One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

goldb

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Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

  • For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
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  • We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

  1. Shanks v Mihawk
  2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
  3. Zoro > Luffy
  4. Zoro v Sanji
  5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
  6. Mihawk's rank within the story
  7. Law having CoC currently.
  8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

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M3J

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Whitebeard was dead when Shanks arrived, thanks to Blackbeard.
 

XXGenesis

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Lmfao, nah boi said Garp isnt proven to not be a swordsman...Lmfao...You are a troll and I'm tired of reading your post now..Yo Moe-kun let's be friends...Nik is going into MH jail, and I ain't visiting the kid.

On to more interesting topics that hasnt been discussed dry.
 

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I wouldnt put Hancock that high up, she's maybe 3rd YC. I don't see her defeating Doffy and Doffy is around Cracker's level.
 

thedude

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Whitebeard needed Shanks to assist him, so yeah I think the Marines have overwhelming power.
The Marines needed all 7 Warlords. They needed it on their turf where they had the highground and could lock WB in while taking away his footing and being able to destroy his ship. They also needed someone on his side to weaken him. And they also needed one of his commanders locked up to provide a constant distraction.

And on top of all that, they needed WB to be dying already, and to suffer minor heart attacks during the battle, which of course caused his commanders, people who viewed him as a father, to abandon their fights, where they were holding off the admirals, and try to help him, thereby leaving their backs exposed for the admirals.

And on top of all that, they needed Blackbeard to come and deliver the killing blow with his entire crew.

Is that overwhelming power? There is a reason the Marines aren't going around trying to take out the Yonko one at a time.
 

Fox666

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Whitebeard was dead when Shanks arrived, thanks to Blackbeard.
Whitebeard was no longer much of a threat by that point. Sengoku alone could contain the Blackbeard Pirates, and I presume should have been capable of easily disposing of Whitebeard.

The Marines needed all 7 Warlords. They needed it on their turf where they had the highground and could lock WB in while taking away his footing and being able to destroy his ship. They also needed someone on his side to weaken him. And they also needed one of his commanders locked up to provide a constant distraction.

And on top of all that, they needed WB to be dying already, and to suffer minor heart attacks during the battle, which of course caused his commanders, people who viewed him as a father, to abandon their fights, where they were holding off the admirals, and try to help him, thereby leaving their backs exposed for the admirals.

And on top of all that, they needed Blackbeard to come and deliver the killing blow with his entire crew.

Is that overwhelming power? There is a reason the Marines aren't going around trying to take out the Yonko one at a time.
Were the Shichibukai helpful? Jinbe, Hancock, and Blackbeard betrayed the Marines. And while Jinbe was willing to sacrifice his life, Mihawk or Doflamingo couldn't care less.

Had the Shichibukai really fought at the World Government side, the Whitebeard Pirates wouldn't have lasted long. I believe each of them (except for Moriah) are capable of fighting against the strongest commanders (Marco, Jozu, Vista), and outnumbered them.

Most points you made are directed towards Whitebeard himself. While I agree that he was weakened, on the enemy side there are the 3 Admirals, Sengoku and Garp. Even Whitebeard at his prime wouldn't be able to do anything against so many strong opponents.
 
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M3J

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Whitebeard was no longer a threat by that point. Sengoku alone could contain the Blackbeard Pirates. So plenty of fighters could have finished Whitebeard.
If you're talking about right before he was attacked by the BB crew, then yeah, but it took tremendous amount of damage to bring him to that point.

If by "Whitebeard needed Shanks," you mean his crew after he died, then yeah because it'd have turned into Marines vs. Whitebeard remnants vs. Blackbeard pirates. Whitebeard pirates lost their captain and a crewmember, so they would have been demoralized.

Curious to see how they'd have done without Luffy though.
 

XXGenesis

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The Marines needed all 7 Warlords. They needed it on their turf where they had the highground and could lock WB in while taking away his footing and being able to destroy his ship. They also needed someone on his side to weaken him. And they also needed one of his commanders locked up to provide a constant distraction.

And on top of all that, they needed WB to be dying already, and to suffer minor heart attacks during the battle, which of course caused his commanders, people who viewed him as a father, to abandon their fights, where they were holding off the admirals, and try to help him, thereby leaving their backs exposed for the admirals.

And on top of all that, they needed Blackbeard to come and deliver the killing blow with his entire crew.

Is that overwhelming power? There is a reason the Marines aren't going around trying to take out the Yonko one at a time.
Yes....

I know it's a shounen and a fictional tale but dive deeper into its fiction.

We are talking about the Naval Military/World Goervment vs Pirates.... They automatically Lose..Asap. Lol

Yonkou are Pirate Emperor's. So Therefore they are Heavyweights within the World. 1 Emperor cannot defeat the military of the WG aka the Marines.

