American Politics

[shionoro]

So, um, wtf is going on in california? I've read some articles on this but what I've read varies between protestors either being a murderous zombie horde or harmless hippies with flowers.

As per usual, most of the protest tends to always be peaceful. That was true even Ukraine or the arab spring, for example. However, when there are many angry people on street and police/military get involved, clashes inevitably happen.

In this case, protestors have a very legitimate reason to be angry and antagonistic towards law enforcement, because ICE keeps raiding the neighbourhoods, just ransacking people when it suits them. These legitimate protests have now been met with violent opposition by trump sending the troops and rightwing media vilifying them as left extremist or gang insurrectionists.

There definitely is some violence from the protestor's side, both against law enforcement and property, but this whole operation can only be understood as Trump seeking a confrontation because he wants to call this an insurrection. That is why he deliberately stokes the flames. Burning police cars are a consequence of that.

 

[kkck]

As per usual, most of the protest tends to always be peaceful. That was true even Ukraine or the arab spring, for example. However, when there are many angry people on street and police/military get involved, clashes inevitably happen.

In this case, protestors have a very legitimate reason to be angry and antagonistic towards law enforcement, because ICE keeps raiding the neighbourhoods, just ransacking people when it suits them. These legitimate protests have now been met with violent opposition by trump sending the troops and rightwing media vilifying them as left extremist or gang insurrectionists.

There definitely is some violence from the protestor's side, both against law enforcement and property, but this whole operation can only be understood as Trump seeking a confrontation because he wants to call this an insurrection. That is why he deliberately stokes the flames. Burning police cars are a consequence of that.

That's more or less what I got from the coverage. Though looking back at previous instances of unrest at the US I get the sense that it's difficult to get a sense of how violent or not a protest is. Take the Rittenhouse case. Setting aside that Rittenhouse acted legally, grabbing a gun and walking into places with unrest like that is deeply stupid. That's not a legal question, it's common sense. But still, he does something this dumb and... runs into two mentally ill people that confront/attack him? That's also not normal. This makes me think that just in general the news around this type of issues are not particularly reliable. And as usual trump is simply at best deeply unhelpful.

 

[shionoro]

That's more or less what I got from the coverage. Though looking back at previous instances of unrest at the US I get the sense that it's difficult to get a sense of how violent or not a protest is. Take the Rittenhouse case. Setting aside that Rittenhouse acted legally, grabbing a gun and walking into places with unrest like that is deeply stupid. That's not a legal question, it's common sense. But still, he does something this dumb and... runs into two mentally ill people that confront/attack him? That's also not normal. This makes me think that just in general the news around this type of issues are not particularly reliable. And as usual trump is simply at best deeply unhelpful.

Trump is the driving force behind the protests. He is stoking them on purpose since months now. This is all outlined in project 2025. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025#Expansion_of_presidential_powers

In 2023, Stephen Miller proposed immediately mobilizing the military at the start of second Trump administration for domestic law and immigration enforcement under the Insurrection Act of 1807.[29] Jeffrey Clark, a senior fellow at CRA and Project 2025 contributor, has investigated using the Insurrection Act for other purposes, including suppressing protests like the George Floyd protests.[30] The Heritage Foundation denied Project 2025 planned to use the Insurrection Act, but Mandate has a single line that says it is possible to use the Insurrection Act to secure the southern border.[156][157] Russell Vought said the CRA was working to keep legal and defense communities from preventing use of the Insurrection Act.[158]

The reason they make ICE agents go far over the top is that they want to provoke these kinds of protests. The second some police cars burn after months of peaceful protests that were met with provocation after provocation, they send in the military to seek further escalation.

The goal is the expanse of presidential powers, to wrestle power out of the hands of the states by deploying the military (and also cutting state funding). As I said before, this is an important step in Trump's fascist powergrab. It is right out of Hitler's (and many other autocrat's) playbook to call an emergency to gain power.

These protests would not exist if Trump didnt deliberately use Gestapo methods in broad daylight to harass immigrants and there would not be burning police cars if they wouldnt be met with force. It is quite obvious that at some point, some people fight back.

