Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.
It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.
For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.
As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:
Shanks v Mihawk
Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
Zoro > Luffy
Zoro v Sanji
Is Smoker a top 30 character?
Mihawk's rank within the story
Law having CoC currently.
Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.
If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.
This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.
Both imo were fighting Izo; I don’t see why they wouldn’t jump Izo and get rid of him quickly instead of fighting 1 on 1 and actually waiting for a conclusion to the fight to intervene.
Well Izo got one CP0 out of commission, more than what a Tobi Roppo member could achieve. I'm glad we just got one panel, i'm sure even Oda doesn't know how to show a fight with guns and make it interesting.
I believe I had an opinion like that too. And you know, maybe it isn't that he can't draw it but rather for it to fit into how one piece is done he can't. I mean you have these things where a slash from Roger is weaker than a bullet from Kaido on Oden (even if Oden was weakened). Weird all the great Pirates were killed in non One Piece like ways. Whitebeard by being shot and Oden by being shot.
I mean you have these things where a slash from Roger is weaker than a bullet from Kaido on Oden (even if Oden was weakened). Weird all the great Pirates were killed in non One Piece ways. Oden and Whitebeard shot. Roger stabbed by two weakling guards. Aces is the only one who died in a way that I'd say is One Piece and not just simplicity. Ace was killed by a Devil Fruit ability.
For me, it seems so weird for Oda to give guys like Kaido, Doflamingo, Beckmann, Blackbeard and such pistols. Beckmann a rifle. I'm sure Zoro fans are pissed Shanks doesn't have a swordsman as his number two or three.
Being stupid isn't the same as the topics that are "banned". No need to ban Wadatsumi/Moriah since no one other than 1 poster is making that weird comparison.
I believe I had an opinion like that too. And you know, maybe it isn't that he can't draw it but rather for it to fit into how one piece is done he can't. I mean you have these things where a slash from Roger is weaker than a bullet from Kaido on Oden (even if Oden was weakened). Weird all the great Pirates were killed in non One Piece like ways. Whitebeard by being shot and Oden by being shot.
I mean you have these things where a slash from Roger is weaker than a bullet from Kaido on Oden (even if Oden was weakened). Weird all the great Pirates were killed in non One Piece ways. Oden and Whitebeard shot. Roger stabbed by two weakling guards. Aces is the only one who died in a way that I'd say is One Piece and not just simplicity. Ace was killed by a Devil Fruit ability.
For me, it seems so weird for Oda to give guys like Kaido, Doflamingo, Beckmann, Blackbeard and such pistols. Beckmann a rifle. I'm sure Zoro fans are pissed Shanks doesn't have a swordsman as his number two or three.
I believe I had an opinion like that too. And you know, maybe it isn't that he can't draw it but rather for it to fit into how one piece is done he can't. I mean you have these things where a slash from Roger is weaker than a bullet from Kaido on Oden (even if Oden was weakened). Weird all the great Pirates were killed in non One Piece like ways. Whitebeard by being shot and Oden by being shot.
I mean you have these things where a slash from Roger is weaker than a bullet from Kaido on Oden (even if Oden was weakened). Weird all the great Pirates were killed in non One Piece ways. Oden and Whitebeard shot. Roger stabbed by two weakling guards. Aces is the only one who died in a way that I'd say is One Piece and not just simplicity. Ace was killed by a Devil Fruit ability.
For me, it seems so weird for Oda to give guys like Kaido, Doflamingo, Beckmann, Blackbeard and such pistols. Beckmann a rifle. I'm sure Zoro fans are pissed Shanks doesn't have a swordsman as his number two or three.
i think death by bullet is ok... heck, you can explain it by a haki imbued bullet but when weakened, its hard to use haki anyways.. the point i was trying to make is, Izou only fights with a gun, so the you cannot drag a gun-fight too long and make it interesting. maybe the anime will make it interesting, we'll have to see.
Izou's situation is weird, he gave up swords for a gun...
While on the topic of power levels. I hope people give Sanji his props after he'd been basically used as a prop all New World. Its like if you say Sanji is strong or deserved to be on the rooftop with the rest of the Supernova, that you are saying that means Zoro doesn't belong up there. I don't get why people treat a boost to Sanji as a notch down on Zoro. He literally belonged up there.
