One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

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• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[M3J]

it was a sneak attack, akainu was chasing luffy and jinbei

akainu's back was turned and focused on someone else, he was essentially ambushed and wb lost half his face in the process, actually taking the more fatal wound

But also, Whitebeard still didn't go down, whereas most fighters would. And given Big Mom's defense and Kaidou's ability to tank damage, as well as Shanks being able to stop Kaidou somehow and talk to the Gorosei, it makes sense people would assume the emperors are superior to the admirals.

I'm of the opinion that it depends on who fights whom, along with other stuff.

 

[hokageji]

Marco did well against BM, I think WB's commanders might just be stronger than the rest.

I think WB commanders top 3, which includes Jozu, Marco and Vista are probably as strong as the other YC.... i wouldn't put Isshou and the others at the same level...

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

i think marco is stronger than katakuri , he's easily stronger than king
I think jozu and vista are likely stronger than jack cracker smoothie and queen

 

[albertwv]

it was a sneak attack, akainu was chasing luffy and jinbei

akainu's back was turned and focused on someone else, he was essentially ambushed and wb lost half his face in the process, actually taking the more fatal wound

Sneak attack? OR it just shows how fast WB can be and how Akainu FAILED to react in time to dodge, assuming Akainu has FS since he was able to dodge both Marcos and Vistas Haki attack. This shows how fast old sick injured WB can be and still keep fighting after getting his face blown. It show that WB took a fatal wound but didnt even stop him at all, if anything his death was caused by the BB pirates not Akainu.

--- Double Post Merged, May 13, 2021, Original Post Date: May 13, 2021 ---

Saying kizaru did was a bug WB is an understatement , a hole to a chest isn’t getting bugged , it passed

And then he casually pinned his bisento to the ground with one foot and then looked away

if anything kizaru was the one treating WB like the inconvenience

Nah WB didnt flinch or even care about Kizaru, he probably didnt feel anything from the lazer. Like I mentioned Marcos took 2-3 lasers and still got up quickly, 1 laser while he was in seastone cuffs. What makes you think WB even felt that laser lol. Also it doesnt seem like WB was struggling to lift his bisento. This is the man who stopped a paddle ship with one hand, Kizaru hasnt done anything strength worthy.
Kizaru was the inconvenience to WB.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Sneak attack? OR it just shows how fast WB can be and how Akainu FAILED to react in time to dodge, assuming Akainu has FS since he was able to dodge both Marcos and Vistas Haki attack. This shows how fast old sick injured WB can be and still keep fighting after getting his face blown. It show that WB took a fatal wound but didnt even stop him at all, if anything his death was caused by the BB pirates not Akainu.

--- Double Post Merged, May 13, 2021, Original Post Date: May 13, 2021 ---

Nah WB didnt flinch or even care about Kizaru, he probably didnt feel anything from the lazer. Like I mentioned Marcos took 2-3 lasers and still got up quickly, 1 laser while he was in seastone cuffs. What makes you think WB even felt that laser lol. Also it doesnt seem like WB was struggling to lift his bisento. This is the man who stopped a paddle ship with one hand, Kizaru hasnt done anything strength worthy.
Kizaru was the inconvenience to WB.

You’re assuming he has future sight and remember , akainu was focused on something else , COO kinda has to work with a clear mind , akainu focus was on chasing Jinbei and luffy
Ya literally tweisting and creating head cannon to get to your point
Marco and vista again attacked akainu from the front within his line of sight ,

there’s no implication of that he was taken unawares or his back to them , that isn’t relevant at all
WB literally snuck on him that his men told him to look out
a nuisance is someone you could easily do away with , kizaru actually immobilized WB when he pinned his bisento , was looking away even , then he pierced him , kizaru was casual as hell , don’t know how you can call him just a nusianxe when WB did nothing of significance to him

Marco is literally a PHOENIX , he can regenerate , he took the lasers and was cuffed so we had no idea , but he was kinda useless in that state had to get the cuffs off and regenerate so he could be useful in battle again

 

[albertwv]

