One Piece Mega Convo Thread

[Hannibal Psyche]

Do you really need to offend another user for every quote you reply?

If being honest is upsetting, that's not my fault.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

If being honest is upsetting, that's not my fault.

I think what he's trying to say is you should stop using words like "Your insight was poor" and go more along the lines of "You probably didn't get my point" or "Perhaps you don't understand the point I'm trying to make".

Anyways, regarding Fujitora's statement that Luffy can back up his words of:
1) Not running away
2) Pitting against established world powers (Yonko and Admirals).

Fujitora confirmed Luffy has the power to back it up and the reason is very clear.
He just witnessed Luffy take down a powerful Shichibukai Doffy who seems to feel he can take on Fujitora.
Same guy who feels confident he could take on Aokiji – another Admiral.
And the same guy Luffy just defeated.
Doffy may be ballsy but he's definitely powerful enough to back up his strength. Likewise Luffy. Even if both pirates might end up losing. They'll definitely give a solid battle.

 

[nik87]

Well, I dont know why this Luffy vs Yonko is a topic again.
Luffy came to Wano certainly not weaker than he was in WCI and he still lost to 1 hit from Kaido, failing to injure him at all with his strongest gear.
Big Mom probably has even better defense than Kaido, she is an iron balloon after all.

Yes, Luffy will win against Yonkos but he is not strong enough to win alone, there would be no need for so many allies if he can do it by himself.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Well, I dont know why this Luffy vs Yonko is a topic again.
Luffy came to Wano certainly not weaker than he was in WCI and he still lost to 1 hit from Kaido, failing to injure him at all with his strongest gear.
Big Mom probably has even better defense than Kaido, she is an iron balloon after all.

Yes, Luffy will win against Yonkos but he is not strong enough to win alone, there would be no need for so many allies if he can do it by himself.

If I hadn't seen Kaido, I'd assume that Big Mom had the best defence among the Yonko. But the fact that she had to defend with hardening against a casual G4 attack is all the confirmation I need.
Kaido took on a barrage of G4 attacks without guarding himself or even using hardening and all he did was sigh.

So best defence, I give it to Kaido.
Don't get me wrong Big Mom is crazy durable but Kaido is a notch above in that section.

Attack on the other hand, is where she's superior.
Kaido felt the need to use his club which might be seastone imbued to damage Luffy.
Whereas, Big Mom's bare punches nearly killed Bege in his strongest defensive form.

They are a perfect match for each other if you ask me.

 

[Fox666]

I find it hard to believe Big Mom would have a stronger punch based on this alone.

Even if Kaido is using his cub, he went right through Luffy like he was nothing.

 

[hokageji]

I find it hard to believe Big Mom would have a stronger punch based on this alone.

Even if Kaido is using his cub, he went right through Luffy like he was nothing.

What i feel is important is that in both cases, Luffy deflated instantly. So makes u wanna think there's something special about their haki. Of course, Mama's was more of a defense while Kaido's was an offense. Yet, Luffy deflated.
Which is why i like to think the most recent Haki theory will have an important role to play. While its not conclusive that its the same as breath of all things, what if these attacks just drain out of the haki of the opponent? No reason for Luffy to deflate by just punching Mama otherwise.

here's the video link, you can see clearly Luffy deflates, quite similar to Kaido's divine thunder attack, except the physical damage.

 

[Fox666]

The manga is more straightforward. Luffy only had energy to exchange one blow against Big Mom.

Luffy deflated against Kaido because he was knocked out...

 

[nik87]

The manga is more straightforward. Luffy only had energy to exchange one blow against Big Mom.

Luffy deflated against Kaido because he was knocked out...

I think Luffy did what he said would do - just one punch. He had more energy but it wasnt the time nor the place to battle a Yonko herself since, you know, they were running away, being surrounded by the powerful ministers after their plan failed. It had nothing to do with Luffy's energy, imo.

 

[Fox666]

But after it, Luffy was almost sleeping.

 

[hokageji]

The manga is more straightforward. Luffy only had energy to exchange one blow against Big Mom.

Luffy deflated against Kaido because he was knocked out...

But Luffy did deflate in the mango too.

 

[Admiral Teach]

One thing is for certain to me. This arc is well planned, or at least far better than Whole Cake Island. Some people here speculated that it was extended to ensure this arc was hammered out better. That may likely be true. So much going on at once, but it is in an ordered fashion. It wouldn't be as confusing if the names were more recognizable to most readers.

Funny thing is, I am actually remembering the people's names, and I am bad at that with Japanese names. Just like with Naruto and Bleach, Oda knows how to make characters memorable, and the names easier to keep track of. But it helps when you have an art style like his, to. (it feels so right having these names brought up again while discussing OP. R.I.P Big 3. Speaking of, isn't Kishi making a new manga? Any news on that? I can't find anything on it)

Fun note: I'm currently reading Midnight by the one and only Osamu Tezuka while the Golden Darkness rests over us all. It's pretty cool. Anyone here read through all of it before? I can definitely see some similarities in how expressive characters are in it as compared to Oda. Great minds do indeed think alike! Or draw alike.

