Discussion Sanji Discussion Thread

[Grandmaster Woro]

I doubt even Zoro could cut through the RS. Its far too durable

enma messed up kaido. Zoro cut through RS.
RS increases durability, but not to dragon-scale durability

 

[Pirate Queen]

enma messed up kaido. Zoro cut through RS.
RS increases durability, but not to dragon-scale durability

Well your post is baseless until we see evidence of Zoro cutting Kaido the same effortless way Oden did. So until then... Sanji's durability is strong enough to brush off a YC1 piercing attack, Zoro has yet to show that level of attack power.

You may be right, but now it is baseless.

 

[Nie Li]

We need to wait for the feats that are to come during this arc's big fights. So far we have to assume Zoro isn't yet near Oden's level because of lack of proof and so Enma in his hands is meaningless until he proves himself, just like Shusui didn't suddenly make him as strong as Ryuuma was (when alive).

With what he's shown so far, if King didn't pierce through the RS with a divebomb ancient zoan piercing attack, neither can Zoro.

I do think Zoro will prove himself soon, and I think the fact that he's casually wielding Enma despite what we saw when he first wielded it is noteworthy.


About the Raid Suit, I understand Moe's annoyed to accept the RS. Sanji has never needed a tool to be strong. He's a cool badass who has reached the level he's at just by fighting with no weapons and even handicaping himself to a style that never relies on fists.

However, the manga has been very clear about the Raid Suit boosting Sanji's speed, strength, versatility and, most importantly, his endurance. He's already doned it in a fight twice and this second time it saved him from dying in a single shot from King's attack. The manga also spent a couple of chapters addressing Sanji's moral dilemma about wielding his family's technology and he apparently has already come to terms with it, so it's pretty clear that the RS is a permanent upgrade for Sanji's fighting style. They still have to change the RS fashion style, though, as Sanji mentioned a while back, so it might end up looking more like a suit, for those who dislike his Kamen Rider look.

It's not the first time a strawhat's style evolves and changes through technology (Franky was always a cyborg, but how he fought pre-TS is very different to now. Nami only had a stick in the beginning. More than 100 chapters into the manga the stick started to evolve into a weapon that can now control the weather. Usopp was only a sharpshooter before the TS). And even without technology, Luffy's fighting style evolved a lot when gears started being introduced. It's the same for Sanji and his RS.


Stealth is but a small part of the improvements the RS bring to the table.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Sanji's durability is strong enough to brush off a YC1 piercing attack,

nah RS doesn't "brush off YC1 attack"
sanji clearly had some wounds from the skirmish, and RS ichiji was brutally beaten by YC1 katakuri.

 

[Pirate Queen]

nah RS doesn't "brush off YC1 attack"
sanji clearly had some wounds from the skirmish, and RS ichiji was brutally beaten by YC1 katakuri.

Soundn like moe.

Sanji was just fine. 0 injury noted.

If you can get up from a YC1 piercing attack, while defenseless... yeah, he brushed it off.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

However, the manga has been very clear about the Raid Suit boosting Sanji's speed, strength, versatility and, most importantly, his endurance. He's already doned it in a fight twice and this second time it saved him from dying in a single shot from King's attack. The manga also spent a couple of chapters addressing Sanji's moral dilemma about wielding his family's technology and he apparently has already come to terms with it, so it's pretty clear that the RS is a permanent upgrade for Sanji's fighting style.

i agree. I think sanji just had an ego against RS, but he clearly receives status boost from it.
I think it also ties the loose ends in judge's ideology for weapons. We saw judge tasting his own medicine when his weapon sons don't care at all about being dead in WCI and was ironically saved by the experiment failure son who maintained his heart. But we also saw that technologies are indeed useful to enhance fighting skill

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 19, 2020, Original Post Date: Sep 19, 2020 ---

Soundn like moe.

Sanji was just fine. 0 injury noted.

If you can get up from a YC1 piercing attack, while defenseless... yeah, he brushed it off.

you should update your note on sanji's injury

 

[Nie Li]

nah RS doesn't "brush off YC1 attack"
sanji clearly had some wounds from the skirmish, and RS ichiji was brutally beaten by YC1 katakuri.

