American Politics

M3J

MH Senpai
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Mar 2, 2009
Messages
48,828
Reaction score
17,292
Gender
Male
Country
Akatsuki
Trump is a perfect representative of most politicians - blames everyone but himself when shit goes bad and says anything ridiculous for votes or support, though Trump is probably one of the worst. I hope come election day, we get enough common sense not to vote for Trump, and hopefully vote for Bernie instead.
 

xi0

あの術
最終形態 / Saishuu Keitai / Final Form
Administrator
Joined
Feb 3, 2006
Messages
65,178
Reaction score
30,220
Gender
Male
Country
Pyke
Trump is a perfect representative of most politicians - blames everyone but himself when shit goes bad and says anything ridiculous for votes or support, though Trump is probably one of the worst. I hope come election day, we get enough common sense not to vote for Trump, and hopefully vote for Bernie instead.
Trump and Bernie aren't facing eachother in the election, they're in different parties :oh
 

M3J

MH Senpai
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Mar 2, 2009
Messages
48,828
Reaction score
17,292
Gender
Male
Country
Akatsuki
yes they are, so why wouldn't they face each other in general election, provided they both win the primaries (which I hope Bernie does, as Hillary seems to be a horrible person)? Am I missing something? Did we change how we vote? Google shows me that NJ voters have Primary Election Day (for which I shall vote Bernie and hope republican voters vote for Kasich) and General Election Day (in November), in which I hope people vote democrat and not republican regardless of who.

Is this not right?
 

xi0

あの術
最終形態 / Saishuu Keitai / Final Form
Administrator
Joined
Feb 3, 2006
Messages
65,178
Reaction score
30,220
Gender
Male
Country
Pyke
yes they are, so why wouldn't they face each other in general election, provided they both win the primaries (which I hope Bernie does, as Hillary seems to be a horrible person)? Am I missing something? Did we change how we vote? Google shows me that NJ voters have Primary Election Day (for which I shall vote Bernie and hope republican voters vote for Kasich) and General Election Day (in November), in which I hope people vote democrat and not republican regardless of who.

Is this not right?
Well that has nothing to do with the general election. Not sure what kind of primary system NJ has, but here you have to be a registered member of a party in order to vote in the primary. This means voters aren't choosing between Trump and Sanders. It's different in the open primary system compared to the closed one, where you can vote for anyone but there are still more primaries that are closed.
 

M3J

MH Senpai
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Mar 2, 2009
Messages
48,828
Reaction score
17,292
Gender
Male
Country
Akatsuki
Well that has nothing to do with the general election. Not sure what kind of primary system NJ has, but here you have to be a registered member of a party in order to vote in the primary. This means voters aren't choosing between Trump and Sanders. It's different in the open primary system compared to the closed one, where you can vote for anyone but there are still more primaries that are closed.
???

then what's going on with the general election? how do we vote for the president of US?
 

xi0

あの術
最終形態 / Saishuu Keitai / Final Form
Administrator
Joined
Feb 3, 2006
Messages
65,178
Reaction score
30,220
Gender
Male
Country
Pyke
???

then what's going on with the general election? how do we vote for the president of US?
That's open to all registered voters in November...
 

SharkBait

MH Senpai
伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2013
Messages
14,071
Reaction score
6,930
Gender
Male
Country
United States

I dont understand the backlash, it only make sense to do this as weve had yet another attack in a first world nation.People are going to have to give up some liberties if they want to live in a safer world. Unless people would rather ban and deport followers of the Islamic faith?
 

Hamy

MH Senpai
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Apr 6, 2010
Messages
2,091
Reaction score
939
Gender
Hidden
Country
Hong Kong

I dont understand the backlash, it only make sense to do this as weve had yet another attack in a first world nation.People are going to have to give up some liberties if they want to live in a safer world. Unless people would rather ban and deport followers of the Islamic faith?
Because there is something in the constitution about "innocent until proven guilty" while I understand your rhetoric about security you also have to consider that the proposal already assumes otherwise about innocence, since they are made suspect. Obviously, I doubt anybody would be pleased at any insinuation thrown at them, given how serious it may be, especially when the Islamic community in your country is already doing what they can to divorce themselves from such attacks.

I mean lets face it who wants to be generalized in a negative light? Yeah you can always say it is for security issues or whatever but it won't change the fact that it would be unpleasant at a personal level.
 
Last edited:

kkck

Waifu Slayer
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
46,284
Reaction score
24,918
Gender
Hidden
Country
Fire Nation

I dont understand the backlash, it only make sense to do this as weve had yet another attack in a first world nation.People are going to have to give up some liberties if they want to live in a safer world. Unless people would rather ban and deport followers of the Islamic faith?
It doesn't have to be one or the other, the notion is idiotic, racist and would certainly fail in its objective. The vast majority of people at those neighborhoods are likely just normal people doing normal things... One of ISIS methods to recruit people is by convincing them that the west and the US in general as hostile against them and a threat. You'd think proving them right is first on the list of things to avoid.
 

