One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Very true Garp is an exception in this verse, he is the only character who doesn't rely on weapon to beat people unlike characters like Luffy who rely on devil fruit powers in order to be strong or even be a contender.

Its a good thing you're not going to downplay Zoro for having high attack damage than Luffy this truly is a first WOW I'm proud of you!

yeah in One Piece are equally dangerous but not all fighting styles are equal, Luffy has defeated people of different fighting styles up till now with a lot of effort on his part but Dallas if he had even half the damage Zoro can use he would have won easier, to bad he isn't on Zoro's level when it comes to damage output or Kaido would have been done by now considering how many hits he has landed.

I don't down play Zoro....

Both Zoro AND Luffy have high attack power. Luffy just doesn't need a weapon and is still nearing Yonko level. Even with a DF and being susceptible to piercing, slashing damage. Whereas Zoro needs Enma to perform these higher level attacks until he can do them on his own. He even gave up 3 sword style because his other blades can't do what Enma can. If Luffy has gauntlets that did the same thing as Enma it would be Luffy with the higher attack power...

I never once said Zoro doesn't have a high attack power tho, I disagree with your entire last paragraph. In fact Luffy has defeated Zoro couldn't multiple times starting with Crocodile despite as you think with Zoro having higher attack power than Luffy. But like i said... Luffy doesn't kill people whereas Zoro doesn't care. Its not a similar situation.

Luffy has better stats in all areas compared to Zoro with atk power arguably being better (Zoro's being better.) And now Luffy is taking Yonko level attacks so the gap seems to be widening in my opinion.

If Zoro had the stats Luffy does i would even argue Kaido would be in trouble in a 1v1 situation.

Give Zoro FS, Insane speed, overwhelming physical force, internal destruction haki, endurance and durability to tank Yonko level attacks and Kaido would have already been in serious trouble. And your right, Give Enma to Luffy and this fight would be dire for Kaido

Zoro should hand over Enma



(Joking)

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 1, 2021, Original Post Date: Feb 1, 2021 ---

Whitebeard has the greatest attack power in the world and it still wasn't enough to make him definitively stronger than Roger. Atk power among Top Tiers seems to be equally dangers no matter the fighting style with no one being greater than the other.

And for fun, the anime Episode about God Valley made Garp a Sword User @Shasha23 its pretty funny you should check it out

 

[kkck]

Its great that Luffy is so powerful he doesn't need a weapon to defeat Yonko level characters whereas almost every other top tier besides Garp has been shown to use something other than their fists.

Luffy and Garp really are exceptionally power in that regard.

Luffy doesn't kill people so his fighting style is perfect for the type of King h wants to be.

Even Oda said Luffy wins by defeating his opponents dream. Luffy doesn't have to kill someone to crush someone's dreams and that has served him well (seeing as Crocodile came back and saved his life in marineford)

That being said, you don't see all the damage punching is doing to the body where as with a clean slash you can see the flesh being cut. You can't see broken bones. Concussive damage or internal bleeding.

In One Piece all fighting styles are equally dangerous but swordsmen have the benefit of ending fights quicker unless they are very outmatched. Luffy has defeated weapon users, non weapon users, and df users alike.

There are A LOT of fighters in the series who rely simply on their bare bodies to fight, though a lot have abilities. To name a few... Katakuri (he has a trident but it's not his primary fighting style), smoothie, oven, perospero, daifuku, marco, jozu, beckham, Blackbeard, sengoku, doflamingo... just to name a few. Granted that so far yonko and yonko peers have been mostly weapon users but that doesn't mean yonko HAVE to be weapon users. Add to that, there is a bit of nuance behind big mom's use of a weapon (it's the product of a devil fruit and she uses a lot more than that in fights). And BB isn't a weapon user and yet is a yonko. WB for instance had his spear but he used his fists about as much as the spear when fighting. At times he seemed to be more of a brawler than a spear user.