 

[I Am Atomic]

We know for certain that Luffy had energy because he fought Katakuri for 10+ hours later.

 

[Fox666]

Isn't it weird for a manga that most of the main villains in Paradise were much stronger than Luffy?

1. Wapol: A buffon.
2. Crocodile: Completely out of Luffy's league. Despite Luffy finding what his weakness was, it seems weird that he managed to defeat Crocodile, considering he stood among the world's strongest in Marineford, and Doflamingo even asked him to form an alliance.
3. Enel: The author stated if he was a pirate, he would have a bounty of 500 million, which proves he's would be a threat even in the New World. That's not a surprise, since the destructive power of his Devil Fruit was only seen with the Admirals, besides an impossible Observation Haki thanks to his ability. What's more, even in a hand-to-hand combat, he stopped Zoro's swords with his bare hands, and put Luffy down with his staff in a matter of seconds.
4. Rob Lucci: Evenly matched with Gear 2.
5. Moriah: Luffy could take on Moriah alone. It's a bit more complicated to compare against Oars, since Moriah took Luffy's shadow, and Luffy himself used other shadows.
6. Kizaru: No comments.
7. Magellan: Luffy almost died by attacking him, and he was barely affected. Even Crocodile or Jinbe did not want to fight him, and Ivankov barely survived.
8. Marineford: Way too many people who would defeat Luffy instantly.

 

[thedude]

One thing is for certain to me. This arc is well planned, or at least far better than Whole Cake Island. Some people here speculated that it was extended to ensure this arc was hammered out better. That may likely be true. So much going on at once, but it is in an ordered fashion. It wouldn't be as confusing if the names were more recognizable to most readers.

Funny thing is, I am actually remembering the people's names, and I am bad at that with Japanese names. Just like with Naruto and Bleach, Oda knows how to make characters memorable, and the names easier to keep track of. But it helps when you have an art style like his, to. (it feels so right having these names brought up again while discussing OP. R.I.P Big 3. Speaking of, isn't Kishi making a new manga? Any news on that? I can't find anything on it)

Fun note: I'm currently reading Midnight by the one and only Osamu Tezuka while the Golden Darkness rests over us all. It's pretty cool. Anyone here read through all of it before? I can definitely see some similarities in how expressive characters are in it as compared to Oda. Great minds do indeed think alike! Or draw alike.

I wouldn't be shocked if WCI was made longer for that planning. Oda in 2017 said that he was struggling to write a good way for Luffy to beat Kaido, a strong punch wouldn't do. And it was also said that WCI, which started May 2016, would end in 2017 and Wano would start in 2017. It didn't' end until April 2018 instead. So Oda stretching Luffy vs Katakurri and the endless chase could very well have been due to that (I hope that's the reason...I really hope Oda's pacing stays sharp, so far I don't have complaints in this arc, but in WCI and Dressorsa, the pacing was just utter shit).

 

[Admiral Teach]

I give Oda a pass for Dressrosa because it is just so clear he did not feel well. He was sick and had surgery, and they even said he should take a hiatus, but he refused. It has enough wrong with it to leave me babbling for hours, but even in artistic presentation, it just felt like the author had... changed, completely, from the one in Punk Hazard, especially by around chapter 50, where it just lost all momentum completely.

WCI has great pacing at first. And I actually appreciated the Kata fight being long, it was the way it was implemented butchered beyond recovery any tension or hype. One Piece has always given us very good reasons to have the villain and Luffy duke it out, usually with a friend's or friends lives at stake.

With Kata, it was a foolish and very stupid choice. Especially with the much greater threat (Big Mom) after his crew while he stayed and trained CoO, however amazing that ability may be. His actions were by his own admission, selfish. And in the worst possibly way. If he'd already gotten Sanji out, his friends safe, it would've been totally fine. It was a place where we could get this manly need to just confront a powerful foe and, while learning from the experience, defeat them. But nope.

This is how it should have been done, imo: Everyone actually manage to find a mirror in Whole Cake Plateau before or after the bombing, my preference being right in the middle of the collapse! Chaos!

While this chaos is going on, Katakuri calmly navigates after the Straw Hats and grabs Luffy so that he is pulled into the Mirror World as everyone escapes. Bege says this is where they part and rushes through another mirror, leaving the Straw Hats to deal with Kata alone.

Nami and Luffy both believe they can defeat Katakuri, given their victory over Cracker, if they and everyone else work together. But alas, even with Nami's rain and Jinbei's fishman karate, Kata is always one step ahead and is in danger of killing the weaker ones, namely Nami, one by one.

And then he suddenly reveals his objective was to distract them so he could free Brulee, and now everything has changed. Luffy and friends manage to get a hold of Brulee a second time, and Luffy orders them to all make for the Thousand Sunny, but is trapped by Mochi and can't go with them. He promises he will be fine. They object, but Luffy forces them all through and then shatters the mirror. He turns back to face Kata.

