One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[nik87]

Please, read a science book,

A man is a gender, not a race buddy, lol.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 29, 2019, Original Post Date: Sep 29, 2019 ---

Again, you need to improve your scientific base of knowledge, lol.

Whitebeard is a creature in the sense that he's Human. Being a Creature is not an individual thing, it's a label based on anatomy. Seems like this is far too complex for you to wrap your understanding around unfortunately.

Humans cannot be the strongest creatures because they're fragile.

Even Arlong as a Fishman is superior to Whitebeard because Humans are weaker than Fishmen:

1. Humans are 10x weaker than Fishmen at birth.
2. Fishmen can breathe both on land and on water.
3. Fishmen have immense physical abilities and recovery abilities that are superior to Humans.

You can be as ignorant as you want, but the fact is, as Oda said, Kaido's title refers to his Species/race, not to him as a person, lol.

Spoiler

Whitebeard has never been known as the strongest creature because he's Human, he's been known as the strongest person and Kaido was never known as the strongest person because he never was, lol.

It's just a matter of having some knowledge of basic biology.

Let's try this again.

Kaido is not human and thus he cannot be "adult human male".
Fishmen arent humans either. Minks arent either.
Kaido is most likely an Oni.

Nothing you wrote disapproves that among all living creatures(everything living and breathing) Kaido is the strongest one, thus title WSC, land, sea or air.

Excuses excuses. Big Mom wasn't using her DF (homies) either and if Kaido wanted to kill her why didn't he just do hybrid from the start since according to you he's stronger and hybrid form would destroy her?

So you call facts excuses now? Alrighty then.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Why only above 1 billion? We have Robin at age 9 or God Usopp with bounties that doesn't equal their strength. Bounties above 1 billion are just rare. But Luffy 1.5 billion bounty is based on a sensationalist news paper.

Not just above 1 billion.
It starts from 500 million and up.

Robin at age 9 (or any age) had under 500 million. Meaning her bounty is certainly not about her strength.
This so far applies to people below 500 million.

 

[Fox666]

Please, read a science book,

A man is a gender, not a race buddy, lol.

That's not correct.

A "man" is the word used for a Human male, you would never use it for a dog, for example. Also the actual word is 男 (Otoko), which is not age-restrictive like "man".

However, in One Piece world, races like Fishmen or Minks are Human. Fishmen are 魚人 (Gyojin) and have the Kanji 人 (Hito) for Human in the name.

Whitebeard is also a creature and of creatures Kaido is the strongest one.

生物 (Seibutsu) can be translated as creature, living thing, organism, and so on. I believe you usually don't refer to Humans as 生物, except in the sense of "Humans are organisms", etc.

 

[AmitDS]

Let's try this again.

Kaido is not human and thus he cannot be "adult human male".
Fishmen arent humans either. Minks arent either.
Kaido is most likely an Oni.

Nothing you wrote disapproves that among all living creatures(everything living and breathing) Kaido is the strongest one, thus title WSC, land, sea or air.


So you call facts excuses now? Alrighty then.

Meanwhile you're ignoring FACTS like Big Mom and Kaido without using their DF clashed equal in terms of strength and haki. If Kaido was stronger he would have beaten her and not fight equally for a day or so without even dominating at any point. You all love feats until and unless they debunk your headcanons eg) for the alpha male wet dream to be above Shanks, WB, Big Mom and BB.

And Fishmen, Kaido and Mink have all been called human or man at some point and a man is a creature if we're using your logic so unless Kaido has only been WSC for 2 years, your claims doesn't add up. He can't be WSC while WB is WSM/WSP if creature = man.

 

[nik87]

Meanwhile you're ignoring FACTS like Big Mom and Kaido without using their DF clashed equal in terms of strength and haki. If Kaido was stronger he would have beaten her and not fight equally for a day or so without even dominating at any point. You all love feats until and unless they debunk your headcanons eg) for the alpha male wet dream to be above Shanks, WB, Big Mom and BB.

And you ignore the fact that Kaido's hybrid form actually increases his raw strength while Big Mom's Zeus and Prometheus dont.

 

[jaymizzo]

And you ignore the fact that Kaido's hybrid form actually increases his raw strength while Big Mom's Zeus and Prometheus dont.

Wait, would that not mean that Kaido is only stronger than BM after using his DF not before (while she isn't using hers?). They were equally matched... from their clash and BM didn't even think twice about approaching Wano.

If we go by what is established by the Manga, i.e. Whitebeard being the gatekeeper of the throne, then Kaido and BM were definitely not stronger than him if they couldn't overcome him.

 

[nik87]

Wait, would that not mean that Kaido is only stronger than BM after using his DF not before (while she isn't using hers?). They were equally matched... from their clash and BM didn't even think twice about approaching Wano.

BM is using her DF - Napoleon.
They were evenly matched without Kaido using his DF, sure.
I never said Big Mom was far behind to be scared of him.

If we go by what is established by the Manga, i.e. Whitebeard being the gatekeeper of the throne, then Kaido and BM were definitely not stronger than him if they couldn't overcome him.

Kaido and Whitebeard was never touched upon and we dont know if they ever went against each other.
Physically, Kaido is no doubt above him, above everyone. Whether WB can have the edge over him due to Gura Gura no Mi, is unclear.

