On Break One Piece Chapter 1194 Discussion

[JStackz26]

If there was ever an arc of a Sanji Ivankov time skip flashback and conqueror's Haki stuff it would be now. This is literally Ivankov's direct enemy Sanji is facing, with Ivankov bring a founding commander of the revolutionaries and even having briefly fought Magellan who took down Blackbeard and his whole crew as well as Akainu briefly (unless that is anime only).

But this was a nice chapter even though it was a Zoro chapter and I detest the bias seeming Zoro Sanji writing. Sanji and Zoro and Luffy are the same when you compare Zoro and Sanji and Luffy both being weaklings to their peers (Ace, Sabo, Kuina, Germa kids). Nothing wrong with writing them similar even if Sanji does not have a renown dream as far as we know. He's heavily rooted in the Underworld by background and linked indirectly to taboo death worthy matter in lineage factor which also relates to devil fruits.

 

[AmyRose]

Oh...im goin to miss him a lot,,if he dies or somehow is taken out of the story,,even when he totally deserve it-- he have proven to be absolutly charming and EVEN MORE FUNNY than ANY TOON SHIT GIMMICK LUFFY CAN MAKE IN G5--- just look at his face in the very very last panel.. hahaha

I won't miss him. If he dies one way or another I'll be able to just forget him and make space for characters I actually like. He's just trash and no matter how funny he seem (espesially in his misery) he belongs to garbage can.

 

[ViscountVivaciousVirtuoso]

A bit disappointing since this reveals Oda left out too much the haki development and then has to retcon introduce it.

 

[Federicoxxx]

A bit disappointing since this reveals Oda left out too much the haki development and then has to retcon introduce it.

Welp..it kinda would explain how the hell Roger and many of his generation were so freaking badass without Devil Fruits.. tough Roger's DID HAVE a Badass Sword as an addon "Ace" ...but leaving that aside, he was mostly thanks to his Conquerors, same for Gaban and Rayleight..

So yeah if the Haki is iNSANE. it can beat Anyyyy devil fruit shit... even goin as far to De-transform someone ... like what happened with JB's Haki and the Goros..

But need to be "ThE HAKI" Jb level one... a lame version wont work... for people with the level of Power close to Imu's or the Goros..

 

[kkck]

Huh, i didn't notice it before but in this chapter it's zoros practice shots that were failing. Whereas the times he meant to cut something like the vines his attacks were imbued with conquerors haki. Sommers also seens to be implying that its conqueror haki that allows him to so easily cut the vines.

I wonder if the implication in this chapter is also that a conqueror could lose his conqueror haki. If his sense of self is trashed....

 

[Federicoxxx]

Huh, i didn't notice it before but in this chapter it's zoros practice shots that were failing. Whereas the times he meant to cut something like the vines his attacks were imbued with conquerors haki. Sommers also seens to be implying that its conqueror haki that allows him to so easily cut the vines.

I wonder if the implication in this chapter is also that a conqueror could lose his conqueror haki. If his sense of self is trashed....

It probably does..seems to be tied to a very specific mental state .. it iss soo specific, that Makes Zoro's totally inconsistent With it...

The problem is not knowing about even having the power.. thats why at times cut the vines and at key moments like heart stabbing he wont..

Same for when he did the lightning haki Cut, he even said he didnt do nothing different,.. i think he need to pinpoint the exact will and Motive for pull it off..

Mastering it , means to know yourself at 100%..
if not it will be inconsistent and random...

thats why IT CANt be Teached...not to mention you need to born with it first..

 

[wing_gundam]

It probably does..seems to be tied to a very specific mental state .. it iss soo specific, that Makes Zoro's totally inconsistent With it...

The problem is not knowing about even having the power.. thats why at times cut the vines and at key moments like heart stabbing he wont..

Same for when he did the lightning haki Cut, he even said he didnt do nothing different,.. i think he need to pinpoint the exact will and Motive for pull it off..

Mastering it , means to know yourself at 100%..
if not it will be inconsistent and random...

thats why IT CANt be Teached...not to mention you need to born with it first..

I semi-forgot that Gaban also just had the same fight with Sommers and chopped him up some 50 chapters ago with Coc attacks until I saw the anime. He should have killed Sommers. I'm really annoyed we're trying the same thing expecting different results.

 

[korwinkrulpolski]

There is no indication that Gaban knew about the mechanical heart. He only knew that if you use conquerors, that would make regeneration harder for HK's.

 

[Federicoxxx]

I semi-forgot that Gaban also just had the same fight with Sommers and chopped him up some 50 chapters ago with Coc attacks until I saw the anime. He should have killed Sommers. I'm really annoyed we're trying the same thing expecting different results.

