One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[McNuss]

I appreciate the effort, agree with most of it.

But you lowballed the heck out of X Drake. The dude is easily stronger than Vergo and Smoker. And you put him a tier below them

I'd include old characters in their prime as well. I'll put prime Tsuru in zodiac VA Tier, prime Sengoku at Fleet Admiral Tier and prime Garp at a tier above FA

I think X Drake is close to the level of a Yonko commander?

I don't think Sentoumaru was very strong... he relied too much on the Pacifistas, and seemingly couldn't handle Chooper monster point. Both which were one-shot by Luffy post-timeskip...

I don't remember Sentomaru not handling Monster Chopper. Might have been anime filler because in the Manga, he isn't touched by him at all.

I mean X Drake was a walking L in Wano! He sneak attacked CP0 boss and still lost.

Otherwise yes, he is supposed to be the strongest officer after the calamities.

How is Drake close to a Yonko Commander? Queen fodderized him, CP0 guy fodderized him...He took out a number and that's it.

We need to stop these taking good guy=hype glasses because Drake didn't live up to it at all.

Strongest Tobi Roppo is Ulti. Any other of them would have dropped out from either the Raimei Hakke or Maser Cannon. Also has the highest bounty/age out of any of them.

Inflating Drake blows this entire list. There's the other Supernova and most are above him. Ironically, the Preskip version is going to rank quite high among them as they don't yet have Haki to compensate for his Ancient Zoan.

Anyways let's take this a level further:

• Fleet Admiral Tier
  • Sakazuki, Kuzan, Monkey D. Garp
• Admiral Tier
  • Issho, Aramaki, Borsalino, Sengoku, Kong,
• Zodiac Vice Admiral Tier
  • Tokikake, Gion, Tensei, Sentomaru
• Base Commander Vice Admiral Tier
  • Momonga, Comil, Vergo, Smoker (current), Tsuru, John Giant, Jaguar D. Saul, Dorry, Broggy
• Standard Vice Admiral Tier
  • Stainless, Cancer, Mozambia, Onigumo, Doberman, Strawberry, Yamakaji, Lacroix, Lonz, Dalmatian, Bastille, Nazu Ketagari, Draw, X Drake (Post-Timeskip), Enel, Rob Lucci (Pre-Timeskip), Roronoa Zoro (Ashura, Shusui)
• Rear Admiral Tier
  • Sicily, Akehende, Catacombo, Hina (current), T Bone (current), Kadar, X Drake (Pre-Timeskip), Smoker (Pre-Timeskip), Maynard, Koby (current), Roronoa Zoro (Iron Cutting, Flying Sword Slashes), Crocodile (start)
• Commodore Tier
  • Daigin, Yarisugi, Brannew (Post-Timeskip), Tashigi (current), Daz Bones, Nico Robin (Pre-Skip), Roronoa Zoro (Loguetown Swords), Monkey D. Luffy (start), Viper, Kaku, Jabra
• Captain Tier
  • Very Good, Shu, Sharinguru, Gorilla, Helmeppo (current), Hina (Pre-Timeskip), T Bone (Pre-Timeskip), Arlong, Buggy (Muggy Balls), Alvida (slim), Zala, Vinsmoke Sanji (start), Roronoa Zoro (start), Nami (Climate Tact), Pell, Chaka, Dalton, Wapol, Chessmarimo, Bellamy, Satori, Gedatsu, Shura (&Fuza), Aum, Usopp (Kabuto), Bruno, Kalifa, Fukurou, Kumadori
• Commander Tier
  • Donquixote Rosinante, Kuro, Kuroobi, Hatchan, Chew, Krieg, Gin, Buggy (start), Bentham, Galdino, Babe, Drophy, Chess, Kuromarimo, Shojo, Sarquiss, Yama, Usopp (Dials), Brahm, Kamakiri
• Lieutenant Commander Tier
  • Pudding Pudding, Fullbody (current), Jango (current), Buchi (Hypnotized), Pearl, Gem, Mikita, Igaram, Usopp (start), Masira, Genbo
• Lieutenant Tier
  • Nezumi, Zotto, Fullbody (Pre-Skip), Morgan, Jango (Pre-Skip), Kabahji, Mohji (&Richie, Pre-Skip), Nefertari Vivi (&Karoo, Pre-Skip), Hotori, Kotori, Raki
• Lieutenant Junior Grade
  • Ripper, Stalker, Buchi, Alvida (fat), Mr. 7, Miss Father's Day
• Ensign Tier
  • Makko, Tashigi (Pre-Skip), Sham, Mr. 9, Miss Monday
• Warrant Officer Tier
  • Mr. 10, Miss Tuesday
• Master Chief Petty Officer Tier
  • Rokkaku, Mr 11
• Chief Petty Officer Tier
  • Mashikaku, Shine, Asahija
• Petty Officer Tier Tier
  • Mr. 13, Miss Friday
• Seaman First Class Tier
  • Lines
• Seaman Apprentice Tier
• Seaman Recruit Tier
• Chore Boy
  • Koby (start), Helmeppo (start), Ukkari, Makino, Woop Slap, Rika, Ririka, Boodle, Poro, Kaya, Mornin,

Need to catch a break

 

[albertwv]

@McNuss I agree with you about the overestimation of X. Drake due to being popular. IN the raid, Drake's best feats were taking down a Number in one hit, but honestly IDK if that's a feat. The Numbers were seriously disappointing. Drake's portrayal in Onigashima was lacking too.
I was hoping to see more from him but Ulti and WW did a better job from all the Flying 6.
I place Drake the same level as Page One. Drake had hype but that was it. He really should have just dealt with Apoo but Oda screwed him on that. How does he promise Zolo he will deal with the traitor Apoo but then join forces to fight CP0 who wasn't even trying to fight them.
My list of Flying 6: WW>Ulti>Sasaki>Drake>Page One>Black Maria.

