One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[M3J]

IMHO you guys have too much conviction about how a magical ability works.

Luffy's ability turn him into rubber. Unlike a regular person, he can survive even if his body is squished. However, Haki can still hurt his "real body".

Buggy's ability turn him into a creature that can survive even if sliced into small pieces. Would a Haki slash just turn him into small pieces, or would it hurt his "real body"?

It'd hurt his body. Why wouldn't it, when haki usually hurts devil fruit users?

 

[albertwv]

Enough about Buggy......

Can Franky defeat a Pacifista by himself?

 

[King Moe]

Enough about Buggy......

Can Franky defeat a Pacifista by himself?

He can at this point especially Oda let him defeat an border of different model Pacifistas in Movie Z. While non-Canon technically, to give a go from Oda to let Franky do that is something.

 

[Fox666]

Buffalo and Baby 5 confused the Franky Shogun with a Pacifista, which I think may suggests it's equal.

He can at this point especially Oda let him defeat an border of different model Pacifistas in Movie Z. While non-Canon technically, to give a go from Oda to let Franky do that is something.

Like you said, the movie is non-canon and these are not the same model of Pacifista.

I really I don't think in the manga Franky could vaporize 7 Pacifistas instantly...

 

[M3J]

Franky can likely beat a Pacifista by himself, but he probably can't one-shot it. Dunno how destructive his lasers are though.

 

[albertwv]

Yeah I dont use the films to rank anyone, because in Z film, at the beginning one of the best fights in OP animation was Z vs Kizaru and it kinda shows Z matching Kizaru, although we all know Kizaru would win the fight. But ultimately, G2 Luffy defeats Z and I doubt G2 Luffy would be able to match Kizaru like Z did.

Personally, I think Franky can mid diff defeat a Pacifista. He can shoot lasers too but how many times can he? Franky is pretty strong, he is often overlooked, especially now in the NW but I think he can defeat or match with a Pacifista.

 

[nik87]

Dunno how destructive his lasers are though.

Going by manga facts, far more destructive than Sanji's kicks. Franky would slap Pacifistas around like mere toys. Dont sleep on our cyborg.

 

[Fox666]

Going by manga facts, far more destructive than Sanji's kicks. Franky would slap Pacifistas around like mere toys. Dont sleep on our cyborg.

Could you please elaborate what are said manga facts?

IMHO it's clear that the monster trio is far superior to Franky

One clear comparison between Sanji and Franky is that Sanji knocked out Ikaros with one kick, which turned out to be Franky's main opponent during fish-man island arc.

It took Franky to use the "Super Radical Beam" to defeated Ikaros

Spoiler

 

[XXGenesis]

Franky imo, is his own walking Pacifista. Meaning he's above them especially when he goes Shogun Franky. Franky & Robin are not as strong as the trio but are next up and they ain't weak.

Franky heldback vs Senior Pink..He didnt use his weapons & lasers..& just brawled out like a Man with him..Senior Pink was awesome lol serious that backstory is beautiful..any who's

Sanji vs Franky....in terms of comparisons...Frank's beam is Vega'sPunk tech via Kizaru DF powers..so Yes the beam is strong asf, still yet to stronger opponents they'll avoid it, and pummel Franky..

 

[Fox666]

Sanji vs Franky....in terms of comparisons...Frank's beam is Vega'sPunk tech via Kizaru DF powers..so Yes the beam is strong asf, still yet to stronger opponents they'll avoid it, and pummel Franky..

On theory someone like Sanji would still die from a gun shot, so that's what makes the laser still dangerous.

 

[XXGenesis]

On theory someone like Sanji would still die from a gun shot, so that's what makes the laser still dangerous.

Yup. Exactly what I'm saying.

Swords, Guns Etc are still deadly against Humans..Only cannon balls suck lmao makes no sense but oh well.

You either dodge them, use tekkai or haki to block & defend against them when using your physical body. Unless your Kaido or BM.

Lasers are straight piercing skin & an explosion is likely to occur. Their AOE is good as to why all SN were very pressured against Pacifista's laser spam.