Power can be defined in many ways. Intelligence is power, Strategy is power, Even Luck is power. So yes the Marine are undoubtedly strong asf. Pacifista, Warlord System they are all tools at the expense of the WG & Navy.

WB said a War will engulf the World. SH will be the General and won't just be supported by Grand Fleet, but all of the countries/islands military that he visited and liberated; Also Revolutionaries help; This is how SH crew is gonna take down the WG.

But without grand scheming and a change of events, A Yonkou cannot go head up and win vs the Navy
 

afromarco005

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I don't think Kaido's kid will be in BM's crew, but it would be a cool twist. I mean, she has like 80 kids, why not one with her former crewmate?

I wonder where Smoothie ranks in the YC group on the island right now. She's a wildcard, we really don't know much about her strength. Biscuit is also there, right? So he's YC level. Is Cracker there as well? That could be 6 YC level people, which would give everyone a good fight (I don't care that they've already lost, they are still strong enough to match up with people).
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---



I'd have to think Shanks crew is the strongest pound for pound. They are the smallest, and yet BM still included them in the group she could defeat if she had the giants on her side. She probably thinks she can beat them anyway (they all likely do), but they all know the victory would take too much out of them to be worth it.

Makes me wonder about the strength of Beckham, Lucky Roo, and Yassop. Those 3 must be monsters.
The way I see it Beckman Yasopp and Roo must be the commanders closest in strenght to their yonko captain.
 

Fox666

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The way I see it Beckman Yasopp and Roo must be the commanders closest in strenght to their yonko captain.
Going by what Brannew said, his crew is the most balanced. But I don't think the difference would be too big compared to the other commanders.
 

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The Marines needed all 7 Warlords. They needed it on their turf where they had the highground and could lock WB in while taking away his footing and being able to destroy his ship. They also needed someone on his side to weaken him. And they also needed one of his commanders locked up to provide a constant distraction.

And on top of all that, they needed WB to be dying already, and to suffer minor heart attacks during the battle, which of course caused his commanders, people who viewed him as a father, to abandon their fights, where they were holding off the admirals, and try to help him, thereby leaving their backs exposed for the admirals.

And on top of all that, they needed Blackbeard to come and deliver the killing blow with his entire crew.

Is that overwhelming power? There is a reason the Marines aren't going around trying to take out the Yonko one at a time.
I think an accurate comparison would be between the US and Russia. Both are nuclear powers, and both have very large militaries. However just looking at their expenses on defense and the global positioning of its militaries tells you that the US is absurdely more powerful. However, to defend itself from Russia, the US needs Europe and created NATO for that reason. Also, despite local conflicts and open hostilities between the two, an open war never breaks out.

The thing is, when it comes to war, once you are past a certain level of military progress, there will always be unavoidable collateral damage, no matter how overwhelmingly powerful you are.

You can't take one Yonko at a time. When they picked a fight with Whitebeard, Kaido and Shanks were already on their way. A single conflict already involved 3/4 of the Yonko.

Also just to point out, none of Whitebeard's commanders have shown any capability whatsoever to damage an admiral. Jozu and Vista would loose 100% of the time, and rather sooner than later. Marco can only hold his own due to his fruit, but the Admirals can fight for weeks, so it doesn't matter.

They also didn't need Blackbeard at all. Half of Whitebeards head was already gone at that moment and Whitebeard knew he would die even beforehands, hence why he chose to sacrifice himself. It was only a matter of minutes for him to bleed out from Akainu's attack. Had Blackbeard not appeared, Kizaru or Aokiji would have finished him before he could sink the island.

The moment Whitebeard went to close quarter combat with an Admiral, he took lethal damage, whereas the Admiral got back up after minutes and continued to steamroll his way through. Even at the start of the battle, the Admiral's showed no difficulty facing Whitebeard, as Aokiji just shrugged of Whitebeards Haki imbued attack. I think there is also a panel of Akainu blocking Whitebeard's Bisento with just his feet, his hands in his pocket.

The reason why the Yonko always get evaluated as more powerful han the Admirals is simply due to appearance, to be honest.

80 year old drunk Hulk Hogan who dies standing
Crazy drunk Mongol Warlord who transforms into a dragon
A fat lady who sings, then takes your life
The most piratey pirate, all consuming darkness
A cripple who is equal to all of the above

vs

Japanese Actors in suits.

There is no single indicative in the Manga that actually confirms Yonko > Admiral. Quite the opposite, actually.

But would they really ally with each other? Big Mom and Kaidou were part of the same crew but became enemies until Luffy.
And the Marines would never take action unless they know they have overwhelming power, so the Emperors would likely not need another Emperor to fight the Marines.