But I must disagree with your VA tier list. I don't think Base commander makes them anymore stronger than the rest. I do think there is a considerable gap between Vice Admirals as we have seen with Vergo vs Smoker. The reason why I am against the Base Commander idea is because we have no idea if any other VA's are base commanders, for all we know they can be.
Also we literally have no idea how strong the "Zodiac VAs" are so I wouldn't even bother ranking them yet.
I believe the Buster Call VAs we saw in Enies Lobby and in Marineford line up are the senior VAs and possibly the strongest ones aside from Garp duh.

And lastly, how could you rank Pre TS Lucci and Pre TS Zolo as a standard VA. No way. I don't even think Pre TS Luffy in Marineford was VA level just yet. I say that because we know that VAs have CoA and CoO. Luffy would have lost to a Buster Call VA pre time skip due to not knowing CoA and CoO. The VAs are basically upgraded versions of CP9 Lucci. It was only after TS that Luffy could defeat a VA, as we saw how much Sanji struggled with Vergo.

 

[Fox666]

How is Drake close to a Yonko Commander? Queen fodderized him, CP0 guy fodderized him...He took out a number and that's it.

Isn't "fodderized" an exaggeration?

Queen had Who's Who and Hawkins to back him up, it wasn't a fair fight. While I think Queen himself is already stronger than Drake, that was overkill.

Drake also fought Appo fairly well... and Appo proved himself to be a pain in the ass to a lot of characters.

The CP0 guy wasn't weak either.

 

[LadyVados]

@grey matter: But sure Prime Ray isn't PK tier.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 9, 2022, Original Post Date: Sep 9, 2022 ---

You have lost all credibility with your powerscaling.

Your claimed seriously that Zoro could beat Marineford Whitebeard after he scarred Kaido

You claimed current Luffy loses to King

You claimed Mihawk was not a pirate once it was revealed Kaido was the World's Strongest Pirate and thus stronger than Kaido

And now your claiming Old Ray is stronger than Kaido but would lose due to stamina issues.(which probably means you think the same for Shanks, but somehow not Mihawk. Wonder why?)

Idk what claim is more outrageous but no one should take what you say seriously. You don't even try to understand the manga.

At least when I joke about Hacock being Pirate King level+ people know I'm joking because I love Hancock so much. You actually believe what you are saying

1. I changed my mind.

2. I said he's too dumb to figure out how King's power works. And I've changed my mind on that.

3. He isn't one. I told you before and gave you evidence of me saying he isn't a pirate since at least 2015, it's not something I made up just because Kaido was called the strongest pirate. Also don't you rate Shanks > Kaido so you're just being hypocrite now.

4. He may be stronger than Mihawk actually. Nonetheless I didn't even bring Mihawk into discussion. We're talking about Yonko here.

5. Ok that's just unnecessarily rude and mean-spirited. I'm reporting you for harassment.

Also how is it outrageous when lots of people think Old Garp could beat Akainu ?

6. I don't think you are joking. It's easy to say things and then backtrack and say when you're joking when you're called out on them.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 9, 2022 ---

I’m a zoro fanboy. Ur I ain’t that delusional

I changed my mind on the first and the second one.

The rest is hardly delusional.

In the comments of YouTube videos complaining about 'wokeness' you'll see lots of comments saying I'm a member of so and so minority but the modern LGBT/Black rights/whatever movement has gone too far. And I always suspect that these people are actually straight white dudes. I get the same vibe from you and Grey Matter when you say... I'm a Zoro fanboy but actually... and start lowballing Zoro.

 

[Pirate Queen]

@grey matter: But sure Prime Ray isn't PK tier.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 9, 2022, Original Post Date: Sep 9, 2022 ---

1. I changed my mind.

2. I said he's too dumb to figure out how King's power works. And I've changed my mind on that.

3. He isn't one. I told you before and gave you evidence of me saying he isn't a pirate since at least 2015, it's not something I made up just because Kaido was called the strongest pirate. Also don't you rate Shanks > Kaido so you're just being hypocrite now.

4. He may be stronger than Mihawk actually. Nonetheless I didn't even bring Mihawk into discussion. We're talking about Yonko here.

5. Ok that's just unnecessarily rude and mean-spirited. I'm reporting you for harassment.

Also how is it outrageous when lots of people think Old Garp could beat Akainu ?

6. I don't think you are joking. It's easy to say things and then backtrack and say when you're joking when you're called out on them.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 9, 2022 ---

I changed my mind on the first and the second one.

The rest is hardly delusional.

In the comments of YouTube videos complaining about 'wokeness' you'll see lots of comments saying I'm a member of so and so minority but the modern LGBT/Black rights/whatever movement has gone too far. And I always suspect that these people are actually straight white dudes. I get the same vibe from you and Grey Matter when you say... I'm a Zoro fanboy but actually... and start lowballing Zoro.

Report for harassment

Get help, seriously.

And Grey Matter and LaGoat low balling Zoro? What???