 

[McNuss]

So you believe Law is and will always be stuck at his Dressrosa power level? He lost to Doffy clean no doubt but are we attacking like Luffy wasn't trolled by Doffy's string clones on multiple occasions? The first meaningful hit landed on Doffy was Luffy's red hawk, that landed because of Law's powers.

Kidd lost his arm to Shanks crew, lost to Kaido, attacked Big Moms ships and invaded her territory got what he wanted and left while "injuring" a sweet commander. Thats what we know. L's against Kaido and Shanks (which we have zero context on could have been when he first entered the new world) are nothing to be ashamed of. Yonko and their crews are the creme of the crop when it comes to piracy and power. Luffy is the main character so naturally we know all of his feats. Thing is the only feat that can be used is the defeat of a yonko which Luffy failed to do as well.

You can dislike Kidd thats your prerogative. But he is without a doubt being built up as Luffy's primary rival. It started in Saboady and is continuing in Wano. Nothing has happened to indicate Oda has changed the direction for the character.

This goes off-topic too much so I reply to you here.

Yes, Law's Dressrosa Powerlevel is perfectly sufficient. He already became a Shishibukai with that, he is probably in the Top 30 of characters o something, that's fine.

Yes Luffy could also only defeat Doflamingo with extensive help, mainly from Law. Luffy with G4 is stronger than Doflamingo, but he couldn't keep it up long enough.

Blackbeard is built up as Luffy's primary rival, since Jaya Arc. Kid needs to fall off and given the "5 year expectancy" and dozens of characters left, it will happen rather sooner then later. The only sufficient conclusion to Kid's character is that he realizes that he is not going to become the Pirate King, that's the only way for him to become happy and possibly also calm down all that violent, reckless shit that caused him to become a cripple and lobotimized his best friend.

And I don't dislike Kid, quite the opposite.

 

[nik87]

Could you please elaborate what are said manga facts?
IMHO it's clear that the monster trio is far superior to Franky
One clear comparison between Sanji and Franky is that Sanji knocked out Ikaros with one kick, which turned out to be Franky's main opponent during fish-man island arc.
It took Franky to use the "Super Radical Beam" to defeated Ikaros

Sanji and Franky vs Punk Hazard doors. We have a direct comparison of their DCs in that scene.
If Sanji can take out a Pacifista, Franky can at least do the same.
Depends which Monster trio you mean, there are different setups now with Jinbe. Also, the gap between Sanji and Franky is small, I bet.
How did Ikaros end up as Franky's opponent if Sanji knocked him out?

 

[Mwhitt]

This goes off-topic too much so I reply to you here.

Yes, Law's Dressrosa Powerlevel is perfectly sufficient. He already became a Shishibukai with that, he is probably in the Top 30 of characters o something, that's fine.

Yes Luffy could also only defeat Doflamingo with extensive help, mainly from Law. Luffy with G4 is stronger than Doflamingo, but he couldn't keep it up long enough.

Blackbeard is built up as Luffy's primary rival, since Jaya Arc. Kid needs to fall off and given the "5 year expectancy" and dozens of characters left, it will happen rather sooner then later. The only sufficient conclusion to Kid's character is that he realizes that he is not going to become the Pirate King, that's the only way for him to become happy and possibly also calm down all that violent, reckless shit that caused him to become a cripple and lobotimized his best friend.

And I don't dislike Kid, quite the opposite.

Just because his power level in Dressrosa is "sufficient " in your opinion doesn't mean he will be stuck there, thats my point.

Blackbeard isn't competing with Luffy directly per se, Kid is hence the term rival being used. Blackbeard is destined to be a pivotal opponent for Luffy whether he is the final opponent we will see. Blackbeard is and has been a yonko before Luffy was given the "5th" yonko title. Luffy and Kidd are going to the same place at the same time. They met on Saboady where they fought the marines alongside Law, when Luffy and Law were first displayed as being paired as allies Kidd was making an attempt to ally with supernova captains as well, Luffy and Kidd competed in the prison, and are both now racing to Kaido. Also his plot against Shanks is likely to become another point of conflict between him and Luffy in the future. Kidd could fall off true he eventually will have to as Luffy will be the one to succeed in the end.