It was good.. in the sense of slowing down the regen...not good enough for kill..

Also maybe cause it didnt aimed exactly into the steel heart... maybe cause Gaban's never saw one.. and Zoro's is maybe the first one in doing it.. thanks to Luffy who rip him to pieces..

I dont remenber gaban mentioned they actually killed Gks when they came for Baby Shanks..

they probably got sliced so bad..they were unable to function, but even then they didnt found out about "Steel hearts"

with i presume it appears automatically in all the Tier 2 and Up Gks, and is the key 2 infinite regen.

 

[kkck]

Tbh i am open to conqueror haki not being something you are born with. Rather people being born with it is a misconception over it's rarity and the fact that lore wise it makes sense it can't be taught.

 

[Federicoxxx]

Tbh i am open to conqueror haki not being something you are born with. Rather people being born with it is a misconception over it's rarity and the fact that lore wise it makes sense it can't be taught.

At least we know.. it cant be acquired trought training.. is a King quality.. your indomitable strong will Crushing and pushing down Weaker Ones..

If you can coat that into an attack, and your Will is strong and Focused enought into a point.. you can beat your enemy Physically and Mentally, crushing it 100% Bypassing any cheat defense, no matter how rare coming from a D.F could be..

It is applied to real Life.. you can have the most deadly and profesional UFC fighter ever... if you make him fight the day his whole family got horrible killed in a traffic accident.. his mind definitly wont be on the fight.. and he might lose, no matter how strong and professional he might be..

Now look at the Sommer's mental state vs Zoro's one... the only thing that is keeping Sommer's alive is just that Zoro's haven't focused his full will into his attacks yet..

Even tought in the very last panel it seems he did..

And Sommer's defense are not even tied to his will to begin it.. is a crappy cheating added perk by Imu's..

If the next attack lands right into Sommer's steel heart..it might be over for him.

 

[FetherMan]

Next chapter, flash back, build up to Zoro defeating Sommers. Afterwards, a week break, color page for chapter 1195 and story shifts to Sanji's fight with Quinlingham.

I suspect, this will drag out further since Loki's hybrid form was shadowed for a reason.

Imu in a way demonstrated how all 3 forms of Haki work in battle, since he arrived in Elbaf.

 

[Federicoxxx]

Next chapter, flash back, build up to Zoro defeating Sommers. Afterwards, a week break, color page for chapter 1195 and story shifts to Sanji's fight with Quinlingham.

I suspect, this will drag out further since Loki's hybrid form was shadowed for a reason.

Imu in a way demonstrated how all 3 forms of Haki work in battle, since he arrived in Elbaf.

Welp..the guy have 900 years of experience...not to mention a young inmortal Body to make the best use of everething, he is quite the strategist too ,, not leaving behind his pawns, and buffing them non stop , to help him reach his goal.... (and cause it wont be good for him if they died, like Harald Did)

 

[kg21tmac11]

Huh, i didn't notice it before but in this chapter it's zoros practice shots that were failing. Whereas the times he meant to cut something like the vines his attacks were imbued with conquerors haki. Sommers also seens to be implying that its conqueror haki that allows him to so easily cut the vines.

I wonder if the implication in this chapter is also that a conqueror could lose his conqueror haki. If his sense of self is trashed....

I also love Sommers narrating what people think in real life when they read the manga. Thank god he is there to confirm it hahaha

 

[Federicoxxx]

I also love Sommers narrating what people think in real life when they read the manga. Thank god he is there to confirm it hahaha

Yeah he is veeeeryyy aware of Zoro's potential on his "Tought bubbles"... Mihawk was absolutly right.. on him from the first moment they meet...

His Potential and Skills are increidble.. is the kind of people you need to Kill as soon as possible, so they wont keep growing and getting better.. until they reach a point they are able to trash you..

Sadly for Sommer's he cant do that.. his best bet it was.. he could never grasp the full mastery of King Haki...

--- Double Post Merged, Today at 2:09 AM, Original Post Date: Yesterday at 11:22 PM ---

Is funny GRAM it was supposed to CREATE EXPLOSIONS.. and Sommer's is just using to Launch spikes... That didn't even explode....

 

[AmyRose]

Is funny GRAM it was supposed to CREATE EXPLOSIONS.. and Sommer's is just using to Launch spikes... That didn't even explode....

Guess he's simply unfit to wield that sword. He's from Shepard (sorry if it's wrong, I forgot how to write this) family just like one of Gorosei, right? Gram would be probably better used by that Gorosei. He would deffinetly know how use its power to the max. Since Sommers dosen't seem to know how to do it you could say that Imu basicaly gave fancy toy to baby who dosen't know how to play with it. I feel like this will be a reason for his death. Well, at least partly.

