Fantasy Laxus Dreyar vs Spriggan

[LaGOAT]

Mest did that to Brandish because PLOT but there's no indication that Mest has higher MP than Brandish. Did Mest show a feat capable of BREAKING Brandish's magic? I said, BREAK SOMEONE'S MAGIC, NOT USE THEIR MAGIC AGAINST SOMEONE. BTW how did Dimaria become stronger than Irene?? I cannot get your argument at all. Moreover, age seal is NOT OVERRATED, that's just how it works, it is just purely hax, it is capable of stopping even a spriggan tier like Brandish, Laxus had a hard time fighting Wahl and there's no indication or a statement that suggests that Wahl is superior to Dimaria so?? I admit, Laxus can beat Dimaria WITHOUT AGE SEAL but it's absurd if you think Laxus can break Dimaria's age seal. Furthermore, I don't really get your "erza>=gray=END>dimaria" thing, so by your logic if a mage WITH GREAT DURABILITY stopped a demon's and devil slayer's punches without fighting them, then that already makes her stronger than them?? I don't know why you're asking these questions when you already know that the answer is NO.

Where did I bring up the mest mp>brandish MP? Mest>brandish because of hax same with dimaria >human Irene I'm going by ur logic. My point in was having a had hax ability can be broken by sheer MP. Erza stop an attack that both END and dark des gray were giving their all. Yes I would say she is about above them at the very least on their level.

 

[Demon Hunter]

Not really. This all made up

We thought more mp means more durability but that has never been shown

And nor does ds have higher durability than normal mages.

Spoiler

debunked.

next one.

 

[Ilikeyou]

I don't know if I wanted my opinion but I just say it again. I think he loses to the top 3 and dimiria andaybe brandish because she is hax but at the same time pretty weak.

 

[Jko]

Ok, now you're just grasping at straws. Even if Mest's plan was really what you say it is there was literally no reason for Mest to make August Brandish's grandpa. Why on earth would he do that? What would the point even be? If he was going to alter Brandish's perception of who August was why not make August an antagonist rather than a family member? It doesn't make any sense in the slightest.

It may not have taken August down but stab to the chest is still a stab to the chest. He's not just going to walk that shit off, he even needed Brandish to heal him afterwards.

Show me one instance outside that scene where she calls him Grandpa (even August is baffled when she said it). Just one other instance and I'll concede.

Lol he did walk it off. He was smiling and pulled a nuke right after the stab. Also August has Brandish's MM via his Copy magic if he thought it was a problem he'd do it himself.

 

[Boomburst]

Show me one instance outside that scene where she calls him Grandpa (even August is baffled when she said it). Just one other instance and I'll concede.

Lol he did walk it off. He was smiling and pulled a nuke right after the stab. Also August has Brandish's MM via his Copy magic if he thought it was a problem he'd do it himself.

You're dodging around the question. Again, why on earth would Mest deliberately make August a grandfather figure to Brandish? Just give me one legitimate reason and I'll concede. You still haven't explained to me Brandish's clear and abrupt expression changes either.

Pulling a nuke right after the stab does not mean he was perfectly fine. Laxus was wrecking house against Ajeel and Wahl, but that doesn't change the fact that he was suffering from having his innards all fucked up.

You might as well ask why August decided to blow himself up rather than use MM against Gildarts then. Or any other of the Spriggan's magics.

 

[Jko]

You're dodging around the question. Again, why on earth would Mest deliberately make August a grandfather figure to Brandish? Just give me one legitimate reason and I'll concede. You still haven't explained to me Brandish's clear and abrupt expression changes either.

Pulling a nuke right after the stab does not mean he was perfectly fine. Laxus was wrecking house against Ajeel and Wahl, but that doesn't change the fact that he was suffering from having his innards all fucked up.

You might as well ask why August decided to blow himself up rather than use MM against Gildarts then. Or any other of the Spriggan's magics.

