One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

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As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[grey matter]

I think you're giving Conqueror's coating far less credit than it deserves; it makes blows significantly more devastating, increases reach, as well as allows one to use it defensively as a barrier. It is a game changer.

Could be. I'm waiting to see more of this to accurately rate it's usage in general combat

Plus, Yamato is one of the only characters that has taken a direct CoC blow from Kaido and stayed conscious

Everyone at the rooftop took blows from Kaido and BM.
Law and Kid are still fighting BM, pretty sure they've tanked many off screen as well.

And again, it depends on perspective.
For me, Kaido 100% was not going to kill her. So, he held back a bit IMO

All three excel at different things, so I don't think it's easy to rank them comfortably.

I agree.

For me, Yamato excels against "Yonko tiers"

Marco excels in most matchups involving admiral tiers and below.

Like I said before, I rank Marco a above the rest, generally speaking, because of his having direct comparisons to admirals, and his 1v2 against King+Queen for hours while healing up thousands of soldiers (which directly contributed to his depletion of stamina)

Yamato only has two feats so far in the series - against Ulti, and against Kaido.
Against Ulti was in her base, and zoan is a powerup.
I don't know what to make of her feats against Kaido due to reasons I've already stated. Like, Zoro with Asura giving Kaido a scar of the likes which only Oden has given. The dude is now struggling against King.
Once she gets some solid feats (probably going to be the next strawhat), we can accurately rank where she actually is.

 

[LadyVados]

But it's more apparent than ever that Luffy really is a Tier or 2 above Zoro.

Beating a yonko in a 50v1 doesn't make you yonko level

 

[Ellenate]

if zoro at the start of the timeskip is teleported to right now and is handed enma-

Is there anything stopping him from preforming the same?

 

[Pirate Queen]

Toxic fanbase answer, just proved my point perfectly as you did not get the sense of my message.

Anyway, mostly commenting on the other thread that was going astray. No need to take it personal, not targeting anyone here. Take a chill pill.

Toxic to call you out for being a hypocrite?

Interesting, interesting....

Maybe don't end a post criticizing power level discussion... on a power level discussion thread... by saying Zoro would cut Luffy's arms off in a fight.... despite Luffy never having made such a devastating mistake in a fight before?

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Could be. I'm waiting to see more of this to accurately rate it's usage in general combat



Everyone at the rooftop took blows from Kaido and BM.
Law and Kid are still fighting BM, pretty sure they've tanked many off screen as well.

And again, it depends on perspective.
For me, Kaido 100% was not going to kill her. So, he held back a bit IMO



I agree.

For me, Yamato excels against "Yonko tiers"

Marco excels in most matchups involving admiral tiers and below.

Like I said before, I rank Marco a above the rest, generally speaking, because of his having direct comparisons to admirals, and his 1v2 against King+Queen for hours while healing up thousands of soldiers (which directly contributed to his depletion of stamina)

Yamato only has two feats so far in the series - against Ulti, and against Kaido.
Against Ulti was in her base, and zoan is a powerup.
I don't know what to make of her feats against Kaido due to reasons I've already stated. Like, Zoro with Asura giving Kaido a scar of the likes which only Oden has given. The dude is now struggling against King.
Once she gets some solid feats (probably going to be the next strawhat), we can accurately rank where she actually is.

Against luffy
Why do people always conveniently leave Yamato excellent against gear 2 and gear 3 luffy

Luffy was actively trying to get past Yamato he combined GEAR 2 + GEAR 3 , with armament haki , that’s very poweful and Yamato was casually blocking it

Ulti is pretty tough she also fought luffy FOR LONGER , but yeah that doesn’t mean anything
Yamato also wasn’t interested in fighting ulti

 

[Gallon]

Everyone at the rooftop took blows from Kaido and BM.
Law and Kid are still fighting BM, pretty sure they've tanked many off screen as well.

And again, it depends on perspective.
For me, Kaido 100% was not going to kill her. So, he held back a bit IMO

I'm not of the opinion that most attacks from the Yonko were imbued with Conqueror's (until Kaido realized Luffy's growth). I figure you have to be cautious or you'll exhaust your Haki reserves otherwise.
With Kaido, of the attacks that were imbued and made contact, it was one Thunder Bagua that Luffy barely evaded, which was implied to have been able to knock him out yet again if it had landed; the Ocean Sovereignty that was implied to be able to kill multiple Supernovas, and broke most of Zoro's bones, while on guard, in one second of contact; the Ragnaraku that knocked Luffy out; finally, the Thunder Bagua that knocked Zoro out, while Law magically took it, which was surprising. Perhaps the fact that Zoro took it decreased the force of impact.
Big Mom, on the other hand, has only used the ability twice on-screen, so I wouldn't say that Law and Kidd have taken multiple blows. Highly unlikely, rather.