 

[kkck]

Guess he's simply unfit to wield that sword. He's from Shepard (sorry if it's wrong, I forgot how to write this) family just like one of Gorosei, right? Gram would be probably better used by that Gorosei. He would deffinetly know how use its power to the max. Since Sommers dosen't seem to know how to do it you could say that Imu basicaly gave fancy toy to baby who dosen't know how to play with it. I feel like this will be a reason for his death. Well, at least partly.

It's a bit funny because ju peter sheperd transforms into a massive worm. And we never saw his hybrid form. Doesn't seem fit to wield a sword though I suppose there's wiggle room. It's pretty clear sommers isn't outright weak, he is just outclassed by zoro. We saw how his ability affected so much of elbaf before luffy and co returned from the underworld. It's unlikely sommers could have pulled that off if he was weak. Sommers is probably stronger than most vice admirals and even Yonko executives. But he doesn't scale to the top fighters in those categories.

 

[AmyRose]

It's a bit funny because ju peter sheperd transforms into a massive worm. And we never saw his hybrid form. Doesn't seem fit to wield a sword though I suppose there's wiggle room. It's pretty clear sommers isn't outright weak, he is just outclassed by zoro. We saw how his ability affected so much of elbaf before luffy and co returned from the underworld. It's unlikely sommers could have pulled that off if he was weak. Sommers is probably stronger than most vice admirals and even Yonko executives. But he doesn't scale to the top fighters in those categories.

Yeeeaaah, Ju Peter kinda lost a lottery by getting whatever power he have. Like seriously, what kind of power have huge sand worm from Dune? Beside swallowing everything, I mean. But I still think he would use Gram better than Sommers, just not in whatever his hybrid form would be and DEFFINETLY not in his animal form.

--- Double Post Merged, Today at 6:36 AM, Original Post Date: Today at 6:22 AM ---

Hmm, it seems like this chapter taught us something new. Sommers said (well, thought) that omen is counterpart of Conqueror Haki or Haki in general but what does that actually mean? Could it be that on top of being able to use haki Imu can generate some kind of demonic counterpart that he can share with his subordinates to make them stronger? Or omen is just fragment (or skill based on) of maki itself.

 

[kkck]

Yeeeaaah, Ju Peter kinda lost a lottery by getting whatever power he have. Like seriously, what kind of power have huge sand worm from Dune? Beside swallowing everything, I mean. But I still think he would use Gram better than Sommers, just not in whatever his hybrid form would be and DEFFINETLY not in his animal form.

--- Double Post Merged, Today at 6:36 AM, Original Post Date: Today at 6:22 AM ---

Hmm, it seems like this chapter taught us something new. Sommers said (well, thought) that omen is counterpart of Conqueror Haki or Haki in general but what does that actually mean? Could it be that on top of being able to use haki Imu can generate some kind of demonic counterpart that he can share with his subordinates to make them stronger? Or omen is just fragment (or skill based on) of maki itself.

Eating everything is probably a strong power in general but it does sound inconvenient that he can't punch stuff or otherwise wield a weapon.

I think we already have the answer to that. Conqueror haki, the capacity to weaponize your sense of self and willpower against omen, the might of being utterly subjugated/dominated.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

A bit disappointing since this reveals Oda left out too much the haki development and then has to retcon introduce it.

What exactly is retconned?
There is a lot we know about Haki, it just requires reading between the lines and you will see how consistent it is.

--- Double Post Merged, 1 minute ago, Original Post Date: 8 minutes ago ---

This chapter really feels redundant but also really enjoyable.. If you were to switch Zoro with any other character , fans would have gone crazy.
One interesting thing, Maki is the counterpart to Conquerers Haki?! Is that translation correct??

I don't think this is the case.
Devil fruits depending on how powerful they are have some level of resistance to Haki.
Akainu was cut by Marco and Vista with Haki, and it didn't do much damage.

For example as well, Law said back in Punk Hazard that his DF powers became strong enough to overpower Vergo's Haki. So, this is not about "Maki" being a counter to Haki, Devil fruits have some level of resistance to Haki by default. The stronger the Haki, the more effective it is against Devil fruits.

Even Wano and Law's battle with BB shows this. Big Mom and Kaido couldn't get teleported with room due to the strength of their Haki - Law could reverse Doc Q's sex change.

I don't think the translation is wrong, I think the interpretation is probably incorrect. It's just the standard DF Haki dynamics:

• Weak Haki will not be effective against a Powerful Devil fruit.
• Strong Haki will be,

If Haki was a default counter to Devil fruits, there will not be any need to make it stronger. The default needs to be stronger to be effective, unless it's against a DF that doesn't have much natural defence against Haki.