as japanese viewers mostly do), and not as an exact copy of the source material, but for that it´ll take time and teaching the viewers what exactly is an adaptation. Another factor that made western viewers to think like this is that most anime directors, for "respect to the source material, and its fans", prefer to copy every panel and script in order to make for a good "adaptation", when they could use some creative liberty and include non-canon content.

Those people who watch US tv and movie adaptations are used to loose adaptations because they know there will always be changes, and of course when a bad adaptation happens it´ll get noticed. But western anime viewers want every. adaptation. to be the same as the source material, which is why we have "commercial anime adaptations" instead of actual anime adaptations. Why can´t Gintama be finished in the anime? Because "it´s not the canon ending, it´s going to be a bad ending" and stuff like that. Whoever like the Toriko anime, let him/her like it, don´t obligate him/her to read the manga then.

 

[Nakura]

I'm very proud of Kimetsu. I was worried for the majority of it's first year of serialisation, so I'm happy that it's doing well. It's been on a roll, especially with the current chapters being as good as they are.

 

[Leoat12]

Is 7000 even a lot? Doesn't seem like that big of a deal. That's like less than 10% of the people who buy the volumes.

Yeah, it is not. They should keep it down until they have a good number.

 

[RafaFedKilla]

Is 7000 even a lot? Doesn't seem like that big of a deal. That's like less than 10% of the people who buy the volumes.

It's Jump's new mentality of low expectations

 

[Leoat12]

Well, I think they shouldn't expect find another Naruto or Bleach (at its prime) because they were from another era, but they at least should keep their standard higher than the other publishers.

 

[vampire killer]

so 7000 is good thing for 1999. Now its very bad.