You’re assuming he has future sight and remember , akainu was focused on something else , COO kinda has to work with a clear mind , akainu focus was on chasing Jinbei and luffy
Ya literally tweisting and creating head cannon to get to your point
Marco and vista again attacked akainu from the front within his line of sight ,

there’s no implication of that he was taken unawares or his back to them , that isn’t relevant at all
WB literally snuck on him that his men told him to look out
a nuisance is someone you could easily do away with , kizaru actually immobilized WB when he pinned his bisento , was looking away even , then he pierced him , kizaru was casual as hell , don’t know how you can call him just a nusianxe when WB did nothing of significance to him

Marco is literally a PHOENIX , he can regenerate , he took the lasers and was cuffed so we had no idea , but he was kinda useless in that state had to get the cuffs off and regenerate so he could be useful in battle again

I stated that I am assuming that Akainu has FS or even Great CoO since he is an admiral and by pointing out Akainu vs Marco and Vista, years later we found out that, that is thanks to FS. Whether there back is turn or eyes closed or whatever, Haki still works.

And well I mentioned how Marco took Kizarus laser like whatever even when seastone cuffed and WB has a more tolerable damage than Marcos, so it is safe to imply that the lasers didnt do much to WB, Kizaru didnt do much to WB either. If anything WB slashed at Kizaru to stop Kizaru from attacking Luffy. We know Kizarus lasers are dangerous to weaker people but WB wasnt weak and him taking on 3 lasers shows how much of a monster WB is.

WB showed no struggle with Kizaru and neither did Kizaru, but do you really believe that Kizaru's foot is able to stop WB from lifting his bisento if WB really wanted. Do you really believe that? @LordTraffyLaw

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

I stated that I am assuming that Akainu has FS or even Great CoO since he is an admiral and by pointing out Akainu vs Marco and Vista, years later we found out that, that is thanks to FS. Whether there back is turn or eyes closed or whatever, Haki still works.

And well I mentioned how Marco took Kizarus laser like whatever even when seastone cuffed and WB has a more tolerable damage than Marcos, so it is safe to imply that the lasers didnt do much to WB, Kizaru didnt do much to WB either. If anything WB slashed at Kizaru to stop Kizaru from attacking Luffy. We know Kizarus lasers are dangerous to weaker people but WB wasnt weak and him taking on 3 lasers shows how much of a monster WB is.

WB showed no struggle with Kizaru and neither did Kizaru, but do you really believe that Kizaru's foot is able to stop WB from lifting his bisento if WB really wanted. Do you really believe that? @LordTraffyLaw

Yes because why wouldn’t he not try , he’s trying to save ace , heck the time kizaru pinned it down , ace was about to be executed , WB really needed to get past kizaru at that very moment , but he didn’t
Yeah if his slash landed it’d be an issue but he dodged it or countered as he should have
WB in that state and critical moment had no reason to hold back his son was being executed the only thing he held back was

again I’m referring to old sick whitebeard people kinda conflate primebeard at times for him , in his prime this would have been no issue , but his heart was acting up , he couldnot even use his COO and COC at will

 

[M3J]

i think marco is stronger than katakuri , he's easily stronger than king
I think jozu and vista are likely stronger than jack cracker smoothie and queen

I don't think there's really any way to tell at this point. If Marco is easily stronger than King, then why hasn't King gone down? Has he sustained significant damage? I mean, they each have their own strengths and weaknesses that make them great at combat, like Katakuri's Future Sight and Marco's regeneration.

 

[albertwv]

Yes because why wouldn’t he not try , he’s trying to save ace , heck the time kizaru pinned it down , ace was about to be executed , WB really needed to get past kizaru at that very moment , but he didn’t
Yeah if his slash landed it’d be an issue but he dodged it or countered as he should have
WB in that state and critical moment had no reason to hold back his son was being executed the only thing he held back was

again I’m referring to old sick whitebeard people kinda conflate primebeard at times for him , in his prime this would have been no issue , but his heart was acting up , he couldnot even use his COO and COC at will

Okay I do not agree with you but so be it. I think we should change subject.

i think marco is stronger than katakuri , he's easily stronger than king
I think jozu and vista are likely stronger than jack cracker smoothie and queen

I totally agree with you on this. For some reason, I feel Katakuri is weaker than Marcos and even King but we have yet to see what King can offer, so at the moment Katakuri > King.
Jozu and Vista can easily be YC2s and have been the ones whove shown what a YC can do besides Jack. I think the WBP top 4 Commanders are stronger than the rest of YCs to include the Red Haired YCs. I believe this because they have been fighting since Rogers era, We have yet to see how strong the Red Haired YCs are.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Okay I do not agree with you but so be it. I think we should change subject.