Point is, while it may become a common theme in future fights, and their weight may appear diluted with time, Conqueror-coated blows seem to be devastating thus far.

But I do see your reasoning as far as other points are concerned. I just thought I'd retort on this particular one.

 

[BoyNextDoor]

Beating a yonko in a 50v1 doesn't make you yonko level

um but you know hes gonna beat him in a 1 on 1 now right?

 

[Pirate Queen]

um but you know hes gonna beat him in a 1 on 1 now right?

You just earned yourself your first like

 

[BoyNextDoor]

You just earned yourself your first like

just speaking fax

 

[grey matter]

Against luffy
Why do people always conveniently leave Yamato excellent against gear 2 and gear 3 luffy

Luffy was actively trying to get past Yamato he combined GEAR 2 + GEAR 3 , with armament haki , that’s very poweful and Yamato was casually blocking it

Ulti is pretty tough she also fought luffy FOR LONGER , but yeah that doesn’t mean anything
Yamato also wasn’t interested in fighting ulti

I don't ignore it at all lmao, I consider it irrelevant. Luffy's intent there was for Yamato to GTFO, he didn't really fight her as an enemy or something

Ulti is strong, but she is YC4 tier at best

I'm not of the opinion that most attacks from the Yonko were imbued with Conqueror's (until Kaido realized Luffy's growth). I figure you have to be cautious or you'll exhaust your Haki reserves otherwise.
With Kaido, of the attacks that were imbued and made contact, it was one Thunder Bagua that Luffy barely evaded, which was implied to have been able to knock him out yet again if it had landed; the Ocean Sovereignty that was implied to be able to kill multiple Supernovas, and broke most of Zoro's bones, while on guard, in one second of contact; the Ragnaraku that knocked Luffy out; finally, the Thunder Bagua that knocked Zoro out, while Law magically took it, which was surprising. Perhaps the fact that Zoro took it decreased the force of impact.
Big Mom, on the other hand, has only used the ability twice on-screen, so I wouldn't say that Law and Kidd have taken multiple blows. Highly unlikely, rather.

Point is, while it may become a common theme in future fights, and their weight may appear diluted with time, Conqueror-coated blows seem to be devastating thus far.

But I do see your reasoning as far as other points are concerned. I just thought I'd retort on this particular one.

Right, it is what I'm saying. Esp bold part.

Like, armament hardening was introduced as some insane stuff, to hype it up.
How it actually fares will be decided once it gets past the hype phase. Then we will get to see it's effectiveness in general
Advanced armament is also another example. Seemed OP in the beginning, when it was in hype phase. Now, scabbards all have them, and all of them range from YC2-4 tier. This allowed them to damage Kaido, but against say "regular" enemies, it is a bonus and not a deciding factor

So far, advanced conqueror's is not only in it's hype phase, but also being used against someone who takes maximum damage from this technique exclusively. So, it's portrayal double inflated.
I say, let's wait for this phase to die out and then see.

 

[M3J]

What about Naruto vs Sasuke WTF!

Bruh, it was even worse than this and constant. From what I remember, Zoro vs. Luffy was barely a discussion, and Zoro vs. Sanji didn't start until WCI, or at least it didn't get worse until then. Zoro fans kept bashing Sanji, then Sanji fans fought back, and then it turned into this whole thing.


But it is a fact that right now, Luffy is superior to Zoro, unless Zoro can actually cut Luffy or keep up with his speed and Future Sight. Before the timeskip, Zoro had a chance as Luffy's weakness was sword, but now Luffy's main weakness is haki-clad swords. If Zoro's haki is superior to Luffy's, then he might have a chance. I have yet to see any evidence otherwise.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

I don't ignore it at all lmao, I consider it irrelevant. Luffy's intent there was for Yamato to GTFO, he didn't really fight her as an enemy or something

Ulti is strong, but she is YC4 tier at best



Right, it is what I'm saying. Esp bold part.

Like, armament hardening was introduced as some insane stuff, to hype it up.
How it actually fares will be decided once it gets past the hype phase. Then we will get to see it's effectiveness in general
Advanced armament is also another example. Seemed OP in the beginning, when it was in hype phase. Now, scabbards all have them, and all of them range from YC2-4 tier. This allowed them to damage Kaido, but against say "regular" enemies, it is a bonus and not a deciding factor

So far, advanced conqueror's is not only in it's hype phase, but also being used against someone who takes maximum damage from this technique exclusively. So, it's portrayal double inflated.
I say, let's wait for this phase to die out and then see.