You are standing by your claim Mihawk isn't a pirate is just wild that your serious about


Why are you always bringing social issues into this forum? Just like when you called me racist for "not liking swordsmen"

 

[XXGenesis]

So much rather talk about Tiers below the Top or Commanders as ranking them are so much more interesting…

XDrake is the strongest Tobi Roppo.
WW, Ulti & XDrake are the Top 3.

The differences is negligible only feats sets them apart.

WW fought Jimbei…Lost Low-Mid He couldn’t even hurt Jimbei when he got serious & got 1hit K.O

Ulti got back up after Yamato’s Thunder Bagua & Big Mom’s DF attack, showed good haki with the headbutt clash with Luffy. Great endurance & stamina & Dino Strenght but No way to gauge her damage output against more suitable opponents. Ulti did seem to be pretty balanced.

XDrake’s performance was mid but his role never needed to be huge in Wano. He easily took out a number 1hit k.o…Was gaining the advantage against Apoo, until CP0 low commander lv characters appeared, It was 3 vs 2 until Apoo left mid fight; XDrake losses & makes a last to no avail…

*1shot on a number does mean something. We’ve seen it takes Big attacks to K.O a number..like G4 Luffy, Franky’s Laser Beam that Even BM was going to block using fodder or Hybrid XDrake Attack. They don’t go down unless you hit them really really hard. They are useful fodder lv characters.

Narratively the Tobi Roppo all admit XDrake is #1 in power.

The Tobi Roppo; Hawkins; Apoo even Perospero are all on the same tier.

Below the All Stars/Commanders meaning they are all weaker than ppl like Jack; Dogstrom & CatViper & CP0; But can give them a good fight.

 

[McNuss]

I don't get how you all can overrate Drake so hard.

A big attack alone doesn't make you a top tier, else Elizabello would be Admiral Tier.

He couldn't bust Apoo, whom Zoro took out without even bothering. Drake is a melee expert enhanced by an Ancient Zoan, couldn't take out Apoo in an extended period of time in melee combat.

The reason why I am against the Base Commander idea is because we have no idea if any other VA's are base commanders, for all we know they can be.

We know there can't be too many bases, as G5 is already the dumpster vanguard outpost. We know the commanders of G1, 2 and 5, meaning among known bases only two commanders are unknown. Majority of Vice Admirals has been shown stationed in or operating from Marineford, hence it being unlikely that they are base commanders.

Vergo and Smoker have way better feats than any other VA fleshed out after the timemskip, indicating them as being stronger, and they are a base commander and his succesor.

 

[albertwv]

So much rather talk about Tiers below the Top or Commanders as ranking them are so much more interesting…

XDrake is the strongest Tobi Roppo.
WW, Ulti & XDrake are the Top 3.

The differences is negligible only feats sets them apart.

WW fought Jimbei…Lost Low-Mid He couldn’t even hurt Jimbei when he got serious & got 1hit K.O

Ulti got back up after Yamato’s Thunder Bagua & Big Mom’s DF attack, showed good haki with the headbutt clash with Luffy. Great endurance & stamina & Dino Strenght but No way to gauge her damage output against more suitable opponents. Ulti did seem to be pretty balanced.

XDrake’s performance was mid but his role never needed to be huge in Wano. He easily took out a number 1hit k.o…Was gaining the advantage against Apoo, until CP0 low commander lv characters appeared, It was 3 vs 2 until Apoo left mid fight; XDrake losses & makes a last to no avail…

*1shot on a number does mean something. We’ve seen it takes Big attacks to K.O a number..like G4 Luffy, Franky’s Laser Beam that Even BM was going to block using fodder or Hybrid XDrake Attack. They don’t go down unless you hit them really really hard. They are useful fodder lv characters.

Narratively the Tobi Roppo all admit XDrake is #1 in power.

The Tobi Roppo; Hawkins; Apoo even Perospero are all on the same tier.

Below the All Stars/Commanders meaning they are all weaker than ppl like Jack; Dogstrom & CatViper & CP0; But can give them a good fight.

There is no indication that Drake is indeed the strongest Flying 6 member. He had time to shine in Wano and Onigashima but Oda did him wrong. He did not beat Apoo. He was most likely ambushed by Queen alone, but even so he wouldn't stand a chance against Queen. His biggest feat as I repeat is taking down a Number, which in reality its nothing admirable. Brook took down a number. Franky radical beam is strong but I'm sure BM was just being paranoid, seeing how she tanked Kid's Lazer beam and I'm sure Kid's laser beam >>> Franky radical beam.

@McNuss again, we don't know if being a base commander makes anybody stronger and for all we know, there could be other VAs that are base commanders but Oda doesn't Care enough to make it known.

And yes Vergo and Smoker do have the best feats of any VA shown on screen. I really enjoyed their fight. It pains me that we never saw Luffy or Zolo take down a VA post time skip, all we saw was Sanji fighting one but never bothered to conclude the fight properly.

 

[Franz]

No. He got defeated by G4 Luffy who was relative to Cracker.

Doflamingo was nerfed? Yeah. But at best he would've been relative to G4 Luffy instead of getting dominated

All very nice. It's a pity that:

Cracker fought healthy. Doflamingo no.

Doflamingo was knocked out by one of Luffy's strongest hits. Cracker no.

Against Doflamingo Tufy was supported by Law and half Dressrosa. Against Cracker by Nami alone.