"You're about to say, 'I won't let you hurt my crew!', right, Strawhat?" says Kata. He twirls his trident, which flicks a little of Nami's blood, making Luffy scowl darkly. Kata's face is also shaded with rage. "Well, the same goes for me! Return Brulee, and I promise this spear won't touch them."

"I can"-
-"get that result by beating me here," Kata finishes for him. "You're about to understand just how hopeless the situation is. If you can't change that future, I am going to kill you here. And then I'll hunt down your dangerous crewmates. I won't take you lightly like your previous enemies, StrawHat Luffy! Not after you hurt my family!"

Or something along those lines. Imagine it then: his friends escape, but Big Mom has been sent directly after them with Persopero. Luffy cannot reach them and is now fighting for his life. His sacrifice has bought little real time. If he wants to do something at all, if he wants to even survive, he must survive, and win, or else Kata will eventually get to them all.

Brulee escapes and that leaves Luffy doubly trapped. Kata breaks for donuts, and the revelation of his habits leads to a similar conclusion as usual. Same general plot, but with FAR, FAR higher stakes, with a structure that makes the fight one of desperate necessity.

 

[Zehahaha]

I give Oda a pass for Dressrosa because it is just so clear he did not feel well. He was sick and had surgery, and they even said he should take a hiatus, but he refused. It has enough wrong with it to leave me babbling for hours, but even in artistic presentation, it just felt like the author had... changed, completely, from the one in Punk Hazard, especially by around chapter 50, where it just lost all momentum completely.

I didn't know this
Then I must ask, why in the world did he drag that arc so much with shitty fights and shitty characters ? I cannot describe how much I loathe Shitjao, Lao G, Trebol, Senor Pink (even tho his backstory was sad at least) and other DD executives. The only cool executive was Vergo, can you believe it ?

Dressrosa should've been much shorter, with less shenanigans and forced humor which did not make laugh at all (Pica's voice, Franky vs Senor Pink, Lao G, Shitjao and I can go on)

Re Katakuri vs Luffy, I don't think it was that selfish. The most dangerous person during that arc was effectively Katakuri due to how powerful he was, his collected mind, and his COO. If Luffy didn't take him on, I have no doubts these guys would not have escaped Totland at all no matter what kind of lucky circumstances were to happen

 

[Fox666]

I don't see why Dressrosa was different from other arcs, other than the scale. One Piece always had some stretched arcs. It was similar to Alabasta, when every Straw Hat had an individual fight fight against a Baroque agent. Except this time it was 15 characters instead of 6.

It was tiresome, expecially following on a weekly base, but saying the author was different is a bit too much for me. If anything it was too much of the same.

 

[Zehahaha]

I don't see why Dressrosa was different from other arcs, other than the scale. One Piece always had some stretched arcs. It was similar to Alabasta, when every Straw Hat had an individual fight fight against a Baroque agent. Except this time it was 15 characters instead of 6.

It was tiresome, expecially following on a weekly base, but saying the author was different is a bit too much for me. If anything it was too much of the same.

Alabasta was much more organic and the pacing was good + the enemy was a god damn Shichibukai, which was something crazy at the time
Even the humor then was good, and the characters were not literal buffoons like DD's executives. I prefer a Mr 4 over Lao G anytime anyday

 

[Admiral Teach]

There's another thing. It was most definitely NOT on a weekly basis! There were breaks every other week there for a long while, and when it got better, it was still every two or three weeks at best.

Reread Punk Hazard and then Dressrosa. I will argue until I'm blue in the face that there's a drop in quality and consistency. Yes, I totally agree more of the same is the primary problem, Fox, not arguing that at all! It's true! But the way the artwork especially just sort of... went down. And yes, Oda was sick, something to do with his teeth? Or maybe tonsillitis perhaps? I forget, but there was an official announcement in the mag and like a two or three week hiatus where it SHOULD have been like a six month one.

With Dressrosa being as big as it was, that was the worst place for Oda to be feeling bad. Chances are the assistant staff or Oda himself stretched a lot of the fights out big time and tried to add gags that just felt flat because of bloat (fast and furious was what Dressrosa needed to be) and things sort of... trundled along at a slow gait. I mean, we have plenty of arcs with tons of characters. It's just in this one they get far, far too much focus individually.

I think I may post a thread on this soon. I have a whole review in my head that obviously needs writing just so it leaves my system. It is, after all, the one worst arc of OP.

And then there was a whole rewrite I did for it in my brain. It was actually very good, and most of my head-rewrites for stuff usually look really, really bad or worse than the original after I give it a few weeks. But not this one. It fixes the key issues. Sort of. Still not sure what to do about the humor, since a LOT of that was just bland as can be.

There's another thing. It felt like filler anime humor most times. Whole Cake was a breath of fresh air. Wano feels like classic Pre-time skip.

 

[Erinyes]

Its been a while i havent been there, just sharing, thats so great (highschool style one piece animated by Shaft)

characters pic credits Captain M (ap)