Discussion Sanji Discussion Thread

[King Moe]

If a single panel of Sanji trying to kick Drake is of any indication, he stand no chance against Drake.

The one he was getting away from Drake due to Toko in his arms. Wasn't trying to go for serious blow. The fight was inconclusive especially Drake struggles to even try to hit him after majority strikes and still took him easily when focusing on others.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 30, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 30, 2020 ---

So Drake, a Supernova and pirate Captain himself would be a warm up fight for Sanji?
We'll disagree on that. It's very possible Sanji could defeat Drake in an all out fight, regardless of the fact that he uses his long axes, but to call him a warm up is hugely underestimating someone we know to be a higher tier within Kaido's ranks than even the likes of Hawkins, another supernova.

I don't believe Sanji is on a Calamity level at the moment, as a very reasonable argument (as I've made above) can be made that right now he's just about at the Flying Six Headliner tier.

You have to take into consideration that the only people we've seen or heard fight yonkou commanders in this timeskip have been pirate captains, specifically Supernova captains; Luffy, Urouge and Kid (if memory serves me right). So to say that Sanji can have one of them as a final enemy in this arc is being hopeful to say the least.

Again, it's not say it won't happen, it's just to say based on current showing it's unlikely Sanji can defeat one right now, let alone fight one. Ultimately, that's the level you hope for him to be on and I think he'll fight to a level just in between those (commander and Flying Six).

Personally I don't think it'll be Drake that he fights. Coming into the final battle I think his mission as SWORD member will take precedence and/or he'll act to help defeat Kaido in order to help shift the balance of power between the WG and pirates.

Nah don't see it like that especially T6H are more same level as no hierarchy among the group seeing how they address one another. Since Sanji able to mowed down PO easily and that him just testing the suit with Base Kicks, Drake won't that be great challenge if Sanji goes farther than he did with PO. Plus his training and modify of RS, Drake won't last long in the long run.

Though to be honest feels he won't fight him as he also traitor to the Beast Pirates and could turn on them fully once the Marines arrive. So Sanji could have and warm-up fight with someone else then. Though I doubt he is T6H level after Oda went out his way to show dominance on PO easily. His full power is beating YC lvl opponent being King or Queen. If Luffy going to face Kaido in a major fight, I don't see why Sanji, Jimbei, and Zoro (Though iffy on Zoro given his past 4 fights went) wouldn't reach YC lvl by end of the arc. Doesn't make sense to have large of a gap like that. They should be closest to Luffy's power while having reasonable gap to them.

Just saying how writing going in the arc for this. The Strawhats won't just stay in background and let major opponents be fought by someone else as this arc be developing everyone to get strong including Sanji.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 30, 2020 ---

I think he cant fight a swordsman like Drake, rematch with P1 seems more likely and whether he will get to fight Queen is not certain, especially if Queen's swords arent just decoration.

Stop using the sword excuse. We are Wano we already see Sanji not afraid taking on weapon opponents before this. Stop with Headcannon you think Luffy and Sanji won't fight anyone with a weapon due to they fight with their bodies. You been debunked this argument many times already.

Nah He isn't facing PO. That fight been over. He facing someone greater in the end. Though I know 'certain character with weapons' who can face T6H to redeem the character.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 30, 2020 ---

Actually, since probably big mom crews also join the festival, yuen might be there too (the dude who knocked down sanji at WCI with a single swing of his fan)
Sanji might also get rematch with yuen

Nah, Yuen is scrub then and before. Though can see 'certain character' taking care of him. Sanji need stronger challenges, fodder enemies and stop with excuse since we know Sanji was protecting Luffy, wasn't even trying to fight him. Nice headcannon there.

 

[nik87]

Stop using the sword excuse. We are Wano we already see Sanji not afraid taking on weapon opponents before this. Stop with Headcannon you think Luffy and Sanji won't fight anyone with a weapon due to they fight with their bodies. You been debunked this argument many times already.

Nah He isn't facing PO. That fight been over. He facing someone greater in the end. Though I know 'certain character with weapons' who can face T6H to redeem the character.