 

[XXGenesis]

I don't get how you all can overrate Drake so hard.

I don’t see anyone saying he’s commander lv. So he’s not being overrated but underrated.

A big attack alone doesn't make you a top tier, else Elizabello would be Admiral Tier.

He couldn't bust Apoo, whom Zoro took out without even bothering. Drake is a melee expert enhanced by an Ancient Zoan, couldn't take out Apoo in an extended period of time in melee combat.

Your putting words into others argument They did not mention to make your seem more valid….I said a Big attack is needed to take down a Number…

Zoro’s entire encounter with Apoo was not that easy or quick. Zoro is also much stronger than XDrake…Bad comparison.

Your underrating Apoo now..Because he received a attack from Zoro followed up by XDrake chomping on him. Yet Apoo was still around fighting in the arc…

XDrake was a good enough fighter to figure out the functions of Apoo’s DF power; easily had the upper hand in that fight before it ended.

There is no indication that Drake is indeed the strongest Flying 6 member.

You are correct. Sorry I was wrong. I read some Mis translation of chapter 978 where they say “XDrake is the closest to the ALLSTAR’s” my fault…I still think from feats he’s the strongest.

He had time to shine in Wano and Onigashima but Oda did him wrong. He did not beat Apoo.

Yes he did have his time to shine. He got a hit off Sanji…WW escorted him into a trap..escaped, took out a number…Kept Apoo busy; As with the CPO. I don’t know how many fans XDrake has, but I had a slight interest in him which diminished over the years. But I’m statistics with the role he’s played so far. It’s obvious he doesn’t have that much of one to play on the grand theme of things. Just minor influence like slowing CP0 down from catching Robin.

Apoo more than likely would have been defeated. He endured more damage; & XDrake had his DF power figured out.

He was most likely ambushed by Queen alone, but even so he wouldn't stand a chance against Queen. His biggest feat as I repeat is taking down a Number, which in reality its nothing admirable. Brook took down a number. Franky radical beam is strong but I'm sure BM was just being paranoid, seeing how she tanked Kid's Lazer beam and I'm sure Kid's laser beam >>> Franky radical beam.

He was escorted by WW into a room with Queen & Hawkins….He’s lucky he even escaped;

Kidd used a Rail Gun..to shoot a metal projectile at super fast speed…it wasn’t a Electromagnetic beam.

No Big Mom wasn’t overreacting. The Beam is Vega Punk tech reversed engineered by Franky. It’s potent especially when he charges it up. BM likes to tank attacks but knows when to block; it could have did minor damage..that would have been impressive for Franky.

Still takes a potent attack to take the numbers down. XDrake also fought a decent fight with CP0 mostly alone, Apoo ran on him & the number. Then he showed good enough stamina to land a blow even after getting beat.

XDrake imo is still stronger than WW. Who had some good skills but Jimbei a commander blew off his strongest attacks & Spanked him quick. While XDrake imo has similar damage or attack output but more endurance & stamina..Ulti has a lot of stamina but with only 2 attacks…The headbutt & flying headbutt I’m not gonna say she’s above WW, or XDrake

 

[grey matter]

@grey matter: But sure Prime Ray isn't PK tier.

.......

I've told you multiple times that the reason I don't put Rayleigh there at "PK tier" is because there is no conclusive evidence.
Like, we know for a fact that Roger, WB and Garp were relative. No such statement or narrative was made regarding it for Rayleigh.

How is it so hard to understand lmao?

That being said, I didn't even say you were necessarily wrong in putting him there. There are some hints suggesting he is up there are well:
- "dark king" is an epithet that suggests he could've become the King, but chose to stay in the dark/shadows
- Garp talking about Whitebeard and Rayleigh as legends of similar stature
- The difference in reaction from Coby that you put here

My point simply is that it's not conclusive, so I'm 50/50 on Rayleigh being on that tier.
I simply choose to go with Roger PK tier, and Rayleigh high-end Yonko tier. Because it mirrors what I see for Luffy/Zoro in EoS as well as in most arcs (with few exceptions like Wano), I predict Zoro being a high-extreme diff material for him.


The difference between you and me is, you are not even willing to see (the valid) room for uncertainty here.
You are convinced that Rayleigh is PK tier, because you think Luffy = Zoro EoS

I changed my mind on the first and the second one.

The rest is hardly delusional.

In the comments of YouTube videos complaining about 'wokeness' you'll see lots of comments saying I'm a member of so and so minority but the modern LGBT/Black rights/whatever movement has gone too far. And I always suspect that these people are actually straight white dudes. I get the same vibe from you and Grey Matter when you say... I'm a Zoro fanboy but actually... and start lowballing Zoro.

Imagine thinking LaGoat and I low ball Zoro lmfao.
I can be a fan of Zoro, and still see through agendas and call them out.

Interesting that you don't mention me calling out the other agendas here.
Like massive low ball of Mihawk to YC1/YC1+ until very recently from Shank agenda and/or anti-Zoro agenda. Or BM agenda putting her at Kaido level. Or Sanji agenda putting him at Zoro level.

I can't speak for @LaGOAT , but I've always thought Zoro was high-extreme diff material for Luffy in most arcs. This is where I see EoS Zoro relative to Luffy as well. Wano is more of an exception to this from my perspective.
The funny thing is, I can guarantee you that this would be the "consensus" take from the Zoro fans, with Zoro = Luffy more of an outlier opinion even within Zoro fandom.

