Discussion Sanji Discussion Thread

[M3J]

Yeah, I don't see any problem to let Robin dealing with Black M.

Plus, Brook is with her and he showed that he was more than capable to hold much bigger (and maybe stronger) opponents.

The problem for me was the way he got tricked by Black M and the way Oda depicted him calling for help. It was definitely too much.

I can understand that his values are so deeply and inculcated deep inside of him that he can't go against them.

If it was Nami, I'd understand some rage, but Robin can handle herself, and Sanji made that clear. Just another thing for readers to complain about without understanding.

I hope Oda shows how or why Sanji wasn't dumb or weak to have cried for help like that. Maybe lull any enemy he has into false sense of security or something.

 

[Prince13333]

Kind of weird that he dropped to the 4th place in the last popularity contest (actually no)

But honestly, what are your thoughts about that ?

For me, when I'm thinking about it, in the recent arcs, I consider that Nami was actually more supportive, level-headed and decisive compared to Sanji.

She's a major support of Luffy during WCI and is actually head-on facing Ultia now.

She really deserve this 3rd spot

Nami’s also an extremely attractive female character and one of the original 3 main characters in the story. One of the very few strawhats that played a Key role in a Luffy fight. And she and she has cool abilities...... The character has a lot of Weight. Maybe more so than Sanji honestly

 

[Ellenate]

If it was Nami, I'd understand some rage, but Robin can handle herself,

but...

Nami has a better fighting resume than robin

She took down:

A member of cp9
A member of baroque works
Aided in taking down a yonko commander

I would buy the whole "trusted his ally" angle had he called nami. Would've been a cool callback to when she saved him during enies lobby.

What we got though-

and Sanji made that clear.

Was just him saving his own a**

He called her cause he was TOLD TO and expected to be freed for doing so.

He lured Robin into a trap where she was going to be heavily outnumbered (he didn't know brook was coming with her).

There's nothing redeemable about what he did. the manga itself even calls him out for being pathetic

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Kind of weird that he dropped to the 4th place in the last popularity contest (actually no)

But honestly, what are your thoughts about that ?

For me, when I'm thinking about it, in the recent arcs, I consider that Nami was actually more supportive, level-headed and decisive compared to Sanji.

She's a major support of Luffy during WCI and is actually head-on facing Ultia now.

She really deserve this 3rd spot

It’s not weird at all , Oda has given sanji fuck all to do in the post time skip
Nami was great in whole cake island and pretty cool overall post time skip

but...

Nami has a better fighting resume than robin

She took down:

A member of cp9
A member of baroque works
Aided in taking down a yonko commander

I would buy the whole "trusted his ally" angle had he called nami. Would've been a cool callback to when she saved him during enies lobby.

What we got though-



Was just him saving his own a**

He called her cause he was TOLD TO and expected to be freed for doing so.

He lured Robin into a trap where she was going to be heavily outnumbered (he didn't know brook was coming with her).

There's nothing redeemable about what he did. the manga itself even calls him out for being pathetic

Yeah Oda and fans try to frame this as trust of his teammates but it’s bullshit lmao if Robin gets captured or badly injured , it’ll fall on sanji and his bullshit code , it was a betrayal I get it was supposed to be a trust thing but to me it was pathetic , Robin is a target



Lmaooo this thread is giving me Deja VU , I do think sanji is finally get a high profile fight but as a sanji fan we’ve been in the ringer , how many times in the 400+ chapters of the new world did we expect sanji to show out and show dominance as a fighter and strategist , yet no side
So while I fully expect it to happen , saying Oda gonna make it pay off when it hasn’t happened all timeskip is ...... yeah

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

Trust is when you let someone do something that only you feel comfortable personally doing or is best done by you.. and that you want to do. If I win the lottery with a ticket, I'll be trust if I for some reason let someone go cash the ticket on my behalf. It's better for me to cash in the ticket because they could steal the money after.

Trust really ultimately defined is when you let someone do something you're not comfortable with them doing, and giving them access to do so. Letting your girlfriend go visit her ex-bf for example assuming she's cheated once before.

Lots of people have all sorts of things on their laptops or computers they don't want anyone to have access to, as a result, they wouldn't share their computer password with anyone. If I gave someone my password to access a certain file and nothing else... that's trust because I'm letting them do something that only I feel comfortable doing... and that's accessing my computer, or rather, I'm letting someone do something I'm generally not comfortable with them doing.

This Black Maria situation would only be trust if Sanji was already fighting her and thought he was the only one capable of defeating her in this situation, and Robin requested that Sanji stop fighting and let her takeover. If Sanji didn't want to, but let her do so? That's trust.

If that's not the context, it's not trust. If I have to go knock on someone's door and I'm scared to do so, or don't want to do it... me passing on this responsibility to another person isn't trust, that's just being a coward.

