One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[Shasha23]

It clear you don't understand how Enma is a power up for Zoro so I'm just going to walk away from this for now.

Enma having its own ability doesn't make it a power-up, Zoro mastering Enma is a power-up, a weapon has never been a power-up, it just gives the user new avenues of power to explore.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 3, 2021, Original Post Date: Feb 3, 2021 ---

If Zoro is capable of doing everything he can WITHOUT Enma.... why is Enma still the only sword he has that is capable of cutting Kaido?
Interesting question that no one seems to have the answer to...

Spoiler: 1003

Dont gloss over my point again please, you just see this very chapter that Zoro cuts Kaido with his other blades, so this point of yours that only Enma can cut him since it has magic powers from Oden is a moot point, Enma is not the holy sword but just a blade that has shown Zoro others ways of attacking, strength different from Shusui

 

[Pirate Queen]

Enma having its own ability doesn't make it a power-up, Zoro mastering Enma is a power-up, a weapon has never been a power-up, it just gives the user new avenues of power to explore.

If Zoro is capable of doing everything he can WITHOUT Enma.... why is Enma still the only sword he has that is capable of cutting Kaido?

Spoiler: 1003

even in the latest chapter the spoiler say Kaido realizes Zpro is using Enma. 4 times a Yonko has focused on Enma itself and not on Zoro. 4 times... and not 1 mention of the person wielding it

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 3, 2021, Original Post Date: Feb 3, 2021 ---

Enma having its own ability doesn't make it a power-up, Zoro mastering Enma is a power-up, a weapon has never been a power-up, it just gives the user new avenues of power to explore.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 3, 2021, Original Post Date: Feb 3, 2021 ---

Spoiler: 1003

Dont gloss over my point again please, you just see this very chapter that Zoro cuts Kaido with his other blades, so this point of yours that only Enma can cut him since it has magic powers from Oden is a moot point, Enma is not the holy sword but just a blade that has shown Zoro others ways of attacking, strength different from Shusui

Spoiler: 1003

you can see Zoro is leading with Enma... again. You can see it clear in the picture....

 

[XXGenesis]

@Pirate Queen @Shasha23

Enma is a Magic blade that can cut Kaido.
Ok, some may view that as a cheap mechanism to make Zoro more relevant than necessary.

Except for the caveat that Enma is cursed; Zoro hasnt been seen struggling aside from this battle with the Curse function. Still yet Zoro had to train with the weapon before he could use it effectively.

Shouldn’t be anymore nay sayers. Zoro is & was hella strong After the TS. He just never had a opponent to really go al out on. Spoilers for 1003 are looking real crazy

 

[Ellenate]

I don't think so as they never really mentioned his fruit or destructive capabilities, but he inherited that title after Roger passed, if I recall correctly. Blackbeard got the fruit because it's OP, but it wouldn't make him the strongest. We've never seen Blackbeard get hyped to that level after the timeskip, even when Jinbei was catching Luffy up on current events.

sengoku did when he said he could destroy the world.

 

[Fox666]

That's what i assumed too but i think he's holding it at marineford. Mihawk challenging him, sengoku's words, being the closest to pirate king-

Mihawk's words are ambiguous in the original. He says he wants to measure how closer to him Whitebeard has fallen. (you may ask someone else about this)

Whitebeard is said to have sit in front of the "throne" but never taken it because Roger told him everything about Laugh Tale and the One Piece, but Whitebeard had no interest on it.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 3, 2021, Original Post Date: Feb 3, 2021 ---

sengoku did when he said he could destroy the world.

That seems to have been exaggerated.

Officially, the Gura Gura no Mi is the "strongest Paramecia" and equal to a Logia.

Kizaru appears to have similar destructive power, instantly causing an explosion underwater that liften the waters around Marineford.

 

[Ellenate]

Mihawk's words are ambiguous in the original. He says he wants to measure how closer to him Whitebeard has fallen. (you may ask someone else about this)

Whitebeard is said to have sit in front of the "throne" but never taken it because Roger told him everything about Laugh Tale and the One Piece, but Whitebeard had no interest on it.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 3, 2021, Original Post Date: Feb 3, 2021 ---

That seems to have been exaggerated.

Officially, the Gura Gura no Mi is the "strongest Paramecia" and equal to a Logia.

Kizaru appears to have similar destructive power, instantly causing an explosion underwater that liften the waters around Marineford.

"equal to a logia" compares it to arguable the strongest logai.


Blackbeard strongest* man alive; confirmed!
Whitebeard strongest* man alive during marineford!


You guys may not like it but that is what peak power looks like.

(note: combat may vary.)

 

[Fox666]

"equal to a logia" compares it to arguable the strongest logai.

If it's called "the strongest Paramecia", then it should not the strongest fruit.

Blackbeard called the Yami Yami no Mi the strongest of all fruits.

 

[LadyVados]

It's implied but not proven. If Luffy took the sword and did the same thing, he could hurt Kaidou too. Why would Big MOm warn Kaidou about punches? She was surprised he got hurt by them, but she felt his punches long time ago and wasn't affected, whereas swords work differently from fists and has the potential to do damage. Doesn't really mean Zoro's damage output is more than Luffy's. I think it's just a ridiculous point to make to make Zoro look better.