It's true that luffy doesn't kill BUT you have to consider that nowadays getting punches by luffy is the equivalent of having a blender violently phased into your tender insides. A normal human would be turned to paste before a punch from luffy even touches him.

The series is rather arbitrary regarding how swordsmen finish their battles. And mostly to the benefit of zoro. Zoro generally fights swordsmen and through the story he has taken a lot of big hits from a lot of swordsmen. What you have is that big sword attacks from enemies hit zoro but he still doesn't fall. Or he accumulates a a lot of wounds through the fight but continues to push through. Meanwhile zoro defeats enemies with one hit. Zoro got ragdolled by mr 1 for instance. Or took several hits from that skypeia guy IIRC. And a lot of attacks from kaku... In turn when zoro and luffy fought back at whiskey peak the two of them exchanged blows evenly...

 

[Pirate Queen]

There are A LOT of fighters in the series who rely simply on their bare bodies to fight, though a lot have abilities. To name a few... Katakuri (he has a trident but it's not his primary fighting style), smoothie, oven, perospero, daifuku, marco, jozu, beckham, Blackbeard, sengoku, doflamingo... just to name a few.

It's true that luffy doesn't kill BUT you have to consider that nowadays getting punches by luffy is the equivalent of having a blender violently phased into your tender insides. A normal human would be turned to paste before a punch from luffy even touches him.

The series is rather arbitrary regarding how swordsmen finish their battles. And mostly to the benefit of zoro. Zoro generally fights swordsmen and through the story he has taken a lot of big hits from a lot of swordsmen. What you have is that big sword attacks from enemies hit zoro but he still doesn't fall. Or he accumulates a a lot of wounds through the fight but continues to push through. Meanwhile zoro defeats enemies with one hit. Zoro got ragdolled by mr 1 for instance. Or took several hits from that skypeia guy IIRC. And a lot of attacks from kaku... In turn when zoro and luffy fought back at whiskey peak the two of them exchanged blows evenly...

We have countless languages on this earth and you chose the speak the only one that matters: FAXXXXXXXX

 

[LadyVados]

Where's all this nonsense about King Kong Gun coming from ? It wasn't really that impressive in terms of raw destruction. I'm sure most One Piece high tiers could punch the ground and level a city

It doesn't even compare to cleaving apart the Horn of Onigashima.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 1, 2021, Original Post Date: Feb 1, 2021 ---

I don't down play Zoro....

Both Zoro AND Luffy have high attack power. Luffy just doesn't need a weapon and is still nearing Yonko level. Even with a DF and being susceptible to piercing, slashing damage. Whereas Zoro needs Enma to perform these higher level attacks until he can do them on his own. He even gave up 3 sword style because his other blades can't do what Enma can. If Luffy has gauntlets that did the same thing as Enma it would be Luffy with the higher attack power...

I never once said Zoro doesn't have a high attack power tho, I disagree with your entire last paragraph. In fact Luffy has defeated Zoro couldn't multiple times starting with Crocodile despite as you think with Zoro having higher attack power than Luffy. But like i said... Luffy doesn't kill people whereas Zoro doesn't care. Its not a similar situation.

Luffy has better stats in all areas compared to Zoro with atk power arguably being better (Zoro's being better.) And now Luffy is taking Yonko level attacks so the gap seems to be widening in my opinion.

If Zoro had the stats Luffy does i would even argue Kaido would be in trouble in a 1v1 situation.

Give Zoro FS, Insane speed, overwhelming physical force, internal destruction haki, endurance and durability to tank Yonko level attacks and Kaido would have already been in serious trouble. And your right, Give Enma to Luffy and this fight would be dire for Kaido

Zoro should hand over Enma



(Joking)

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 1, 2021, Original Post Date: Feb 1, 2021 ---

Whitebeard has the greatest attack power in the world and it still wasn't enough to make him definitively stronger than Roger. Atk power among Top Tiers seems to be equally dangers no matter the fighting style with no one being greater than the other.

