maybe after wano he's getting into YC4 level, but for now i would say sanji was still (struggling against) flying six level. We saw sanji lost to black maria, failed to beat page one, and was knocked down with drake's tail
To be honest, your points are kind of biased here.
Of course Sanji lost against Black Maria, from what I know he would lost a re-match with Kalifa, a 1v1 with Tashigi and even Alvida pre-timeskip. She's a woman, that's his ultimate weakness.
Luffy also took a hard hit from Ulti which hurted him, and I don't think it necessarily means he's F6 level.
And yes, he failed to beat PO, but from my point of view, he clearly had the edge. Failing to beat someone doesn't really mean you are weaker than him/her (or we could assume that Luffy was more or less Monet level when he fought her during PH). Especially given the circumstances of the fight (he was on the run and from and the longer he was fighting PO, the more he would had a chance to be noticed and deal with another F6 or a Calamity.)
But I agree, you can't chose which scenes of the anime you like and fitting your narrative and excluding others.
To be honest, your points are kind of biased here.
Of course Sanji lost against Black Maria, from what I know he would lost a re-match with Kalifa, a 1v1 with Tashigi and even Alvida pre-timeskip. She's a woman, that's his ultimate weakness.
Luffy also took a hard hit from Ulti which hurted him, and I don't think it necessarily means he's F6 level.
And yes, he failed to beat PO, but from my point of view, he clearly had the edge. Failing to beat someone doesn't really mean you are weaker than him/her (or we could assume that Luffy was more or less Monet level when he fought her during PH). Especially given the circumstances of the fight (he was on the run and from and the longer he was fighting PO, the more he would had a chance to be noticed and deal with another F6 or a Calamity.)
But I agree, you can't chose which scenes of the anime you like and fitting your narrative and excluding others.
Semi-biased. It’s more spiteful because you constantly have Moe over hype, over portray a scene....Then results Moe having a wanky ass power scale, because Sanji lost, didn’t look good. Or Zoro did better....
P1 fight. Sanji had the edge; But it seemed more of an even fight. P1 wasn’t sustaining heavy damage and overpowered Sanji.,,
Aside from Vergo this was Sanji’s toughest clash. After that we see a clash with D Drake another Tobi Roppo, who had the edge against Sanji this time, disregarded his attack and countered.
So Sanji hasn’t shown superiority or serious threat to commander lv fighters....He hasn’t shown any adept Haki skills or advance Haki skills. He has a Raid Suit anyone can use & he Cooks
Semi-biased. It’s more spiteful because you constantly have Moe over hype, over portray a scene....Then results Moe having a wanky ass power scale, because Sanji lost, didn’t look good. Or Zoro did better....
P1 fight. Sanji had the edge; But it seemed more of an even fight. P1 wasn’t sustaining heavy damage and overpowered Sanji.,,
Aside from Vergo this was Sanji’s toughest clash. After that we see a clash with D Drake another Tobi Roppo, who had the edge against Sanji this time, disregarded his attack and countered.
So Sanji hasn’t shown superiority or serious threat to commander lv fighters....He hasn’t shown any adept Haki skills or advance Haki skills. He has a Raid Suit anyone can use & he Cooks
To be honest, I can't really call his altercations with Drake (or King/Daifuku for example) a real fight. They exchanged one or two blows and then the confrontation was done.
And if take into account the sturdiness of the F6/Ancient Zoan, sure, I can understand that Sanji was surprised by it.
But again, it's too vague. It's clearly possible that he's already YC level, I would not be surprised by that. But sure, he still hasn't showed it yet.
To be honest, I can't really call his altercations with Drake (or King/Daifuku for example) a real fight. They exchanged one or two blows and then the confrontation was done.
And if take into account the sturdiness of the F6/Ancient Zoan, sure, I can understand that Sanji was surprised by it.
But again, it's too vague. It's clearly possible that he's already YC level, I would not be surprised by that. But sure, he still hasn't showed it yet.
Giving that none of us fans write the story. It is possible for Sanji to actually being stronger than he is. But going on foreshadowing, context, plot progression, deeper analysis; Oda hasn’t shown Sanji hype or much love in terms of fighting. While others have gotten the clues to their growth curve & adequate feats. Sanji doesn’t have this....
So yes there’s room for him to be scaled higher. He just hasn’t been highlighted in any form of having YC skills yet
This is not the first time I say this, but I'll say it again.