From the jump there was actually nothing rare about Ryou all the elite samurai in wano have it , it’s like mantra on skypeia
Around the world it’s rare but it’s a speciality for the region

 

[Pirate Queen]

From the jump there was actually nothing rare about Ryou all the elite samurai in wano have it , it’s like mantra on skypeia
Around the world it’s rare but it’s a speciality for the region

Mastered Ryou is very rare. Breath of All things, which is a precursor to mastering Ryou, seems more common.

Master Ryou, also called barrier haki, has really only been seen by a handful of characters.

3 Admirals
Ray
Luffy
Sentomaru
Hyo
Oden
The 9 scabbards

If every single Samurai had Ryou, Kaido wouldn't have stood a chance

And the internal damage Ryou has only been shown by Luffy and Ray

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Also where would we rank the top tier scabbards
I still think suulong inu and neko are around YC2 or YC2+ level ( suulong seems to be a double if not triple multiplier for most )
Kyoshiro/Denjiro : YC3 + if not lower end YC2
Ashura : YC3+ or lower end YC2
Base inu/neko : YC3 level
Kawamatsu: lower end or basic YC3 level

 

[Crimson Ice]

if zoro at the start of the timeskip is teleported to right now and is handed enma-

Is there anything stopping him from preforming the same?

Yes, he's not handling Enma. Zoro had to train with it and said it would make him stronger.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 21, 2021, Original Post Date: Nov 21, 2021 ---

That was me.

@Bold That is true. Always has been. Always will be. Sorry Zoro-sama. King is inferior to Kaido and his VC tells the same. Sorry about your feelings.
We both know why I said that lol so pls.

"Motivation behind King opposition" lmao.
The literal only reason you're going so hard for King is because of the Zoro agenda. It's as clear as day to anyone really lol. You guys still can't fathom after 2 decades and 1000+ chapters that Zoro is inferior to Luffy and his subordinate and closer to people like Sanji ()
Just a couple of weeks ago, King was "trash" and "beneath Zoro" as he was "dancing with Kaido." Then Zoro dismissed himself after Ashura and King was cemented as his opponent and then the wanking started. Like clockwork.
The ones who are in the Luffy > Zoro camp are eating good and sitting pretty and have always been since the manga's inception. The fact that you're trying to portray this as if it's up for debate and due to an agenda or bias is hilarious to me.

I don't know why people are so antsy about these plot developments. Dw, Zoro is getting his time to shine in an extreme-diff fight against YC1 King and is getting a power-up with Enma.

Zoro stans thought we wouldn't notice them gassing King up out of nowhere LMAO.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Yes, he's not handling Enma. Zoro had to train with it and said it would make him stronger.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 21, 2021, Original Post Date: Nov 21, 2021 ---

Zoro stans thought we wouldn't notice them gassing King up out of nowhere LMAO.

Went from king not being a worthy enough opponent to him being the strongest YC1. Lmao okay man

 

[Ellenate]

Yes, he's not handling Enma. Zoro had to train with it and said it would make him stronger.

How so... he negated the suck within 2 seconds of handling it and has proven deadly despite any extensive training.

There's no reason why, if place here directly from the timeskip, he couldn't repeat his feats.

 

[Pirate Queen]

How so... he negated the suck within 2 seconds of handling it and has proven deadly despite any extensive training.

There's no reason why, if place here directly from the timeskip, he couldn't repeat his feats.

Power creep in shounen is always so hard to define

 

[XXGenesis]

Bruh, it was even worse than this and constant. From what I remember, Zoro vs. Luffy was barely a discussion, and Zoro vs. Sanji didn't start until WCI, or at least it didn't get worse until then. Zoro fans kept bashing Sanji, then Sanji fans fought back, and then it turned into this whole thing.


But it is a fact that right now, Luffy is superior to Zoro, unless Zoro can actually cut Luffy or keep up with his speed and Future Sight. Before the timeskip, Zoro had a chance as Luffy's weakness was sword, but now Luffy's main weakness is haki-clad swords. If Zoro's haki is superior to Luffy's, then he might have a chance. I have yet to see any evidence otherwise.

It’s always been a thing even before the time skip. It just wasn’t this ridiculously toxic…

Sanji Vs Zoro was heated but nobody really hated the other fandom.

You can fight back the absurd comments. But why he the idiot to say Sanji can’t hold a candle to Zoro…It’s the same idiocy as saying Zoro can’t give Luffy a challenge

 

[Crimson Ice]

How so... he negated the suck within 2 seconds of handling it and has proven deadly despite any extensive training.

There's no reason why, if place here directly from the timeskip, he couldn't repeat his feats.

He negated the power suck but couldn't fight with it properly. Shit, YOU should know he's still somewhat struggling with it. Zoro explicitly said learning how to tame it will make him stronger. If you chose to ignore that it's on you.