Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2018] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[Tamil]

Toriko wasnt selling digitally so your comparison is non sensical.

Oh right, I forgot about that. Sorry for my ignorance.

 

[SharkBait]

Oh right, I forgot about that. Sorry for my ignorance.

Was just making sure. We cant allow misinformation to go unaddressed.

 

[4Eyes]

That Gintama page made me laugh way too hard. But it's really ending or nah?

Ps: I just love how discussing and comparing BC sales and quality lead us nowhere, bring pages and pages of empty discussion and yet we do it at least twice a month.

 

[OtterBrigade]

and yet we do it at least twice a week.

fixed your post for you

 

[TyVip]

Toriko is mad HYPU. Might reread it one day with the Viz Digital Vault.
I just want Saint Seiya, I's to be in the vault

 

[Mankichi Togawa]

I need Saint Seiya AND Hokuto no Ken in the vault (come on Viz, you also own Hokuto no Ken). If possible, Kinnikuman and City Hunter too, but Viz hasn't neither of them.

 

[xAsum0x]

feels good to finally be able to read all the Jujutsu Kaisen chapters

 

[Lizard_Boots]

Tomorrow’s Jump GIGA is apparently sold out on Amazon.

 

[Mankichi Togawa]

Ok, I'm doing the 12 characters list of Jump Force assuming there are going to be more characters plus DLC, but for some reason everybody think we are getting only 12 more characters when Yonkou didn't say that.

1. Kakashi
2. Sakura
3. Naruto villain (Madara/Pain/Orochimaru)
---
Jump Cover is Dragon Ball, One Piece and Naruto. Dragon Ball and One Piece have 6 characters, Naruto only 2. Even HxH and Bleach have more characters than Naruto (4 both). We should be expecting this, otherwise I'd like to think what the heck is Bandai Namco thinking.

----
4. Tsuna (Reborn!)
5. Koro-sensei (Assasination Classroom)
6. Jotaro (JoJo)
7. Dio (JoJo)
---
Yonkou ''confirmed these''

----
8. Jonathan, Joseph, or Josuke (JoJo)
9. Hiei or Kurama (Yu Yu Hakusho)
10. Toriko (Toriko)
11. Kinnikuman (Kinnikuman)
12. I'm between Gintoki or Raoh (Hokuto no Ken)

---
Characters everybody is saying they are going to be in the game, but I don't see it happening: MEDAKA,WON'T HAPPEN. Yeah, it was in J-Stars, but that amounts nothing. Except Black Clover, rest of titles in the game are +20 million copies, while Medaka has less copies than Ninku or Sexy Commando for example. Same reason I also say Bobobo, Beelzebub, World Trigger, or Kimetsu no Yaiba won't happen. There are even titles that deserve it more to be in (Hoshin Engi, Cobra, Sakigake! Otokojuku, NuBe) and that I'm very doubtful won't neither happen. Dragon Quest Dai no Daiboken could happen but has very little repercusion currently, so I doubt it too.

For 9 DLCs I see stuff like 6th Naruto character, 4th JoJo and Yu Yu Hakusho character, 3rd Saint Seiya character, Raoh if it doesn't happen now, Noelle, All Might or Bakugou, Seto Kaiba, and maybe and I hope it happens: Ryotsu.

 

[SharkBait]

Ok, I'm doing the 12 characters list of Jump Force assuming there are going to be more characters plus DLC, but for some reason everybody think we are getting only 12 more characters when Yonkou didn't say that.

1. Kakashi
2. Sakura
3. Naruto villain (Madara/Pain/Orochimaru)
---
Jump Cover is Dragon Ball, One Piece and Naruto. Dragon Ball and One Piece have 6 characters, Naruto only 2. Even HxH and Bleach have more characters than Naruto (4 both). We should be expecting this, otherwise I'd like to think what the heck is Bandai Namco thinking.