 

[kkck]

Trump is the driving force behind the protests. He is stoking them on purpose since months now. This is all outlined in project 2025. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025#Expansion_of_presidential_powers



The reason they make ICE agents go far over the top is that they want to provoke these kinds of protests. The second some police cars burn after months of peaceful protests that were met with provocation after provocation, they send in the military to seek further escalation.

The goal is the expanse of presidential powers, to wrestle power out of the hands of the states by deploying the military (and also cutting state funding). As I said before, this is an important step in Trump's fascist powergrab. It is right out of Hitler's (and many other autocrat's) playbook to call an emergency to gain power.

These protests would not exist if Trump didnt deliberately use Gestapo methods in broad daylight to harass immigrants and there would not be burning police cars if they wouldnt be met with force. It is quite obvious that at some point, some people fight back.

Trump is doing simply what he said he would. I am not sure of how him carrying out policy that he has talked about publicly for years and years amounts to him stocking protesters on purposes. This plan would be too Darth Sidious-y while we are talking about Trump... Trump can't come up with a plan, let alone stick to one or carry it out to fruition. Trump's only move is to bulldoze through stuff. That said, I don't doubt that trump wants more power for himself. I just don't think he is a person with a plan. Best case scenario (or worse I suppose) his minions have plans which they carry out as trump shoots himself repeatedly in the foot.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 13, 2025, Original Post Date: Jun 13, 2025 ---

South Florida Latino Trump voters stand by him, but question his immigration policies

Latino voter gains helped President Donald Trump become the first Republican to win Miami-Dade County since 1988, but worries over immigration measures are creeping up.

www.nbcnews.com

This article touches on something I've been thinking the past week. Even now it's non latinos that feel more strongly about deportations than latinos. Democrats shouldn't be surprised if next elections they still don't have the support and gratitude they will probably feel the latin community will own them (this shouldn't be interpreted to mean I am saying trump is acting correctly or legally, that's a different issue).

 

[shionoro]

Trump is doing simply what he said he would. I am not sure of how him carrying out policy that he has talked about publicly for years and years amounts to him stocking protesters on purposes. This plan would be too Darth Sidious-y while we are talking about Trump... Trump can't come up with a plan, let alone stick to one or carry it out to fruition. Trump's only move is to bulldoze through stuff. That said, I don't doubt that trump wants more power for himself. I just don't think he is a person with a plan. Best case scenario (or worse I suppose) his minions have plans which they carry out as trump shoots himself repeatedly in the foot.

But Trump is not on his own. This is Miller's plan and trump seems to give him free reign here. And Trump very much wants to be a Dictator, it is clear that he wants to unify all power onto the president. And creating the pretense for the insurrection act helps him with that. That is not some 4D chess move, trump understands that.

This article touches on something I've been thinking the past week. Even now it's non latinos that feel more strongly about deportations than latinos. Democrats shouldn't be surprised if next elections they still don't have the support and gratitude they will probably feel the latin community will own them (this shouldn't be interpreted to mean I am saying trump is acting correctly or legally, that's a different issue).

That is quite possible. Democrats cannot run on just not being Trump, that is for sure. If they are allowed to run in a fair election by 2026, that is.

 

[kkck]

But Trump is not on his own. This is Miller's plan and trump seems to give him free reign here. And Trump very much wants to be a Dictator, it is clear that he wants to unify all power onto the president. And creating the pretense for the insurrection act helps him with that. That is not some 4D chess move, trump understands that.



That is quite possible. Democrats cannot run on just not being Trump, that is for sure. If they are allowed to run in a fair election by 2026, that is.

Sure, Trump's minions have plans and schemes. I just don't buy at this point in time when trump's older and more unhinged than ever before he has the capacity to stick to any of it. If he becomes a dictator it won't be because trump stuck to some meticulously crafted masterplan from some minion but rather because maga voices became loud enough to hand him the country on a silver platter like is the case with most dictators. Trump's not an actual sith lord.

