One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[jaymizzo]

How comes Mizzo-chan? To who did WSM, the strength related title, belong?



There wont be any major Roger flashback. This is the best you will get.

Nik-kun, it went to WB, after Roger died.

The many characters in the manga have referred to WB as a runner up I.e. Roger being the only person WB could not surpass and Roger having a bigger rival in Rocks.

 

[nik87]

Nik-kun, it went to WB, after Roger died.

No, he had it while Roger was alive.

enjoying fantasy land

Which fantasy is that? All I say is backed by the manga itself.
Compare me to Hitler instead to Moe...

Roger being the only person WB could not surpass

Surpass in what? Going to Lodestar or Raftel? He never wanted to...

 

[jaymizzo]

No, he had it while Roger was alive.

Which fantasy is that? All I say is backed by the manga itself.
Compare me to Hitler instead to Moe...


Surpass in what? Going to Lodestar or Raftel? He never wanted to...

I mean they were rivals for shits and giggles, not because they were competing for something.

Also, where was it stated that he was WSM while Roger was alive? I could be wrong but since you have very good memory on this, do you mind showing the title card or where WB was referred to as that (genuinely curious).

 

[nik87]

I mean they were rivals for shits and giggles, not because they were competing for something.

Also, where was it stated that he was WSM while Roger was alive? I could be wrong but since you have very good memory on this, do you mind showing the title card or where WB was referred to as that (genuinely curious).

 

[jaymizzo]

Doesn't necessarily mean in terms of power level - ability to destroy the world. *whoosh*

Still, how can the WSM have a rival he has never defeated?

 

[Luke Beifong]

The fights in One Piece, in my opinion, are more than just physical strength, DF powers or Haki... It’s a summation of to many things.

For example, Vergo is stronger than Law, he has been defeated because is over confidence in his superiority.

Another example (this one will be very controversial...) is Zoro vs Pica. Zoro is the only one that can fight Pica in Dressrosa arc, his DF powers makes him a stupid difficult matchup and Zoro is the only one that fits this fight.

My point is, Roger is the PK, WB is the WSM, Garp is the Hero of Marines, Sengoku is the FA (I mentioned those two because Roger tells they are the only marines that worth fight) and all of them is monstrous strong and must have many ways of defeating one another if they meet at the right moment and have this intention, what all of them, again, in my opinion, didn’t show.

Or you will tell me that Garp can’t fight equally with WB too, even begin stated that he alongside Roger defeated the Rocks Pirates?

For me the title WSM is because of the destructive power of Gura Gura no mi along side WB beginning one of the strongests pirates alive, not necessarily nor literally he beginning THE strongest one in all the world above Roger, Garp or Segoku.

 

[nik87]

Doesn't necessarily mean in terms of power level - ability to destroy the world. *whoosh*
Still, how can the WSM have a rival he has never defeated?

This is the denial of Mihawk's WSS title all over again...
Shanks is Mihawk's rival too yet Mihawk is the one who holds the title.

Or you will tell me that Garp can’t fight equally with WB too

I very much doubt this. Maybe he could push him to extreme difficulty but 0 feats speak in Garp's favor.

 

[Luke Beifong]

And the same thing can be said over Kaido title, The Strongest Creature in the World. He can be one of the Strongest, but I didn’t see he having a easy time against BM and I definitely not see him defeating WB or Shanks and going out ready for another fight with any fodder that happens to appears in front of him

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 1, 2020, Original Post Date: Jan 1, 2020 ---

I very much doubt this. Maybe he could push him to extreme difficulty but 0 feats speak in Garp's favor.

0 feats? He along side Roger defeated Xebec, WB, Kaido, BM and Shiki, all of them beginning referee as monsters. Xebec is the greatest rival of Roger, WB is the WSM, BM is a monster since she’s born and even if we didn’t know the true strength of Kaido and Shiki at that time, they are absolutely not just fodder in Rocks crew

 

[nik87]

0 feats? He along side Roger defeated Xebec, WB, Kaido, BM and Shiki, all of them beginning referee as monsters. Xebec is the greatest rival of Roger, WB is the WSM, BM is a monster since she’s born and even if we didn’t know the true strength of Kaido and Shiki at that time, they are absolutely not just fodder in Rocks crew

We dont know anything about what actually happened in God Valley.
Since Roger was matched by Whitebeard, it seems Garp took out entire Rocks crew bar WB... Do you believe that? I dont.
Kaido was said to be just an apprentice back then. Others like Shiki werent big names back then.

I didn’t see he having a easy time against BM

Of course he wont have an easy time against her but he never went into his hybrid form.

 

[jaymizzo]

We dont know anything about what actually happened in God Valley.

You're bored.

 

[nik87]

You're bored.

Mizzo-kun, those are factsss.

 

[HereNThere]

Oh my Lawd, Oda, and Baby Yoda, please help me in this New Year with these takes and arguments.