My point is Kidd is the Whitebeard to Luffy's Roger. Blackbeard is likely Rocks D Xebec in that equation.

 

[McNuss]

Hi there,

Well Kid haven't lost to any Commanders or anything. He'd only lost to Yonkou from what we know. He lost his arm to Shanks and he lost to Kaido. Luffy has also lost to Kaido. So the loosing streak does not say anything of his strengh other that he isn't on yonkou level.

My point is that you can't deny that Kid could fight even with Luffy. I think he is very close behind Luffy and he will have helped beating Kaido after this ark, hence not lost his will at all.

I think Kid would get slaughtered by G4.

Kid has been in the New World for two more years than Luffy. In just a short amount of time, Luffy became an 1.5 Billion Belly semi-Yonko with thousands of followers, defeating a Shishibukai and two Sweet Commanders.

Had Kid done any feat even remarkably close to Luffy's, his bounty wouldn't be so low.

A lot of people will likely fight Kaido, and Luffy will only win via circumstances as usual, but it will be Luffy's win in the end because the story is always centered around Luffy. I don't think Kid can realistically contribute too much though.

Just because his power level in Dressrosa is "sufficient " in your opinion doesn't mean he will be stuck there, thats my point.

Blackbeard isn't competing with Luffy directly per se, Kid is hence the term rival being used. Blackbeard is destined to be a pivotal opponent for Luffy whether he is the final opponent we will see. Blackbeard is and has been a yonko before Luffy was given the "5th" yonko title. Luffy and Kidd are going to the same place at the same time. They met on Saboady where they fought the marines alongside Law, when Luffy and Law were first displayed as being paired as allies Kidd was making an attempt to ally with supernova captains as well, Luffy and Kidd competed in the prison, and are both now racing to Kaido. Also his plot against Shanks is likely to become another point of conflict between him and Luffy in the future. Kidd could fall off true he eventually will have to as Luffy will be the one to succeed in the end.

There is no time to have a Kid vs Shanks arc, neither is there to keep powerscaling Law. There are too many characters left that still need to be dealt with, and there is a limit how much you can put into an arc. Wano arc already pretty much sidelined Hawkins and we have barely scratched Apoo.

My point is Kidd is the Whitebeard to Luffy's Roger. Blackbeard is likely Rocks D Xebec in that equation.

Ace and Sabo are the matching equvalents.

Roger: Pirate King
Whitebeard: Only wants family
Oden: Noble who wants to change society

Luffy: Pirate King
Ace: Only wants family
Sabo: Noble who wants to change society

 

[Mwhitt]

I think Kid would get slaughtered by G4.

Kid has been in the New World for two more years than Luffy. In just a short amount of time, Luffy became an 1.5 Billion Belly semi-Yonko with thousands of followers, defeating a Shishibukai and two Sweet Commanders...

Had Kid done any feat even remarkably close to Luffy's, his bounty wouldn't be so low.

There is no time to have a Kid vs Shanks arc, neither is there to keep powerscaling Law. There are too many characters left that still need to be dealt with, and there is a limit how much you can put into an arc. Wano arc already pretty much sidelined Hawkins and we have barely scratched Apoo.


Ace and Sabo are the matching equvalents.

Roger: Pirate King
Whitebeard: Only wants family
Oden: Noble who wants to change society

Luffy: Pirate King
Ace: Only wants family
Sabo: Noble who wants to change society

Could I borrow your crystal ball so I can see how One Piece ends?

How do you know Oda's schedule and what he has time for? There are ways of addressing things without making it into a new Dressrosa. Never said there needs to be Shanks- Kidd arc I said its likely to be another point of conflict for Kidd and Luffy.