And for fun, the anime Episode about God Valley made Garp a Sword User @Shasha23 its pretty funny you should check it out

Don't worry Zoro is going to demonstrate amazing durability, stamina and speed, etc. soon too.

Also if Zoro had the gomu gomu no mi he'd probably be DBZ strong and capable of neg-diffing Yonkos. Luffy should just kill himself and let Zoro eat his fruit (And Judge's Son should give him his raid suit as well)

Provided he doesn't get lost he'd become Pirate King in a day (actually knowing Zoro he'd get lost and end up in Laugh Tale !)


(Joking)

 

[Pirate Queen]

Also if Zoro had the gomu gomu no mi he'd probably be DBZ strong and capable of neg-diffing Yonkos. Luffy should just kill himself and let Zoro eat his fruit (And Judge's Son should give him his raid suit as well)

Zoro with Luffy's power/speed/df/endurance and Sanji's Raidsuit would barely be Buggy tier, unless Buggy learned haki.

If Buggy learned haki all hope is lost

 

[Aki1991]

God, here we go again

 

[Pirate Queen]

God, here we go again

If Buggy can low diff 4 Yonko at the same time rubberboi Zoro and swordboi Luffy stand no chance

 

[M3J]

Zoro still hasn't shown high damage output the way LUffy has.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Zoro still hasn't shown high damage output the way LUffy has.

Not alone but with Enma he has. Its implied that attack could have done serious damage to Kaido. BM didn't warn Kaido about Luffys punches. But did warn him about Enma... to be fair Luffy isn't using this like King Kong Gun and Black Mamba. I personally think Luffy's attack output his higher than Zoro's but not by much and only when Zoro has Enma.

Thats my thoughts until we finally get more light shined on what Enma is all about.

Personally I don't think it matters who has higher attack output. This Kaido fight is going to be about endurance and willpower.

 

[M3J]

Not alone but with Enma he has. Its implied that attack could have done serious damage to Kaido. BM didn't warn Kaido about Luffys punches. But did warn him about Enma... to be fair Luffy isn't using this like King Kong Gun and Black Mamba. I personally think Luffy's attack output his higher than Zoro's but not by much and only when Zoro has Enma.

Thats my thoughts until we finally get more light shined on what Enma is all about.

Personally I don't think it matters who has higher attack output. This Kaido fight is going to be about endurance and willpower.

It's implied but not proven. If Luffy took the sword and did the same thing, he could hurt Kaidou too. Why would Big MOm warn Kaidou about punches? She was surprised he got hurt by them, but she felt his punches long time ago and wasn't affected, whereas swords work differently from fists and has the potential to do damage. Doesn't really mean Zoro's damage output is more than Luffy's. I think it's just a ridiculous point to make to make Zoro look better.

 

[Aki1991]

If Buggy can low diff 4 Yonko at the same time rubberboi Zoro and swordboi Luffy stand no chance

Was about that we have again a Zolo > Luffy discussion here...

I don't like that the 5 SN are performing so much better than the 9S. What do you guys think about that?

 

[jaymizzo]

Swords look flashy and that's why their attack power looks absurd. It's worth looking at it this way, Zoros attack power is like a Chidori whereas a punch is like a Rasengan.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 1, 2021, Original Post Date: Feb 1, 2021 ---

Was about that we have again a Zolo > Luffy discussion here...

I don't like that the 5 SN are performing so much better than the 9S. What do you guys think about that?

Luffy Vs Zoro will always end with Luffy as the winner

You'll very rarely see Luffy fans instigate a Luffy Vs Zoro, our sights are significantly higher.

 

[Pirate Queen]

It's implied but not proven. If Luffy took the sword and did the same thing, he could hurt Kaidou too. Why would Big MOm warn Kaidou about punches? She was surprised he got hurt by them, but she felt his punches long time ago and wasn't affected, whereas swords work differently from fists and has the potential to do damage. Doesn't really mean Zoro's damage output is more than Luffy's. I think it's just a ridiculous point to make to make Zoro look better.