 

[kkck]

Judge is a competent fighter but my overall impression is that he was below sanji and his other children when it comes to combat. Sanji blocked judge's spear with only his haki, and not even hardened haki at that, and when sanji got kicked in the face he was pushed back but sanji didn't seem exactly in pain... And judge won with assistance from his underlings in the end. Add to that, even sanji's siblings were quickly overwhelmed by big mom's commanders after they initial cool transformation sequence. The germa are strong but as vinsmoke said their actual relevance comes from their clone army and advanced technology. They are different from yonko who rely on a vast network of subordinates and core main crewmembers of substantial strength and relevance to the world stage. So far every yonko commander we have seen is easily qualified to be a shichibukai at least....

And.... another bit that stands out to me is the lack of information regarding whether judge and his children are capable of haki. The combination of their mutations and advanced technology is powerful but without haki they are just thugs with fancy toys rather than people who are actually competitive against commander-VA class fighters.

 

[King Moe]

Thats not blitzs, only you think that. If you think being hit is blitzed, then sanji was also blitzed by drake,page one,judge,doflamingo,vergo,niji,yuen....

You said to not underestimate judge but you also did that when it was about sanji...this shows you are biased in your arguments...

Those weren't even right enemies he got blitz on compare to Zoro enemies. He isn't a speedster. Make sense Zoro get blitz by many more.

They are not to be underestimate. It's not biased. It's logic as we saw Judge beating YC4 Snack and his children beating YVs opponents. If Oda thought they were fodder, they would beat their enemies and survive that.

 

[kkck]

The fight between judge and cracker isn't cannon, it's just anime nonsense. Add to that that even the anime did not actually show the fight.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Those weren't even right enemies he got blitz on compare to Zoro enemies. He isn't a speedster. Make sense Zoro get blitz by many more.

They are not to be underestimate. It's not biased. It's logic as we saw Judge beating YC4 Snack and his children beating YVs opponents. If Oda thought they were fodder, they would beat their enemies and survive that.

Zoro runs fast, i already said he could even move faster than fishman underwater
I actually dont underestimate judge. In fact, i believed that judge was winning against sanji in their clash.

 

[King Moe]

Zoro runs fast, i already said he could even move faster than fishman underwater
I actually dont underestimate judge. In fact, i believed that judge was winning against sanji in their clash.

No he doesn't unless you mean comical runs. Striking and Reaction Speed he is poor at with enemies who got drop on him.

Using human shield to cheat and protect yourself isn't winning. He knew Sanji was stronger and Sanji walk away in disgust him doing that.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 3, 2020, Original Post Date: Jan 3, 2020 ---

The fight between judge and cracker isn't cannon, it's just anime nonsense. Add to that that even the anime did not actually show the fight.

He never face Cracker. We talking Snack and it is canon as in manga Snack is where he was and in front of him.

 

[kkck]

No he doesn't unless you mean comical runs. Striking and Reaction Speed he is poor at with enemies who got drop on him.

Using human shield to cheat and protect yourself isn't winning. He knew Sanji was stronger and Sanji walk away in disgust him doing that.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 3, 2020, Original Post Date: Jan 3, 2020 ---

He never face Cracker. We talking Snack and it is canon as in manga Snack is where he was and in front of him.

Ah, I meant snack. But IIRC judge never faced snack in the manga. Standing in front of him isn't the same as fighting him. And the anime does not show judge fighting snack. It applied oda's offscreen no jutsu.

 

[King Moe]

You can deny it, but the fact is zoro surpassed hody in speed underwater. We know human gets speed reduced underwater.


This is biased argument. Zoro got blitzed but sanji didnt?
We know the ranking of trio monster is like this: luffy>zoro>sanji. That is the status quo.
Also sanji lost in the aerial combat, which happened before the human shield

Only close distance, but not early when Hody was pushing around early underwater and Zoro is force to push back against water more to speed his attack.

Nah, not biased. Just fact as Speed is one if the things Sanji specialize on. Those came at him more directly than outspeed him.

Not really. He was still fight all around and only stop after human shield thing out of disgust. Sanji is much stronger than Judge and he knew that which why he cheated at the end.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Only close distance, but not early when Hody was pushing around early underwater and Zoro is force to push back against water more to speed his attack.

Nah, not biased. Just fact as Speed is one if the things Sanji specialize on. Those came at him more directly than outspeed him.

Not really. He was still fight all around and only stop after human shield thing out of disgust. Sanji is much stronger than Judge and he knew that which why he cheated at the end.

Judge wasnt cheating, the human shield is part of his tactics. The clones are his creation after all.
Judge also managed to give good hit to sanji on aerial combat. His spear work is not a joke either. Sanji blocked one of the pierce and had to kneel to recover from the pain. Judge had the upper hand against sanji in the short fight