And at this point, Sanji sure looks up to par with these Supernova in general. Except for the lack of super destructive flashy ability. When you really look at it..
Katakuri - 1 billion 57 million
Queen - 1 billion 320 million
Marco - 1 billion 374 million
King - 1 billion 390 million
His opponent stronger than Luffy's, and 70 million or so less than Zoro. 54 million less than Marco. A 70 million bounty difference in early One Piece was a big deal. In the New World not so much. But also we have a 250 million difference from Luffy's opponent.
Here's the thing, Oda didn't say you know what? Sanji is not on these guys level, lets have Killer fight Queen (the guy who literally tried to torture and drown Killer) and Zoro fight King because Sanji is not a match for someone in the billion bounty range. Instead, lets have Killer fight the guy who Zoro showed himself to be a match for PRE-ENMA. Let's have Sanji fight the Superior of that guy. Wait a minute Hawkins is a headliner. The headliners are a rank below the All Stars. Where Queen is 2nd to King. The All Stars are right below Kaido. But wait Hawkins was not ranked in the 6 strongest headliners. 6 STRONGEST. NOT BOUNTIES BUT STRENGTH. That means
Queen
1)Jack 2)Who's Who 3)X Drake 4)Sasaki 5)Black Maria 6)Ulti 7)Page One
that means there were at least 7 guys determined stronger than Hawkins. Even though I am a fan of Hawkins. And he's one of my favorite characters. And favorite Supernova.
And technically Hawkins lost due to miscalculation. I'm sure he'll be much stronger next appearance.
Killer is the number 2 to Kidd. Sanji is number 3 behind Luffy. Yet the one who took on this billion bounty character is Sanji.
Next, do you realize that Kaido is swinging that big club and his opponents are usually dropping right in front of him. For example, do you recall the part (it may be anime only) where Kaido sent one of his men flying and was drinking and going on about the Supernova? His club strike sent the guy flying through the castle. Meaning Kaido's club strikes can do that when the sheer difference in power is large. Luffy did get knocked off Onigashima by Kaido's club. Now back to Whole Cake Island, what did they say? How is that huge cake going to get from one ship to the next. Followed by who is lifting that huge cake (with all those people) with one leg.
Now, consider how huge and bulky Queen is especially in his devil fruit form. A full sized Queen is bigger than Big Mom. The hybrid one, you have to also consider has cyborg parts which are heavier than human body parts, hence the size of Franky and Kuma. Just really consider how huge of a person Sanji sent flying. And remember Tankman sent Cracker flying, but cracker is the complete opposite to Queen in mass. So Tankman sent a smaller and lighter object flying. While Sanji sent someone of much more mass flying off an island in One Piece. Where Sanji is supposed to be evenly matched with Queen.
Consider that Kidd had to repeatedly fire a HUGE Mechanical Rail Gun beam to move Big Mom. And Sanji sent a huge Queen flying with a kick. Of course Big Mom is much more durable than Queen but the concept of sending someone flying like Sanji did you Queen in defeat pretty much indicates a huge strength gap. Obviously Kidd was the beneficiary of a huge hole in the battle field where Big Mom was laying. It wasn't brute force.
Sanji is underestimated here.
I hope he finally stops getting that downplay. As they said his last bounty was due to being Germa.
So now this one is due to having defeated a billion bounty pirate. Who, based on Whitebeard Pirates portrayal and relating that to other Yonko crews, may be able to fight off an Admiral. He did manage to KO and amnesiac Big Mom.
Also, going by Jinbe facing off with Who's Who (a subordinate to Queen & basically 800 million less of a bounty than Queen) and the fact that Jinbe was able to withstand an enraged hunger pang Big Mom and send her backwards off a ship, it could at this point be guessed that Sanji would have survived on that rooftop. And even moreso now that he has his exoskeleton. Basically we have 5, maybe 6 Strawhats (me hoping Marco joins) who could deal blows to a Yonko. At this point I'd say if we replaced the Supernova rooftop with the top 5-6 Strawhats (assuming Marco & Yamato joining) then they likely can create the same scenario we have now.