Sanji's visible wounds were only on his head, which is unprotected and was damaged by going through a wall and into the ground, but his stomach wasn't punctured, so the RS definitely resisted the attack.

Ichiji, too, was only bleeding from the head and had his RS intact when Katakuri defeated him.

It's a big weak point for the suit, but the suits themselves have remained undamaged so far.

 

[Pirate Queen]

i agree. I think sanji just had an ego against RS, but he clearly receives status boost from it.
I think it also ties the loose ends in judge's ideology for weapons. We saw judge tasting his own medicine when his weapon sons don't care at all about being dead in WCI and was ironically saved by the experiment failure son who maintained his heart. But we also saw that technologies are indeed useful to enhance fighting skill

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 19, 2020, Original Post Date: Sep 19, 2020 ---

you should update your note on sanji's injury

Cringe... so the part of his body NOT covered by the RS is damaged lol. Your such a troll.

In regards to the RS durability, it is completely undamaged and wasn't peirced.

So until it is damaged the highest damage output is a YC1 piercing attack at high velocity and Sanji brushed it off lol

Nothing can cut or peirce it that we know of. I doubt it would last against a yonko. But anyone below that isn't hurting it until otherwise noted

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Sanji's visible wounds were only on his head, which is unprotected and was damaged by going through a wall and into the ground, but his stomach wasn't punctured, so the RS definitely resisted the attack.

Ichiji, too, was only bleeding from the head and had his RS intact when Katakuri defeated him.

It's a big weak point for the suit, but the suits themselves have remained undamaged so far.

duh his visible wounds is only on his head. His clothes cover all the other parts of his body, same can be said for ichiji's case.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Clothes get visibly damaged all the time... the RS has not been damaged yet.

 

[Nie Li]

duh his visible wounds is only on his head. His clothes cover all the other parts of his body, same can be said for ichiji's case.

If his stomach had been pierced by the pteranodon's beak, Sanji wouldn't be standing straight and he would be bleeding all over that Strawhat's Assemble scene.

 

[Pirate Queen]

If his stomach had been pierced by the pteranodon's beak, Sanji wouldn't be standing straight and he would be bleeding all over that Strawhat's Assemble scene.

Lord takes every oppourtunity to bash Sanji. Don't expect honest posts from him.

How durable do you think the suit it? What do you think the highest level of attack it can tank?

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Cringe... so the part of his body NOT covered by the RS is damaged lol. Your such a troll.

In regards to the RS durability, it is completely undamaged and wasn't peirced.

So until it is damaged the highest damage output is a YC1 piercing attack at high velocity and Sanji brushed it off lol

Nothing can cut or peirce it that we know of. I doubt it would last against a yonko. But anyone below that isn't hurting it until otherwise noted

i already answered this above.
the suit doesn't break easily, but doesn't always mean the same thing for the user. Sanji mentioned he still felt the attack from page one.
"Brushed it off" with a head wound. Sure, buddy.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 19, 2020, Original Post Date: Sep 19, 2020 ---

If his stomach had been pierced by the pteranodon's beak, Sanji wouldn't be standing straight and he would be bleeding all over that Strawhat's Assemble scene.

i didn't say his stomach was pierced. Read my post above, already explained

 

[Pirate Queen]

i already answered this above.
the suit doesn't break easily, but doesn't always mean the same thing for the user. Sanji mentioned he still felt the attack from page one.
"Brushed it off" with a head wound. Sure, buddy.

Yeah, like Zoro brushed off getting stabbed by Killer and fucking wrecked him.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Lord takes every oppourtunity to bash Sanji. Don't expect honest posts from him.

ad hominem.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 19, 2020, Original Post Date: Sep 19, 2020 ---

Yeah, like Zoro brushed off getting stabbed by Killer and fucking wrecked him.

exactly. You clearly had no idea what "brushed off" actually means lol

 

[Nie Li]

duh his visible wounds is only on his head. His clothes cover all the other parts of his body, same can be said for ichiji's case.

I don't think that's the case. Sanji seems to be doing very well and Ichiji too kept on fighting and saved Sanji during a later scene.