Sword is a fact. Sanji has never fought a master swordsman. The one swordsman that Luffy fought, ended up fighting with biscuits instead.
Facts that have never been debunked. PageOne has a grudge with Sanji so I doubt he will just let him go. Leave swordsmen to swordsmen.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Sword is a fact. Sanji has never fought a master swordsman. The one swordsman that Luffy fought, ended up fighting with biscuits instead.
Facts that have never been debunked. PageOne has a grudge with Sanji so I doubt he will just let him go. Leave swordsmen to swordsmen.

Yeah it is hard to guess with how the fight will go with so many characters in onigashima
Oda might also go for a route where zoro fought beast pirate and sanji fought big mom pirate.
Sanji might finish his business with daifuku or oven

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 30, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 30, 2020 ---

If a single panel of Sanji trying to kick Drake is of any indication, he stand no chance against Drake.

Sanji was losing but i could see RS sanji had a good fight with drake

 

[King Moe]

Sword is a fact. Sanji has never fought a master swordsman. The one swordsman that Luffy fought, ended up fighting with biscuits instead.
Facts that have never been debunked. PageOne has a grudge with Sanji so I doubt he will just let him go. Leave swordsmen to swordsmen.

Again they are in Wano. Your idea think they won't face any weapon people is dumb since they already beaten those with them prior. Luffy and Sanji not going to be disadvantage by weapons. They going to overcome and beat their enemies as usual.

Nah Sanji has no grudge. He deal with him easily. Also he already taken down so no need for that. If you want someone face T6H Zoro can have final opponent himself. Leave it to professionals on beating stronger foes after all, Zoro need to redeem himself from his fights. He need someone more his level after all.

Luffy and Sanji will be fine in who they face and won't back down in beating them.

 

[nik87]

Again they are in Wano. Your idea think they won't face any weapon people is dumb since they already beaten those with them prior. Luffy and Sanji not going to be disadvantage by weapons. They going to overcome and beat their enemies as usual.

Nah Sanji has no grudge. He deal with him easily. Also he already taken down so no need for that. If you want someone face T6H Zoro can have final opponent himself. Leave it to professionals on beating stronger foes after all, Zoro need to redeem himself from his fights. He need someone more his level after all.

Luffy and Sanji will be fine in who they face and won't back down in beating them.

They in Wano and Luffy is about to fight Kaido who doesnt use a sword. In Wano, he was chased by Big Mom who wasnt using a sword...
Sanji clashed with Drake who picked a dino form instead humanoid form because dinos dont use swords. The pattern is bulletproof.
Luffy and Sanji have yet to prove that they can beat master swordsmen who rely on their swords and not biscuits instead.

Sanji doesnt need to have a grudge for PageOne to have a grudge with Sanji. I posted a screenshot yesterday of PageOne who was clean after 2 hits from Sanjino. The one who doesnt fight with his hands and puts cooking first is no professional when it comes to fighting, fighting is second for him. Leave it to Mr Bushido because he is the man of this arc.

 

[goldb]

Sanji might finish his business with daifuku or oven

Sanji v Oven is a fight I would prefer to see. Was he aboard the ship that came to Wano, do you know? I can't be arsed to check.

Nah don't see it like that especially T6H are more same level as no hierarchy among the group seeing how they address one another. Since Sanji able to mowed down PO easily and that him just testing the suit with Base Kicks, Drake won't that be great challenge if Sanji goes farther than he did with PO. Plus his training and modify of RS, Drake won't last long in the long run.

Though to be honest feels he won't fight him as he also traitor to the Beast Pirates and could turn on them fully once the Marines arrive. So Sanji could have and warm-up fight with someone else then. Though I doubt he is T6H level after Oda went out his way to show dominance on PO easily. His full power is beating YC lvl opponent being King or Queen. If Luffy going to face Kaido in a major fight, I don't see why Sanji, Jimbei, and Zoro (Though iffy on Zoro given his past 4 fights went) wouldn't reach YC lvl by end of the arc. Doesn't make sense to have large of a gap like that. They should be closest to Luffy's power while having reasonable gap to them.