I'm assuming she could be the equivalent of Katakuri if not stronger, just because of her beauty and devil fruit alone. Otherwise she's shown to be an incredibly competent fighter with how she's damaged the Pacifista, but I'm not sure how she'd fare in an actual fight.
The thing is, defeating a Pacifsta puts you on a level with Pavlik. Who? Yes, that basically answers how much this is worth by the standards of New World captains. Basically, it appears once you are a Haki user, you can bypass the armor of the Pacifista, turning them into a non-issue.

I actually agree with you and think Hancock is crazy strong but her feats don't give that away. She is, as of now, definitely the most overrated character in One Piece.

If we go by actual feats of female characters, the list would probably be:

1. Big Mom
2. Nami
3. Smoothie

The number two and three spots should tell you something isn't right here and that's true. The thing is just that the female characters have comparably less feats and this is mostly for ethical reasons. Oda wont draw gory fights involving (beautiful) female characters, however that greatly limits the design space for such fights, leading to many female characters comparably lacking feats. That's why Nami places second, because a fed up Zeus Tempo is the most powerful attack displayed by a female character, and something aside from her, only the #1 can do as well. Smoothie's giant slashes never hit anything, but at least they were huge.

And we can't even evaluate much more than attack power. Because the females never get critically injured, we can't really evaluate stamina, and we can hardly evaluate speed either.
 

M3J

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It's why I said I dunno how she'd fare in an actual fight since the Pacifista are programmed to see her as an ally, and Hancock's usually used her attractiveness to her advantage. I'm curious to see how someone like Akainu would fare, given that one vice admiral was quick enough to stab his hand to take his thoughts off her.

Don't forget Carrot, she'd probably be above Nami, no?
 

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It's why I said I dunno how she'd fare in an actual fight since the Pacifista are programmed to see her as an ally, and Hancock's usually used her attractiveness to her advantage. I'm curious to see how someone like Akainu would fare, given that one vice admiral was quick enough to stab his hand to take his thoughts off her.

Don't forget Carrot, she'd probably be above Nami, no?
I think if my theory is true that they sent Fujitora to bring her in, it confirms she is close to admiral level. Like I'm said I'm biased for her. But if they need a blind Admiral level character to bring her in it means her beauty effects even top tiers and it gives her the advantage. Despite having a solid haki defense.

Idk, just my hopes
 

nik87

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It is expected of Boa to be around YC2-YC1, imo. There is no point in Empress being any lower than that, lower than the likes of Smoothie who is YC2...
Some of her stats may be low but Katakuri has the same stat(endurance) low, for example while ppl like Doffy have high endurance and low offense.
Her offense is pretty hax.
 

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I think if my theory is true that they sent Fujitora to bring her in, it confirms she is close to admiral level. Like I'm said I'm biased for her. But if they need a blind Admiral level character to bring her in it means her beauty effects even top tiers and it gives her the advantage. Despite having a solid haki defense.

Idk, just my hopes
Well, as it stands currently they send...Koby?

I don't think any Shishibukai is even close at all to the Admirals. They are all one-shot if they enter close quarter combat. Except for Kuma, but his fruit is a cheat and I don't think he can pull it off fast enough anymore now that he is just a mindless machine.

I don't even have much hopes for Mihawk. He has been pulling the opposite of Zoro. Zoro was training with the apes, but Mihawk was gardening with them and Perona. Not really something that makes you stronger, and all other Shishibukai that have left the New World have decayed rapidly. Last time Mihawk tested how far he can go, he was stopped by Jozu...

It's why I said I dunno how she'd fare in an actual fight since the Pacifista are programmed to see her as an ally, and Hancock's usually used her attractiveness to her advantage. I'm curious to see how someone like Akainu would fare, given that one vice admiral was quick enough to stab his hand to take his thoughts off her.

Don't forget Carrot, she'd probably be above Nami, no?
Well in terms of Speed, Sulong Carrot definitely is, but that's not even hard considering that the only other speedy female character so far has been...Kalifa I guess?

She didn't really show how powerful she got as she only sabotaged the ships, but didn't defeat anyone noteworthy.

But yeah we can assume that all Sulongs are above Nami.

Akainu would kill Hancock with one attack as he did with Whitebeard. The strongest character that Hancock could defeat is probably to be found among the other Shishibukai, the Worst Generation or the higher ranking Yonko executives.
 

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Who said that Yonko arent stronger than the admirals? You are out of your mind.
a Yonko crew equals Marine HQ and 7 Warlords, this was proven at MF War. Marine HQ needed the strength of the warlords to fight versus WB Pirates, if not then the Marines wouldnt have called in the Warlords.
1 Yonko crew = WG , if 2 Yonko were to form an alliance that would be the end of the WG.
IF the admirals were supposedly stronger than a Yonko, then why not send the admirals to fight off the Yonko?!!!!!!
Plus did you forget how Jack fought off Fujitora, Sengoku, Tsuru, and 2 other VAs and still managed to survive!?