So, am I low balling Zoro, or are you overestimating Zoro?

As for that political nonsense, I'll just not comment on it extensively here, or I'll get banned lol. Let's just say I'm an Indian and I hate the woke fucks in the west lmao; so there is some pattern there with actuality, not pretend.

 

[LaGOAT]

.......

I've told you multiple times that the reason I don't put Rayleigh there at "PK tier" is because there is no conclusive evidence.
Like, we know for a fact that Roger, WB and Garp were relative. No such statement or narrative was made regarding it for Rayleigh.

How is it so hard to understand lmao?

That being said, I didn't even say you were necessarily wrong in putting him there. There are some hints suggesting he is up there are well:
- "dark king" is an epithet that suggests he could've become the King, but chose to stay in the dark/shadows
- Garp talking about Whitebeard and Rayleigh as legends of similar stature
- The difference in reaction from Coby that you put here

My point simply is that it's not conclusive, so I'm 50/50 on Rayleigh being on that tier.
I simply choose to go with Roger PK tier, and Rayleigh high-end Yonko tier. Because it mirrors what I see for Luffy/Zoro in EoS as well as in most arcs (with few exceptions like Wano), I predict Zoro being a high-extreme diff material for him.


The difference between you and me is, you are not even willing to see (the valid) room for uncertainty here.
You are convinced that Rayleigh is PK tier, because you think Luffy = Zoro EoS



Imagine thinking LaGoat and I low ball Zoro lmfao.
I can be a fan of Zoro, and still see through agendas and call them out.

Interesting that you don't mention me calling out the other agendas here.
Like massive low ball of Mihawk to YC1/YC1+ until very recently from Shank agenda and/or anti-Zoro agenda. Or BM agenda putting her at Kaido level. Or Sanji agenda putting him at Zoro level.

I can't speak for @LaGOAT , but I've always thought Zoro was high-extreme diff material for Luffy in most arcs. This is where I see EoS Zoro relative to Luffy as well. Wano is more of an exception to this from my perspective.
The funny thing is, I can guarantee you that this would be the "consensus" take from the Zoro fans, with Zoro = Luffy more of an outlier opinion even within Zoro fandom.

So, am I low balling Zoro, or are you overestimating Zoro?

As for that political nonsense, I'll just not comment on it extensively here, or I'll get banned lol. Let's just say I'm an Indian and I hate the woke fucks in the west lmao; so there is some pattern there with actuality, not pretend.

First of all I don’t know what she bring these Politics stuff and what does that have to do with the debate? Lol
@LadyVados
2. I’m a huge zoro fanboy but I try to be very objective with Zoro I don’t Blindly follow Zoro I’ll call some be if ur making Nonsensical claims if what @Pirate Queen said is true then I don’t what to tell. Zoro ain’t yonko lvl just yet luffy will beat zoro and that is a fact

 

[Qenjin]

Now Oda did it again. After Luffys huge Win against Kaido he displayed yet again Blackbeard as force to be reckoned with. Naturally we should assume Luffy overall outshines blackbeard, however yami yami no mi gives BB huge advantage. Luffy without his nika fruit would have trouble handling 2 devil fruits. I still think luffys coc would outmatch blackbeard.

What I am not sure is one thing:
Nika was called "sun god", do you think there will be some power connected to sun with his DF? Myabe power to overcome yami yami no mi.

 

[Fox666]

Nika was called "sun god", do you think there will be some power connected to sun with his DF? Myabe power to overcome yami yami no mi.

Dunno

The rubber body seems like a natural defense against the Gura Gura no Mi

But I want to see Luffy fighting without his fruit power at all

 

[albertwv]

I don’t see anyone saying he’s commander lv. So he’s not being overrated but underrated.



Your putting words into others argument They did not mention to make your seem more valid….I said a Big attack is needed to take down a Number…

Zoro’s entire encounter with Apoo was not that easy or quick. Zoro is also much stronger than XDrake…Bad comparison.

Your underrating Apoo now..Because he received a attack from Zoro followed up by XDrake chomping on him. Yet Apoo was still around fighting in the arc…

XDrake was a good enough fighter to figure out the functions of Apoo’s DF power; easily had the upper hand in that fight before it ended.




You are correct. Sorry I was wrong. I read some Mis translation of chapter 978 where they say “XDrake is the closest to the ALLSTAR’s” my fault…I still think from feats he’s the strongest.



Yes he did have his time to shine. He got a hit off Sanji…WW escorted him into a trap..escaped, took out a number…Kept Apoo busy; As with the CPO. I don’t know how many fans XDrake has, but I had a slight interest in him which diminished over the years. But I’m statistics with the role he’s played so far. It’s obvious he doesn’t have that much of one to play on the grand theme of things. Just minor influence like slowing CP0 down from catching Robin.

Apoo more than likely would have been defeated. He endured more damage; & XDrake had his DF power figured out.




He was escorted by WW into a room with Queen & Hawkins….He’s lucky he even escaped;

Kidd used a Rail Gun..to shoot a metal projectile at super fast speed…it wasn’t a Electromagnetic beam.

No Big Mom wasn’t overreacting. The Beam is Vega Punk tech reversed engineered by Franky. It’s potent especially when he charges it up. BM likes to tank attacks but knows when to block; it could have did minor damage..that would have been impressive for Franky.

Still takes a potent attack to take the numbers down. XDrake also fought a decent fight with CP0 mostly alone, Apoo ran on him & the number. Then he showed good enough stamina to land a blow even after getting beat.