 

[shionoro]

Sure, Trump's minions have plans and schemes. I just don't buy at this point in time when trump's older and more unhinged than ever before he has the capacity to stick to any of it. If he becomes a dictator it won't be because trump stuck to some meticulously crafted masterplan from some minion but rather because maga voices became loud enough to hand him the country on a silver platter like is the case with most dictators. Trump's not an actual sith lord.

I think that is not giving him enough agency. Lots of Dictators were inept and rather driven by greed than by discipline. That doesnt mean they didnt understand what they are doing. Trump is unhinged but he still understands power. When Elon started fighting him, he understood very well who to side with and how to dispatch of that threat. Of course he has help and advisors who play their own game, but Trump is definitely on board with project 2025 as long as it gives him unlimited power. And he understands what the plan about the protests is right now. I am sure of that.

 

[Newkerzy]

I think that is not giving him enough agency. Lots of Dictators were inept and rather driven by greed than by discipline. That doesnt mean they didnt understand what they are doing. Trump is unhinged but he still understands power. When Elon started fighting him, he understood very well who to side with and how to dispatch of that threat. Of course he has help and advisors who play their own game, but Trump is definitely on board with project 2025 as long as it gives him unlimited power. And he understands what the plan about the protests is right now. I am sure of that.

My take on the Mango Mussolini is that he‘s not as smart as he thinks he is…..but he’s also not as dumb as people all over the world think he is.

 

[kkck]

I think that is not giving him enough agency. Lots of Dictators were inept and rather driven by greed than by discipline. That doesnt mean they didnt understand what they are doing. Trump is unhinged but he still understands power. When Elon started fighting him, he understood very well who to side with and how to dispatch of that threat. Of course he has help and advisors who play their own game, but Trump is definitely on board with project 2025 as long as it gives him unlimited power. And he understands what the plan about the protests is right now. I am sure of that.

It's not an issue of agency. Rather the issue is that trump is chaotic, impulsive and vindictive. That's why his minions go around making conflicting excuses everywhere they go. That's why most of the people who work for him eventually break relations and up calling him a lunatic or some variety of that.

I suppose trump would be on board with anything that throws him praises and gives him power but I don't believe he has read what's in project 2025 or otherwise given any input into it.

 

[shionoro]

Everbody can see who is peaceful and who is not on videos like this

 

[M3J]

Its great if Elon Musk hurts Trump, tho there cannot ever be any concession to him just to build some kind of united front. There is no successfull protection against Trump that hinges on Elon, it has to come from people who do it for the right reasons.

He's not going to hurt Trump, Elon has no power to do that, nor would he ever do that. Trump still holds all the card, and Elon has also likely made it clear that he'd be going to jail if the president became his enemy (he said something like that about Harris?). Moments after the Epstein tweet he probably spent time trying to contact Trump, crying and apologizing.

So, um, wtf is going on in california? I've read some articles on this but what I've read varies between protestors either being a murderous zombie horde or harmless hippies with flowers.

ICE raiding neighborhoods and separating parents from kids and other evil stuff. Things you'd condone.

Most protests, if not all, since BLM marches have been peaceful, but it's been the cops and the right that turned it violent, or people from out of town that started looting or escalating. There's even a video of a cop aiming at and shooting an Australian reporter who threateningly... did her job of reporting.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 16, 2025, Original Post Date: Jun 16, 2025 ---

Also, remember when ninjabot saw few Palestinian supporters like Aaron Bushnell self-immolate and somehow made the conclusion that it meant the left would only escalate violence from there?

It's actually the right that resort to violence. A Trump supporter shot two Democrat politicians in Minnesota and their spouses. Melissa Hortman and her husband was killed in the shooting while John Hoffman and his wife seemed to have survived.

 

[shionoro]

It is pretty much always the right who escalate actual violence against people.

Leftists sometimes harm property, but for all the rhetoric you sometimes see, people on the left tend to be on the left because they care for other humans, i.e. have basic empathy. They might write a paper about why it is okay to attack a cop, but they do not actually form groups that prioritize violence against people. The scattered fringe groups who are pro violence against people that I know off narrow that violence to only neo-nazis who have used violence themselves already.