At the least Zoro, Sanji & Jinbe can stall Big Mom for Luffy. Of course, if you add in Yamato that becomes even more of a reality. Topped off with Marco, those 5 would probably easily defeat her.
Now the main thing, at this point it should be safe to say Sanji as serious fighter vs a Yonko like the 5 Supernova just did is not far fetched.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
People overlook the fact that if you watch the whole Queen vs Sanji fight, Queen was overmatched the whole fight. Except for the one death grip attack. Its like Whitebeard vs Akainu where Akainu literally being Magma is the only thing that gave him a chance but otherwise he was no match for Whitebeard. But because he's magma he literally almost killed a half dead Whitebeard.
Sanji was literally having Queen riving in pain from fire the whole battle. From the Perospero moment where he was holding Zoro to the end. Then we all seem to be ignoring that he also fought Queen and King at the same time as well.
--- Double Post Merged, ---
People will say, it is because Queen is not an impressive fighter. Rather than, Sanji is just that much more stronger than Oda was portraying him. Because what people have to base Sanji is Vergo and Doflamingo. Two people whose abilities were unknown to him. For comparison, not Zoro vs Sanji comparison but comparison in general. Zoro said he'd struggle to defeat King without understanding King's ability. So Sanji fought Vergo without realizing what Vergo was and fought Doflamingo with no knowledge of his ability until Law told him after the clash. So ultimately Sanji fought two opponents with unknown abilities. For instance Zoro and Luffy almost lost to Apoo because they had no clue what his ability was prior to Killer indicating it to them. Not saying Sanji knowing Doflamingo's ability would have Dressrosa Sanji defeat Doflamingo. Just that because Sanji was portrayed how he was through the New World, people find it ridiculous that maybe it isn't that Queen is weak but
Sanji is just much stronger than Oda was portraying the character. For example, Dressrosa Sanji tells the crew forget about him and escape.
Wano Sanji says he'll handle Queen. And most of the battle he's toying with and dodging Queen's attacks. Just like Queen was toying with Chopper. Sanji was toying with Queen, B$1,320,000 Queen, to the point that he was calling Queen's lasers cute sarcastically. Similar to Big Mom with Franky. That says that Sanji was operating from an advantage. To be fair, the attack that captured Sanji was kind of a surprise attack. But again, most of the fight was Sanji having dominance over Queen. Meaning he was basically above Queen's level already. People want to say Jack is stronger than Queen is really to down Sanji. And that is wack.
--- Double Post Merged, ---
Also, Sanji did happen to fight Queen and King. A feat that even Marco said is exhausting. Gotta respect Sanji.
While on the topic of power levels. I hope people give Sanji his props after he'd been basically used as a prop all New World. Its like if you say Sanji is strong or deserved to be on the rooftop with the rest of the Supernova, that you are saying that means Zoro doesn't belong up there. I don't get why people treat a boost to Sanji as a notch down on Zoro. He literally belonged up there.
And at this point, Sanji sure looks up to par with these Supernova in general. Except for the lack of super destructive flashy ability. When you really look at it..
Katakuri - 1 billion 57 million
Queen - 1 billion 320 million
Marco - 1 billion 374 million
King - 1 billion 390 million
His opponent stronger than Luffy's, and 70 million or so less than Zoro. 54 million less than Marco. A 70 million bounty difference in early One Piece was a big deal. In the New World not so much. But also we have a 250 million difference from Luffy's opponent.
Here's the thing, Oda didn't say you know what? Sanji is not on these guys level, lets have Killer fight Queen (the guy who literally tried to torture and drown Killer) and Zoro fight King because Sanji is not a match for someone in the billion bounty range. Instead, lets have Killer fight the guy who Zoro showed himself to be a match for PRE-ENMA. Let's have Sanji fight the Superior of that guy. Wait a minute Hawkins is a headliner. The headliners are a rank below the All Stars. Where Queen is 2nd to King. The All Stars are right below Kaido. But wait Hawkins was not ranked in the 6 strongest headliners. 6 STRONGEST. NOT BOUNTIES BUT STRENGTH. That means
Queen
1)Jack 2)Who's Who 3)X Drake 4)Sasaki 5)Black Maria 6)Ulti 7)Page One
that means there were at least 7 guys determined stronger than Hawkins. Even though I am a fan of Hawkins. And he's one of my favorite characters. And favorite Supernova.