XDrake imo is still stronger than WW. Who had some good skills but Jimbei a commander blew off his strongest attacks & Spanked him quick. While XDrake imo has similar damage or attack output but more endurance & stamina..Ulti has a lot of stamina but with only 2 attacks…The headbutt & flying headbutt I’m not gonna say she’s above WW, or XDrake

Regarding Franky's beam, irregardless, Kids beam > Franky beam. And we saw how little damage it did to BM, I doubt Frankys beam would do much to her. All I'm saying is The Numbers were disappointing and I would not use them as a way to show off feats.
Drake is not portrayed as the strongest F6, but he is popular among the fans so there is a strong push for him to be the "strongest". Oda could have given him an actual 1v1 win but chose not too.

Also I believe BB > Rayleigh > Hancock.
I think Hancock is YC3 level, below Doffy.
Rayleigh is low Yonko tier with BB being right above him. I think Luffy and Rayleigh may be in the same power with Luffy having the edge due to young age and stamina.

 

[XXGenesis]

Regarding Franky's beam, irregardless, Kids beam > Franky beam. And we saw how little damage it did to BM, I doubt Frankys beam would do much to her. All I'm saying is The Numbers were disappointing and I would not use them as a way to show off feats.
Drake is not portrayed as the strongest F6, but he is popular among the fans so there is a strong push for him to be the "strongest". Oda could have given him an actual 1v1 win but chose not too.

Also I believe BB > Rayleigh > Hancock.
I think Hancock is YC3 level, below Doffy.
Rayleigh is low Yonko tier with BB being right above him. I think Luffy and Rayleigh may be in the same power with Luffy having the edge due to young age and stamina.

Irregardless?? Bro Kidd doesn’t have a Beam….!!!
Not to be condescending but duh Kidd is > Franky.
I’m pointing out your comparison is a faulty 1.
But yes Radical Beam would not have hurt Big Mom.

Disappointing to you. Sorry you found them underwhelming. I wasn’t disappointed with them, that much. Once they were revealed.

A subjective matter of what you consider not being portrayed as the strongest Flying six member. When he had the most fights amongst them. You me mentioning a 1 vs 1 for XDrake but he didn’t get it..Again your stating the obvious, what is that suppose to mean entirely?! When XDrake was in the Wano arc & had a role. Unlike WW wasn’t one shotted.

 

[john ellis]

If weavile appears in the stoy as the next major villian, how easy should luffy take him out. Even with the bounty hype of the warlords there all still around WCI Luffy so i feel like luffy should 1 shot weavile to show off his status as an emperor

 

[albertwv]

Disappointing to you. Sorry you found them underwhelming. I wasn’t disappointed with them, that much. Once they were revealed.

A subjective matter of what you consider not being portrayed as the strongest Flying six member. When he had the most fights amongst them. You me mentioning a 1 vs 1 for XDrake but he didn’t get it..Again your stating the obvious, what is that suppose to mean entirely?! When XDrake was in the Wano arc & had a role. Unlike WW wasn’t one shotted.

WW fought and lost to Jimbei. Drake's battles were mostly off screened or shortened. He lost to Queen (whatever), battled Apoo (inconclusive), battle CP0 (lost). WW had better feats than Drake., shit even Ulti had better feats.

Regarding Weevil, I could care less. I don't like his design. I think Oda forgot about him. But I will say this. I don't think he can give Luffy a challenge. Maybe when WCI Luffy but not anymore.

 

[McNuss]

Some updates, still far from complete.

• Throne Tier
  • Sakazuki, Kuzan, Monkey D. Garp, Monkey D. Luffy (Awakening), Kaido, Charlotte Linlin, Edward Newgate, Shanks, Marshall D. Teach (Post-Timeskip), Im
• Throne Challenger Tier
  • Issho, Aramaki, Borsalino, Sengoku, Kong, Monkey D. Luffy (Advanced Haki), Roronoa Zoro (Wano Arc), Trafalgar Law (Awakening), Eustass Kid (Awakening), Marco, Silvers Rayleigh, Yamato