These are some contentious points that you're stuck on and we won't ever agree on it, so we'll move on.

Just saying how writing going in the arc for this. The Strawhats won't just stay in background and let major opponents be fought by someone else as this arc be developing everyone to get strong including Sanji.

There are enough strong opponents within Kaido and Big Mom's forces that if they all join, there would more than enough of challenge for all the Strawhats. It could very well be that Sanji ends up fighting someone from Big Mom's crew.

 

[nik87]

Was he aboard the ship that came to Wano, do you know? I can't be arsed to check.

Nope, if my memory serves me.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Sanji v Oven is a fight I would prefer to see. Was he aboard the ship that came to Wano, do you know? I can't be arsed to check.

That is what i also think fam
Daifuku was on the ship so oven probably stayed
I feel like the BM crews to wano are the crew who have not been beaten yet

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 30, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 30, 2020 ---

Sanji vs. Yuen will be lit. Both are aerial fighters

 

[King Moe]

They in Wano and Luffy is about to fight Kaido who doesnt use a sword. In Wano, he was chased by Big Mom who wasnt using a sword...
Sanji clashed with Drake who picked a dino form instead humanoid form because dinos dont use swords. The pattern is bulletproof.
Luffy and Sanji have yet to prove that they can beat master swordsmen who rely on their swords and not biscuits instead.

Sanji doesnt need to have a grudge for PageOne to have a grudge with Sanji. I posted a screenshot yesterday of PageOne who was clean after 2 hits from Sanjino. The one who doesnt fight with his hands and puts cooking first is no professional when it comes to fighting, fighting is second for him. Leave it to Mr Bushido because he is the man of this arc.

Kaido has his club which has spikes on it and can deal heavy damage to Luffy as shown before. He still going to use weapon on him, so is Luffy going to back down over it? No he won't. He beat him heads on and not run away from him. Sanji same way as he deal with Daifuku and stop his blade without much effort at all. Weapons are non-factor to them and it doesn't stop them at all.

PO isn't around at all though as do you have manga panel he came back after the fight? If your argument is Anime, then prepare for Zoro vs Batman if your using that as a excuse. Page One was finished by him and Sanji evolved more since the fight and going after it. He be facing more top tiers in his wake while Zoro going to need to face T6H to be relevant in his fighting again as always. He got major backhand in this arc out of anyone.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 30, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 30, 2020 ---

Sanji v Oven is a fight I would prefer to see. Was he aboard the ship that came to Wano, do you know? I can't be arsed to check.



These are some contentious points that you're stuck on and we won't ever agree on it, so we'll move on.



There are enough strong opponents within Kaido and Big Mom's forces that if they all join, there would more than enough of challenge for all the Strawhats. It could very well be that Sanji ends up fighting someone from Big Mom's crew.

Just saying how writing looks, not because of my feelings as Oda is writing them to deal major threats than before, so why should Sanji deal with an YV when he already beaten one easily and can fight one off before. Just saying not just Luffy, but crew will evolve more in the battles to get stronger even Sanji. We shouldn't count them out much at all.

No one on BM's crew is worth the fighting for final fight as she didn't bring her full force with her as well. The goal is to take down Kaido more and from writing, he has more business with them than facing again on BMP side again.

 

[nik87]

Kaido has his club which has spikes on it and can deal heavy damage to Luffy as shown before. He still going to use weapon on him, so is Luffy going to back down over it? No he won't. He beat him heads on and not run away from him. Sanji same way as he deal with Daifuku and stop his blade without much effort at all. Weapons are non-factor to them and it doesn't stop them at all.

PO isn't around at all though as do you have manga panel he came back after the fight? If your argument is Anime, then prepare for Zoro vs Batman if your using that as a excuse. Page One was finished by him and Sanji evolved more since the fight and going after it. He be facing more top tiers in his wake while Zoro going to need to face T6H to be relevant in his fighting again as always. He got major backhand in this arc out of anyone.