So no. Okay I'm done with this discussion. You haven't given evidence that supported she ever called or saw him as a Grandfather before or after that entire scene. There's nothing to dodge since your argument is void of any evidence that supports your theory. August himself is bewildered at the idea of her being his granddaughter.

Mest implants memories he doesn't actually control people. He implanted a false memory of her needing to kill her grandfather. He did this on Tenrou when he implanted false memories of him being an FT member. Mest can't control memories he can only alter memories to influence or manipulate her into doing it. He can't just say kill August and she'll do it. He needs to create a narrative or her prior memories will override the flimsy implanted memory of just "kill August". Mest basically creates "False Memories" which is an actual concept in real life. You can look it up. The reason why he specifically chose grandfather role is unknown but the fact August said "I've no recollection of you being my granddaughter." rather than "Stop calling me Grandfather" just shows Brandish never had that sentiment beforehand. Brandish wouldn't be scared of August if she actually thought of him as her Grandfather. It's also generally easier to kill people who're closer to you.

Laxus had a disease not a hole through him lol. Even Erza can walk off a couple sword stabs.

 

[Boomburst]

So no. Okay I'm done with this discussion. You haven't given evidence that supported she ever called or saw him as a Grandfather before or after that entire scene. There's nothing to dodge since your argument is void of any evidence that supports your theory. August himself is bewildered at the idea of her being his granddaughter.

I may not have any hard evidence but neither do you. And since your theory doesn't make any sense as shown by your complete inability to explain Mest's reasoning, guess that makes mine the one which holds more water. I notice you've conveniently forgotten to address Brandish's abrupt expression changes yet again despite me bringing it up multiple times and even explicitly asking you to explain it in the post you literally just replied to.

Mest implants memories he doesn't actually control people. He implanted a false memory of her needing to kill her grandfather. He did this on Tenrou when he implanted false memories of him being an FT member. Mest can't control memories he can only alter memories to influence or manipulate her into doing it. He can't just say kill August and she'll do it. He needs to create a narrative or her prior memories will override the flimsy implanted memory of just "kill August". Mest basically creates "False Memories" which is an actual concept in real life. You can look it up.

Besides the fact that you think I am somehow ignorant of all this, none of this holds even a shred of relevance to the topic we are debating.

The reason why he specifically chose grandfather role is unknown but the fact August said "I've no recollection of you being my granddaughter." rather than "Stop calling me Grandfather" just shows Brandish never had that sentiment beforehand. Brandish wouldn't be scared of August if she actually thought of him as her Grandfather.

This is nothing but pure conjecture. Given August's character it's entirely realistic that this is the relationship that they have, with Brandish fawning over him and August acting relatively indifferent.

See this right here?

"The reason why he specifically chose Grandfather role is unknown"

Yea, you can stop right there buddy. You're suggesting a plan of action from Mest that you yourself can't even find a logical explanation for, yet my theory is the unfounded one? No. Just no.

It's also generally easier to kill people who're closer to you.

What?

Laxus had a disease not a hole through him lol.

What the hell is that supposed to mean?

Even Erza can walk off a couple sword stabs.

So you want us to completely ignore all of Erza's feats against Irene however ridiculous they may be, and now you try and use those very same feats to downplay the seriousness of injuries? Double standard much?

 

[Jko]

I may not have any hard evidence but neither do you. And since your theory doesn't make any sense as shown by your complete inability to explain Mest's reasoning, guess that makes mine the one which holds more water. I notice you've conveniently forgotten to address Brandish's abrupt expression changes yet again despite me bringing it up multiple times and even explicitly asking you to explain it in the post you literally just replied to.



Besides the fact that you think I am somehow ignorant of all this, none of this holds even a shred of relevance to the topic we are debating.



This is nothing but pure conjecture. Given August's character it's entirely realistic that this is the relationship that they have, with Brandish fawning over him and August acting relatively indifferent.

See this right here?