Just because someone says thank you for trusting me doesn't mean you trust them especially when they lack context. If I don't want to go knock on someone's door because I know there's a dog in there, and I let someone do it on my behalf and they say "thank you for trusting me", it's not trust, it's just me being a coward or passing on my own problems to another.

He simply shifted his problems to the last person that should be involved in that situation which makes it worse.

There's a place for trust, and this situation wasn't it.

Sanji didn't want to fight Black Maria, and that's all that's needed to understand that this had nothing to do with trust.

 

[catagon87]

It’s not weird at all , Oda has given sanji fuck all to do in the post time skip
Nami was great in whole cake island and pretty cool overall post time skip

Sanji tracks better in Japan than other countries from what I remember. A lot of his jump probably has to do with the poll being global for the first time. Japan is very homogenous, and the consistency in polls has shown that.

Yeah Oda and fans try to frame this as trust of his teammates but it’s bullshit lmao if Robin gets captured or badly injured , it’ll fall on sanji and his bullshit code , it was a betrayal I get it was supposed to be a trust thing but to me it was pathetic , Robin is a target

Agree with you in spirit, but it's not going to happen because of plot.

Lmaooo this thread is giving me Deja VU , I do think sanji is finally get a high profile fight but as a sanji fan we’ve been in the ringer , how many times in the 400+ chapters of the new world did we expect sanji to show out and show dominance as a fighter and strategist , yet no side
So while I fully expect it to happen , saying Oda gonna make it pay off when it hasn’t happened all timeskip is ...... yeah

It's weird because Sanji actually did one of the most critical things in the whole arc by saving Momo right under King and Queen's nose (literally). I think if Brook or Nami had done that people would be ecstatic, but due to the fact that Sanji did it, and it wasn't Sanji straight up kicking King's ass or something, it's overshadowed by the fact that he's still running around Onigashima and got caught in the most obvious trap ever.

I'm a heavy Sanji critic, but I have to say Onigashima is different. Previous situations didn't really allow for Sanji to have a battle. His job on Dressrosa was to take Caesar to Zou, and he wasn't really given an opponent on Punk Hazard. Vergo was a kind-of situation. Vergo was strong enough to compete with Law, though. At that point in time he was clearly above Sanji, and Sanji didn't even have the RAID suit. There were only two real opponents on PH, and they got taken out by Law and Luffy. Monet was a sort-of opponent where Zoro got to defeat her and show part of his more badass side, but for obvious reasons that would never happen with Sanji. In WCI only Luffy really got any fights. Not even Jinbei got a one on one. Everyone else got their asses kicked repeatedly on the way out.

Right now Sanji literally has to fight someone strong. There's no way Nami defeats Ulti, and Robin defeats Black Maria, but Sanji doesn't defeat some strong opponent. Robin and Nami haven't exactly had a plethora of New World fights themselves.

 

[M3J]

but...

Nami has a better fighting resume than robin

She took down:

A member of cp9
A member of baroque works
Aided in taking down a yonko commander

I would buy the whole "trusted his ally" angle had he called nami. Would've been a cool callback to when she saved him during enies lobby.

What we got though-



Was just him saving his own a**

He called her cause he was TOLD TO and expected to be freed for doing so.

He lured Robin into a trap where she was going to be heavily outnumbered (he didn't know brook was coming with her).

There's nothing redeemable about what he did. the manga itself even calls him out for being pathetic

Robin has been surviving for nearly twenty years against enemies at every side, especially the World Government. Nami has not, and that is why Sanji trusts Robin more than Nami.

Did he lure RObin into a trap though? If he called someone for help, then Robin would have figured out it was a trap.

 

[Ellenate]

Robin has been surviving for nearly twenty years against enemies at every side, especially the World Government.

Robin's backstory consisted of her running not fighting-

Nami has not

do you not remember nami's backstory?

whole village taken over by fishmen
forced to work with the men who killed her mother
robbing pirates

Robin got to run, Nami didn't.

Nami relied only on herself and fought for her village's freedom
While Robin hid in crocodile's shadow and became a pawn

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

It's weird because Sanji actually did one of the most critical things in the whole arc by saving Momo right under King and Queen's nose (literally).

This moment was ruined for me by the fact that:

1. They disembarked at Onigashima.
2. Nami and co, set off to go save Momonosuke who they saw get abducted.
3. His role was to protect Nami as they head on to find Momonosuke.

Sanji's first instinct despite all that was to go look for women DESPITE all of this. He may have saved Momonosuke in the end, but he's still a douche for prioritising women over the situation which left a bad taste in my mouth.

It's like the police knowing my child is kidnapped, but they decide to grab a few donuts, get a massage, watch a movie after.... and then they save my child out of pure coincidence that they walk into my child after they leave the movie theature. Doesn't really show they cared despite the result. The context is not at all pleasing.

While the whole thing was quite funny with Sanjil looking gloomy... at the cost of representing Sanji as some sick pervert who will leave comrades and abducted kids for sexual pleasure?

