Games Mafia Game 103 - Chainsam Pan: End Game

[Copy Panda]

Spoiler: Here are zhe night actions!

I thank you all for playing! It was an entertaining game to spectate. I hope most enjoyed the gameplay as well! Thank you to my fellow co-host @SirSamuel016 (and briefly @Farfalla) for providing the necessary support and inputs during the game! Once again thank you @Valhalla for the avatars! And most of all, congratulations mafia team (as the kids say nowadays) for copping the W! Also shoutouts to @GB for not speaking the truth once this game!

It was a simple but engaging experience. As you can see, the ???? was just another townie. In hindsight perhaps not as impactful but it was very omo seeing you all speculate over the identity of this mystery role. Unfortunately, in this sterile environment, we didn't get to trial the devil properly, as they both passed quickly. I think in special circumstances the potential is there, it is rather powerful in a more role-heavy comp. There are just enough secondaries for the psychiatrist to put IQ into analyzing their result (a difficult role to play in this game). Bomb's dominant strategy I think was somehow getting the mafia to kill them (feigning devil? ). Freeman... Died uncovered. And also came out quite early. If they had to die, that was probably the best time. The traitors deployed interesting strategies. Very exotic approach. Mafia overall played pretty decent; the first few nights town mislynched and only towards the mid-to-end did non-towns start perishing.

I am curious what you thought of the game and each other's performances! Was town too lazy? Was ???? too spicy? Did non-town play strong enough? Curious what you guys think of such role- and mechanicless comps ~

Once again, thank you, everyone! It was super spicy


​

 

[Farfalla]

Hmmm Bia, why do you think it was better to lynch James, so mafia wouldn't have that chance?

 

[GrySun]

That’s only true if someone was saved/someone broke a tie without a clear reason/doing so suddenly. None of that happened last day, and it certainly doesn‘t happen every game.

 

[Farfalla]

Kouhai, expecting people to take a "usual" role (if you see it that way) or to exploit a situation doesn't make things truthful per se.

 

[Lady pompom]

lol I make no claim to the non existence of other scenarios.

I just made one and followed up on it, until you show me your contribution don't shit on mine xD

You said you will lynch a scum right and that I wasted my vote, I'm still waiting for the action, talk is easy xD

I never said I’d lynch a scumright, all I said is that you can’t be 100% sure someone is scum by D2 with no other evidence (without any det results or anything whatsoever) and by locking your vote first thing i the day you’re just throwing it. If suddenly something else happened and we got a suspect, you’d not be able to vote because you locked it right away.

I’m not s*** in anyone’s contribution, you were doing that by ridiculing my theories actually and reducing it to protecting gry when my whole point is about you overfocusing on someone since D1 with an argument that does not make sense.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 18, 2022, Original Post Date: Jul 18, 2022 ---

Hmmm Bia, why do you think it was better to lynch James, so mafia wouldn't have that chance?

I just think once mafia has no devils to lynch, they’ll wait to lynch James and win the game. Freeman is no danger at the start, but in the endgame it can be gamechanging.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 18, 2022 ---

Sorry, they’ll wait to*kill him

 

[Shad]

That’s only true if someone was saved/someone broke a tie without a clear reason/doing so suddenly. None of that happened last day, and it certainly doesn‘t happen every game.

You could argue it was too obvious that farf won't be the main topic of discussion that fair, even tho I won't completely rule it out, mafia makes mistakes.
I gave alternative scenarios to explain this point tho.

Lynching farf on D2 would put you on the spot light starting D3, as a 3 man mafia, you can't look suspicious until few days have passed, you can only hide behind her as long as she is alive, since she sounds townie unlike you.

My turn.
List me your contributions this game.

Kouhai, expecting people to take a "usual" role (if you see it that way) or to exploit a situation doesn't make things truthful per se.

Sorry I didn't get this.
I'm trying to stop arguing tho so that others can catch up.

I never said I’d lynch a scumright, all I said is that you can’t be 100% sure someone is scum by D2 with no other evidence (without any det results or anything whatsoever) and by locking your vote first thing i the day you’re just throwing it. If suddenly something else happened and we got a suspect, you’d not be able to vote because you locked it right away.