"The reason why he specifically chose Grandfather role is unknown"

Yea, you can stop right there buddy. You're suggesting a plan of action from Mest that you yourself can't even find a logical explanation for, yet my theory is the unfounded one? No. Just no.



What?



What the hell is that supposed to mean?



So you want us to completely ignore all of Erza's feats against Irene however ridiculous they may be, and now you try and use those very same feats to downplay the seriousness of injuries? Double standard much?

Again killing her Grandpa made her like that. She was knocked out quickly after that so we didn't see what would have happened.

Except for the fact August nor anyone else has seen Brandish talk to August like that outside of that encounter.

My theory is based on Mest's actual power yours is based on Mest mind controlling Brandish. Just look up False Memory. Also that is the only specific thing that was unknown. We already knew Mest thought the negotiation would fail so he was going to set up his own plan to take top S12 out by surprise.

It's easier to kill people emotionally close to you. It's a statistical fact that most murders are done by people you're emotionally connected to.

A disease that attacks you on a cellular level is a lot harder to comeback than injury which for superhumans would take less than a day to recover from.

Erza has been stabbed before, and that injury is something Erza has shown she can tank lol. The Meteor feat is the only thing that is ridiculous, and Irene's incompetence as well.

 

[Boomburst]

Again killing her Grandpa made her like that.

Well clearly it isn't easier to kill someone who's close to you if doing so makes you this distraught, right?

Except for the fact August nor anyone else has seen Brandish talk to August like that outside of that encounter.

Where's your evidence for this? And even if this was the first time she's ever addressed August like this, that doesn't automatically make it contradictory to the nature of the relationship that they have.

My theory is based on Mest's actual power yours is based on Mest mind controlling Brandish. Just look up False Memory.

I don't see how my theory is contradictory to what Mest's power entails, but whatever floats your boat I guess.

Also that is the only specific thing that was unknown. We already knew Mest thought the negotiation would fail so he was going to set up his own plan to take top S12 out by surprise.

Except that "only specific thing" is literally the crux of your argument. If your contention is that Mest made August a grandfather figure to Brandish intentionally then the question becomes WHY. If you can't even answer that question then your argument holds no weight at all.

It's easier to kill people emotionally close to you. It's a statistical fact that most murders are done by people you're emotionally connected to.

How does "most murders are done by people you're emotionally connected to" equal "it's easier to kill people emotionally close to you"? That's like saying black people are genetically more likely to commit murder than other ethnicities because the majority of murders are committed by blacks. Not to mention that statement just doesn't make any sense at all. Would you rather kill your mother or some random stranger walking down the street?

A disease that attacks you on a cellular level is a lot harder to comeback than injury which for superhumans would take less than a day to recover from.

Well clearly if a stab to the heart is something August can just laugh off then Brandish should have slit his throat or something. If Brandish's objective was to kill August why did she go for an attack that according to you wouldn't even faze August?

Erza has been stabbed before, and that injury is something Erza has shown she can tank lol. The Meteor feat is the only thing that is ridiculous, and Irene's incompetence as well.

The Meteor feat is only ridiculous due to the severity of the injuries she sustained. If you have no problem with Erza shrugging off stabs then what's so absurd about her splitting a meteor with broken bones?

 

[Jko]

Well clearly it isn't easier to kill someone who's close to you if doing so makes you this distraught, right?



Where's your evidence for this? And even if this was the first time she's ever addressed August like this, that doesn't automatically make it contradictory to the nature of the relationship that they have.



I don't see how my theory is contradictory to what Mest's power entails, but whatever floats your boat I guess.



Except that "only specific thing" is literally the crux of your argument. If your contention is that Mest made August a grandfather figure to Brandish intentionally then the question becomes WHY. If you can't even answer that question then your argument holds no weight at all.



How does "most murders are done by people you're emotionally connected to" equal "it's easier to kill people emotionally close to you"? That's like saying black people are genetically more likely to commit murder than other ethnicities because the majority of murders are committed by blacks. Not to mention that statement just doesn't make any sense at all. Would you rather kill your mother or some random stranger walking down the street?