I doubt Luffy could use Enma

 

[M3J]

PRetty sure he can. Feel free to prove otherwise though

 

[LadyVados]

Someone on reddit posted this and I agree with it 100%-

I don’t like power scaling (something like A>B) because results of fights depend on different factors, so we can’t compare the characters like solving mathematical questions.
However, I have to admit that Oda does not keep a good balance between Zoro and Luffy, because they are portrayed in two opposite ways as shonen protagonists. Luffy’s fighting style is to keep throwing punch until he is exhausted, as well as keep challenging the boss no matter how many times he got defeated. However, Zoro is a swordman so every slash is lethal. The enemies are not supposed to tank it with their bodies, unless they have insane durability or specific abilities. That is why most of the Zoro’s enemies seem like being “one-shotted”.
Both Luffy and Zoro are badass in their own ways. However, by their natures, Luffy needs to be defeated multiple times to show his unbreakable will power, but Zoro promised he will never lose. When you put these two together, no matter how the narratives always indicate Luffy is superior, Zoro inevitably seems more impressive.

 

[Nie Li]

PRetty sure he can. Feel free to prove otherwise though

Luffy probably can hold Enma and survive the sideeffects like Zoro did, but actually use it efficiently to cut someone? Not in a thousand years. Twice in the series have they made it a point that Luffy should refrain from using swords.

 

[Shasha23]

PRetty sure he can. Feel free to prove otherwise though

Same way he was able to use Kitetsu, sure thing then

 

[Wurstkuche]

The Zoro and Enma discussion is really interesting. How do you guys see Oden since it seems it had some magical properties back then? I heard some thing very and I think it might be true. Enma, on top of its usual properties might literally have a bit of Odens essence in it (similar to what Kawamatsu said to Onimaru) so it is an additional boost until Odens will is completed. But once they win the battle against the beast pirates odens will will be full filled and it will become a blackblade. And maybe that’s how you get a black blade, by the swordsmans ambition being fullfilled. It would make sense about Mihawk being the only one we’ve seen with a blackblade. I like that theory and then maybe enma stays in wano and becomes a National treasure like shusui.

For those upset about Zoro power I think you gotta get used to it because it’s here to stay. Enma has pushed him train his haki and he probably remembers the feeling so I think he’ll be able to do the same with other swords. And if he gets the ni-dai kitetsu which is a higher grade sword then I really don’t see the damage output changing. We’ll see tho.

But yea if he’s really meant to bring about Odens will then he was meant to play a big part in the battle. If you look at the lore and the manga. White tigers do battle with the dragon. And a few times Zoro has been identified as a tiger (ch 695 cover, white tiger with Zoro likeness, and then kanjuro drawing of the white tiger and the dragon on Zou)

Also this maybe be just a coincidence but I did think it was interesting that in an SBS Oda said that if Zoro were to resemble a flower it would be a wisteria lol

 

[sir_rocky]

Enma is not some magical blade that miraculously makes Zoro able to cut Kaido.

It is still Zoros own haki that gets released through Enma.

Give Enma to a weaker swordsman and it would probably suck him dry of haki and he still would not be able to hurt Kaido.

 

[Ellenate]

If it's called "the strongest Paramecia", then it should not the strongest fruit.

Blackbeard called the Yami Yami no Mi the strongest of all fruits.

couldn't that be due to it possibly stealing other fruits?

All i'm saying is nothing outright counters-

Blackbeard being the strongest man alive
Whitebeard being the strongest man alive during marineford

...in fact, the story does nothing but support these ideas.

(note: combat may vary. )

 

[Shasha23]

If Zoro is capable of doing everything he can WITHOUT Enma.... why is Enma still the only sword he has that is capable of cutting Kaido?

Spoiler: 1003

even in the latest chapter the spoiler say Kaido realizes Zpro is using Enma. 4 times a Yonko has focused on Enma itself and not on Zoro. 4 times... and not 1 mention of the person wielding it

Spoiler: 1003

Zoro just used a 3 sword style attack and damaged Kaido, so again your point is moot

Spoiler: 1003

you can see Zoro is leading with Enma... again. You can see it clear in the picture....

Spoiler: 1003

Did he use 3 sword style with 3 Enma blades? when did Zoro get the copy copy no mi?

 

[Wurstkuche]

Enma is not some magical blade that miraculously makes Zoro able to cut Kaido.

It is still Zoros own haki that gets released through Enma.

Give Enma to a weaker swordsman and it would probably suck him dry of haki and he still would not be able to hurt Kaido.

Magical in the sense that has those properties of drawing out the users haki. It’s definitely highly unusual. Sword makes it clear that this isn’t for the weak. Curious to see if other blades have different properties like enma as the grade increases

 

[Pirate Queen]

Hey!

The latest SBS has Oda revealing that if Nami had Enel's DF she would be the strongest Strawhat (excluding Luffy)

Imagine that for a direct powerscaling quote directly from ODA????

Imagine a SH crew with a battle hierarchy like this:

Luffy
Nami
Jinbei
Zoro
Sanji

Lol thats insane!!!!!!!!

 

[Gallon]

Bruh wot? She'd get wrecked by Seiryuu Zoro, pls.

 

[Nie Li]

Hey!

The latest SBS has Oda revealing that if Nami had Enel's DF she would be the strongest Strawhat (excluding Luffy)

Imagine that for a direct powerscaling quote directly from ODA????

Imagine a SH crew with a battle hierarchy like this:

Luffy
Nami
Jinbei
Zoro
Sanji

Lol thats insane!!!!!!!!

Enel's DF is one of the strongest logias, and it suits Nami's way of fighting perfectly. Even then, if we're seriously powerscaling, I don't feel like she would even be as strong as Enel if she ate it right now. She would have greater potential in how to use it, but just taking into account Enel's haki she would still lose now.