 

[AmitDS]

And you ignore the fact that Kaido's hybrid form actually increases his raw strength while Big Mom's Zeus and Prometheus dont.

And you ignore the fact that Big Mom can fuse with her homies (Prometheus) and her homies can attack and fight on their own, adding to her power. (One on one bet on Kaido oh wait with Big Mom it's never one on one).

And again, given that neither Big Mom nor Kaido have shown their full powers you can't say that Kaido's hybrid form makes him more powerful than how ever she'd use her homies and soul fruit. After all they are already equal in physical strength and haki mastery in base and they'd both be masters of their DF anyway which leaves us with two equals again.

 

[Fox666]

If we go by what is established by the Manga, i.e. Whitebeard being the gatekeeper of the throne, then Kaido and BM were definitely not stronger than him if they couldn't overcome him.

Technically you don't have to defeat everyone in order to become Pirake King. Inuarashi explained to the Strawhats they could just steal a print of Kaido and Big Mom Poneglyphs, and Luffy is even disappointed about it. Apparently Roger did not defeat them either.

Whitebeard was said to stand in front of the throne, but never took it. This is because Roger told him everything about Raftel and the Void Century, and if Whitebeard wanted he could go there, but he never did. Kaido and Big Mom still possessed two Poneglyphs, and Whitebeard did not fight them to take the Poneglyphs.

 

[nik87]

(One on one bet on Kaido oh wait with Big Mom it's never one on one).

Touche.

 

[Kato756]

Where do you guys powerscale Rocks-era Yonkou?

Id say between 1st commander but below admiral to be a safe bet

 

[LaGOAT]

This is the way I see it Rogers>WB>=garp>=kaido>Big mom>shanks>BB>as for now until I see feats that would probably disrupt this flow. I don’t see how their bounties doesn’t mainly reflect their strength and yes I know that bounties=/=strength but I strongly believe at this particular case it does

 

[M3J]

Option E: not enough information to determine anything. We don't even know how they lost, especially give the crew's hype against two (arguably some of the strongest) people.

 

[Pirate Queen]

This latest chapter has me wondering how much Enma actually played a factor in harming Kaido.

Oden is clearly no pushover and presumably much stronger at the time he faces Kaido, and yet Enma was the only blade that could pierce Kaido's flesh.

Kaido has an "X" shaped scar tho, so he struck Kaido twice with Enma?

If Oden didnt have Enma he would have never cut Kaido, that much is obvious, but I would like to get a detailed history of Enma's creation for this to make any sense to me. I know we can chalk it up to "Magic Sword gunna Magic" but still....

 

[King Moe]

This latest chapter has me wondering how much Enma actually played a factor in harming Kaido.

Oden is clearly no pushover and presumably much stronger at the time he faces Kaido, and yet Enma was the only blade that could pierce Kaido's flesh.

Kaido has an "X" shaped scar tho, so he struck Kaido twice with Enma?

If Oden didnt have Enma he would have never cut Kaido, that much is obvious, but I would like to get a detailed history of Enma's creation for this to make any sense to me. I know we can chalk it up to "Magic Sword gunna Magic" but still....

Think it was more Oden combine with his swords to cut Enma as he is casual fighting WB latest chapter, so should says a lot his power to hurt Kaido maybe or Enma giving extra boost or something.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Think it was more Oden combine with his swords to cut Enma as he is casual fighting WB latest chapter, so should says a lot his power to hurt Kaido maybe or Enma giving extra boost or something.

If that was the case his second sword should have been able to cut Kaido as well.... It could not. So Enma is the deciding factor here

 

[M3J]

Wouldn't be surprised if Whitebeard was always stronger than Roger, but Roger somehow was able to get the best of him OR they never fought physically. Kinda like Guy vs. Kakashi, where I thought Kakashi and Guy went off their fights against each other when it was really random competitions.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Wouldn't be surprised if Whitebeard was always stronger than Roger, but Roger somehow was able to get the best of him OR they never fought physically. Kinda like Guy vs. Kakashi, where I thought Kakashi and Guy went off their fights against each other when it was really random competitions.

I think enough people had made it clear that Roger was WB's superior in almost everything or else i would agree with you.

 

[ThatOtherGuy]

Whitebeard = Gura + Haki on Oden's level

Bare in mind this is the minimum for Whitebeard. Which begs to question exactly how much haki Roger needed to be able to compete with that, or even be better? Probably more than current Shanks? Definitely more than Rayleigh and Garp, right?

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

I never said WB was WSM in this chapter, quite the opposite. I said WB was WSM around the time Roger became PK (before the Great Pirate Era)

And no Roger wasn't likely in his prime 40 years ago because he only became PK many years later. So far we can conclude that the most powerful form of Roger would be the Roger who found Raftel and became PK.

I don't think WB was ever the WSM while Roger was alive (before the Great Pirate Era), he must've only been called that epithet after. Just as Roger was called PK after successfully conquering Raftel.

Also the Roger that became Pirate King was a weaker version of Roger since he was growing terminally ill before that final voyage. So I disagree, Roger was either already at his peak before he became PK, or never hit it (which is absurd). How else would he have been able to defeat the greatest pirate at that time, Rocks?

It is well hinted that Roger and Garp hit their prime way before the likes of WB and BM.