Well clearly if a stab to the heart is something August can just laugh off then Brandish should have slit his throat or something. If Brandish's objective was to kill August why did she go for an attack that according to you wouldn't even faze August?



The Meteor feat is only ridiculous due to the severity of the injuries she sustained. If you have no problem with Erza shrugging off stabs then what's so absurd about her splitting a meteor with broken bones?

Man we'll being going forever and just bcs it's easier to kill a family member doesn't mean uou can't have remorse after the deed. (It easier to lash out and kill someone out of rage.) Blacks commit crime more bcs of the conditions they're brought up in it has nothing to do with genetics. Your analogy is very flawed. It's an actually study that most murders are committed by people who have an emotional connection to the victim. Until I see Brandish ever acting like that then I'm not going to accept your theory. Mest's magic affected Brandish despite the severe difference in MP this debate really doesn't matter either way.

 

[Boomburst]

Blacks commit crime more bcs of the conditions they're brought up in it has nothing to do with genetics. Your analogy is very flawed.

On the contrary, you've actually illustrated my point exactly. The reason behind the statistic that black people commit more crime is not because they're black, it's because many are brought up in ghettos and the like. Despite the statistic being about black people, the reason is due to other factors. You've provided a statistic for murders committed by people who have an emotional connection to the victim, but you have yet to prove that that statistic is due to it being easier for people to murder others they have an emotional connection with.

It's an actually study that most murders are committed by people who have an emotional connection to the victim.

My problem with all of this is that you've provided a single number and somehow managed to produce an explanation FOR that single number FROM that single number. Basically what you're saying is that it's easier for them to commit murder because of the statistic. And the reason for that statistic is that it's easier for them to commit murder. It's nothing but circular reasoning.

Until I see Brandish ever acting like that then I'm not going to accept your theory.

And until I get a logical explanation as to why Mest would make August Brandish's grandfather, I'm not going to accept yours.

Mest's magic affected Brandish despite the severe difference in MP this debate really doesn't matter either way.

The reason this debate matters is because if I am right, then Mest's hax does indeed have limits when it comes to the MP of his opponent. Whereas if you are right Mest can solo the entire Spriggan 12.

Guess we can just agree to disagree since it's clear neither of us are going to budge.

 

[Seven777]

Brandish calling August Grandpa was obviously the manga showcasing how close the two were, making it far more dramatic and terrible when Mest made Brandish stab her.
You could literally see her eyes change when Mest took over her mind

Spoiler

Mest was controlling her from the "Pa" onward, before that she was a fine..

 

[TeamWendy]

Where did I bring up the mest mp>brandish MP? Mest>brandish because of hax same with dimaria >human Irene I'm going by ur logic. My point in was having a had hax ability can be broken by sheer MP. Erza stop an attack that both END and dark des gray were giving their all. Yes I would say she is about above them at the very least on their level.

If you read my statement clearly, I said from the start of our argument that HAX CAN BE BROKEN BY HIGHER OR TREMENDOUS MP (or at least, that's what I'm implying) so I don't know what you're talking about, can you tell me which part of my statement suggests that Mest>Brandish and Dimaria>Irene just because of their hax?? 'Cause I clearly see NONE. BTW your Erza stuff being ABOUT ABOVE THEM cringes me, can't you do anything more to wank Laxus?? BTW Erza has shown to be one of the top tiers in terms of durability to blunt forces in fairy tail (FACT), that's why it's understandable that she can tank Natsu's and Gray's attack even on their other forms, BUT there's no indication that she can survive their attacks if they continued, so going on by your logic, Jellal is also stronger than Acnologia or AT LEAST ON HIS LEVEL just because he blocked one of his attacks?? Did you see the point?? Erza cannot be proven to be stronger than them, unless she fights them, so your assumption with Laxus is invalid.

