One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
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• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[kkck]

Doffy and Cracker had amazingly well developed and exploited DF abilities!

I kinda miss the good old "ability" fights, when figuring out an opponent's power mattered as much as having killer haki...
Cracker sorta was the last of these, and this is something One Piece lost lately.

Especially in Wano: nothing very complicated about Zoan abilities, so all you need is superior hitting/cutting power.
I think Oda wrote himself into a corner with this Zoan-only theme, and the story is the poorer for it.

Welp, I think oda did try to sort of make up for that with smile fruits given how inherently silly some of them are. However this didn't quite end up working as in the end smile users were strong but not exactly major players in the war. Even kaido's top forces, the calamities and topo robi, ended up being standard zoans (albeit ancient ones). The arc could have been more fun if there were smile users around that actually posed a challenge to the strawhats... Seems like a wasted opportunity.

 

[grey matter]

Doffy and Cracker had amazingly well developed and exploited DF abilities!

I kinda miss the good old "ability" fights, when figuring out an opponent's power mattered as much as having killer haki...
Cracker sorta was the last of these, and this is something One Piece lost lately.

Especially in Wano: nothing very complicated about Zoan abilities, so all you need is superior hitting/cutting power.
I think Oda wrote himself into a corner with this Zoan-only theme, and the story is the poorer for it.

I think the "ability" fights are still at play here, though to a lesser extend. We saw that with Doffy, Cracker and Katakuri as well. Doffy basically lost cause he got hard countered (in with the theme of Luffy countering "Gods" lol)

Doflamingo, for eg, can clearly fight above his tier due to his DF, as shown against Jozu who IMO is upper YC2 tier even though Doffy himself is YC3 tier. I think even current Zoro might face a lot of issues facing Doflamingo

It's just kinda forgotten because we're in Kaido's arc, all of them use Zoan fruits. And, Zoan basically boils down to "I transform, I becomes stronger". Maybe with some weird abilities, but thee impact of stats far outweigh. So, the ability fights aren't on focus here

Welp, I think oda did try to sort of make up for that with smile fruits given how inherently silly some of them are. However this didn't quite end up working as in the end smile users were strong but not exactly major players in the war. Even kaido's top forces, the calamities and topo robi, ended up being standard zoans (albeit ancient ones). The arc could have been more fun if there were smile users around that actually posed a challenge to the strawhats... Seems like a wasted opportunity.

True, but I think they were never meant to be top tiers.

The smile users were meant to be far above grunts. Maybe some even standard pacifista level (like that elephant warden guy). But that's about it.

Kaido would never risk using smiles on his true high ranking officials. Cause the smiles aren't that strong, plus risks are way too high (90% chance for failure).

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Oden a born monster for reals
Using enma so easily from time
Also king might leap frog katakuri

 

[kkck]

True, but I think they were never meant to be top tiers.

The smile users were meant to be far above grunts. Maybe some even standard pacifista level (like that elephant warden guy). But that's about it.

Kaido would never risk using smiles on his true high ranking officials. Cause the smiles aren't that strong, plus risks are way too high (90% chance for failure).

Welp, but that's kinda the point. It was a wasted opportunity on oda's side that not one smile user managed to climb beyond middle management so to speak. I doubt kaido even had much of a hand in his stronger subordinates getting real fruits, most of them seem recruited. I doubt kaido would care if his higher ranked officers eat a smile or a devil fruit. It doesn't seem like any of the smile users we saw were weakened by consuming a smile.

 

[Core D. Roy]

Welp, but that's kinda the point. It was a wasted opportunity on oda's side that not one smile user managed to climb beyond middle management so to speak. I doubt kaido even had much of a hand in his stronger subordinates getting real fruits, most of them seem recruited. I doubt kaido would care if his higher ranked officers eat a smile or a devil fruit. It doesn't seem like any of the smile users we saw were weakened by consuming a smile.

As soon as I saw Holdem get one-shot I knew I was going to be perpetually disappointed with the Gifters. For all the narrative fuel Oda spent on hyping up the SMILEs as this incredibly important weapon supply line to Kaidou's crew, the result was quite a let-down. Like, I like the Gifters' designs- they're peak One Piece, but to not have a single one that isn't fodder or otherwise casually one-shot... Ugh.

 

[HereNThere]

Yeah, despite their supposed threat, the Giters were largely disappointing. I blame that on a bit if the pacing in Wano. Feels like Oda planned a lot more, but just couldn't get to it due to the arc being so jam packed already.