Kaido doesnt help your point because he is not a swordsman so why are you using useless information in the first place?
Did Big Mom use a sword when she chased him in Udon? Did she use a sword when she clashed with him in WCI? The pattern is bulletproof.
Daifuku isnt a swordsman either. If Sanji or Luffy ever end up fighting a swordsman, they will discard their swords to make it easier for Sanji/Luffy.

I dont have manga panel that he came back same as you dont have manga panel that he is defeated. Anime has shown the inevitable.
If you are going by Anime, you can expect Luffy vs Batman because he slapped him away like a fodder lol, just like Queen did.
I bet PageOne will be hunting Sanji as soon as he sees him. Sanji be facing top tiers? Do you know what top tiers are? Zoro cant help you.

 

[M3J]

If a single panel of Sanji trying to kick Drake is of any indication, he stand no chance against Drake.

I hate this logic though because Luffy was unable to do anything to Lucci and got his ass kicked easily, but he still won. Sanji may not have done much to Drake, but it doesn't mean he doesn't stand a chance. We've never really seen Sanji go all out after the timeskip, so we don't know how he'd fare.

 

[King Moe]

I hate this logic though because Luffy was unable to do anything to Lucci and got his ass kicked easily, but he still won. Sanji may not have done much to Drake, but it doesn't mean he doesn't stand a chance. We've never really seen Sanji go all out after the timeskip, so we don't know how he'd fare.

Drake be warm up fight though not all out for Sanji since he got reach YC lvl at end of the arc and King or Queen can do that for him.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 31, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 31, 2020 ---

Kaido doesnt help your point because he is not a swordsman so why are you using useless information in the first place?
Did Big Mom use a sword when she chased him in Udon? Did she use a sword when she clashed with him in WCI? The pattern is bulletproof.
Daifuku isnt a swordsman either. If Sanji or Luffy ever end up fighting a swordsman, they will discard their swords to make it easier for Sanji/Luffy.

I dont have manga panel that he came back same as you dont have manga panel that he is defeated. Anime has shown the inevitable.
If you are going by Anime, you can expect Luffy vs Batman because he slapped him away like a fodder lol, just like Queen did.
I bet PageOne will be hunting Sanji as soon as he sees him. Sanji be facing top tiers? Do you know what top tiers are? Zoro cant help you.

Point is about weapons and Luffy will still beat anyone regardless so your weapon talk is really debunked and headcannon.

Daifuku uses bladed weapon. It doesn't matter if a sword or not. He even defeated those with swords before as well. Swords isn't the issue. It's the skill behind it. Weapons don't make a difference at all.

Nah it does. Zoro vs Batman as he gave a glare since like you said all we need one trait and we know they are going to fight. Zoro won't let him off easy and that's the truth here. Luffy and Sanji are only credible ones to face stronger foes in the end. Just the truth.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

I hate this logic though because Luffy was unableto do anything to Lucci and got his ass kicked easily, but he still won. Sanji may not have done much to Drake, but it doesn't mean he doesn't stand a chance. We've never really seen Sanji go all out after the timeskip, so we don't know how he'd fare.

Different case though, this was even addressed during lucci vs luffy rematch at enies lobby. Luffy had G2 as powerup.

Sanji was losing against drake, but sanji with RS might rival drake, just like luffy did against lucci.
A rematch for sanji against drake or PO will be cool.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 31, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 31, 2020 ---

Drake be warm up fight though not all out for Sanji since he got reach YC lvl at end of the arc and King or Queen can do that for him.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 31, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 31, 2020 ---

Nah it does. Zoro vs Batman as he gave a glare since like you said all we need one trait and we know they are going to fight. Zoro won't let him off easy and that's the truth here. Luffy and Sanji are only credible ones to face stronger foes in the end. Just the truth.

I thought you said anime is not canon? Why use anime feats then?

 

[M3J]

Different case though, this was even addressed during lucci vs luffy rematch at enies lobby. Luffy had G2 as powerup.

Sanji was losing against drake, but sanji with RS might rival drake, just like luffy did against lucci.
A rematch for sanji against drake or PO will be cool.

No it's not, the point is that Luffy didn't go all out, just as Sanji hasn't. If we went by skirmishes, then Luffy would never beat Crocodile and Lucci, for example. If Sanji goes all out, he may be able to beat Drake for all we know.