 

[sharkai]

Spoiler

debunked.

next one.

Not really

No magic in his body means laxus is dieing.
This is basically saying laxus took that hit when he was already dieing.

More mp meant more durability before this arc.though it was never confirmed

But now other than top two springgans. Everyone have extremely less durabilty than our main battle characters.

 

[LaGOAT]

If you read my statement clearly, I said from the start of our argument that HAX CAN BE BROKEN BY HIGHER OR TREMENDOUS MP (or at least, that's what I'm implying) so I don't know what you're talking about, can you tell me which part of my statement suggests that Mest>Brandish and Dimaria>Irene just because of their hax?? 'Cause I clearly see NONE. BTW your Erza stuff being ABOUT ABOVE THEM cringes me, can't you do anything more to wank Laxus?? BTW Erza has shown to be one of the top tiers in terms of durability to blunt forces in fairy tail (FACT), that's why it's understandable that she can tank Natsu's and Gray's attack even on their other forms, BUT there's no indication that she can survive their attacks if they continued, so going on by your logic, Jellal is also stronger than Acnologia or AT LEAST ON HIS LEVEL just because he blocked one of his attacks?? Did you see the point?? Erza cannot be proven to be stronger than them, unless she fights them, so your assumption with Laxus is invalid.

Good u understand that higher MP>hax. Anyways she survived a dragon claw from Irene so yes she can survive gray and END attacks ur over hyping END. Laxus causal nuke could solo a sprriggan neither erza gray or natsu could do that. No that not the same logic because acno was playing with Jellal while gray and END were giving their all.

 

[~Charging Lightning~]

Forgot that you responded to my post.

Erza had a double boost before her Dragon form, and Irene took a stab by her sword to the head defenseless, and it didn't even penetrate her skull. Irene whooped Erza's butt while she was boosted from Wendy in her human form also.

So? How is this relevant? I'm talking about Erza's state when she was hit by Dragon Irene's claw attack, not while she fought human Irene.

Her whole battle was an inconsistency bcs she didn't want to kill Erza from the start. Also she literally said she wanted to immobilize Erza. She was pretty calm when she did the meteor.

Um... what?

Spoiler

She literally says the words "kill her" when ordering Neinheart to go find her and tells Erza to die and vanish for all eternity right before transforming and hitting her with her claw attack. The only point where Irene didn't want Erza dead was the end of their fight when Erza smiling triggered Irene's memories of baby Erza smiling.

Being a contender for the number one position of the S12 is very impressive since five them could actually solo Ishgar if plot wasn't intervening in their battles. The S12s have been the biggest PIS battles in FT history for a reason.

It's not impressive enough for you to hype her up this much.

Durability still doesn't change. Being in her strongest defense armor or her being healthy she would've still got her bones crushed. Magical armor is useless to a Dragon since their scales would penetrate right through the magic like butter. Just bcs you're beat up doesn't actually change your durability point and if Wendy didn't save Erza from Wendy Bel's explosion Erza would be downed.

This isn't just about durability, it's also about defense. Erza's was in her weakest defense armor. When you have a stronger defense you have a better chance of defending against something. That's common sense bro. Also, durability doesn't change when you get weaker? Wtf are you on about??

Laxus was scared of Wall's fireball lol you think he can tank hits from a Dragon that could crush all of Erza's bones? The dude hasn't even gotten up and fought again after the Wall/Pretch fight which shows he has horrible endurance.

This has to be a joke... You're using Laxus when he had a life threatening illness to low ball him...

Also Jellal's fight was Acno walking the entire time and not even talking to Jellal. His face was bored while his face with Irene was filled with excitement. He even laughed how pathetic they were. Jellal was a bug to Acno. Even right now he could blitz Christina yet he plays around and chases after them. If you think he was as serious as the time he fought Serena let alone Irene you're definitely wrong. He let a ship push him back....