However, if I'm wrong and Sanji is damaged under his clothes, then he will surely say so himself later during his next fight, perhaps during an inner monologue.

Until then, we see no wounds where he took the big impact, he's alive, he's standing straight, so I'll keep assuming there are no wounds on his stomach.

Lord takes every oppourtunity to bash Sanji. Don't expect honest posts from him.

How durable do you think the suit it? What do you think the highest level of attack it can tank?

I honestly didn't expect it to tank King's attack to such an extent. Obviously I expected Sanji to survive the attack and have enough fire left in him to defeat a strong opponent before the arc ends, but I thought he would somehow evade the impact against the ground at the last moment.

The fact that Kaidou's (possible) strongest subordinate was sure that he would sever Sanji's torso in half and miserably failed at it despite hitting him head-on speaks volumes of the RS durability. I'm starting to think it takes a Yonko to actually break the RS, so it's good that the head is exposed or Sanji would be too invulnerable to be a fun fighter anymore (if his fights were to become easy it would be boring).

I guess other ways to defeat a RS-wearer would be an attack like Lucci's rokuougan, "shockwave" attacks that pierce through the target to cause internal damage.

 

[Pirate Queen]

I don't think that's the case. Sanji seems to be doing very well and Ichiji too kept on fighting and saved Sanji during a later scene.

However, if I'm wrong and Sanji is damaged under his clothes, then he will surely say so himself later during his next fight, perhaps during an inner monologue.

Until then, we see no wounds where he took the big impact, he's alive, he's standing straight, so I'll keep assuming there are no wounds on his stomach.


I honestly didn't expect it to tank King's attack to such an extent. Obviously I expected Sanji to survive the attack and have enough fire left in him to defeat a strong opponent before the arc ends, but I thought he would somehow evade the impact against the ground at the last moment.

The fact that Kaidou's (possible) strongest subordinate was sure that he would sever Sanji's torso in half and miserably failed at it despite hitting him head-on speaks volumes of the RS durability. I'm starting to think it takes a Yonko to actually break the RS, so it's good that the head is exposed or Sanji would be too invulnerable to be a fun fighter anymore (if his fights were to become easy it would be boring).

I guess other ways to defeat a RS-wearer would be an attack like Lucci's rokuougan, "shockwave" attacks that pierce through the target to cause internal damage.

I'm of the same opinion. It could be made of shock resistant fibers? Similar to Wapol metal. I doubt even Katauri with his trident could have peirced through the suit.

The RS really does make Sanji op to a certain degree in the sense that it puts him from a YC4 up to maybe a YC 2-1, depending on who is opponent is and how he performs.

But the RS seems to provide durability that even haki armor can't replicate. And even better Sanji doesn't have to use up his Haki reserves so quickly, saving it for what really matters.

And anyone unbiased could see Sanji is stronger than his siblings, even w/o a RS.

And Invisibility adds another layer to combat we have yet to see interacting with a competent CoO user.

 

[Nie Li]

I'm of the same opinion. It could be made of shock resistant fibers? Similar to Wapol metal. I doubt even Katauri with his trident could have peirced through the suit.

The RS really does make Sanji op to a certain degree in the sense that it puts him from a YC4 up to maybe a YC 2-1, depending on who is opponent is and how he performs.

But the RS seems to provide durability that even haki armor can't replicate. And even better Sanji doesn't have to use up his Haki reserves so quickly, saving it for what really matters.

And anyone unbiased could see Sanji is stronger than his siblings, even w/o a RS.

And Invisibility adds another layer to combat we have yet to see interacting with a competent CoO user.

What we have now to see is if Sanji's attack power while doning the RS is on par with his durability. If he can damage King as easily as he tanked his attack, then he's now a YC1 level monster, otherwise he should be YC 2-3, since no matter how much durability the RS provides, he could end up in the end like Ichiji did against Katakuri.

About the siblings, I'm on the fence about who's stronger, to be fair.

About Niji, Sanji did dislocate Niji's jaw with a kick, but Niji didn't seem like he's a weakling without his RS either, and how his electricity power actually comes from his body it's possible that RS-Niji is actually much stronger than he had the chance to demonstrate. I think Sanji with a RS is stronger than Niji, unless Niji really had much else to show.