I totally agree with you on this. For some reason, I feel Katakuri is weaker than Marcos and even King but we have yet to see what King can offer, so at the moment Katakuri > King.
Jozu and Vista can easily be YC2s and have been the ones whove shown what a YC can do besides Jack. I think the WBP top 4 Commanders are stronger than the rest of YCs to include the Red Haired YCs. I believe this because they have been fighting since Rogers era, We have yet to see how strong the Red Haired YCs are.

Yeah I think they’re two tier among 1st commanders ( with Zoro being smack in the middle )

-Marco Ben beckmann Rayleigh
Zoro
-King katakuri ( betting Blackbeard right hand man is in this tier )

the red haired crew is kinda implied to have the most formidable fighters among the top members on average

 

[AmitDS]

If Perospero is revealed to be YC3 leveled due to fighting Nekomamushi (they're both injured) this would align with him having a higher bounty than Snack (YC4), having an enmity with Marco, and also open up the possibility that him and even Compote could have been Big Mom's commanders in their youth.

So certain flying 6 members, Ace, Perospero, Yamato, and even other notable members of Shanks/BB's crews could all potentially show us that Emperors have more commander leveled fighters than their main 3-4 commanders which makes them being threats to the gov't more believable than it was prior.

 

[albertwv]

If Perospero is revealed to be YC3 leveled due to fighting Nekomamushi (they're both injured) this would align with him having a higher bounty than Snack (YC4), having an enmity with Marco, and also open up the possibility that him and even Compote could have been Big Mom's commanders in their youth.

So certain flying 6 members, Ace, Perospero, Yamato, and even other notable members of Shanks/BB's crews could all potentially show us that Emperors have more commander leveled fighters than their main 3-4 commanders which makes them being threats to the gov't more believable than it was prior.

I wish Oda had shown us more what Snack and Compote could do. I wanted to see a preview of how Snack vs Urouge went, my theory is that both Urouge and Kid fought Snack, with Kid just injuring Snack and leaving, then Urouge fighting an injured Snack and winning but then facing Cracker and forced to retreat.
I put Perospero below Cracker for the time being. Hes a hard one to place given his seniority and how he believes the BMP would fall under his command.

Yeah that could be possible outside the Top 3-4. I think Ace was the weakest of the top 4 WB commanders since he was inexperienced. Who do you think from the Flying 6 is around YC level? Whos Whos admitted that he would need help to take down Queen since it may be too much for him alone. I dont see Drake being YC level.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

If Perospero is revealed to be YC3 leveled due to fighting Nekomamushi (they're both injured) this would align with him having a higher bounty than Snack (YC4), having an enmity with Marco, and also open up the possibility that him and even Compote could have been Big Mom's commanders in their youth.

So certain flying 6 members, Ace, Perospero, Yamato, and even other notable members of Shanks/BB's crews could all potentially show us that Emperors have more commander leveled fighters than their main 3-4 commanders which makes them being threats to the gov't more believable than it was prior.

Again people need to remember , bounties aren’t just about power , pero soero is her oldest son so he’s her most experienced and he’s shown repeatedly to be the best leader among them ( aside katakuri maybe ) and in general the smartest , there’s more to piracy than just strength
Perospero has shown himself to be
And no I don’t think he’s as powerful as the likes of jack and cracker , well especially cracker
I didn’t get the impression he was as strong as that but he is smart and a good and creative fighter , I could seeing him around snack tier of strength
If an injured neko can compete and even defeat him it’s clear he isn’t YC3 strength

who’s who admitting help to take queen down was a bait and switch to lure x drake out , he might end up being just as powerful or even more powerful than queen , I suspect them to be a level 6 prisoner hiding under kaido and hiding their strength ( hence why they recognized jinbei)

I think at their best I think who’s who and x drake are potentially commander level fighters

 

[AmitDS]

I wish Oda had shown us more what Snack and Compote could do. I wanted to see a preview of how Snack vs Urouge went, my theory is that both Urouge and Kid fought Snack, with Kid just injuring Snack and leaving, then Urouge fighting an injured Snack and winning but then facing Cracker and forced to retreat.
I put Perospero below Cracker for the time being. Hes a hard one to place given his seniority and how he believes the BMP would fall under his command.