M3J

MH Senpai
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Mar 2, 2009
Messages
48,828
Reaction score
17,292
Gender
Male
Country
Akatsuki
That's open to all registered voters in November...

I dont understand the backlash, it only make sense to do this as weve had yet another attack in a first world nation.People are going to have to give up some liberties if they want to live in a safer world. Unless people would rather ban and deport followers of the Islamic faith?
Cruz is a horrible person, and anyone who agrees with him or Trump on how to deal with Muslims is trash. It makes no sense to do this because not only does it target innocent Muslims, but it also increases fear of them for no reason. If people really cared about safety, why not go after right wings, Christians, white people, and gun owners? These people are more likely to be (and have been) violent in America than Muslims.

But I do think European nations should improve their vetting process and make as stringent as America's. May take longer for refugees to enter the country, but it's safer. I mean, thanks to US's stringent vettin process only terrorist attacks we see are from our own citizens.
 

SharkBait

MH Senpai
伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2013
Messages
14,071
Reaction score
6,930
Gender
Male
Country
United States
I keep seeing articles of Cruz inquiring of Rubio to join his ticket. Im kind of mixed on this idea. Itd be great for Rubio but how much could he affect things.
 

xi0

あの術
最終形態 / Saishuu Keitai / Final Form
Administrator
Joined
Feb 3, 2006
Messages
65,178
Reaction score
30,220
Gender
Male
Country
Pyke
If people really cared about safety, why not go after right wings, Christians, white people, and gun owners? These people are more likely to be (and have been) violent in America than Muslims.
It's not one or the other... For the majority of the country, what you list doesn't put forth an existential threat. It's obvious why people focus on foreign-influenced terrorism. I don't agree with fear-mongering or anything though. I don't see how what either Cruz or Trump says about muslim neighborhoods makes any sense. Last I check, we don't really have the large "enclaves" that some European countries have. I know a place like Dearborn, Michigan has a huge muslim population, but other than that, nothing really stands out to me offhand.

But I do think European nations should improve their vetting process and make as stringent as America's. May take longer for refugees to enter the country, but it's safer.
They can't really, due to the Schengen agreement. A country like Germany decides that they'll have an open-door policy, and then the rest of the nations in the EU are kinda fucked as a result.
 

SharkBait

MH Senpai
伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2013
Messages
14,071
Reaction score
6,930
Gender
Male
Country
United States
Another overwhelming victory for clinton in Arizona. When I checked she was at 60% or more. Trump won in this winner take all state. The rest close at times that are not good for east coast people.

I think the road to the presidenciy is getting farther away for Kasich and Sanders, especially since Clinton wins states with lots o delegates.
 

M3J

MH Senpai
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Mar 2, 2009
Messages
48,828
Reaction score
17,292
Gender
Male
Country
Akatsuki
It's not one or the other... For the majority of the country, what you list doesn't put forth an existential threat. It's obvious why people focus on foreign-influenced terrorism. I don't agree with fear-mongering or anything though. I don't see how what either Cruz or Trump says about muslim neighborhoods makes any sense. Last I check, we don't really have the large "enclaves" that some European countries have. I know a place like Dearborn, Michigan has a huge muslim population, but other than that, nothing really stands out to me offhand.


They can't really, due to the Schengen agreement. A country like Germany decides that they'll have an open-door policy, and then the rest of the nations in the EU are kinda fucked as a result.
How do we know they don't put forth an existential threat? Who knows? What if a radical Christian decides that no other religion deserves to live and starts gatherin followers to kill anyone who's not Christian? What if a right winger decides to go after anything left? I'm just saying, the US have more important things to focus on than nearly non-existential threat from Muslim refugees who are vetted so stringently.

I don't agree with fear-mongering either, although that's what I'm doing in counter to Muslim fear-mongering that's going on. But it's somewhat ironic. I'm pretty sure that trying to monitor Muslim neighborhoods will make things worse and likely have racists be even more inspired to attack these Muslims.

how so? I hope this gets fixed because countries should be more stringent in their vetting.
 

xi0

あの術
最終形態 / Saishuu Keitai / Final Form
Administrator
Joined
Feb 3, 2006
Messages
65,178
Reaction score
30,220
Gender
Male
Country
Pyke
How do we know they don't put forth an existential threat? Who knows? What if a radical Christian decides that no other religion deserves to live and starts gatherin followers to kill anyone who's not Christian? What if a right winger decides to go after anything left? I'm just saying, the US have more important things to focus on than nearly non-existential threat from Muslim refugees who are vetted so stringently.
What's the point of saying that they might? They don't at the moment. Islamism on the other hand does. Don't see the point in "what ifs" here. How radical are Christians even allowed to be in the west? Not to the point where they blow themselves up to kill innocents en masse. The main problem is that supposed "progressives" make excuses and try to act like jihad has nothing to do with Islam, when it clearly does and is openly preached among some members of the faith. Nothing like that is going on here with Christians or Jews or anyone else. Speaking the truth doesn't mean all critics are trying to foster hate and fear regarding Muslims, but many progressives make so many excuses regarding this and are so afraid of saying the wrong thing that they're doing a massive disservice to the actual problem and any solution it could have.