About Ichiji, I believe Ichiji is stronger than Sanji, RS or not, until Sanji has a feat that proves otherwise. I don't know exactly how strong or weak Ichiji's basic CQC is, since he really didn't show anything, but Ichiji pierced through Oven's body with his special ability.

Oven was praised as having the strongest durability out of all of the Charlotte sons. He ignored kicks from both Sanji and Niji, he was run over by a ship and hit on the head with a giant club, and he ignored all of it, but Ichiji pierced his shoulder all the way through with a single skill, so Ichiji is definitely a force to be recokned with despite how Katakuri humiliated him. His attacks destructibility are definitely top tier, but he lacked good CoO to beat Kata.

If Sanji proves to be YC-1 level all around, then I'll accept that he has definitely surpassed Ichiji as a fighter.

 

[Pirate Queen]

What we have now to see is if Sanji's attack power while doning the RS is on par with his durability. If he can damage King as easily as he tanked his attack, then he's now a YC1 level monster, otherwise he should be YC 2-3, since no matter how much durability the RS provides, he could end up in the end like Ichiji did against Katakuri.

About the siblings, I'm on the fence about who's stronger, to be fair.

About Niji, Sanji did dislocate Niji's jaw with a kick, but Niji didn't seem like he's a weakling without his RS either, and how his electricity power actually comes from his body it's possible that RS-Niji is actually much stronger than he had the chance to demonstrate. I think Sanji with a RS is stronger than Niji, unless Niji really had much else to show.

About Ichiji, I believe Ichiji is stronger than Sanji, RS or not, until Sanji has a feat that proves otherwise. I don't know exactly how strong or weak Ichiji's basic CQC is, since he really didn't show anything, but Ichiji pierced through Oven's body with his special ability.

Oven was praised as having the strongest durability out of all of the Charlotte sons. He ignored kicks from both Sanji and Niji, he was run over by a ship and hit on the head with a giant club, and he ignored all of it, but Ichiji pierced his shoulder all the way through with a single skill, so Ichiji is definitely a force to be recokned with despite how Katakuri humiliated him. His attacks destructibility are definitely top tier, but he lacked good CoO to beat Kata.

If Sanji proves to be YC-1 level all around, then I'll accept that he has definitely surpassed Ichiji as a fighter.

Sanji already proved himself against Page 1 and then by blocking King in the beginning of their clash without losing ground and finally brushing of King's attack. Ichiji was clowned by Katakuri. Sanji facing a similar opponent was at least able to hold his ground in a single clash.

All feats better than anything his brothers have done. And hasn't used anything stronger than Diable Jambe.

But like you said, more feats are clearly needed.

Imagine, Invisible Hell Memories with accelerators activated... thats a Yonko Commander finisher for sure

 

[King Moe]

Sanji is capable fighter without and with RS on him as we seen that already and for him to tank Full Zoan King's attack who was aiming to use a move to kill him and come out fine, shows that he is being push more as YC lvl that didn't do much to him and he now fighting with everyone to help Luffy get to Kaido. Also it's obvious we haven't seen Sanji's full power as he hasn't shown that in any fight at all during NW. Some are interrupted from what I recall, but he shown feats against handling and beating credible enemies like Oven and PO with ease giving them damage without using much of his power and we just seen him tank away YC King attack and come back to fighting. This arc is going to be like Enies Lobby on Strawhats going on another level in power as they going to take down an Yonko.

If Luffy is going to be one to deal major damage and defeat Kaido, make sense why Sanji is showing performance of being YC lvl and going on to face King (Maybe Queen, but looks it hinting on King more) given he isn't afraid and wants to fight the enemies to take them down.

Also:

Sanji has no visible injuries whatsoever in next chapter compare to injuries we seen like on Zoro for example. He is clearly fine after King's Full Zoan Attack and back to fighting just like that. I don't get where 'he is injured' fantasy is coming from as seems like few people can't admit when they are wrong on the matter.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 19, 2020, Original Post Date: Sep 19, 2020 ---

I doubt even Zoro could cut through the RS. Its far too durable

He couldn't even touch Sanji in Base when he make comment about needing armor for his body given his durability and stamina issues.