Too much on the defensive, are we?
Cool down, HP. I even stated I like your post.
We don't know that for sure, but granted, that could be half right. Only half right, though, sice what we do know for sure is that the first clone, or armor (what he called it initially), was imbued with Haki, Haki stronger than any other Luffy had ever met.
Unaguarbly false. Strength of Haki is extremely relevant, but it's not everything. I never said it was, though, so assuming that to be my position from now on would be a strawman. Even so, I'm not persuaded that Luffy's
physical strenghth is greter than Cracker's. After all,
This was only one part of the fight, one part I never denied. The only thing I disagreed about this part was that it was completely DF-dependent, rather than DF + Haki dependent. It's not entirely clear whether the armor did all the work or was "helped" by his own power, but what we do know for sure is that he
was using Haki. I'm happy in assuming it did all the work except for the haki, though. After all, it was unable to hold a G4 attack, which supports the theory. Rather, what I was refering to was this part here, which tells a completely different story about Cracker's physical strength:
This was not a cookie. This was his own combo of physical strength + Haki + swordsmanship, and, unlike the clone/armor, it was enough to cause a deep cut in Luffy's G4 form. We do know his Haki is better than Luffy's, but the combo was still stronger than Luffy's physical strength + G4 + L's Haki. Since you yourself acknowledges Haki is not everything in a Haki imbued attack, we can certainly surmise that his attack stregth may be superior to Luffy's. The fact that it was strong enough to do so, while the haki imbued clone was not, actually supports
my theory, i.e., that his
physical strength is superior to Luffy's as well. One thing is for sure,
it's superior both to his cookies' and to Doflamingo's. Neither the clones, nor the armor nor DF were able to inflict that kind of damage, and we have good reasons to believe Doflamingo was physically stronger than non-G4 Luffy:
Given that the deep cut was inflicted in G4 Luffy, we actually have some evidence that Cracker's physical strength, at least in sword attacks, may be superior to G4. What is certain is that it is superior to G4’s physical resistance, as well as to the damage from all the clones’ and DF’ attacks.
True, Luffy's stamina is probably greater. I never said anything to the contrary, though.
Easily explainable by the fact, admitted by him, that he has little pain resistance. What may suggest that he has weaker physical resistance overall, although not neccessarily. In any case, that's a possibility. What it does not suggest is that his physical strength, i.e. his ability to inflict damage by his own physical strength is weaker than Luffy's, much less that it is weak. And while it was never a one x one fight, every hit dealt by his own power inflicted damage in Luffy, even in G4 form, while Luffy may never has even touched him, which means that, even with the cookies helping him, his speed is not just for show either.
Almost no character in the OP universe goes out of his way to go easy on the enemy. Even the fact that he was not full blown at the beginning is explainable by his preference to hide his ability in order to have greater informational advantage against other enemies. He always used his clones, just like Luffy would have done if his ability was his, but it does not follow that he is 100% reliant on them, just as it does not follow that Luffy is 100% reliant on been made of rubber just because he is made of rubber 100% of the time (i.e., unless he is touched by Kairouseki or Black Beard). I already showed how both assumptions are unarguably false. Besides his ability and its usage, Luffy has also speed, streghth and haki working for him. Cracker obviously has all three as well. His haki was obviously superior at that point, his speed was great enough for Luffy never to touch him (i.e. greater than Doflamingo's) and all evidence seems to point out that his strength may be even greater than Luffy's, and it's certainly greater than G4's resistance with Haki (which means it's greater than DF's and the cookies', and thus greater than non G4 Luffy).
There is enough ground for we to guess that Luffy may be overall faster, but it's not 100% sure. What seems more reasonable is to guess that Luffy has better stamina, better pain resistance and, overall, perhaps better resistance as well. Nothing more than that.
False, as shown above. Evidence points he is stronger than his cookies. He attacked Luffy before, and with greater results than the cookie clones were able to attain. What I think really happened was that, once the first G4 was up, Luffy started getting defensive until Nami was able to weaken the cookies. From that point onwards, the combat became a battle of attrition. Even so, Cracker was still with the upper hand until the last transformation. So, I do grant he may not have received one hit, but he was not defeated by one either.