Like it or not, but WB at MF war was weakened, due to poor health and a cheap shot by his own crew. He survived Akainus hits and managed to win his fight in 2 hits versus Akainu, yes Akainu did get up eventually but he still lost that fight. Had they continued fighting im sure WB wouldve killed Akainu
 

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Well, as it stands currently they send...Koby?

I don't think any Shishibukai is even close at all to the Admirals. They are all one-shot if they enter close quarter combat. Except for Kuma, but his fruit is a cheat and I don't think he can pull it off fast enough anymore now that he is just a mindless machine.

I don't even have much hopes for Mihawk. He has been pulling the opposite of Zoro. Zoro was training with the apes, but Mihawk was gardening with them and Perona. Not really something that makes you stronger, and all other Shishibukai that have left the New World have decayed rapidly. Last time Mihawk tested how far he can go, he was stopped by Jozu...

Well in terms of Speed, Sulong Carrot definitely is, but that's not even hard considering that the only other speedy female character so far has been...Kalifa I guess?

She didn't really show how powerful she got as she only sabotaged the ships, but didn't defeat anyone noteworthy.

But yeah we can assume that all Sulongs are above Nami.

Akainu would kill Hancock with one attack as he did with Whitebeard. The strongest character that Hancock could defeat is probably to be found among the other Shishibukai, the Worst Generation or the higher ranking Yonko executives.
Fujitora was sent as well. His panel on the boat shows the snake sea monster battling his Marines while he's talking to Akainu on the phone.
 

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Well, as it stands currently they send...Koby?
I'm still salty that they sent Coby to Hancock instead of Buggy, letting Coby's chance of his dream to capture Alvida go away.
 

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I think if my theory is true that they sent Fujitora to bring her in, it confirms she is close to admiral level. Like I'm said I'm biased for her. But if they need a blind Admiral level character to bring her in it means her beauty effects even top tiers and it gives her the advantage. Despite having a solid haki defense.

Idk, just my hopes
I suppose anyone with CoO could fight her to some extend with their with their eyes closed.
 

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Who said that Yonko arent stronger than the admirals? You are out of your mind.
a Yonko crew equals Marine HQ and 7 Warlords, this was proven at MF War. Marine HQ needed the strength of the warlords to fight versus WB Pirates, if not then the Marines wouldnt have called in the Warlords.
1 Yonko crew = WG , if 2 Yonko were to form an alliance that would be the end of the WG.
IF the admirals were supposedly stronger than a Yonko, then why not send the admirals to fight off the Yonko?!!!!!!
Plus did you forget how Jack fought off Fujitora, Sengoku, Tsuru, and 2 other VAs and still managed to survive!?

Like it or not, but WB at MF war was weakened, due to poor health and a cheap shot by his own crew. He survived Akainus hits and managed to win his fight in 2 hits versus Akainu, yes Akainu did get up eventually but he still lost that fight. Had they continued fighting im sure WB wouldve killed Akainu
While I do think that Yonkos>Admirals, MF has proven that one Yonko crew is nothing. They were completely stomped by the Marines who were taking turns instead of ganging up, with Garp and Sengoku doing nothing and with 7 Warlords doing literally nothing than joking around...

Jack fought off someone? Lol
 

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Who said that Yonko arent stronger than the admirals? You are out of your mind.
a Yonko crew equals Marine HQ and 7 Warlords, this was proven at MF War. Marine HQ needed the strength of the warlords to fight versus WB Pirates, if not then the Marines wouldnt have called in the Warlords.
1 Yonko crew = WG , if 2 Yonko were to form an alliance that would be the end of the WG.
IF the admirals were supposedly stronger than a Yonko, then why not send the admirals to fight off the Yonko?!!!!!!
Plus did you forget how Jack fought off Fujitora, Sengoku, Tsuru, and 2 other VAs and still managed to survive!?

Like it or not, but WB at MF war was weakened, due to poor health and a cheap shot by his own crew. He survived Akainus hits and managed to win his fight in 2 hits versus Akainu, yes Akainu did get up eventually but he still lost that fight. Had they continued fighting im sure WB wouldve killed Akainu
I suppose you were replying to me?
Anyways, we don't accuse others that they are "out of their mind" here.

Especially because everything you have written has already been debunked by me and you don't tackle this at all. I could give even more arguments, such as that only Lons, Lacroix and John Giant were defeated on the Marines side, and that's it, but we circlejerk around this every second month ever since Marineford and I don't think it is worth the effort anymore.

The thoughtline of 1 Yonko crew equaling the entire World Government is nonsense and cannot be proven via the Manga at all.
 
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