"Walking the entire time". Funny you mention this when he moved a hell of a lot more in the Jellal fight than he did in the Irene fight. What do you mean he was bored? Acno was laughing like a madman in both fights. Acno regarded Irene as a bug before learning that she uses enchantment magic which got him excited. The only reason he was excited was because of her type of magic, not her strength. Why are you mentioning Serena? If Acno was remotely as serious against Irene as he was against Serena then Irene would have been dead earlier.

 

[Jko]

Forgot that you responded to my post.

So? How is this relevant? I'm talking about Erza's state when she was hit by Dragon Irene's claw attack, not while she fought human Irene.

Um... what?

Spoiler

She literally says the words "kill her" when ordering Neinheart to go find her and tells Erza to die and vanish for all eternity right before transforming and hitting her with her claw attack. The only point where Irene didn't want Erza dead was the end of their fight when Erza smiling triggered Irene's memories of baby Erza smiling.

It's not impressive enough for you to hype her up this much.

This isn't just about durability, it's also about defense. Erza's was in her weakest defense armor. When you have a stronger defense you have a better chance of defending against something. That's common sense bro. Also, durability doesn't change when you get weaker? Wtf are you on about??

This has to be a joke... You're using Laxus when he had a life threatening illness to low ball him...

"Walking the entire time". Funny you mention this when he moved a hell of a lot more in the Jellal fight than he did in the Irene fight. What do you mean he was bored? Acno was laughing like a madman in both fights. Acno regarded Irene as a bug before learning that she uses enchantment magic which got him excited. The only reason he was excited was because of her type of magic, not her strength. Why are you mentioning Serena? If Acno was remotely as serious against Irene as he was against Serena then Irene would have been dead earlier.

Bcs Dragon Irene > Base Irene. And as I said she only wanted to immobilize Erza.

Spoiler

Still couldn't kill her. She obviously held back subconciously bcs she is her daughter, and you know plot.

Spoiler

If she wanted Erza dead a slap would've done it.

Erza in her "weakest" defense armor took a END punch, and a bloodlusted Gray's punch and shrugged it off. Erza in her weakest armor has shown greater durability than Laxus. Red pants being her weakest armor despite having the greatest durability feats out of all her armors is kind of funny.

He was shown to be clearly scared of Walls fireball, and his illness only affected the him in the second part of their fight where Wall went legit mentally retarted. Also his life threatening illness (lol) was cured after the Wall fight, and he was healed by Wendy. What's Laxus doing now? Oh yeah walking while everyone else is fighting. The guy needed an entire day of recovery while everyone else came back hours after their S12 fight. It really shows the lack of stamina Laxus has.

Just showing off to waste panels? The guy was literally pushed back by a ship and you're comparing that to the crater he made and the praise he gave Irene? Also he never once tried to blitz. He could have easily went through Jellal's attack and killed him with a slap or he could be just blitz all three from the get go. FT plot force kicked and let them survive that's it.

He was excited (He didn't laugh at her attack) in his fight against Irene, and praised her. She ended the fight with the upperhand and terraformed a continent. Jellal had to get on a ship to run away, and that same ship got blown up by Wall's basic level attacks. You actually think Acno was trying as much he did against Serena or Irene? Bcs if you think a ship can stop a trying Acno then wow lol.

I'll wait for one feat to say Laxus is anywhere near the caliber of top 2. Bcs all feats I've seen from him as only been that of a mid tier S12. He has shown nothing to say he can take down a Dragon, and would be killed by many S12 lower than Irene's caliber. The only downplay here is people thinking he can take out a woman who's a lot faster, stronger, way more versatile (has hax that would oneshot and nukes), a lot more endurance, a lot more durability, and a way more MP. She has him beat in all categories to the point that this fight is a stomp fest. She could attack him anywhere on Earthland and he wouldn't even know where she was. Her feats are a lot better and it's mind boggling that people say Laxus can win from beating an S12 who had to go mentally retarded in order for him to win.

Laxus is a top tier in the Ishgar forces but that is nothing special compared to the high tiers of the S12 let alone top tiers.