• New World Diamond Tier
  • Tokikake, Gion, Tensei, Sentomaru, Donquixote Doflamingo, Monkey D. Luffy (Post-Timeskip), Roronoa Zoro (Post-Timeskip), Vinsmoke Sanji (Wano Arc), Jinbe, Trafalgar Law (Post-Timeskip), Killer (Post-Timeskip), Charlotte Katakuri, Charlotte Cracker, King, Queen, Jack, Charlotte Smoothie, Nightmare Luffy
• New World Platinum Tier
  • Momonga, Comil, Vergo, Smoker (current), Tsuru, John Giant, Jaguar D. Saul, Dorry, Broggy, Gecko Moria (Oars), Oars, Little Oars Jr.. Pica, Scratchmen Apoo, Charlotte Perospero, Charlotte Snack, Count Niwatori, Inuarashi, Nekomamushi, Crocodile (Marineford), Vinsmoke Sanji (Raid Suit)
• New World Gold Tier
  • Stainless, Cancer, Mozambia, Onigumo, Doberman, Strawberry, Yamakaji, Lacroix, Lonz, Dalmatian, Bastille, Nazu Ketagari, Draw, X Drake (Post-Timeskip), Enel, Rob Lucci (Pre-Timeskip), Roronoa Zoro (Ashura, Shusui), Diamante, Trebol, Basil Hawkins (Post-Timeskip), Pedro, Viscount Hiyoko, Charlotte Oven, Charlotte Daifuku, Shishilian, Bartolomeo, Cavendish, Sai (Don Sai), Caesar Clown, Monkey D. Luffy (Gears), Hody Jones (Second Overdose), Nami (Zeus Tact), Vinsmoke Sanji (Post-Timeskip), Tony Tony Chopper (Rumble Upgrade)
• New World Silver
  • Sicily, Akehende, Catacombo, Hina (current), T Bone (current), Kadar, X Drake (Pre-Timeskip), Smoker (Pre-Timeskip), Maynard, Koby (current), Roronoa Zoro (Iron Cutting, Flying Sword Slashes), Crocodile (start), Gecko Moria, Baron Tamago, Monet, Hody Jones (Overdose), Hyouzou (Overdose), Nami (Wukong Tact), Tony Tony Chopper (Post-Timeskip)
• New World Bronze
  • Daigin, Yarisugi, Brannew (Post-Timeskip), Tashigi (current), Daz Bones, Nico Robin (Pre-Skip), Roronoa Zoro (Loguetown Swords), Monkey D. Luffy (start), Viper, Kaku, Jabra, Vinsmoke Sanji (Diable Jambe), Absalom, Hody Jones, Hyouzou, Ryuma, Nami (Post-Timeskip), Usopp (Post Timeskip, CoO), Tony Tony Chopper (start), Minotaurus, Minokoala, Minorhinoceros, Minozebra, Minochihuahua

• New World Challenger Tier
  • Very Good, Shu, Sharinguru, Gorilla, Helmeppo (current), Hina (Pre-Timeskip), T Bone (Pre-Timeskip), Arlong, Buggy (Muggy Balls), Alvida (slim), Zala, Vinsmoke Sanji (start), Roronoa Zoro (start), Nami (Perfect Clima Tact), Pell, Chaka, Dalton, Wapol, Chessmarimo, Bellamy, Satori, Gedatsu, Shura (&Fuza), Aum, Usopp (Kabuto), Bruno, Kalifa, Fukurou, Kumadori, Perona, Franky (start)
• Paradise Diamond Tier
  • Donquixote Rosinante, Kuro, Kuroobi, Hatchan, Chew, Krieg, Gin, Buggy (start), Bentham, Galdino, Babe (&Lassoo), Drophy, Chess, Kuromarimo, Shojo, Sarquiss, Yama, Usopp (Dials), Brahm, Kamakiri, Nami (Clima Tact), Nero
• Paradise Platinum Tier
  • Pudding Pudding, Fullbody (current), Jango (current), Buchi (Hypnotized), Pearl, Gem, Mikita, Igaram, Usopp (start), Masira, Genbo
• Paradise Gold Tier
  • Nezumi, Zotto, Fullbody (Pre-Skip), Morgan, Jango (Pre-Skip), Kabahji, Mohji (&Richie, Pre-Skip), Nefertari Vivi (&Karoo, Pre-Skip), Hotori, Kotori, Raki
• Paradise Silver Tier
  • Ripper, Stalker, Buchi, Alvida (fat), Mr. 7, Miss Father's Day
• Paradise Bronze Tier
  • Makko, Tashigi (Pre-Skip), Sham, Mr. 9, Miss Monday

• Paradise Challenger Tier
  • Mr. 10, Miss Tuesday
• Blue Diamond Tier
  • Rokkaku, Mr 11
• Blue Platinum Tier
  • Mashikaku, Shine, Asahija
• Blue Gold Tier
  • Mr. 13, Miss Friday, Nami (start)
• Blue Silver Tier
  • Lines, Billions, Akumai, Mr. Mellow, Mr. Love
• Blue Bronze Tier
  • Millions, Miss Catherina, Mr. Beans, Mr. Shimizu
• Poop Tier
  • Mansion Guards, Johnny, Yosaku, Genzo
• Civilian Tier
  • Koby (start), Helmeppo (start), Ukkari, Makino, Woop Slap, Rika, Ririka, Boodle, Poro, Kaya, Mornin,

 

[Pirate Queen]

Some updates, still far from complete.

• Throne Tier
  • Sakazuki, Kuzan, Monkey D. Garp, Monkey D. Luffy (Awakening), Kaido, Charlotte Linlin, Edward Newgate, Shanks, Marshall D. Teach (Post-Timeskip), Im
• Throne Challenger Tier
  • Issho, Aramaki, Borsalino, Sengoku, Kong, Monkey D. Luffy (Advanced Haki), Roronoa Zoro (Wano Arc), Trafalgar Law (Awakening), Eustass Kid (Awakening), Marco, Silvers Rayleigh, Yamato