Yeah that could be possible outside the Top 3-4. I think Ace was the weakest of the top 4 WB commanders since he was inexperienced. Who do you think from the Flying 6 is around YC level? Whos Whos admitted that he would need help to take down Queen since it may be too much for him alone. I dont see Drake being YC level.

Compote, being a woman, and I'm not being sexist, could ideally have weird hax abilities that don't require fighting per se, like Pudding and Brulee. If she has a fruit fruit for eg. she could get OP shit like controlling/shutting down devil fruit powers or something with certain limitations.

Ace being arguably commander leveled but outside of the top 3 of his crew, us finding out about Shanks powerful members, Perospero having a higher bounty than YC4/being Marco's enemy all leave me to believe that each emperor's crew is going to give us a few people close to their top commanders. This is why I believe Kaido's F6 has at least 1 and BB's will give us some too.

I think if Killer, Law, Sanji, Zoro & Kidd are going to be considered YC leveled going forward, odds are that Drake and Hawkins are too. Ignoring Zoro, Sanji and Law, I don't see Killer leaving Drake and Hawkins in the dust especially since he's fighting Hawkins now. Killer was always less important IMO than Drake in this arc until he got on that rooftop. Drake doesn't have to be as strong as Cracker/Jack but being close is good enough IMO.

I think it's not odd to say, IMO, that Who's Who and Drake are commander leveled since Drake is a SN and Who's Who is fighting Jinbei who I think we all consider to be close to a commander and one of Luffy's future 3 'commanders'. Jinbei needs a commander leveled person to have a challenge IMO since he actually has hype already. If he can't get King, Queen or Jack then I'm assuming his opponent shouldn't be far off from YC leveled.

These are all my assumptions and headcanons though.

Again people need to remember , bounties aren’t just about power , pero soero is her oldest son so he’s her most experienced and he’s shown repeatedly to be the best leader among them ( aside katakuri maybe ) and in general the smartest , there’s more to piracy than just strength
Perospero has shown himself to be
And no I don’t think he’s as powerful as the likes of jack and cracker , well especially cracker
I didn’t get the impression he was as strong as that but he is smart and a good and creative fighter , I could seeing him around snack tier of strength
If an injured neko can compete and even defeat him it’s clear he isn’t YC3 strength

who’s who admitting help to take queen down was a bait and switch to lure x drake out , he might end up being just as powerful or even more powerful than queen , I suspect them to be a level 6 prisoner hiding under kaido and hiding their strength ( hence why they recognized jinbei)

I think at their best I think who’s who and x drake are potentially commander level fighters

Bounties aren't always indicative of power levels however at times they are, especially in the same crews where the culture and missions are of the same nature. So Katakuri's bounty may not prove that he's inferior to King but surely indicates he's stronger than Smoothie and Cracker. It's generally understood when a bounty shows strength and when it doesn't. Usopp's bounty has nothing to do with his actual power while Zoro's does, for example.

I don't think he's confirmed Jack leveled, I was just saying that it can still be a possibility precisely because he's so old, he's going to fight Nekomamushi soon, and also because he is a mage-like fighter and is quite smart so his physicals don't necessarily have to be his best attribute.

I think Drake and maybe Who's Who can be commander leveled or close to it even though Drake isn't an actual Beast Pirate.

 

[LadyVados]

Yeah I think they’re two tier among 1st commanders ( with Zoro being smack in the middle )

-Marco Ben beckmann Rayleigh
Zoro
-King katakuri ( betting Blackbeard right hand man is in this tier )

the red haired crew is kinda implied to have the most formidable fighters among the top members on average

I put Rayleigh in the same tier as Roger, Primbeard and Prime Garp, above even the Yonko.

Even Old Rayleigh should be on Old Garp's level so well above Marco

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

I put Rayleigh in the same tier as Roger, Primbeard and Prime Garp, above even the Yonko.

Even Old Rayleigh should be on Old Garp's level so well above Marco

Rayleigh didn’t show that he could coat COC on his weapon though , and he was kinda opposed to kaido , not ruling outRayleigh being able to use it , I do think he’s still a strong beast

 

[LadyVados]

Is Doflamingo the most overrated character in One Piece. Some people still think he could have beaten Aokiji...