It's your opinion (so believe in who you want to believe could win idc) but fact is we know that Hiro made two overpowered af enemies to the point where they both had to suicide out of a fight because their was no logical outcome where FT could win.

 

[~Charging Lightning~]

Bcs Dragon Irene > Base Irene. And as I said she only wanted to immobilize Erza.

Spoiler

Still couldn't kill her. She obviously held back subconciously bcs she is her daughter, and you know plot.

Spoiler

If she wanted Erza dead a slap would've done it.

Again, not the point. Stop changing the subject. Erza wasn't enchanted by Wendy when she was hit by Dragon Irene like you implied she was and that's my point. Don't change the subject completely just to avoid saying you were wrong.

"Only wanted to immobilize Erza". Yeah, how silly of me to think that Irene wanted to kill Erza when she was screaming "DIE DIE DIE!!! VANISH FOR ALL ETERNITY!!" She clearly only wanted to immobilize her, right? kappa

Erza in her "weakest" defense armor took a END punch, and a bloodlusted Gray's punch and shrugged it off. Erza in her weakest armor has shown greater durability than Laxus. Red pants being her weakest armor despite having the greatest durability feats out of all her armors is kind of funny.

Erza hasn't even gotten to use her adamantine armor this arc yet you're gonna conclude that red pants is a better defense armor because it has better defense feats? That's like saying Natsu's base form is stronger than his DF form because in this arc his base form has performed feats that are better than the feats displayed by pre skip DF Natsu. Look dude, Erza said it, not me. Red pants has no defense aspects and it was stated by Erza herself that she abandons defense and relies on offense when using it. If you wanna argue with Erza's own words about her own armor then be my guest. Why didn't Erza use hot pants against Jupiter in the Phantom arc if it's her best defense armor? Why use Adamantine instead?

He was shown to be clearly scared of Walls fireball, and his illness only affected the him in the second part of their fight where Wall went legit mentally retarted. Also his life threatening illness (lol) was cured after the Wall fight, and he was healed by Wendy. What's Laxus doing now? Oh yeah walking while everyone else is fighting. The guy needed an entire day of recovery while everyone else came back hours after their S12 fight. It really shows the lack of stamina Laxus has.

Stop trying to trigger me by bringing Laxus into this and downplaying him. I quoted your post to talk about Irene's power, not Laxus's stamina.

Just showing off to waste panels? The guy was literally pushed back by a ship and you're comparing that to the crater he made and the praise he gave Irene? Also he never once tried to blitz. He could have easily went through Jellal's attack and killed him with a slap or he could be just blitz all three from the get go. FT plot force kicked and let them survive that's it.

He was excited (He didn't laugh at her attack) in his fight against Irene, and praised her. She ended the fight with the upperhand and terraformed a continent. Jellal had to get on a ship to run away, and that same ship got blown up by Wall's basic level attacks. You actually think Acno was trying as much he did against Serena or Irene? Bcs if you think a ship can stop a trying Acno then wow lol.

My point isn't that a half dead Jellal is stronger than Irene (that would be ridiculous). However in both fights virtually the same thing happened. Acnologia was playing around and he got pushed back. If he was remotley serious in either of those fights then he would have murdered them instantly. You can't go nuts and overhype Irene just because she got Acno excited and pushed him back a bit yet when Acno gets pushed back by Jellal's nine thunder stars you simply brush it off as not impressive since Acno wasn't trying.The double standard is real here and even as a Laxus fan myself I can tell that Jellal isn't getting the respect he deserves from you.

I'll wait for one feat to say Laxus is anywhere near the caliber of top 2. Bcs all feats I've seen from him as only been that of a mid tier S12. He has shown nothing to say he can take down a Dragon, and would be killed by many S12 lower than Irene's caliber. The only downplay here is people thinking he can take out a woman who's a lot faster, stronger, way more versatile (has hax that would oneshot and nukes), a lot more endurance, a lot more durability, and a way more MP. She has him beat in all categories to the point that this fight is a stomp fest. She could attack him anywhere on Earthland and he wouldn't even know where she was. Her feats are a lot better and it's mind boggling that people say Laxus can win from beating an S12 who had to go mentally retarded in order for him to win.