I don't agree with fear-mongering either, although that's what I'm doing in counter to Muslim fear-mongering that's going on. But it's somewhat ironic. I'm pretty sure that trying to monitor Muslim neighborhoods will make things worse and likely have racists be even more inspired to attack these Muslims.
I don't know about it making things worse. I think that's a false narrative put forth by people on the left. I just think it'd be a waste of time and resources. They do these kind of things in enclaves in Europe apparently, and what does that really prevent? Social integration here is a bit more successful.

how so? I hope this gets fixed because countries should be more stringent in their vetting.
Countries in the Schengen area don't have stops between their borders. So a refugee could enter into Germany and then go to Belgium without incident. At least, that's how I understand it.
 

M3J

MH Senpai
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Mar 2, 2009
Messages
48,828
Reaction score
17,292
Gender
Male
Country
Akatsuki
What's the point of saying that they might? They don't at the moment. Islamism on the other hand does. Don't see the point in "what ifs" here. How radical are Christians even allowed to be in the west? Not to the point where they blow themselves up to kill innocents en masse. The main problem is that supposed "progressives" make excuses and try to act like jihad has nothing to do with Islam, when it clearly does and is openly preached among some members of the faith. Nothing like that is going on here with Christians or Jews or anyone else. Speaking the truth doesn't mean all critics are trying to foster hate and fear regarding Muslims, but many progressives make so many excuses regarding this and are so afraid of saying the wrong thing that they're doing a massive disservice to the actual problem and any solution it could have.


I don't know about it making things worse. I think that's a false narrative put forth by people on the left. I just think it'd be a waste of time and resources. They do these kind of things in enclaves in Europe apparently, and what does that really prevent? Social integration here is a bit more successful.


Countries in the Schengen area don't have stops between their borders. So a refugee could enter into Germany and then go to Belgium without incident. At least, that's how I understand it.
Different beliefs and ways of Islamist radicals and Christian radicals doing things. Islamist radicals twist the Qu'ran into making it look like suicide attacks gain the favor of Allah, I don't recall the Bible saying that or the leaders saying suicidal attacks are good. Shooting is nearly just as bad as suicide bombing, if not as bad.

Many progressives fear alienating Muslims, I guess. Alienation is a good way for terrorist groups to recruit people, just as it's a good way for gangs to recruit. But I believe MENA leaders need to start taking action one way or another, unless they already are. The ISIS are destroying mosques and killing other Muslims, they haven't much to lose by opposing the ISIS. I'm sure the West will gladly help get rid of one of the most destructive groups. IMO that's what we need to do first, make the MENA leaders do something.

I don't think so. If Muslims are segregated, it'll just end up pissing them off even more and making it easier for them to recruit. Treating people like shit will generally get them to turn into horrible people or hate you, and that's exactly what the ISIS wants. I don't think it's a false narrative at all, and I've read/heard stories about how many Muslims turned to terrorism out of anger and shit.

Ah, then they need to put in stops and all that.
 

kkck

Waifu Slayer
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
46,284
Reaction score
24,918
Gender
Hidden
Country
Fire Nation
What's the point of saying that they might? They don't at the moment. Islamism on the other hand does. Don't see the point in "what ifs" here. How radical are Christians even allowed to be in the west? Not to the point where they blow themselves up to kill innocents en masse. The main problem is that supposed "progressives" make excuses and try to act like jihad has nothing to do with Islam, when it clearly does and is openly preached among some members of the faith. Nothing like that is going on here with Christians or Jews or anyone else. Speaking the truth doesn't mean all critics are trying to foster hate and fear regarding Muslims, but many progressives make so many excuses regarding this and are so afraid of saying the wrong thing that they're doing a massive disservice to the actual problem and any solution it could have.


I don't know about it making things worse. I think that's a false narrative put forth by people on the left. I just think it'd be a waste of time and resources. They do these kind of things in enclaves in Europe apparently, and what does that really prevent? Social integration here is a bit more successful.