And technically Hawkins lost due to miscalculation. I'm sure he'll be much stronger next appearance.
Killer is the number 2 to Kidd. Sanji is number 3 behind Luffy. Yet the one who took on this billion bounty character is Sanji.
Next, do you realize that Kaido is swinging that big club and his opponents are usually dropping right in front of him. For example, do you recall the part (it may be anime only) where Kaido sent one of his men flying and was drinking and going on about the Supernova? His club strike sent the guy flying through the castle. Meaning Kaido's club strikes can do that when the sheer difference in power is large. Luffy did get knocked off Onigashima by Kaido's club. Now back to Whole Cake Island, what did they say? How is that huge cake going to get from one ship to the next. Followed by who is lifting that huge cake (with all those people) with one leg.
Now, consider how huge and bulky Queen is especially in his devil fruit form. A full sized Queen is bigger than Big Mom. The hybrid one, you have to also consider has cyborg parts which are heavier than human body parts, hence the size of Franky and Kuma. Just really consider how huge of a person Sanji sent flying. And remember Tankman sent Cracker flying, but cracker is the complete opposite to Queen in mass. So Tankman sent a smaller and lighter object flying. While Sanji sent someone of much more mass flying off an island in One Piece. Where Sanji is supposed to be evenly matched with Queen.
Consider that Kidd had to repeatedly fire a HUGE Mechanical Rail Gun beam to move Big Mom. And Sanji sent a huge Queen flying with a kick. Of course Big Mom is much more durable than Queen but the concept of sending someone flying like Sanji did you Queen in defeat pretty much indicates a huge strength gap. Obviously Kidd was the beneficiary of a huge hole in the battle field where Big Mom was laying. It wasn't brute force.
Sanji is underestimated here.
I hope he finally stops getting that downplay. As they said his last bounty was due to being Germa.
So now this one is due to having defeated a billion bounty pirate. Who, based on Whitebeard Pirates portrayal and relating that to other Yonko crews, may be able to fight off an Admiral. He did manage to KO and amnesiac Big Mom.
Also, going by Jinbe facing off with Who's Who (a subordinate to Queen & basically 800 million less of a bounty than Queen) and the fact that Jinbe was able to withstand an enraged hunger pang Big Mom and send her backwards off a ship, it could at this point be guessed that Sanji would have survived on that rooftop. And even moreso now that he has his exoskeleton. Basically we have 5, maybe 6 Strawhats (me hoping Marco joins) who could deal blows to a Yonko. At this point I'd say if we replaced the Supernova rooftop with the top 5-6 Strawhats (assuming Marco & Yamato joining) then they likely can create the same scenario we have now.
At the least Zoro, Sanji & Jinbe can stall Big Mom for Luffy. Of course, if you add in Yamato that becomes even more of a reality. Topped off with Marco, those 5 would probably easily defeat her.
Now the main thing, at this point it should be safe to say Sanji as serious fighter vs a Yonko like the 5 Supernova just did is not far fetched.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
People overlook the fact that if you watch the whole Queen vs Sanji fight, Queen was overmatched the whole fight. Except for the one death grip attack. Its like Whitebeard vs Akainu where Akainu literally being Magma is the only thing that gave him a chance but otherwise he was no match for Whitebeard. But because he's magma he literally almost killed a half dead Whitebeard.
Sanji was literally having Queen riving in pain from fire the whole battle. From the Perospero moment where he was holding Zoro to the end. Then we all seem to be ignoring that he also fought Queen and King at the same time as well.
