Discussion Natsu Dragneel/E.N.D Thread

[MangerDan]

If we're being completely honest, END hasn't managed to kill anyone that people claim he has fought. He obviously didn't kill Igneel when they fought, seeing as Acnologia did. If he fought Acnologia, he certainly didn't kill him either. And Zeref is obviously still very much alive. If anything, END ended up in worse shape than anyone else if he really fought.

There's also no proof he even fought anyone anyways. All Atlas flame said is that igneel tried to destroy him. Which doesn't necessarily mean they fought.

 

[Marche]

Doesn't this page confirm that years ago END failed to kill Zeref years ago ?
http://readms.com/r/fairy_tail/464/3085/8

Zeref tells Natsu that thing are unfolding like this because he natsu failed to kill zeref.

I believe that Zeref refers to what happened in their meeting at Tenrou Island.

 

[Axiomus]

Honestly, with just he's own power I already have him up there with some Spriggans. With Igneel's power in his arm, he's probably 2nd to only Acnologia in a fist fight. Granted, Acnologia would tear him apart. If we're excluding people like Zeref and Acnologia, then yeah Natsu's pretty much the strongest on the battlefield until that power in his arm runs out.

 

[Axiomus]

There's also no proof he even fought anyone anyways. All Atlas flame said is that igneel tried to destroy him. Which doesn't necessarily mean they fought.

Atlas Flame said that Igneel failed to destroy him. Honestly, I think that sort of implies that he couldn't bring himself to kill baby-Natsu more than anything else. I just can't see why Igneel would be either unable to destroy kid-Natsu's body or be unable to burn END's book from Mard Geer's hands.

 

[Vasgoko]

I wouldn't be too quick to assume. We don't know how strong he is and we haven't seen anything from everybody else. It's too early to tell and there are plenty of characters that haven't even shown their faces..

 

[DemonKing888]

I too see Dragon King Mode Natsu up there with Acnologia. But that doesn't help the fact that this mode runs on limited amount of juice. Any opponent with high speed could just out last Natsu till he runs out of this one time mode. I wanna see what normal Natsu can do, hopefully he's still up there with Laxus.

Now if Mavis could link Fairyheart to Natsu's Igneel arm...... the world would just burn.

Is this a normal roar or a king's roar? This is the only skill He's used that doesn't look like King's mode.
http://www.mangapanda.com/fairy-tail/423/10

 

[SirSamuel016]

I too see Dragon King Mode Natsu up there with Acnologia. But that doesn't help the fact that this mode runs on limited amount of juice. Any opponent with high speed could just out last Natsu till he runs out of this one time mode. I wanna see what normal Natsu can do, hopefully he's still up there with Laxus.

Now if Mavis could link Fairyheart to Natsu's Igneel arm...... the world would just burn.

Is this a normal roar or a king's roar? This is the only skill He's used that doesn't look like King's mode.
http://www.mangapanda.com/fairy-tail/423/10

Thats a basic Flame Dragon's Roar, and fairy tail wikia also have it listed as such.

I believe Natsu is currently one of the strongest characters we have on the good side. With Dragon Force at his disposal, he's an extremely powerful foe and now that one off Flame Dragon King Mode using Igneel's power should put him near Acnologia's level. If Natsu can eventually develop his own Flame Dragon King Mode (which he actually should as he's the son of the King, making him the successor to the tile when Igneel died), then I'd say he could still be a bit behind Acnologia, but definitely getting to be one of the strongest mages we have in the story now.

 

[Holt]

We've not seen enough from the relevant characters to determine Natsu's level and strength. I also disregard Dragon king mode because it's a one time thing and after this he wouldn't have access to it again. We've not seen him properly duke it out with a spriggan or anyone relevant for that matter

 

[Nomi]

Well, since it was never stated that ONLY humans can use Dragon Slaying magic, I'd guess the ultimate (Most likely, impossible) mode.
If he somehow manages to enable his Dragon Force while being in his (aka END's) Etherious form and uses his Dragon King spells, Natsu would defeat his enemies just by looking at them. lol!

 

[DemonKing888]

I have a theory that the power Igneel left is really his Anti-bodies and Natsu mistook it's purpose as a powerup. We're suppose to be getting a Natsu Dragonize movie if the movie is cannon then this could be why.

 

[Vasgoko]

Natsu's power level.... IS OVER FREAKIN 9000!!!!!!

Oh wait.. That's from Ichiya's point of view... Let's switch that to Acnologia's point of view...

Scouter Reading: 90

Ah, now that's more like it. Jk, Natsu will probably on Acnologia's level when he is END.

Until then, we don't know, so let's don't treat our guesses as facts

 

[Vasgoko]

Talk no Jutsu...

Jk, probably the one we saw this recent chapter.

 

[Vasgoko]

But then that would defeat the purpose of the markings and the words that came out of Natsu's mouth. The markings is specifically of a dragon and not a demon.

Natsu himself even specifically said it was from Igneel. I'm pretty sure Natsu wouldn't have said that it was from Igneel if didn't have any clue if it was true. Unless he really is that stupid...

Plus, even judging from the way Zeref reacted, Zeref acted like he was surprised by Natsu's "new" attack. If it had something to do with END, Zeref should have known all about it or at least sense it and be familiar with it since he was the one that created END

 

[Nomi]

But then that would defeat the purpose of the markings and the words that came out of Natsu's mouth. The markings is specifically of a dragon and not a demon.

Natsu himself even specifically said it was from Igneel. I'm pretty sure Natsu wouldn't have said that it was from Igneel if didn't have any clue if it was true. Unless he really is that stupid...