Countries in the Schengen area don't have stops between their borders. So a refugee could enter into Germany and then go to Belgium without incident. At least, that's how I understand it.
Well, going online does suggest that over the years there have been acts labelled as terrorist by the FBI and other such groups that were carried out by Christians, white supremacists and whatever other variety of extremist. In the end as far as statistics show I doubt the paris and belgium attacks would even put a dent in them. Now, that is not to say ISIS and their fanatics aren't a threat, thing is they aren't the only threat around. Of course, in the context of europe right now they have to deal with other issues, such as the circumstances which have allowed for two attacks to be carried out so close to one another. Alienating Muslims and rounding them up would most likely result in more violence in the end.

I am not sure of what your point here is though, or how jihad was brought up. It's a political correctness issue now? As far as the majority of muslims are concerned Jihad is a concept which has been hijacked by extremist. Regular peaceful muslims are ultimately every bit as much a victim as everyone else. The whole point of the attacks is to inflict terror and cause further alienation to muslims elsewhere. So... what exactly is accomplished by bringing up Jihad?

As far as the schengen, that is more or less it. Heck, when I was other there I crossed holland, germany and belgium without so much as a stop sign (it was awesome).
 

xi0

あの術
最終形態 / Saishuu Keitai / Final Form
Administrator
Joined
Feb 3, 2006
Messages
65,178
Reaction score
30,220
Gender
Male
Country
Pyke
Different beliefs and ways of Islamist radicals and Christian radicals doing things. Islamist radicals twist the Qu'ran into making it look like suicide attacks gain the favor of Allah, I don't recall the Bible saying that or the leaders saying suicidal attacks are good. Shooting is nearly just as bad as suicide bombing, if not as bad.
Who are these christian radicals you're talking about really? Even if a case of domestic terrorism isn't influenced by Islam, how influenced is it by christianity and the bible? They usually aren't. The motivations are typically political before anything else. I don't see how Islamists twist the Qu'ran in any way. They're literalists. It's more that the majority of the Muslim population ignores the passages that condone violence and extremists don't. The same could be said about Christians and Jews and the Bible, but they don't have a portion of their community interpreting scripture literally and using it as an excuse to commit mass-murder as a means to an end.

Many progressives fear alienating Muslims, I guess. Alienation is a good way for terrorist groups to recruit people, just as it's a good way for gangs to recruit. But I believe MENA leaders need to start taking action one way or another, unless they already are. The ISIS are destroying mosques and killing other Muslims, they haven't much to lose by opposing the ISIS. I'm sure the West will gladly help get rid of one of the most destructive groups. IMO that's what we need to do first, make the MENA leaders do something.
I understand the fear of alienation, but that shouldn't overrule common sense. How would we go about doing that then? I don't see it having an easy, practical solution. But I do know that acting like terrorism and Islam have no link between one another is disingenuous and counter-productive. And this is something many progressives are all too eager to do.

I don't think so. If Muslims are segregated, it'll just end up pissing them off even more and making it easier for them to recruit. Treating people like shit will generally get them to turn into horrible people or hate you, and that's exactly what the ISIS wants. I don't think it's a false narrative at all, and I've read/heard stories about how many Muslims turned to terrorism out of anger and shit.
My point was that I don't even understand how such a thing would be done. So it's a false narrative to say it'll make things worse when I don't think these politicians even understand what they're suggesting. Good police work can cover any of these things. It isn't like muslim communities are being ignored here.

Well, going online does suggest that over the years there have been acts labelled as terrorist by the FBI and other such groups that were carried out by Christians, white supremacists and whatever other variety of extremist. In the end as far as statistics show I doubt the paris and belgium attacks would even put a dent in them. Now, that is not to say ISIS and their fanatics aren't a threat, thing is they aren't the only threat around. Of course, in the context of europe right now they have to deal with other issues, such as the circumstances which have allowed for two attacks to be carried out so close to one another. Alienating Muslims and rounding them up would most likely result in more violence in the end.
I'm not a fan of Cruz or Trump, but they weren't suggesting "rounding" them up, last I checked.

I am not sure of what your point here is though, or how jihad was brought up. It's a political correctness issue now? As far as the majority of muslims are concerned Jihad is a concept which has been hijacked by extremist. Regular peaceful muslims are ultimately every bit as much a victim as everyone else. The whole point of the attacks is to inflict terror and cause further alienation to muslims elsewhere. So... what exactly is accomplished by bringing up Jihad?
Because Milly brought up right wingers, Christians, white people, and gun owners as something that people should go after more than islamic extremists. This isn't a matter of having to choose between one or the other as far as preventing these sorts of incidents goes. Discounting the threat of islamic extremism just because domestic terrorism exists as well is a bit nonsensical.
 

SharkBait

MH Senpai
伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2013
Messages
14,071
Reaction score
6,930
Gender
Male
Country
United States

Well not surprising Hillary lost in those states but won Arizona. She only lost by a handful of delegates yesterday since Arizona gives more than what the other two states gave Sanders.
 
Top