----
4. Tsuna (Reborn!)
5. Koro-sensei (Assasination Classroom)
6. Jotaro (JoJo)
7. Dio (JoJo)
---
Yonkou ''confirmed these''

----
8. Jonathan, Joseph, or Josuke (JoJo)
9. Hiei or Kurama (Yu Yu Hakusho)
10. Toriko (Toriko)
11. Kinnikuman (Kinnikuman)
12. I'm between Gintoki or Raoh (Hokuto no Ken)

---
Characters everybody is saying they are going to be in the game, but I don't see it happening: MEDAKA,WON'T HAPPEN. Yeah, it was in J-Stars, but that amounts nothing. Except Black Clover, rest of titles in the game are +20 million copies, while Medaka has less copies than Ninku or Sexy Commando for example. Same reason I also say Bobobo, Beelzebub, World Trigger, or Kimetsu no Yaiba won't happen. There are even titles that deserve it more to be in (Hoshin Engi, Cobra, Sakigake! Otokojuku, NuBe) and that I'm very doubtful won't neither happen. Dragon Quest Dai no Daiboken could happen but has very little repercusion currently, so I doubt it too.

For 9 DLCs I see stuff like 6th Naruto character, 4th JoJo and Yu Yu Hakusho character, 3rd Saint Seiya character, Raoh if it doesn't happen now, Noelle, All Might or Bakugou, Seto Kaiba, and maybe and I hope it happens: Ryotsu.

No saiki?

 

[Franz]

Boycott everything that is Japanese to protest against the government's decision to resume whaling !!!

 

[OtterBrigade]

Boycott everything that is Japanese to protest against the government's decision to resume whaling !!!

My favourite Jump manga. Too bad no one in Japan liked it and it got axed so quickly though.

 

[Unok]

Feels bad that Toriko is treated as BC's retarded cousin or something. Y'all need to put some respect on Toriko's name since I know most of you guys haven't read it.

Tbf, while both BC & Toriko both got pushed, the latter got pushed far more than the former. Nothing in this magazine is going to rival Toriko's push so it's not fair to compare. Plus Toriko was at least a hit prior to it's anime, doing more or less the same BC does now with it's anime.

Everytime I hear about Toriko's biggest push in Jump's history, I start to laugh and wonder if people actually believe that or they just repeat things they heard.

It's been discussed in the past. The super heavily promoted Toriko was having less color pages than other zero promoted series like Bleach (which was in it's high decline and bad toc positions). So I always wonder, how it was promoted more than all other series, when it had less CPs & Covers? Majority of it's CPs were due to anime announcements, game announcements, movie, anniversaries, etc. The only real argument can be the crossover with OP, but that happened for obvious reasons. And lets not forget there are Naruto x OP, Sket Dance x Gintama and few more manga crossovers that everyone conveniently forgets.

Here is my old comment, were I counted the CP of all series during Toriko's "heavy" push - https://mangahelpers.com/forum/posts/3916557/
You can see in 2011 it go beaten by: Kochikame, Bleach, Beelzebub and same as Gintama & Sket Dance, and in 2012 it got beaten by 8 other series. But hey, "nothing" can compare to it's push.

Another "super push" Toriko vs Bleach comparison - https://mangahelpers.com/forum/thre...rankings-2009-2015.50703/page-58#post-3387956
And another "super push" Toriko vs World Trigger comparison - https://mangahelpers.com/forum/thre...-toc-talk-part-7.2998305/page-82#post-3916476

For the most pushed series in Jump history, surprisingly a lot of other series had more CP&C than Toriko. I always feel that people can't understand that each year Jump promote as much as they can their most popular series, especially if they have news about them (new anime season, new movie, new game, anniversary, etc.)

edit: Riding on the "super promotion" wave, I remember while reading Kimetsu, that it got lots of color pages. So I went and checked it:
For 2017 it got 10 CP and 2 Covers, a lot of which were really close to each other: ch42, ch45, ch50, ch53, ch59, ch61, ch63, ch66, ch71, ch87 -> ch35 & 40 also had CP but those are in 2016; and ch92 & ch94 but those are 2018 issues.
The anime was announced in 2018, so basically it was receiving CP only for popularity in 2017 and celebrating 1st anniversary. In 2018 issues it had 9CP & 1 Cover. Yet no one talks about "push". People talking about Toriko's push are totally not biased XD

 

[savethecat]

That Gintama page made me laugh way too hard. But it's really ending or nah?