--- Double Post Merged, ---
People will say, it is because Queen is not an impressive fighter. Rather than, Sanji is just that much more stronger than Oda was portraying him. Because what people have to base Sanji is Vergo and Doflamingo. Two people whose abilities were unknown to him. For comparison, not Zoro vs Sanji comparison but comparison in general. Zoro said he'd struggle to defeat King without understanding King's ability. So Sanji fought Vergo without realizing what Vergo was and fought Doflamingo with no knowledge of his ability until Law told him after the clash. So ultimately Sanji fought two opponents with unknown abilities. For instance Zoro and Luffy almost lost to Apoo because they had no clue what his ability was prior to Killer indicating it to them. Not saying Sanji knowing Doflamingo's ability would have Dressrosa Sanji defeat Doflamingo. Just that because Sanji was portrayed how he was through the New World, people find it ridiculous that maybe it isn't that Queen is weak but
Sanji is just much stronger than Oda was portraying the character. For example, Dressrosa Sanji tells the crew forget about him and escape.
Wano Sanji says he'll handle Queen. And most of the battle he's toying with and dodging Queen's attacks. Just like Queen was toying with Chopper. Sanji was toying with Queen, B$1,320,000 Queen, to the point that he was calling Queen's lasers cute sarcastically. Similar to Big Mom with Franky. That says that Sanji was operating from an advantage. To be fair, the attack that captured Sanji was kind of a surprise attack. But again, most of the fight was Sanji having dominance over Queen. Meaning he was basically above Queen's level already. People want to say Jack is stronger than Queen is really to down Sanji. And that is wack.
--- Double Post Merged, ---
Also, Sanji did happen to fight Queen and King. A feat that even Marco said is exhausting. Gotta respect Sanji.
I think you gotta calm down lol People do respect sanji now. The thing is that Queen isnt a real fighter, hes just carried by his tech. And this isnt to knock Sanji since its not his fault but its true. King, Katakuri, and Marco are all washing Queen regardless of how close their bounties are to each other.
I think the thing youre missing though is the timing of things. Prior to his upgrades hes doing absolutely no damage to Kaido on the roof and he wasnt going to have time to run away and figure out his feeling while up there. Hes clean af now though so thats kinda all that really matters. Looking forward to his admiral matchup.
I'm interested in making a Tierlist so I will start a bit here. Originally I have tried this with a full reread but that was too tiresome so I am going group by group, starting with the Strawhat Pirates. I will also only use the current version of each character because again anything else becomes too tiresome.
1. Luffy
2. Zoro
I don't think the dynamic between the two ever changed since Whiskey Peak, but yeah, Luffy is stronger. He's the main character, enough said. Wether this will matter once more groups get added, don't know yet. But if Luffy powers up again it will also ultimately solve.
3. Jinbe
Completely humiliated Who's Who, Also has very good vs Big Mom feats and not the worst vs Akainu feats. His Ogi techniques, the way they work, they definitely can damage Kaido or Big Mom, too, which means Jinbe would have been useful at the top, and that still makes him superior to Sanji.
4. Sanji
Actually prior to his upgrades, Sanji was crap. Not even part of any Monster Trio, Franky Shogun says hello! But the upgrade pretty much fixed him, it's like a video game character getting a patch. He still only deals moderate damage due to its pinpoint nature, but now he doesn't drop out from basically anything dangerous, his weakness is gone and his speed based fighting style can finally shine. And yeah, this Sanji can beat Doflamingo.
5. Franky
The Shogun is really powerful. Sasaki brought it to its limits, but not before taking in a barrage of powerful attacks, and end of the day it didn't even help him. The main body alone can probably defeat a Diamante or Trebol with ease, the fight with Senor Pink was more of a joke as he didn't use his weapon arsenal that basically makes him a mini-Kuma as only the coup de vents and laser beams truly matter but those are quite strong. The motorcycle attack is also implied to be very powerful, but that only works once. He brings alot of power from all sides to the table that just place him above
6. Robin
Also really powerful, defeated Black Maria but it left her completely exhausted? Didn't pay enough attention here for reasons (^^) but Brook is carrying her now so that was probably her limit. She handled Hakuba with ease. A frail body places her below Franky though.
7. Brook
This is a bit difficult because he never fights much. I think vs Zeo might have been his only proper fight. But he can one-shot a number and a couple gifters and that's without any power-ups. He also has good vs Big Mom feats due to a natural advantage of his fruit. Could rank higher but lacks screentime.