If this was Caesar in Sanji's place and he did this? I would be fine with it, it'd be quite funny given that Caesar is scum anyway. I don't have any expectations of morality from him, but from someone who is depicted as moral? It's not a great look. Maybe it's a cultural thing that people in Japan appreciate, but not me unfortunately. Doesn't make me better, but I just don't ride with this.

 

[M3J]

Robin's backstory consisted of her running not fighting-




do you not remember nami's backstory?

whole village taken over by fishmen
forced to work with the men who killed her mother
robbing pirates

Robin got to run, Nami didn't.

Nami relied only on herself and fought for her village's freedom
While Robin hid in crocodile's shadow and became a pawn

That doesn't matter, Robin was still able to survive very well on her own for years, and we don't know if she fought to escape. Nami however didn't fight Arlong or his pirates or if she did, she lost.

Two different situation though. Robin had nothing to tie her down, while Nami had her family. Doesn't change the fact that Sanji acknowledges Robin being able to take care of herself while being more concerned about Nami.

 

[Ellenate]

That moment was pathetic and there's little to counter the sentiment.

Nami however...

comparing nami to robin though... that's a lot more interesting.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Sanji is smart, idk about one of the smartest characters in the series.......Theres atleast 3 strawhats smarter than Sanji in the crew...... How is Sanji ruining the story right now? His thing with Black Maria got Robin a fight for the first time in almost 20 years.......Do you know how long people have been waiting for a Robin fight??

Sanji easily used to be the most tactical and strategical strawhat , super perceptive and clever
Always thinking steps ahead
That’s all gone on the time skip

 

[Ellenate]

Sanji easily used to be the most tactical and strategical strawhat

how? the dude just kicks.

are you talking outside of battle?

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

how? the dude just kicks.

are you talking outside of battle?

Out smarting crocodile as mr prince
Destroying Enels engine
Opening the gate of justice during enies lobby
Getting on the sea train to rescue Robin

sanji in general always seemed more perceptive and used to operate in the shadows to help the crew >.> ,now he sneaks off to look for women during a war and when momo was captured
That’s all been dead and gone during the timskip

 

[catagon87]

Out smarting crocodile as mr prince
Destroying Enels engine
Opening the gate of justice during enies lobby
Getting on the sea train to rescue Robin

sanji in general always seemed more perceptive and used to operate in the shadows to help the crew >.> ,now he sneaks off to look for women during a war and when momo was captured
That’s all been dead and gone during the timskip

Sanji is basically a sex-hangry virgin after the time-skip.

 

[Prince13333]

Sanji easily used to be the most tactical and strategical strawhat , super perceptive and clever
Always thinking steps ahead
That’s all gone on the time skip

Tbh idk what to tell u......pre timeskip is literally a different series than post timeskip tbh. The strawhats dont dictate the story as much as they used to. But Wano seems to be a bit different from these post timeskip arcs we've been seeing and its still not over so I think we will see the best of all these characters. I think a more productive conversation would be, what do you think Sanji is going to do in the next chapters? Cause I think the stuff going on with Sanji,Zoro,Kawamatsu and Izo right now is pretty good, and is honestly a good sign for the future chapters.

 

[Ellenate]

Out smarting crocodile as mr prince
Destroying Enels engine
Opening the gate of justice during enies lobby
Getting on the sea train to rescue Robin

sanji in general always seemed more perceptive and used to operate in the shadows to help the crew >.> ,now he sneaks off to look for women during a war and when momo was captured
That’s all been dead and gone during the timskip

meh, most of that was just being in the right place at the right time.

I think the stuff going on with Sanji,Zoro,Kawamatsu and Izo right now is pretty good, and is honestly a good sign for the future chapters.

it's definitely better than what we've been given... i'm wary of where oda will go with it though.

maybe setting up a "usopp sword" situation... or maybe sanji will just hide zoro under a pile of trash next chapter?

 

[Prince13333]

meh, most of that was just being in the right place at the right time.






it's definitely better than what we've been given... i'm wary of where oda will go with it though.

maybe setting up a "usopp sword" situation... or maybe sanji will just hide zoro under a pile of trash next chapter?

What is there to be wary about? Who he fights?If their headed to the live floor only King, Queen, Perospero and maybe CP0 are in that path. These are all respectfully strong characters. All the women who are villains in the arc are being dealt with, and this is not an escape arc nor is it a character arc for Sanji so Sanji's cooking isn't playing a role here either.

Theres also no Mr. Prince Shit for him to do since nobody needs to be saved.

 

[Ellenate]

@Prince13333 ...we'll see.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

meh, most of that was just being in the right place at the right time.

That excuse can be made for any character.

We know that's not true because he thought about what he was doing... he didn't just magically find himself there and his hands moved and did this, and that happened.

Not everyone would have the the same mental acuity or idea to do what he did.

Sanji's always been exceptionally intelligent, inventive and tactical pre-skip.