Anyone is free to talk about either the manga or the anime, but if you want to discuss about things that are canon, don't try to push non-canon material as canon to selectively suit your points.
Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
@King Moe If you can especifically prove the anime-only X Drake vs Sanji is in any form canon, prove it in a post. If you can't prove it, then please stop trying to argue about that as if it were canon or relevant to the manga.
Imagine calling a character who refuse to harm women early that he will 'harm' them. You have no credibility and just going of on biased insecurity cause you got no backing.
Not hunches and please don't use 'inbred'. Can't have a discussion without you getting issue over something that has a point.
--- Double Post Merged, ---
Not saying every Anime scene are Canon. Just certain ones that have the proof.
Like how you ignore that Nami and Robin willingly let themselves be look at in mixed bath by strangers and want call Sanji looking at them sneakily is the problem, but not that? Man your biased hate doesn't hide nor calling out characters on their actions. Your being more like a certain Zoro-fans on picking and changing narration on issues.
Shared baths in Japan are divided by gender. A female going to one does not mean she is asking to be seen by men. A man who sneaks into one to peep on women is going to land themselves in prison as a sexual predator. If you wanna debate me on Sanji you’re going to have a way better time convincing me he’s a strong fighter than you would convincing me he’s not a sexual predator. I mean the dude sniffed Perona. The dude who wanted the invisibility fruit just so he could spy on women in their private moments.
I’m allowed to think that Sanji is a despicable sexual predator.
Shared baths in Japan are divided by gender. A female going to one does not mean she is asking to be seen by men. A man who sneaks into one to peep on women is going to land themselves in prison as a sexual predator. If you wanna debate me on Sanji you’re going to have a way better time convincing me he’s a strong fighter than you would convincing me he’s not a sexual predator. I mean the dude sniffed Perona. The dude who wanted the invisibility fruit just so he could spy on women in their private moments.
I’m allowed to think that Sanji is a despicable sexual predator.
Come back when you can be unbiased and show Sanji ever harming a woman on assault as he never done that. Continue to act like he will 'harm' women when he couldn't harm Maria and female enemies is dumb and biased statement on headcannon. Enough with the talk if you can't be honest on character. It's one thing to not like pervertness, not the issue, but to force to say Sanji will 'harm' women is really dumb to say when we all know he would never do that. That isn't sexual predator if your stating that and not when we have perverts like Franky who pulled a woman to kiss him and Brook asking for panties in more aggressive manner compare to Sanji who wouldn't try that.
Also yeah there still strangers looking at them at the bath and openly stating about their bodies and despite that, Nami and Robin stay and allowed to strangers they don't know. Hypocrisy and illogical in that statement and your acting out in biased manner cause you got issues over him not female enemies to state 'he is sexual predator' despite Sanji saved them from being harm by Drake and Hawkins and your ignoring that over your agenda.
Plus he spent 2 years without no woman in island he was in and was actually one who got assaulted if he didn't fight back. I like how you ignore that when it make sense he is grateful to women's beauty more after that experience. Don't try to denied reason why he was like that.
You have your opinions, but stop making up headcannon in it.
maybe after wano he's getting into YC4 level, but for now i would say sanji was still (struggling against) flying six level. We saw sanji lost to black maria, failed to beat page one, and was knocked down with drake's tail
Nah, he stronger T6H and Drake included given T6H are Supernova level if they were put in same group and no hierarchy. He doesn't fight women. Why Maria? By that logic Zoro need his rematch with Gyukimaro since he never beaten him. He beaten PO. That is clear. Unless your saying Luffy didn't beat him because he didn't knock him out for long?
He has no injuries in fight with Drake. However he survived, so Idk why your using that.
Semi-biased. It’s more spiteful because you constantly have Moe over hype, over portray a scene....Then results Moe having a wanky ass power scale, because Sanji lost, didn’t look good. Or Zoro did better....
P1 fight. Sanji had the edge; But it seemed more of an even fight. P1 wasn’t sustaining heavy damage and overpowered Sanji.,,
Aside from Vergo this was Sanji’s toughest clash. After that we see a clash with D Drake another Tobi Roppo, who had the edge against Sanji this time, disregarded his attack and countered.
So Sanji hasn’t shown superiority or serious threat to commander lv fighters....He hasn’t shown any adept Haki skills or advance Haki skills. He has a Raid Suit anyone can use & he Cooks
Not really. He beaten PO and Sanji wasn't using full power in that fight and enemy didn't cone back until 2 weeks later.