8. Nami (&Zeus)
Powerful glass canon, crazy attack power but a very weak defense. Probably the most phenomenal growth out of any character in the Manga btw.
All of these have become crazy powerful and they all can produce attacks that are top tier relevant, they all could one-shot a number and are already among the strongest characters in the series.
9. Chopper
The upgraded Monster Point could hold itself against Queen somewhat, but it also did not deal much damage. The terrible drawback also kind of made it worse.
10. Usopp
Weak. Can't do anything against anyone.
11. Vivi (&Carue)
Was stronger than her rank suggested within Baroque Works. After the timeskip she acquired some athletic ability, but her current actual strenght remains unknown. If the Pre-Skip is consistent, then she was probably as strong as a #5 agent considering how she handled the #7 pair and thats the minimum, while the maximum would be slightly below current Usopp since Pre-Skip Usopp is around as strong as a #4 agent.
Next I will add the Strawhat Grand Fleet to my list, and then another group and so on. At some point, tiers should start to form. I want to avoid the Yonko and Marines as long as possible because they are very large and a large part of them is not fully fleshed out, I will need a good framework first.
I think you gotta calm down lol People do respect sanji now. The thing is that Queen isnt a real fighter, hes just carried by his tech. And this isnt to knock Sanji since its not his fault but its true. King, Katakuri, and Marco are all washing Queen regardless of how close their bounties are to each other.
I prepared this post yesterday, so just to make it clear, despite some harsh words on Sanji prior to his upgrades this has nothing to do with his post, just to make that clear.
What people shouldn't forget about Queen is that he uses Plagues as his main weapon, but those aren't really accountable for powerlevel evaluation as they are just stupid. Oda didn't use them as an active part of his fighting arsenal for reasons.
If you count in the plagues, you have to make Queen the strongest of all as it technically means he can kill everyone that does not have a miracle doctor at his back.
Plagues easily explain a blown up bounty beyond the already blown up bounties of the Calamities.
I'm interested in making a Tierlist so I will start a bit here. Originally I have tried this with a full reread but that was too tiresome so I am going group by group, starting with the Strawhat Pirates. I will also only use the current version of each character because again anything else becomes too tiresome.
1. Luffy
2. Zoro
I don't think the dynamic between the two ever changed since Whiskey Peak, but yeah, Luffy is stronger. He's the main character, enough said. Wether this will matter once more groups get added, don't know yet. But if Luffy powers up again it will also ultimately solve.
3. Jinbe
Completely humiliated Who's Who, Also has very good vs Big Mom feats and not the worst vs Akainu feats. His Ogi techniques, the way they work, they definitely can damage Kaido or Big Mom, too, which means Jinbe would have been useful at the top, and that still makes him superior to Sanji.
4. Sanji
Actually prior to his upgrades, Sanji was crap. Not even part of any Monster Trio, Franky Shogun says hello! But the upgrade pretty much fixed him, it's like a video game character getting a patch. He still only deals moderate damage due to its pinpoint nature, but now he doesn't drop out from basically anything dangerous, his weakness is gone and his speed based fighting style can finally shine. And yeah, this Sanji can beat Doflamingo.
5. Franky
The Shogun is really powerful. Sasaki brought it to its limits, but not before taking in a barrage of powerful attacks, and end of the day it didn't even help him. The main body alone can probably defeat a Diamante or Trebol with ease, the fight with Senor Pink was more of a joke as he didn't use his weapon arsenal that basically makes him a mini-Kuma as only the coup de vents and laser beams truly matter but those are quite strong. The motorcycle attack is also implied to be very powerful, but that only works once. He brings alot of power from all sides to the table that just place him above
6. Robin
Also really powerful, defeated Black Maria but it left her completely exhausted? Didn't pay enough attention here for reasons (^^) but Brook is carrying her now so that was probably her limit. She handled Hakuba with ease. A frail body places her below Franky though.
7. Brook
This is a bit difficult because he never fights much. I think vs Zeo might have been his only proper fight. But he can one-shot a number and a couple gifters and that's without any power-ups. He also has good vs Big Mom feats due to a natural advantage of his fruit. Could rank higher but lacks screentime.