There is no evidence of that, like I have just shown. I never said he had any excuses. Neither have I suggested he did not have advantages from his attacks. He is stronger than Luffy (well, probably; unless one of us is psychotic, neither I nor you know that 100% for sure), but he is less resistant (probably). What is one 100% sure is that he is
less resistant to pain, but I'm happy in guessing he is less resistant overall. Does not change the strong suggestion that he is stronger. Actually, he is so strong that Luffy cannot block his attacks. He has to evade them. And, granted, Cracker is a master at evasion, but, like Doflamingo pointed out, so is Luffy, who is not the strongest or even second strongest character already shown fighting, but who may be second or third best at speed, after Borsalino and Hakuba. Being reliant on evasion does not even suggest either character has issues with resistance, though, since Cracker admitted he has, we can assume that for him, and that explains why he is so good at it, but also so strong. He is probably stronger, but less resistant. It has no relatin whatsoever to "excuses" for winning or losing. You're getting too attached to the characters to really analyze them rationally.
Oh, please! Of course he was tricked. Now you are suggesting
Luffy is stupid. Besides, you are are merely playing on the semantics. He was immobilized, lost contact with the ground and any means of attriction against the attack, and then was shot at his own cookies. He was unarguably tricked.
Which does not mean Luffy had an advantage here, for God's sake. I did not suggest that either. Try to analyze this with a cool head. It just means Luffy had to use his head, what actually is a merit on his part, a merit I'm not sure can usually be attributed to him.
He knew he was fighting against an enemy who, evidence suggests, was stronger than him, who had an overall stronger ability, even against G4, but who he knew had very little resistance to pain, and perhaps little resistance overall for his standardads. He used his head and thought of a way to trick him. Would have he guessed Cracker to have problems with resistance had he not told him? Probably, since it was obvious. That was my assumption from the start. That's why I did not suggest he was actually advantaged by the information in my previous post, despite the strawman above. As evidence for the reader to get an idea of what kind of fighter Cracker is, however, this is not irrelevant. This is a foundational information that confirms what his weakness actually is, thus leaving less room to interpretation. And of course it's a weakness. Saying it's not is nonsense. Give Luffy some credit for his actual merits, for once.
Yes, his ability was extremely powerful, but not
just extremely powerful. His ability was stronger than Luffy's, his Haki was stronger than Luffy's too, his physical strength was probably stronger than Luffy's as well and his speed was at the very least close, which is not true of DF's, for instance. His only weakness was his little resistance,
which just goes to show how important resistance really is. If you are not resistant, been reliant on close fighting agains strong enemies, even those weaker than you, is dangerous. And, yes, Luffy is strong. Probably not quite as strong as Cracker, though, even on physical stregth alone. I never said Cracker would have won the fight if he did not have a DF. Against G4 Luffy, he would certainly have lost. Against regular Luffy, perhaps he would have lost. No one knows that, since it's mere speculation.
There is no evidence suggesting that. Like shown above, he may be less resistant, but there is much suggesting he is stronger, and nothing, really, suggesting otherwise.
And now let's move on to the main point of my previous post, which you did not address. Cracker was not defeated by
one punch, not even
any punch
, not even a G4 punch. He was tricked into a position into which he had no means of resistance, then shot against his own biscuits, which were the bodies that really dealt the damage. Of course, the shooting power was G4's, and played a good part in the attack, and the fact he could not resist it was probably a an aggravating factor. Just goes to show that Luffy's G4 is great both in strength and in flexibility, but it does not directly suggest that regular G4 punchs would have been enough. Perhaps King Kong would, but Cracker could evade it, which means Luffy's move, which was yes, a trick, was actually the smartest one he could have used. Kudos to him. And, of course, Cracker tricked Luffy as well, but that's beside the point. After all, tricking the enemy, in my perspective, is a form of strength. Unlike suggested in the strawmen above, I never really meant that Luffy was weaker for using a trick. But, yes, Cracker was stronger than him, and without help, who is to say how many rounds it would get Luffy to be able to defeat him. Cracker's case holds a better analogy to Crocodile's, also weak in resistance, than to Enel's, though Cracker may be (and probably is) stronger than Luffy physically, while Crocodile was not.
His base was getting plundered. why would he not defend it. its ridiculous you'd say that because his fight is with WG he wont defend his base, now former base against a pirate.