Laxus is a top tier in the Ishgar forces but that is nothing special compared to the high tiers of the S12 let alone top tiers.

It's your opinion (so believe in who you want to believe could win idc) but fact is we know that Hiro made two overpowered af enemies to the point where they both had to suicide out of a fight because their was no logical outcome where FT could win.

*SIgh*, why do I even bother?

 

[Jko]

Again, not the point. Stop changing the subject. Erza wasn't enchanted by Wendy when she was hit by Dragon Irene like you implied she was and that's my point. Don't change the subject completely just to avoid saying you were wrong.

"Only wanted to immobilize Erza". Yeah, how silly of me to think that Irene wanted to kill Erza when she was screaming "DIE DIE DIE!!! VANISH FOR ALL ETERNITY!!" She clearly only wanted to immobilize her, right? kappa



Erza hasn't even gotten to use her adamantine armor this arc yet you're gonna conclude that red pants is a better defense armor because it has better defense feats? That's like saying Natsu's base form is stronger than his DF form because in this arc his base form has performed feats that are better than the feats displayed by pre skip DF Natsu. Look dude, Erza said it, not me. Red pants has no defense aspects and it was stated by Erza herself that she abandons defense and relies on offense when using it. If you wanna argue with Erza's own words about her own armor then be my guest. Why didn't Erza use hot pants against Jupiter in the Phantom arc if it's her best defense armor? Why use Adamantine instead?



Stop trying to trigger me by bringing Laxus into this and downplaying him. I quoted your post to talk about Irene's power, not Laxus's stamina.



My point isn't that a half dead Jellal is stronger than Irene (that would be ridiculous). However in both fights virtually the same thing happened. Acnologia was playing around and he got pushed back. If he was remotley serious in either of those fights then he would have murdered them instantly. You can't go nuts and overhype Irene just because she got Acno excited and pushed him back a bit yet when Acno gets pushed back by Jellal's nine thunder stars you simply brush it off as not impressive since Acno wasn't trying.The double standard is real here and even as a Laxus fan myself I can tell that Jellal isn't getting the respect he deserves from you.


*SIgh*, why do I even bother?

So Dragon Irene is weaker than Base? We already saw an enchanted Erza get whooped.

Did you not read the panel where she say "Now you can't move". She obviously wanted to immobilize her. You can clearly see she doesn't put much effort in the slap. If she can break Erza bones on contact she could snap Erza neck or actually put effort in the slap and crushed her.

Erza pre-ts red pants defensive feats are better than adamantine armor. That Jupiter feat was before red pants was a concept in the manga. Kagura's fight is a perfect example of the sheer difference between adamantine and her upper lvl armors.

How? Christina, Acno's bored expression, the lack of acknowledgment of Jellal, and him only going after Wendy and Erza shows Acno doesn't care. In the Irene fight he acknowledge her, and praised her power. After that he is in wonderment about who she is, and then she pulls a continental lvl spell.

Bcs Laxus is in question, and his lack of stamina is staggering in this arc is a red flag.

Honestly one feat is all I ask that boost Laxus on August/Irene lvl. I mean if Hiro thought Laxus could take on Irene then he should of had Laxus vs. Irene, but he didn't bcs he knew none of FT are strong enough to beat those two. What are the odds they both committed suicide?

 

[Laxus chan-yo]

I mean if Hiro thought Laxus could take on Irene then he should of had Laxus vs. Irene,

Maybe Hiro didn't make Laxus fight Irene because he wanted her to fight her fucking DAUGHTER who is a MAIN character.
Looks like Julliet and Heine > Laxus because Hiro didn't have them fight