Maybe the success rate of Gifters should've just been kept to like 1 out of every hundred rather than every 10. That way the few that were spotlighted could've been a bit harder to put down rather than them being everywhere and quickly one shot.

 

[Ricko]

As everyone said, Kaido crew is really disapointing.

What I was expecting the most was powerfull awaken Zoans.
But I think that the awakening of devil fruit is linked to CoC.
As we can see with Katakuri and Doflamingo, and for him I'm sure he can use birdcage and parasite because of CoC.
As Kid who can force his power into someone else.

Let see if Law is also a CoC user, as he can also awaken his fruit with Kroom, or my theory would be dull

So my theory is for a Zoan to not finish as a mindless beast like in Impel Down, you need CoC.

I hope King got it (as Kata does i'm 100% sure he have it too), and that he will be the first full awaken Zoan revealed (and Kaido after that).
Because for the moment, Zoro's fight is too much like Mr1....
*I can't wound you * Flashback * Haki * Win *

 

[FetherMan]

Kidd and Luffy are equals. Wano arc proves it.

 

[The Prince of Darkness]

Kidd and Luffy are equals. Wano arc proves it.

Where?
There's a big difference between being rivals and being equals.
Kidd and Law are Luffy's rivals but they're not even close to Luffy in power, right now.
Luffy's now miles away from the other Supernovas with, I think, only Zoro hardly running behind him.
Unless their "awakening" are on Katakuri and Doffy's level, they wouldn't last long against a 3 Advanced haki user Luffy

 

[grey matter]

@kkck @zetsu banned
For me, the mere fact that there were like 500 or 1000 of them in Kaido's crew was cue that, broadly speaking, they weren't going to be any special.

To me, it seemed like Kaido just wanted to have his grunts far superior to the grunts of the opposition (other Yonko, Marines etc)
Which we can safely say, he has accomplished. The smile users would no diff the typical grunts

Still, I kinda get your point.
At least one or two of them should've made it to Tobiroppo tier or something, right? I can agree

 

[XXGenesis]

What were we saying last week about Zoro being so outclassed and left behind by his captain??? Lol

 

[M3J]

I wish there were quite a few Beast PIrates that were on a super high level, rather than just Kaidou and the commanders. Given all the hype about zoan users, every major fighter on the heroes' side should be having difficult fights.

 

[Fox666]

What were we saying last week about Zoro being so outclassed and left behind by his captain??? Lol

So Zoro is fighting someone around the level of Katakuri, whom Luffy may be able to one-shot by this point?

 

[Pirate Queen]

So Zoro is fighting someone around the level of Katakuri, whom Luffy may be able to one-shot by this point?

King and Queen were terrified and seemingly helpless against of Big Mom while she was bound in seastone.

Big Mom, Luffy, and Kaido are simply in another league at this point.

King may not be one-shot material for Luffy but it's certainly a low-mid diff for him. If not now, by the end of his fight with Kaido... and he isn't even awakened

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

So Zoro is fighting someone around the level of Katakuri, whom Luffy may be able to one-shot by this point?

King is a mid/high diff for luffy
Styles makes fights
And luffy clearly isn’t quite kaido/big mum level yet

 

[Pirate Queen]

King is a mid/high diff for luffy
Styles makes fights
And luffy clearly isn’t quite kaido/big mum level yet

What style is King using that would make it a high diff fight for Luffy.

Nothing King has shown yet can't be Bypassed with Internal Damage Haki or Future Sight.

At best a mid diff...

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

What style is King using that would make it a high diff fight for Luffy.

Nothing King has shown yet can't be Bypassed with Internal Damage Haki or Future Sight.

At best a mid diff...

The fact that he seems damn near nigh invulnerable
It would take time luffy to pull out conqueror coated attacks and he’d sustain damage

also seems Zoro has caught up to Yamato now

 

[Pirate Queen]

The fact that he seems damn near nigh invulnerable
It would take time luffy to pull out conqueror coated attacks and he’d sustain damage

also seems Zoro has caught up to Yamato now

What Zoro is showing is no where close to Yamato's feats. By far.

Kaido would absolutely stomp Zoro

 

[Rmstorm]

King is a mid/high diff for luffy
Styles makes fights
And luffy clearly isn’t quite kaido/big mum level yet

He is at their level, he is not even using gears and hybrid kaido is struggling with BASe Luffy. Gear 2, 3 and 4 make this a miss match.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

He is at their level, he is not even using gears and hybrid kaido is struggling with BASe Luffy. Gear 2, 3 and 4 make this a miss match.

Kaido is significantly weakened and burnt out