--- Double Post Merged, May 14, 2021, Original Post Date: May 14, 2021 ---

VS Battles wiki now rates Mihawk above the Yonko... (they previously rated him at Vista-level)

It seems Zoro's crazy feats are making the One Piece fandom come around to the side of reason.

 

[albertwv]

Rayleigh didn’t show that he could coat COC on his weapon though , and he was kinda opposed to kaido , not ruling outRayleigh being able to use it , I do think he’s still a strong beast

Well in Rayleighs defense, Oda had yet to introduce coating CoA with CoC, I think he does have it. I would rate Prime Ray up there with Prime Roger, just a little behind obviously, and now Old Ray I would reckon he is right below Yonko level, seeing how he was able to fight Kizaru even at his old age. Garp mentioned he wouldnt want the Marines to take on 2 legends at the same time.

Old Rayleigh is still above any of the current YC1s.

Is Doflamingo the most overrated character in One Piece. Some people still think he could have beaten Aokiji...

--- Double Post Merged, May 14, 2021, Original Post Date: May 14, 2021 ---

VS Battles wiki now rates Mihawk above the Yonko... (they previously rated him at Vista-level)

It seems Zoro's crazy feats are making the One Piece fandom come around to the side of reason.

Doffy is YC3 level, he couldve pushed Aokiji to break a sweat or injure Aokiji but wouldve lost.
We're not supposed to talk about Mihawk, but I think he is overrated. Buggy was scared shitless from facing WB, but showed no fear when attacking Mihawk (Not a joke). I want to see Zolo in action again this arc.

 

[Critical mindset]

Let's talk about the juicy stuff, yes I want to hear your opinion on this @Rd8901 also you @Best Generation this one is too good

So Vergo was just playing with Sanji. Proof?

Here you see Vergo seemingly going to attack with his left leg

Problem is he attacks with his right leg (foot). Like I didn't notice this at first but here you can see the angling of the stationary leg, the hanging robe where there is supposed to be a right leg lol, just look at the shape of the foot which shows the inside of the foot facing up. This stance only makes sense by it being the right leg. You can clearly see this is the right leg (ankle) clashing lol

This means Vergo SWITCHED LEGS ON PURPOSE LOL

Sanji is using his strongest part of the leg for defence. Consider Sanji also would've used armament haki for defence, while Vergo is using his ankle. Guess who breaks :

But next panel we see him doing this fancy but still unorthodox leg swipe but with the left leg. Means he switched legs yet again :giggle::giggle::

Meaning Vergo was never ever serious. He was actually legit toying with Sanji This was all troll from Vergo, and this is hella fun to watch.

I dont know whats more fun, the leg switching ankle kick or the leg switching leg swipe (the leg swipe shows flowing haki in the kick btw, actual ryou which I highlighted)

This is why I say only internal haki makes sense, otherwise Vergo's physical strength is far superior to BM who clashed with Sanji in WCI, while Vergo broke his leg with his ankle doing a leg switch looking seemingly bored doing it lol

Yet you think Vergo is irrelevant lol what a mistake

 

[john ellis]

the issue i have is the fight was near a total victory for the marines even, there top tiers recieved virtually 0 damage. If BM took on WB she would of come out of the fight with alot of damage. 3 BM? well then she probably would of come out of the fight unharmed. But even with 2 warlords and luffy(kinda revelent at the time) coming as back up, they lost quite convincingly. Also even in his old age WB was possibly the strongest yonku anyway. Even if he wasn't akainu pretty much won the 1 vs 1 anyway. Yes he took some hits but they didn't seem to really phase him, as much as him buring half of whitebeard's face off and punched a whole though his body did.

Also plot wise luffy will likely take on the admirals after he deals with the yonko, and if the admirals are that much folder material. Well zoro will likely be better then mihak, blackleg will be slightly behind zoro. Luffy will be yonko+. How do the admirals deal with this at all. Yes i know they're supposed to lose but someone stronger then mihawk is probably low yonko tier. Like zoro is still probably below mihawk right now and his feats are arguably just below yonko tier right now. Mihawk is then logically probably low yonko tier at the worst. Once zoro defeats him he's slightly stronger then low yonko tier. The govnerment then has to fight 1 above yonko tier 1 low yonko tier which evens out 2 yonko tiers. Plus black leg who will likely be YC+ tier at the very least.