I’m not s*** in anyone’s contribution, you were doing that by ridiculing my theories actually and reducing it to protecting gry when my whole point is about you overfocusing on someone since D1 with an argument that does not make sense.

It like we are not even playing the same game, my vote, my theory, my choice.
You can agree, disagree but you can't tell me what to do.

You say I don't have evidence, as if you do have evidence and I'm going solo.

If you point is really that, then don't worry about me, I won't feel bad for missing out.
Sorry if you genuinely felt offended (I can't tell who is talking for real and who is mafia).
I'm happy with my current situation, thanks for your concern.

I just think once mafia has no devils to lynch, they’ll wait to lynch James and win the game. Freeman is no danger at the start, but in the endgame it can be gamechanging.

I would retire from this game if he is freeman, he is bomb.
If he is lying he has no where to go.

 

[Farfalla]

Sorry I didn't get this.
I'm trying to stop arguing tho so that others can catch up.

Just a shoutout that it's fine if you truly believe that's the course/intentions a person or a group of people took/had.
But you gotta be careful about how you word it, cause deeply believing in something doesn't make it true.
If you hold up to it like that, people can use it against you (to weaken your arguments).
Idk, just sharing my thoughts if they can be helpful to you...

 

[GrySun]

List me your contributions this game.

I‘m talking and sharing thoughts on most of everything I see when I can. What contributions are you expecting?

 

[Shad]

I‘m talking and sharing thoughts on most of everything I see when I can. What contributions are you expecting?

3 people you would vote today and why?

I want to see you go after people not just 'sharing thoughts on most of everything you see'.

How many miss lynches are we allowed if 1 kill, how many if 2 kills?
Who are your 3 ordered top suspects you would vote today and why.

I don't have to teach how to play this game, when I spawn mafia against town Gry, I can feel the pressure, right now your pressure is non existent.

You are just here.

Are you happy with your performance this game or do you agree that it is weak?

 

[James Rye]

Dang, they already got a Devi as their first kill? That sucks.

 

[gnut]

But why not kill Farf or Gry?
You are focusing on why they killed Tatsu, but you should also looks at what other option they had that night.

I don't believe this game has any risk of doc protection in N1, so the idea that Gry or Farf could be protected is dumb.
Mafia had an open field to pick from.

Im still reading but would like to address this...
Just because you think a certain way doesn't make other ways of thinking dumb.

In all honesty...why wouldnt mafia think there is a possibility that three of the most sharpest players arent protected....
Yeah...possibility one or more are scum but in hind sight...depending on devil count...tatsu is just as much a possible jackpot just as much as gry,lala or lamz couldve been in this setup.

Just saying...ok back catching up

 

[GrySun]

3 people you would vote today and why?

I want to see you go after people not just 'sharing thoughts on most of everything you see'.

How many miss lynches are we allowed if 1 kill, how many if 2 kills?
Who are your 3 ordered top suspects you would vote today and why.

I don't have to teach how to play this game, when I spawn mafia against town Gry, I can feel the pressure, right now your pressure is non existent.

You are just here.

Are you happy with your performance this game or do you agree that it is weak?

Don‘t have as much time as most other games to fully get into the game, so most likely all you can get this game is a more supportive Gry that gives his thoughts rather than one that steers the ship. I can have games where I am tryharding less and investing less time, and I am satisfied with that

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 18, 2022, Original Post Date: Jul 18, 2022 ---

Look Shad, I may look to be frequently in the thread but that‘s just me checking the thread every now and then on non-PC devices, and responding to what I see. All games where I tryhard and consider everything I do it on PC, where I take some time just to play the MG and nothing else. Which I can‘t always do.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 18, 2022 ---

As for your mislynch question let me see. 12v3v1, if we assume TP, at start. Now we are 12v3v1. If we keep failing our lynches, with only 1 kill per night(Santa TP), we can have 4v3v1 by the start of Day 5. But, it depends a lot on if Bomb/Freeman die, so we can assume 3-4 mislynches.