There is plenty of time for Law honestly but to display he is stronger than he was in Dressrosa is easy. Have him accomplish a feat that would make his current self superior to his Dressrosa self. Law defeated Hawkins so he hasn't just been sitting around doing nothing. Him progressing in strength is natural.

The arc isn't over Hawkins can show up again and even if he doesn't he was never built up the way Luffy, Kidd and Law has been. Same as Apoo who can still show his stuff and be conveyed as strong.

Honestly I don't even want to touch that Luffy, Sabo and Ace thing its pretty lol and makes my head hurt seeing as that's your response to my thoughts.

--- Double Post Merged, May 8, 2020, Original Post Date: May 8, 2020 ---

Sanji and Franky vs Punk Hazard doors. We have a direct comparison of their DCs in that scene.
If Sanji can take out a Pacifista, Franky can at least do the same.
Depends which Monster trio you mean, there are different setups now with Jinbe. Also, the gap between Sanji and Franky is small, I bet.
How did Ikaros end up as Franky's opponent if Sanji knocked him out?

So a nonchalant kick Sanji did while standing in place is used as "manga fact" to support his destructive level compared to one of Franky's most powerful moves? LOL

 

[nik87]

So a nonchalant kick Sanji did while standing in place is used as "manga fact" to support his destructive level compared to one of Franky's most powerful moves? LOL

So, your assumption is that he could have gone through the door but he waited until Franky woke up to do it for him jsut for the lulz?

 

[King Moe]

So, your assumption is that he could have gone through the door but he waited until Franky woke up to do it for him jsut for the lulz?

Obvious Sanji was holding back as same like with Whitebeard when he didn't break through those walls made to withstand his power. So by your logic, WB is weaker in terms of Franky for not breaking those type of material? Again, we can use same thing about Zoro on why he can't ever get out of cages and break them himself with Haki, but still fails each time when put in situation we seen.

--- Double Post Merged, May 8, 2020, Original Post Date: May 8, 2020 ---

Sanji and Franky vs Punk Hazard doors. We have a direct comparison of their DCs in that scene.
If Sanji can take out a Pacifista, Franky can at least do the same.
Depends which Monster trio you mean, there are different setups now with Jinbe. Also, the gap between Sanji and Franky is small, I bet.
How did Ikaros end up as Franky's opponent if Sanji knocked him out?

By that logic, I guess Jimbei is Robin level since they are pair up together. M3 still the same unless you now say Luffy, Kidd, and Law (Though are WG) now since they are only one heading out by their own free will while Zoro got stop his captain instead of heading out his own. So your backing yourself into a corner again and using debunk theories that backfire every time.

 

[Mwhitt]

So, your assumption is that he could have gone through the door but he waited until Franky woke up to do it for him jsut for the lulz?

Go back and reread the chapter Sanji kicked the door with a simple kick which woke up Franky. No he didn't wait until Franky woke up. The door had 1 dent in it meaning he kicked it once and was interrupted from there by Franky asking him what is he doing. The fact you are using that as a feat against Sanji is a joke...reading comprehension

 

[nik87]

Obvious Sanji was holding back as same like with Whitebeard when he didn't break through those walls made to withstand his power. So by your logic, WB is weaker in terms of Franky for not breaking those type of material? Again, we can use same thing about Zoro on why he can't ever get out of cages and break them himself with Haki, but still fails each time when put in situation we seen.

--- Double Post Merged, May 8, 2020, Original Post Date: May 8, 2020 ---

By that logic, I guess Jimbei is Robin level since they are pair up together. M3 still the same unless you now say Luffy, Kidd, and Law (Though are WG) now since they are only one heading out by their own free will while Zoro got stop his captain instead of heading out his own. So your backing yourself into a corner again and using debunk theories that backfire every time.

Go back and reread the chapter Sanji kicked the door with a simple kick which woke up Franky. No he didn't wait until Franky woke up. The door had 1 dent in it meaning he kicked it once and was interrupted from there by Franky asking him what is he doing. The fact you are using that as a feat against Sanji is a joke...reading comprehension

You two are welcome to post a better DC feat for Sanji. Dont let me hold you back.