8. Nami (&Zeus)
Powerful glass canon, crazy attack power but a very weak defense. Probably the most phenomenal growth out of any character in the Manga btw.
All of these have become crazy powerful and they all can produce attacks that are top tier relevant, they all could one-shot a number and are already among the strongest characters in the series.
9. Chopper
The upgraded Monster Point could hold itself against Queen somewhat, but it also did not deal much damage. The terrible drawback also kind of made it worse.
10. Usopp
Weak. Can't do anything against anyone.
11. Vivi (&Carue)
Was stronger than her rank suggested within Baroque Works. After the timeskip she acquired some athletic ability, but her current actual strenght remains unknown. If the Pre-Skip is consistent, then she was probably as strong as a #5 agent considering how she handled the #7 pair and thats the minimum, while the maximum would be slightly below current Usopp since Pre-Skip Usopp is around as strong as a #4 agent.
Next I will add the Strawhat Grand Fleet to my list, and then another group and so on. At some point, tiers should start to form. I want to avoid the Yonko and Marines as long as possible because they are very large and a large part of them is not fully fleshed out, I will need a good framework first.
I prepared this post yesterday, so just to make it clear, despite some harsh words on Sanji prior to his upgrades this has nothing to do with his post, just to make that clear.
What people shouldn't forget about Queen is that he uses Plagues as his main weapon, but those aren't really accountable for powerlevel evaluation as they are just stupid. Oda didn't use them as an active part of his fighting arsenal for reasons.
If you count in the plagues, you have to make Queen the strongest of all as it technically means he can kill everyone that does not have a miracle doctor at his back.
Plagues easily explain a blown up bounty beyond the already blown up bounties of the Calamities.
It's too small. The fact that you limited yourself to such a small pool of characters likely led to you making some very odd comparisons. Like how is Hajrudin, who high diffefed Machvise, as strong as Inu/Neko? Wouldn't that make Machvise close to Jack? Perospero roflstomped both Sulong Carrot and Sulong Wanda together.
Your problem is, you insterted a small pool of characters into a fixed grid with seven categories from Emperor to "YC4", and anything you've inserted must fit that grid. Once you'll add more characters, you'll eventually notice yourself that such a concept will fall apart. Organize the characters first, then make the tiers, right now everythinh below "YC1" looks very sketchy.
The idea to split the grid into several organizations is good, I am basically also doing that. It is rather easy to rank characters within a specific group.
Readjust a bit. Start with a a group on the left side that is large so you get a large pool to group tiers. I start with the Strawhat Grand Fleet, but you could also use the Big Mom, Beast, Whitebeard or Donquixote Pirates or the Marines. Then you compare the next group to that hierarchy, and so on. Get rid of groups like "Underlings", or "Others", as these only cause confusion.
It's too small. The fact that you limited yourself to such a small pool of characters likely led to you making some very odd comparisons. Like how is Hajrudin, who high diffefed Machvise, as strong as Inu/Neko? Wouldn't that make Machvise close to Jack? Perospero roflstomped both Sulong Carrot and Sulong Wanda together.
Your problem is, you insterted a small pool of characters into a fixed grid with seven categories from Emperor to "YC4", and anything you've inserted must fit that grid. Once you'll add more characters, you'll eventually notice yourself that such a concept will fall apart. Organize the characters first, then make the tiers, right now everythinh below "YC1" looks very sketchy.
The idea to split the grid into several organizations is good, I am basically also doing that. It is rather easy to rank characters within a specific group.
Readjust a bit. Start with a a group on the left side that is large so you get a large pool to group tiers. I start with the Strawhat Grand Fleet, but you could also use the Big Mom, Beast, Whitebeard or Donquixote Pirates or the Marines. Then you compare the next group to that hierarchy, and so on. Get rid of groups like "Underlings", or "Others", as these only cause confusion.
And how should I elaborate on that now? Jinbe is stronger.
Sanji is stronger than Jinbe, and the gap is significant.
Sanji prior to Germa bio awakening? Maybe Jinbe was stronger than that version of Sanji. Current Sanji? No way.