Ps: I just love how discussing and comparing BC sales and quality lead us nowhere, bring pages and pages of empty discussion and yet we do it at least twice a month.

Then there’s always the page where we all point out how Black Clover sales and quality discussions lead us nowhere

 

[Tamil]

Everytime I hear about Toriko's biggest push in Jump's history, I start to laugh and wonder if people actually believe that or they just repeat things they heard.

It's been discussed in the past. The super heavily promoted Toriko was having less color pages than other zero promoted series like Bleach (which was in it's high decline and bad toc positions). So I always wonder, how it was promoted more than all other series, when it had less CPs & Covers? Majority of it's CPs were due to anime announcements, game announcements, movie, anniversaries, etc. The only real argument can be the crossover with OP, but that happened for obvious reasons. And lets not forget there are Naruto x OP, Sket Dance x Gintama and few more manga crossovers that everyone conveniently forgets.

Here is my old comment, were I counted the CP of all series during Toriko's "heavy" push - https://mangahelpers.com/forum/posts/3916557/
You can see in 2011 it go beaten by: Kochikame, Bleach, Beelzebub and same as Gintama & Sket Dance, and in 2012 it got beaten by 8 other series. But hey, "nothing" can compare to it's push.

Another "super push" Toriko vs Bleach comparison - https://mangahelpers.com/forum/thre...rankings-2009-2015.50703/page-58#post-3387956
And another "super push" Toriko vs World Trigger comparison - https://mangahelpers.com/forum/thre...-toc-talk-part-7.2998305/page-82#post-3916476

For the most pushed series in Jump history, surprisingly a lot of other series had more CP&C than Toriko. I always feel that people can't understand that each year Jump promote as much as they can their most popular series, especially if they have news about them (new anime season, new movie, new game, anniversary, etc.)

What are you on about. I was speaking more about it's anime, not so much it's CP. It got 2 OVA's & film before it's anime debut and got another movie sometime in 2013. The DBZ kai timeslot is tough to be rivaled. I'd argue most of its push came from its anime, like with the timeslot, movies & crossovers with DB/OP. I think it is 3 crossovers (2 with OP and one with OP & DBZ), hell the first episode of Toriko is in fact a crossover.

 

[Unok]

What are you on about. I was speaking more about it's anime, not so much it's CP. It got 2 OVA's & film before it's anime debut and got another movie sometime in 2013. The DBZ kai timeslot is tough to be rivaled. I'd argue most of its push came from its anime, like with the timeslot, movies & crossovers with DB/OP. I think it is 3 crossovers (2 with OP and one with OP & DBZ), hell the first episode of Toriko is in fact a crossover.

People talking about Toriko push, usually talk about Jump pushing Toriko. But you are talking about Toei pushing it? Why would they do that? It's not like they earn money.... oh wait.
Also, you talk about anime, but mentions this: "you guys haven't read it."; "Nothing in this magazine is going...", soooo totally not talking about the manga and being PUSHED in the MAGAZINE? No?
It ain't the first series to receive Jump Festa OVA's before the anime and even after the TV anime. Even Beelzebub did it, Yuuna got 3 OVA bundled with the manga volumes and that started before the anime. Toriko got a second one, mostly because another Jump Festa arrived and there still was no TV anime. Jujutsu got animated PVs. The movies are Toei doing, also not the first series to receive a movie. AssClass had OVA and movies too. Kuroko and HQ also received movies and OVA, but guess it counts as promotion only if its for Toriko. It received DBZ Kai slot only because those time slots are since like forever Toei owned. I think right now it's airing Gegege on it, so that's also super pushed I guess. Yet something must air on that time slot, don't you think? And Toei ain't gonna give it that easy to someone else. If the anime was done by another studio, Toriko would neither receive the crossovers, nor the timeslot, nor the movies.
It's the same with the crossovers, it was Toei doing and it also obvious why: their time slots, their properties, fitting settings. It's easily done, far more easily than a OP x Gegege crossover.