• New World Diamond Tier
  • Tokikake, Gion, Tensei, Sentomaru, Donquixote Doflamingo, Monkey D. Luffy (Post-Timeskip), Roronoa Zoro (Post-Timeskip), Vinsmoke Sanji (Wano Arc), Jinbe, Trafalgar Law (Post-Timeskip), Killer (Post-Timeskip), Charlotte Katakuri, Charlotte Cracker, King, Queen, Jack, Charlotte Smoothie, Nightmare Luffy
• New World Platinum Tier
  • Momonga, Comil, Vergo, Smoker (current), Tsuru, John Giant, Jaguar D. Saul, Dorry, Broggy, Gecko Moria (Oars), Oars, Little Oars Jr.. Pica, Scratchmen Apoo, Charlotte Perospero, Charlotte Snack, Count Niwatori, Inuarashi, Nekomamushi, Crocodile (Marineford), Vinsmoke Sanji (Raid Suit)
• New World Gold Tier
  • Stainless, Cancer, Mozambia, Onigumo, Doberman, Strawberry, Yamakaji, Lacroix, Lonz, Dalmatian, Bastille, Nazu Ketagari, Draw, X Drake (Post-Timeskip), Enel, Rob Lucci (Pre-Timeskip), Roronoa Zoro (Ashura, Shusui), Diamante, Trebol, Basil Hawkins (Post-Timeskip), Pedro, Viscount Hiyoko, Charlotte Oven, Charlotte Daifuku, Shishilian, Bartolomeo, Cavendish, Sai (Don Sai), Caesar Clown, Monkey D. Luffy (Gears), Hody Jones (Second Overdose), Nami (Zeus Tact), Vinsmoke Sanji (Post-Timeskip)
• New World Silver
  • Sicily, Akehende, Catacombo, Hina (current), T Bone (current), Kadar, X Drake (Pre-Timeskip), Smoker (Pre-Timeskip), Maynard, Koby (current), Roronoa Zoro (Iron Cutting, Flying Sword Slashes), Crocodile (start), Gecko Moria, Baron Tamago, Monet, Hody Jones (Overdose), Hyouzou (Overdose), Nami (Wukong Tact)
• New World Bronze
  • Daigin, Yarisugi, Brannew (Post-Timeskip), Tashigi (current), Daz Bones, Nico Robin (Pre-Skip), Roronoa Zoro (Loguetown Swords), Monkey D. Luffy (start), Viper, Kaku, Jabra, Vinsmoke Sanji (Diable Jambe), Absalom, Hody Jones, Hyouzou, Ryuma, Nami (Post-Timeskip), Usopp (Post Timeskip, CoO)

• New World Challenger Tier
  • Very Good, Shu, Sharinguru, Gorilla, Helmeppo (current), Hina (Pre-Timeskip), T Bone (Pre-Timeskip), Arlong, Buggy (Muggy Balls), Alvida (slim), Zala, Vinsmoke Sanji (start), Roronoa Zoro (start), Nami (Perfect Clima Tact), Pell, Chaka, Dalton, Wapol, Chessmarimo, Bellamy, Satori, Gedatsu, Shura (&Fuza), Aum, Usopp (Kabuto), Bruno, Kalifa, Fukurou, Kumadori, Perona
• Paradise Diamond Tier
  • Donquixote Rosinante, Kuro, Kuroobi, Hatchan, Chew, Krieg, Gin, Buggy (start), Bentham, Galdino, Babe (&Lassoo), Drophy, Chess, Kuromarimo, Shojo, Sarquiss, Yama, Usopp (Dials), Brahm, Kamakiri, Nami (Clima Tact)
• Paradise Platinum Tier
  • Pudding Pudding, Fullbody (current), Jango (current), Buchi (Hypnotized), Pearl, Gem, Mikita, Igaram, Usopp (start), Masira, Genbo
• Paradise Gold Tier
  • Nezumi, Zotto, Fullbody (Pre-Skip), Morgan, Jango (Pre-Skip), Kabahji, Mohji (&Richie, Pre-Skip), Nefertari Vivi (&Karoo, Pre-Skip), Hotori, Kotori, Raki
• Paradise Silver Tier
  • Ripper, Stalker, Buchi, Alvida (fat), Mr. 7, Miss Father's Day
• Paradise Bronze Tier
  • Makko, Tashigi (Pre-Skip), Sham, Mr. 9, Miss Monday

• Paradise Challenger Tier
  • Mr. 10, Miss Tuesday
• Blue Diamond Tier
  • Rokkaku, Mr 11
• Blue Platinum Tier
  • Mashikaku, Shine, Asahija
• Blue Gold Tier
  • Mr. 13, Miss Friday, Nami (start)
• Blue Silver Tier
  • Lines, Billions, Akumai, Mr. Mellow, Mr. Love
• Blue Bronze Tier
  • Millions, Miss Catherina, Mr. Beans, Mr. Shimizu
• Poop Tier
  • Mansion Guards, Johnny, Yosaku, Genzo
• Civilian Tier
  • Koby (start), Helmeppo (start), Ukkari, Makino, Woop Slap, Rika, Ririka, Boodle, Poro, Kaya, Mornin,

Wtf where is Hancock?

Also I did not look past Throne Challenger Tier

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 13, 2022, Original Post Date: Sep 13, 2022 ---

Regarding Franky's beam, irregardless, Kids beam > Franky beam. And we saw how little damage it did to BM, I doubt Frankys beam would do much to her. All I'm saying is The Numbers were disappointing and I would not use them as a way to show off feats.
Drake is not portrayed as the strongest F6, but he is popular among the fans so there is a strong push for him to be the "strongest". Oda could have given him an actual 1v1 win but chose not too.

Also I believe BB > Rayleigh > Hancock.
I think Hancock is YC3 level, below Doffy.
Rayleigh is low Yonko tier with BB being right above him. I think Luffy and Rayleigh may be in the same power with Luffy having the edge due to young age and stamina.

Cap, where do you rank Hancock? I can certainly read the next line but I want YOU to read it



You wrote that solely to piss off the Grand Fleet