Plus, even judging from the way Zeref reacted, Zeref acted like he was surprised by Natsu's "new" attack. If it had something to do with END, Zeref should have known all about it or at least sense it and be familiar with it since he was the one that created END

You haven't understood what I said. It indeed is Igneel's power but thee portion igneel had left for keeping END sealed.

 

[Vasgoko]

You haven't understood what I said. It indeed is Igneel's power but thee portion igneel had left for keeping END sealed.

I still don't get it. Does this mean Natsu already broke the seal by using the magic? Because of the recent chapter, Natsu technically revealed his whole secret and hasn't turned into END.

How does the portion of magic that Igneel left act as a seal. Somehow, the seal has to be broken or unlocked for END to be awakened, and since Natsu has already shown us everything he got, then what will break the seal?

As far as I can tell, Igneel's magic and END's transformation are 2 totally different things. It's either one or the other.

 

[SirSamuel016]

I just thought of something.
What if Igneel never intended to leave that magic power inside of Natsu??
And the power Natsu is using is actually the Magic Power of Igneel that was sealing E.N.D.?????
Isn't this theory interesting? As we know Igneel never told Natsu about that, neither did he ask Natsu to defeat Zeref. It really makes sense!
And we all know in the end Igneel didn't have much strength left and Natsu and Igneel couldn't talk much, so he couldn't have given this much power to Natsu while dying!

(Well it could be he left the power just to help Natsu but we cant be sure)


{This theory is open to further suggestions, extensions and even criticism , feel free to express your opinion!}

E.N.D is sealed in the Book of E.N.D, so for Natsu to harness that power he'd have to have the book inside of him or nearby to access its power. Zeref doesn't seem to have opened it either, so its highly unlikely the power Natsu is using was for sealing E.N.D away. The power Igneel left in Natsu may of been so Natsu could carry out Igneel's will and defeat Acnologia, as I'd say that would be the best use for it.

 

[SirSamuel016]

Well, since it was never stated that ONLY humans can use Dragon Slaying magic, I'd guess the ultimate (Most likely, impossible) mode.
If he somehow manages to enable his Dragon Force while being in his (aka END's) Etherious form and uses his Dragon King spells, Natsu would defeat his enemies just by looking at them. lol!

Dragon Force + END powers might seem like a good idea, but really that would actually be a pretty weak combination due to the fact that Dragon Force is a type of Magic, which stems from the One Magic (Which is Love) and END powers are Curses, which power stems from negative emotions like hate. They're polar opposites, and thus one would make the other weaker. Natsu's strong feelings about his Nakama would increase the power of his Dragon Force theoretically, but those positive emotions would reduce the power of the curses, which stem from negative emotions.

 

[Nomi]

Dragon Force + END powers might seem like a good idea, but really that would actually be a pretty weak combination due to the fact that Dragon Force is a type of Magic, which stems from the One Magic (Which is Love) and END powers are Curses, which power stems from negative emotions like hate. They're polar opposites, and thus one would make the other weaker. Natsu's strong feelings about his Nakama would increase the power of his Dragon Force theoretically, but those positive emotions would reduce the power of the curses, which stem from negative emotions.

No one actually knows what one magic is. Love is just an assumption. Maybe Master END knows what one magic really is.

 

[SirSamuel016]

No one actually knows what one magic is. Love is just an assumption. Maybe Master END knows what one magic really is.

The one magic being love would actually make a lot of the things that have happened in the manga make sense. The feelings of love for their friends which grow stronger as time goes on has seen FT members especially get stronger as they fight for each other. Mavis even said that love was at the abyss of magic, hinting that love is the one magic. Layla thought that the one magic was love, and its pretty obvious thanks to Chapter 464 that she was close to Zeref, someone who was interested in finding the one magic at one point.

It would make sense for Magic's foundations to be based around positive emotions like love, as it would explain the nakama power-ups and add legitimacy to most of them. Plus, Magic can't be based from negative emotions or it wouldn't be any different from curses, which have been confirmed to be based on negative emotions like hate. The polar opposite of hate is love. Hence the One magic being Love is very believable. And this is why I'd say a power-up for Natsu combining his END Powers and his Dragon Slaying Magic would be extremely flawed and weak, as there's two different origins for them, both of which are polar opposites. Basically:
Positive Emotions like Love result in Magic becoming stronger, as we've seen with the nakama power-up stuff.
Negative Emotions like Hate result in Curses becoming stronger.
They're totally different, and the two together wouldn't work.

 

[Nomi]

Well bro, Please don't take any offense (As I don't intend any), It was stated that Curse is a TYPE OF MAGIC during tartaros arc. Also PureHito (Someone whom Mavis' acknowledged as having a great deal of intelligence and knowledge) said that Magic's source was negative. While I wont justify him or anything. I don't remember anyone (maybe, other than Natsu) growing "stronger" for their friends, they just got some willpower. Well, that said you could be correct as well, or maybe it can also be that curse and magic are linked together. Whatever It is, I believe that Natsu's END mode could very well be compatible with his dragon force.


And even if curse is incompatible with his dragon slaying magic, I believe his "container for magic and curse" will be very large in his Etherious form and then he could ditch his curse power and use magic instead (INSIDE THAT INSANELY LARGE CONTAINER OF HIS)




UPDATE: Well the feelings that made Natsu become stronger could also be negative feelings like (Oh shit I'll loose her forever) Sadness , Fear, Anger or (the HxH way) One's Resolve. This further supports my theory while also explaining Nakama power-ups

---------- Post added at 04:00 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:53 PM ----------

I feel One's resolve is the best way to look at it.