To sum it up: When Trump was shot, people accused the left of being pro violence because they didnt feel bad about it. When a MAGA christian pro lifer actually kills a democrat lawmaker (and this was just the first successful attack, there have been others), people talk about whether the attacker even was a republican and the right's reaction ranges from not caring to being happy about it.

 

[kkck]

So who else is ready for Iraq times 4000?

 

[xi0]

God, it's so good

 

[xi0]

Every single anti-interventionist conservative or any liberal politician that ever said a peep about Bush Jr and Iraq/Aghanistan and is not calling for his impeachment doesn't see the Constitution as anything other than a piece of toilet paper.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 22, 2025, Original Post Date: Jun 22, 2025 ---

Biden's former MENA czar on CNN basically making excuses for this shit, we're so fucked

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 22, 2025 ---

Yet another curtain pulled back on the giant, swollen, hemorrhoid that is the uniparty shithole called America

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 22, 2025 ---

And just a clear reminder for anyone who can't keep themselves from saying "I told you so" regarding the Dem's abject failure in the last presidential election -

 

[kkck]

I don't doubt Obama, kamala or biden would have invaded iran if they came close enough to developing a nuclear bomb though in fairness to them Obama did try to set up the Iran deal which trump promptly tanked.

 

[xi0]

US Foreign Policy is uniparty, don't let anyone lie to you and say otherwise

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 25, 2025, Original Post Date: Jun 25, 2025 ---

I don't doubt Obama, kamala or biden would have invaded iran if they came close enough to developing a nuclear bomb though in fairness to them Obama did try to set up the Iran deal which trump promptly tanked.

The development of nuclear weapons is in direct response to the US's track record of foreign policy decisions in the middle east. Anyone who is not an ally of the US would act the same way.

Despite Obama extrajudicially killing US citizens via drone strike for 8 years, the deal he made with Iran demonstrated an unwillingness to attack them. Kamala's statements suggest she was far more hawkish on Iran than Obama was.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 25, 2025 ---

Ah, my district's representative is listed here. Good to know, will not be casting a vote for him ever again.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 25, 2025 ---

I'm sorry, I just don't see how you can wring your hands as the Democrats have done, called this president a threat to Democracy, and then instead of choosing abstention, instead vote AGAINST articles of impeachment when our current leadership marches us further and further towards hot war with a nation of 90 million people.

Whether it'd be successful or not is absolutely inconsequential.

 

[kkck]

The development of nuclear weapons is in direct response to the US's track record of foreign policy decisions in the middle east. Anyone who is not an ally of the US would act the same way.

Despite Obama extrajudicially killing US citizens via drone strike for 8 years, the deal he made with Iran demonstrated an unwillingness to attack them. Kamala's statements suggest she was far more hawkish on Iran than Obama was.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 25, 2025 ---

Ah, my district's representative is listed here. Good to know, will not be casting a vote for him ever again.

To me it's a pretty big sell that Obama-Biden-Clinton-Harris are THAT different in this regard. They are all cut of the same cloth... That said, I don't doubt the rationality of Iran wanting to get in on the mutually assured destruction thing. Looking back a bit I'd take the more cynical view that things with Iran got hot enough that war in the foreseeable future was on the table and both US and EU got fairly desperate to avoid it hence the apparently excellent conditions on the Iran deal.

Wasn't the drone strike thing over US citizens at literal war zones and isis related stuff? You make it sound like obama was striking parks in Oklahoma or something.

 

[James Rye]

Curious to see how the "big beautiful bill" will change USA. Like it was controversy even within the Rep party and got through rather close in both Senate and House, meaning most of the people voting for it did so with stomachache.

 

[Charlie]

Curious to see how the "big beautiful bill" will change USA. Like it was controversy even within the Rep party and got through rather close in both Senate and House, meaning most of the people voting for it did so with stomachache.

Well as an American, alls I can tell you is that it will be big and beautiful. Hold the mustard on the stomachache until we see how the markets react.