So you are stating that Toriko received the biggest push in history of Jump MAGAZINE, only because the anime got pushed by Toei (who naturally try to promote their properties), who saw fitting to do crossovers with the franchises they own. It's kinda strange to state Toriko got pushed in the magazine, but talk about only for anime push.

 

[shoyoboyo]

My favourite Jump manga. Too bad no one in Japan liked it and it got axed so quickly though.

Don't you mean, it got harpooned quickly?

 

[Scruffy8642]

I don’t know... Toriko got 7 covers in its first year of serialisation, a number that, since 1995, has only been equalled by One Piece. Can you even imagine that? SEVEN!! The only other series to get more than 4 since 2000 are Eyeshield with 6, and Ass Class with 5 (Naruto and PoT both got 5 in 99 though).

Mind you, that was also during one of the most successful years for the magazine this millenium, with Nura, Bakuman, Kuroko, Medaka, Inumarudashi and Beelzebub all starting basically within the same 15 months. Yet none of them even came close in promotion. I do understand that most of these weren’t big right off the bat, but Bakuman had the second best Jump debut in the history of Oricon, and it barely got anything in comparison.

People talk about Black Clover, Neverland and Stone being pushed these days, but neither is even in the same league. That’s without considering everything else it got. Toriko got basically everything it could possibly get at the time in promotion for its first two to three years. I don’t see how people can still deny that. Though of course the promotion in the magazine would go down in later years once it established itself and had other forms of media for promotion.

 

[Unok]

I don’t know... Toriko got 7 covers in its first year of serialisation, a number that, since 1995, has only been equalled by One Piece. Can you even imagine that? SEVEN!!

Name them please. I counted 5. It's 7 if it's first 2 YEARS of serialization, not just 1. Series start in mid May 2008, 1 year makes until ch49 in mid May 2009. That's until issue 25 of 2009. I see covers for issue 2008-25 (beginning of serialization like every other series), 2008-36, 2008-48, 2009-10, 2009-20. Then in it's second year receive 2 more: 2009-29 for 1st anniversary and 2009-40. So which ones I'm missing?

"but Bakuman had the second best Jump debut in the history of Oricon, and it barely got anything in comparison."
Bakuman started in 37/38-2008, usually shared cover issue, still got big box to promote it. Then in next Issue 2008-39 took the cover from Inumarudashii. Another covers in 2009-09, 2009-43, 2010-09, 2010-30, 2010-39. That 6 covers and half for it's first 2 years. In comparison Toriko had 7. Had like 15 CP for 100 chapters, compared to 16-17 for Toriko. Also some of it's covers were just covers without CP. Sure "barely got anything in comparison".... Also Kimetsu no Yaiba, 19 CP for 100 chapters with 3 covers.


Also for the pushed Toriko anime, it was said it go pushed because: had OVA before TV; had 2 movies; had good timeslot; had crossover with popular series. Lets review another series shall we?
One Piece: had OVA before TV; having 800+ episode anime; had tons of movies; had tons of OVAs and Specials; had crossover with DBZ (and Toriko); had timeslot next to DB; had tons of games (even Luffy promoted as main character in Jump crossover games); had manga crossover with DB and one with Naruto; have ~10CPs per year with ~8 covers per year; always big and in front in shared Jump covers; tons of other stuff. It beats Toriko in every aspect that was said as "push" for Toriko, yet Toriko still the biggest push in Jump XD
Then you think of Dragon Ball: tons of original TV, remaster anime, tons of movies, crossovers with OP, OVAs, specials, games, etc, etc.

Call it push, call it whatever, but companies will always milk their properties as much as they can. If they see they can milk it more with a movie, they will do. That's why OP, DB are still being milked (pushed).

 

[Mankichi Togawa]

I think Toriko was VERY pushed at the beginning (all these crossovers Dragon Ball x One Piece x Toriko), but then when sales weren't as expected, they stopped pushing it.

I also think Dr.Stone is being the most pushed Jump title since Toriko.