 

[King Moe]

Different case though, this was even addressed during lucci vs luffy rematch at enies lobby. Luffy had G2 as powerup.

Sanji was losing against drake, but sanji with RS might rival drake, just like luffy did against lucci.
A rematch for sanji against drake or PO will be cool.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 31, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 31, 2020 ---

I thought you said anime is not canon? Why use anime feats then?

You guys said it was Canon. I am Just using your words for your argument. If you believing one thing is Canon, so is other one. You can't pick and choose. You either All is Canon in Anime or not.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

No it's not, the point is that Luffy didn't go all out, just as Sanji hasn't. If we went by skirmishes, then Luffy would never beat Crocodile and Lucci, for example. If Sanji goes all out, he may be able to beat Drake for all we know.

Luffy only invented gear after that fight.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 31, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 31, 2020 ---

You guys said it was Canon. I am Just using your words for your argument. If you believing one thing is Canon, so is other one. You can't pick and choose. You either All is Canon in Anime or not.

I never said it was canon. Give me proof for that.
You are now backpedalling on your arguments.You should take on your own words.

 

[M3J]

Doesn't really change my point. Sanji is still capable of beating Drake, although I admit that'd be weird given Drake's position compared to Sanji. Like, Zoro beat Hodi, but Hodi was a weakling to depended on drugs, while Drake seems legit powerful.

I still would love to see Sanji take on a Yonkou commander though.

 

[goldb]

No one on BM's crew is worth the fighting for final fight as she didn't bring her full force with her as well. The goal is to take down Kaido more and from writing, he has more business with them than facing again on BMP side again.

So just to be clear, in your opinion Smoothie(who is a Sweet Commander), Daifuku or even Perospero are not worth fighting? These are opponents you consider to be below Sanji or at least not worth his time?

Yes, the goal is to take down Kaido, Big Mom is a wildcard at this point and not necessarily needs to be taken down at this point as she's not the obstacle for Wano. I've always said I'd like for her to continue chasing Luffy for a while, maybe until Elbaf.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 31, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 31, 2020 ---

You guys said it was Canon. I am Just using your words for your argument. If you believing one thing is Canon, so is other one. You can't pick and choose. You either All is Canon in Anime or not.

I never said it was canon. Give me proof for that.
You are now backpedalling on your arguments.You should take on your own words.

I've already said to move on from the anime and Page One topic.

 

[King Moe]

So just to be clear, in your opinion Smoothie(who is a Sweet Commander), Daifuku or even Perospero are not worth fighting? These are opponents you consider to be below Sanji or at least not worth his time?

Yes, the goal is to take down Kaido, Big Mom is a wildcard at this point and not necessarily needs to be taken down at this point as she's not the obstacle for Wano. I've always said I'd like for her to continue chasing Luffy for a while, maybe until Elbaf.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 31, 2020, Original Post Date: Mar 31, 2020 ---

I've already said to move on from the anime and Page One topic.

You forget Sanji won't fight a woman. That's why I am not counting her as possible opponent. She has more chances facing either Jimbei, Zoro, or maybe Law. The rest are under her and not much of challenge in hindsight about it. Daifuku is same level as T6H and Sanji prove he above their class just like he handle Daifuku back in WCI. Perospero I would consider, but realize he has has weakness to fire and Sanji would easily destroy as he can melt his candy like Luffy. He is like YC4 lvl at best now, but really Sanji with his training and modify has been above that even prior.

Plus Carrot would have unfinished business with him the most. She will avenge her master and comrade with help to beat him in a fight. Doesn't feel right putting Sanji in while knowing that.

The ones who he face the most especially final fight is looking to be King or Queen.

Wildcards are more Beast Pirates top Commanders who are in their mainland, not BMP who doesn't have a full group on her side. Not much to take from there.

Been studying the fights and how war will go. They can face warm-up fights, but no way Sanji's full power is at YV lvl or even YC4. He be YC lvl after facing Queen or King for that.

 

[afromarco005]

I found the truth about sanji. It all make sense now!

Spoiler