Drake didn't have a edge given he has hard time hitting him. Idk why you think that.
I mean he tanked and blocked King's attacks and came out fine and that was Full Zoan. He hasn't use his full power in a fight, so to say he has there isn't anything is on headcannon as we know he facing YC with King or Queen in a fight.
Not overhype compare to you guys on Zoro side stating Zoro is Yonko lvl after being in team fight and making feats like he could stop Hakai when he couldn't and was saved.
To be honest, I can't really call his altercations with Drake (or King/Daifuku for example) a real fight. They exchanged one or two blows and then the confrontation was done.
And if take into account the sturdiness of the F6/Ancient Zoan, sure, I can understand that Sanji was surprised by it.
But again, it's too vague. It's clearly possible that he's already YC level, I would not be surprised by that. But sure, he still hasn't showed it yet.
Doffy one wasn't really as Sanji didn't know abilities and to be honest he was only to go down to Luffy as even Law couldn't handle him and Zoro couldn't cut the Birdcage. Doffy does compliment his attacks being strong as well him as opponent though.
True we haven't gotten full fight on Sanji yet, but we can see on those you mention above with certain ones he did make Vergo not complete the mission despite nerf, he defeated PO and Yonji (And he is the one with Strength RS), Judge cheated on his side and heavily implied Sanji refuse to keep fighting after seeing what he did and from Drake fight, he is fine given he has no injuries on.
Those are feats what he did with Oven, Daifuku, and King. To damage, blocked, and tanked their attacks do count though.
I mean many are going into new stage of power, so make sense he reaching YC lvl while Luffy reaching Yonko lvl.
This is not the first time I say this, but I'll say it again.
Anyone is free to talk about either the manga or the anime, but if you want to discuss about things that are canon, don't try to push non-canon material as canon to selectively suit your points.
Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
@King Moe If you can especifically prove the anime-only X Drake vs Sanji is in any form canon, prove it in a post. If you can't prove it, then please stop trying to argue about that as if it were canon or relevant to the manga.
Come back when you can be unbiased and show Sanji ever harming a woman on assault as he never done that. Continue to act like he will 'harm' women when he couldn't harm Maria and female enemies is dumb and biased statement on headcannon. Enough with the talk if you can't be honest on character. It's one thing to not like pervertness, not the issue, but to force to say Sanji will 'harm' women is really dumb to say when we all know he would never do that. That isn't sexual predator if your stating that and not when we have perverts like Franky who pulled a woman to kiss him and Brook asking for panties in more aggressive manner compare to Sanji who wouldn't try that.
Also yeah there still strangers looking at them at the bath and openly stating about their bodies and despite that, Nami and Robin stay and allowed to strangers they don't know. Hypocrisy and illogical in that statement and your acting out in biased manner cause you got issues over him not female enemies to state 'he is sexual predator' despite Sanji saved them from being harm by Drake and Hawkins and your ignoring that over your agenda.
Plus he spent 2 years without no woman in island he was in and was actually one who got assaulted if he didn't fight back. I like how you ignore that when it make sense he is grateful to women's beauty more after that experience. Don't try to denied reason why he was like that.
You have your opinions, but stop making up headcannon in it..
I never defended Brook or Franky. We’re in the thread about Sanji.
Ex convicts go years without exposure to women as well and that doesn’t give them any right to get in their personal space or do creepy things.
Re: bathhouses, you should just read up on the cultural implications of what you’re saying. Your argument about “other strangers” doesn’t really make any sense. Bathing with people of the same gender is normal in Japan. Sneaking into the other gender’s bathhouse is not..
There’s more ways to harm a woman than physically. Constantly objectifying them is one.
Such a weird hill to die on. I feel like I’m talking to the family of someone whose dad/husband just got arrested for sex crimes and they decide to stand by him.
I never defended Brook or Franky. We’re in the thread about Sanji.
Ex convicts go years without exposure to women as well and that doesn’t give them any right to get in their personal space or do creepy things.
Re: bathhouses, you should just read up on the cultural implications of what you’re saying. Your argument about “other strangers” doesn’t really make any sense. Bathing with people of the same gender is normal in Japan. Sneaking into the other gender’s bathhouse is not..
There’s more ways to harm a woman than physically. Constantly objectifying them is one.
Such a weird hill to die on. I feel like I’m talking to the family of someone whose dad/husband just got arrested for sex crimes and they decide to stand by him.
I never defended Brook or Franky. We’re in the thread about Sanji.