If there‘s more killers it could be over much earlier depending on when we eliminate one of the teams, but that‘s better to calculate next day if more kills really start happening.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 18, 2022 ---

Actually no, it becomes 4-5 mislynches with a non-killing TP, I didn‘t count the last day that must also be failed. But it‘s a bit too early for the numbers, and vanilla games usually allow a lot more leeway.
Game 100 was only short because of Hot Potato and less townies than this game I think.

 

[Shad]

Hard to argue with busy. and thanks for the math help.

I'm taking a step back, probably not healthy to talk this much in the first half of the day.
Let see what james and gnut say meanwhile.

 

[Farfalla]

This game still feels like the majority needs to be tagged to then say anything... it's so slow...

 

[James Rye]

Finally through. Interesting talks and accusations everywhere btw.

Also james....are you really freeman?

Only two roles would claim freeman in this kinda game with revealed roles: Freeman and Bomb. That should answer your question.

Well, I didn't agree with Marm's lynch, this is what we get. I don't understand why they'd target Tatsu, though.

Those many last votes on Marma were sus, James claim also is strange, I'd rather lynch him earlier than later just to find out if his claim is true, Freeman is more dangerous late game than early.

I honestly expected to die last night. Since I didn't I'd be fine with an early lynch on me.

I just hope the devils investigated James last night.

And I hope none of them used doc on me, would have been a waste. That and our remaining devils should spread their investigations to cover as much ground as possible.

I don‘t see the case on Seraph, like at all. The only thing that had me not vote James was the claim, but before the claim James was suspicious enough for D1 to be voted. It is a dead-end claim so I believe he wouldn‘t do this as mafia, but I can‘t fault Seraph or Pom just for thinking he would do it.

What, sus, me, on day 1, with all the mechanic talk? Even after I pointed out the whole sanity thing which btw Panda still hasn't answered to this day meaning we probably do either have sanity to worry about or sanity is insane from the get-go for all roles due the whole Chainsaw-Man theme and he doesn't want to spoiler due it being part of the game of having to figure that out.

Would have condemned me as Mafia though, claiming one of the three townie roles while not owning it. Bit too risky for my taste if I were Mafia. I like risks I can manage, not crazy ones that mean my death in a couple days. It's also why I never claim spy or innocent child like some mafias did and ended up burning for those claims later down the line.

Tbf, James could still be scum if a Traitor. This is once again panda gaem (Im so sorry Pan) so wouldn't be surprised to see the freeman be a traitor as a way to troll town.

True. In that case only lynching would trigger my Freeman ability if Panda did make me a traitor.

traitor freeman? Makes sense with 3 mafia...The mafia also dont have any roles, vanilla mafia.

They ain't Vanillas. I still believe Mafia got 2 Devils, a single one is too risky, same for town, as that devil could end up getting lynched early or killed early by the ??? role. However we do know that SK ain't a thing now, chances of two kills going through were way too high for that not to happen if Sk had been in the game.

Shit you got me. Welp, Jig is up. She's my Mentee.

I'm the "????". Sorry guys. He's too stronk, please nerf.

Top kek.
Let's lynch shinobi to check Sera's claim. XD

Seraph is just kidding i‘m sure..

Ofc he is, what else?

And assuming James is pretty town, I’d like to hear his opinion too on suspects.

I’d rather poke more the quiet ones to talk, @Mazino @gnut @James Rye who do you guys suspect the most and why? Can you share what you think about Marm’s lynch and the night results?

I think I'd rather lynch one of the less active people. I'd also be fine to be sacrificed today if our devils manage to survive the 2 nights to hopefully have 3 investigations to work with. Could be useful. Depends on what the majority of towns want though.