Well this is more a feat of an Enma feat than a Zoro feat so I have nonproblem saying his atk power right now is near Luffy's. I think it's bad ass Luffy had a subordinate that can threaten a Yonko. It just means Luffy is that much stronger. Zoro is doing great things.

 

[Fox666]

Well this is more a feat of an Enma feat than a Zoro feat so I have nonproblem saying his atk power right now is near Luffy's. I think it's bad ass Luffy had a subordinate that can threaten a Yonko. It just means Luffy is that much stronger. Zoro is doing great things.

It doesn't matter if Zoro's new power is due to Enma. Luffy also need his Devil Fruit to ever stand a chance against the Emperors.

The important thing is that a single attack from Enma already exausted Zoro, and he missed it due to how hard it's to control.

 

[Pirate Queen]

It doesn't matter if Zoro's new power is due to Enma. Luffy also need his Devil Fruit to ever stand a chance against the Emperors.

The important thing is that a single attack from Enma already exausted Zoro, and he missed it due to how hard it's to control.

He's going to get control of it pretty quickly and then he's going to be sending those slashes out as easily as Mihawk splitting the tsunami

 

[M3J]

Was about that we have again a Zolo > Luffy discussion here...

I don't like that the 5 SN are performing so much better than the 9S. What do you guys think about that?

I'm okay with that, especially when Luffy was implied or said to be superior to Kinemon and likely most others. Inu and Neko getting wrecked makes sense when you consider they took turns fighting Jack while the other rested.

Well this is more a feat of an Enma feat than a Zoro feat so I have nonproblem saying his atk power right now is near Luffy's. I think it's bad ass Luffy had a subordinate that can threaten a Yonko. It just means Luffy is that much stronger. Zoro is doing great things.

Is it though, if Enma's still using Zoro's strength? Even then it doesn't really make sense because slashes work differently from stabs and blunt attacks. Luffy's attacks could level an entire town and reduce it to rubbles while ZOro's slashes could cut a town in half but otherwise keep it intact. I don't see how you can compare that. It's a different way of dealing damage, but Zoro uses swords, I don't see how it'll ever compare to Luffy's attacks in terms of power.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Is it though, if Enma's still using Zoro's strength? Even then it doesn't really make sense because slashes work differently from stabs and blunt attacks. Luffy's attacks could level an entire town and reduce it to rubbles while ZOro's slashes could cut a town in half but otherwise keep it intact. I don't see how you can compare that. It's a different way of dealing damage, but Zoro uses swords, I don't see how it'll ever compare to Luffy's attacks in terms of power.

No you definitely can't compare slashing to blunt damage. Both devastating in their own right.

 

[MakMatik]

From what I've seen most of us agree that the RS adds speed, durability and invisibility to Sanji's repertoire. How will you feel about Sanji taking out a YC given that his portrayal has been less than stellar post TS?

Especially considering this will be his first proper 1 on 1 in the new world. Hell memories and poele frire spectre; maybe concasse have been the strongest moves he's used so far.

If he has something stronger, even if we include his growth during the fight, why wait till now to show it and how much would it have helped at an earlier point in the NW?

 

[Nie Li]

Well this is more a feat of an Enma feat than a Zoro feat so I have nonproblem saying his atk power right now is near Luffy's. I think it's bad ass Luffy had a subordinate that can threaten a Yonko. It just means Luffy is that much stronger. Zoro is doing great things.

Anything that Zoro does with Enma is a Zoro feat, who is using his own skills and haki through the sword.

The same holds true for Luffy. Anything he does in G2-4 are his feats, and not the gomu gomu's.

Both can only do what they do because of the tools they have, and wouldn't be able to without them, but that's how the characters work; it's their feats.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Anything that Zoro does with Enma is a Zoro feat, who is using his own skills and haki through the sword.

I'll disagree until we get more info about Enma but I'm not 100% against the idea.