Ex convicts go years without exposure to women as well and that doesn’t give them any right to get in their personal space or do creepy things.
Re: bathhouses, you should just read up on the cultural implications of what you’re saying. Your argument about “other strangers” doesn’t really make any sense. Bathing with people of the same gender is normal in Japan. Sneaking into the other gender’s bathhouse is not..
There’s more ways to harm a woman than physically. Constantly objectifying them is one.
Such a weird hill to die on. I feel like I’m talking to the family of someone whose dad/husband just got arrested for sex crimes and they decide to stand by him.
Nah, your showing biased and your showing headcannon thinking Sanji will do that and yeah your showing bodies to males who can see you and to say they were 'offended' when they weren't shy showing and seeing male strangers look at their bodies and compliment them isn't issue, but your pushing Sanji who won't harm women for peeking is a issue? Whether mixed bath or not, that was still see them looking perverted when they saw the women. Your ignoring that and stating he will do something when he doesn't.
Sanji doesn't objectify them otherwise he wouldn't think Nami and Robin can handle themselves in a fight and he lets them. Your mixing definition of what it is on that.
Your only one defending on something and forcing headcannon. Also again your examples are not same thing here especially by this situation you can add whole Strawhat crew for seeing Nami naked since Alabasta when they peep down on Vivi and Nami if you want go far about this.
Not even close and hope your joking. We talking about canon situation on what he do next and we have few who want to say he won't do nothing just because he refuse to fight women. You guys need to have patience for One Piece to how it goes, but acting like this won't help.
Not really. Just you who think he will physical harm a woman when irony is he actually went to Maria side cause he thought a woman was being sexual assualted by the enemy. Your really twisting things out and by your logic everyone would be an 'sexual assault' as they shown pervert attraction to women for most of them. You got separate the gag from real life when we know especially Sanji won't try to do something to a woman.
He won't physically abused any woman if he couldn't do anything to Maria and female enemies. Hard to believe we have to debate notion Sanji will 'harm' a woman when we were showcased for few chapters he doesn't touch them at all even try not using Haki cause it would have bounce back the pain onto them if he did.
So guess whole crew is given what they did to Nami and Vivi in Alabasta and Luffy have seen women's body in nude to count him as a creep, so that put everyone in 'sexual harrassment'. Also there is Zoro on his situation on sleeping with a prostitute and kid in the arc. Wonder how that look in real life if now going off adding real life to gags that are mention by gags, not truly serious situation on them.
So guess whole crew is given what they did to Nami and Vivi in Alabasta and Luffy have seen women's body in nude to count him as a creep, so that put everyone in 'sexual harrassment'. Also there is Zoro on his situation on sleeping with a prostitute and kid in the arc. Wonder how that look in real life if now going off adding real life to gags that are mention by gags, not truly serious situation on them.
So guess whole crew is given what they did to Nami and Vivi in Alabasta and Luffy have seen women's body in nude to count him as a creep, so that put everyone in 'sexual harrassment'. Also there is Zoro on his situation on sleeping with a prostitute and kid in the arc. Wonder how that look in real life if now going off adding real life to gags that are mention by gags, not truly serious situation on them.
Yes, the other crews were being creep too at alabasta. But unlike sanji, they only did it once, while sanji keeps doing it.
What does zoro have to do here? You need to stop being insecure over zoro
Yes, the other crews were being creep too at alabasta. But unlike sanji, they only did it once, while sanji keeps doing it.
What does zoro have to do here? You need to stop being insecure over zoro
Nah, Luffy has seen naked women more than once and Zoro has been on issue too on certain scenes. Again by that they are all same situation. I am just examples you guys forcing real life into gags and by logic, Zoro would be on suspect for in his position of sleeping next to a prostitute and next to a child. Not insecurity, but just showing you how dumb your trying to force this into real life nature when Oda has use perverted moments on everyone in the crew to be involved in.
If you see that in real life of prostitute and a child sleeping next to someone? What your thoughts on that?
Idk why you keep posting to me most of the time given I already ignored you. Trying to talk with people on canon, but here few you talking like Sanji will harm a woman when we just have situation he will never harm a woman. Either be serious or don't continue debate to go off topic.
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Now let's move onto something else instead of headcannon for once. Do you guys think Sanji can use more moves in combination to new Cipher Pol moves he has? As Idk if Sky Walk is only one he learn as could be certain moves he learn especially on the use of his legs.