Update from yesterday

-Asako- neutral, pending to green. Her points make sense so far and while she hasn;tbeen actively pulling too many discussions, she’s still commenting.I do feel she was a bit more distant today than yesterday,though,would like to hear her opinion on lynch and her list of suspects. @Asako
- Belserion - She has been commenting more today, and trying to understand things, but I also want to hear more from her,so far I feel neutral about her playstyle, but again she usually plays like this.
- DD - neutral, but he was making interesting points and sharing his opinion about the lynch and night results.
- Farfalla - The whole argument with lambu and her last vote on marm did raise my alarm, so I’m a bit suspicious, but this could just prove Farfy is more town since she’d not risk voting a townie last min if she was mafia.
- GB - Started a lynch on Marm and isn’t particpating much in discussions either besides dropping votes, sounds like prime mafia behavior to me, he’s being random but that could be also just lawl, but he’s suspicious imo.
- Gnut - I genuinely think he was busy and trying t share infor, bt uncle is a seasoned mafia so I won't put my hand on fire.
- GrySun - Neutral, but the fact he didn;t try help a lynch on shino instead of Marm could ean something, still i think he looks like town.
- James - I still have my suspicions, but considering it’d be bad if he just lied about freeman (to town and to him), sounds town to me.
- Lambu - I still will be careful around this bird, but so far Lambu has been acting as town, or at least it sounds like. The only thing I have to hold against him is stirring more the Marm lynch.
- Mazino - Still hasn`t said much and seems to e laying low, which makes me suspicious, if he’s trying to hde something, mafia is probably onto him (if he isn't one of them).
- Seraph - I don‘t see a problem with his posts so far, he was almost lynched but managed to keep his composure still.
- Shad - I don't agree or see the point of him making a whole argumento on Gry based on the fact Gry didn‘t die, he might be convinced Gry is mafiaor want us to believe that, but it does’t bode well to me, even if he's town, I don’t trust him.
- Shinobi - Suspicious, she’s very quiet and despite having 2 votes yesterday she never adressed it or commented much, @shinobi who do you suspect the most currently and why?

When I think about it, Tatsu was talking about people grasping straws to try and find arguments, did you feel calledout, @Shad?

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 18, 2022, Original Post Date: Jul 18, 2022 ---

True, just my opinion that he isn't scum, but you have to admit that you suddenly shouting Gry is scum in plain D2 when everyone barely talked looks very, very iffy.

About prioritizing survival, I think you’re missing the point here that even if no one protected Gry last night, it doesn’t change the fact mafia could be afraid of missing a kill, since Gry is a popular target. Tatsu was not really very engaged, but she did pull discussion and agreed with James points, maybe that provoked mafia enough and they were more sure of hitting her than someone else since she didn;t seem like any priority for protection And they hit the jackpot by killing her.

On the other hand, it’s possible that Tatsu death was not from a mafia kill but from an insane doc protecting her and the actual mafia kill failed to sane doc. I don't know who used what last night, but it’s a possibility, and since no one has useful results yet (probably) and hosts never answered to how sanity works, this could have happened.

Why would an insane doc target Tatsu tough?

 

[Lady pompom]

Why would an insane doc target Tatsu tough?

This is just assuming they don;t know their sanity, thinking they’re protecting.

 

[digitaldude]

This game still feels like the majority needs to be tagged to then say anything... it's so slow...

Vanilla game

 

[Lady pompom]

This is just assuming they don;t know their sanity, thinking they’re protecting.

Oops, missed your point there with the question, @James Rye , the only reason I could think of is that she was not saying much and also looked green, so mafia made a bet.

 

[digitaldude]

So you are the bomb james, shame now we cant get the mafia.

 

[Farfalla]

DD why the insistence in checking if James is Freeman or Bomb? Discussing the possibility of a Freeman Traitor is interesting, but I don't get why are you trying to make sure about what James is between those 2 options.

 

[James Rye]

This is just assuming they don;t know their sanity, thinking they’re protecting.

Yeah, but why would a doc protect Tatsu night 1 after day 1? Nothing Tatsu wrote suggested she's a devil holder. If I had been a devil choosing doc I would have kept talkative players safe like Gry or Lambu or Farf or ofc the freeman claimer wanting to prevent an early freeman death. Which as you said wouldn't actually be that bad early on.
A doc betting on Tatsu not saying much could have done the same with shinobi, Bel, gnut, etc.

Plus early det investigations would be way stronger than early doc protections. Dets get results you can work with, docs usually never know if they were successful or not unless their target does die. So I dunno if a town devil would risk a doc with the whole sanity stuff not resolved by Panda and same for Mafia as an escort is a way stronger role for them early, middle and late on then betting on an extra insane doc kill.