Politics American Politics

Pat

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It's not when we have far too many cops behaving horribly because there's little to no accountability. It's not unfair when they're constantly in the news for killing someone because they were "scared" or used excessive force. These people are in position of authority, there's no excuse for them, and they should be held to a higher standard instead of having their actions justified. I mean, Chicago (I think?) cops were recently caught planting evidence to throw people in jail.


No it is not. It's me defending guns/looking at both sides. We need stricter gun laws, but at the same time guns can be useful in defending someone. And what if it's just one robber who may not even be expecting the gun? Obviously if there are more than one robber, then you shouldn't be fighting back, but that depends on the situation as well.
I guess those who do their jobs properly aren't news material which results in selective perception. Their public image isn't as dire IMHO.

A gun is a tool of defense if and only if it deters people from committing crimes, fighting fire with fire isn't defense, it's mutual destruction IMHO. When everybody has guns, it's much more likely that some criminal you encounter will also have a gun and it's much more likely that he will expect you have a gun. These criminals are often under the influence of drugs or aren't thinking clearly either way, if you bet your chances on them being scared away, that will rarely work IMHO and more often than not, someone will get hurt because of the threat of gunfire. Also people usually rob houses when owners aren't at home and you can't carry your gun everywhere, so however I do the math, widespread use of guns doesn't make the society better IMHO.

That said, it's not as if some random guy's opinion will have any bearing on gun policy and if other people have guns, it's your constitutional right to get one for whatever reason. I don't criticize you or anybody just because you exert your right, I just state my overall view on guns and it's probably very optimistic for the current conjuncture. Strict gun laws are certainly for the better but it's difficult to stop guns from falling into the wrong hands, so they may not have the intended result IMHO.
 

M3J

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I guess those who do their jobs properly aren't news material which results in selective perception. Their public image isn't as dire IMHO.

A gun is a tool of defense if and only if it deters people from committing crimes, fighting fire with fire isn't defense, it's mutual destruction IMHO. When everybody has guns, it's much more likely that some criminal you encounter will also have a gun and it's much more likely that he will expect you have a gun. These criminals are often under the influence of drugs or aren't thinking clearly either way, if you bet your chances on them being scared away, that will rarely work IMHO and more often than not, someone will get hurt because of the threat of gunfire. Also people usually rob houses when owners aren't at home and you can't carry your gun everywhere, so however I do the math, widespread use of guns doesn't make the society better IMHO.

That said, it's not as if some random guy's opinion will have any bearing on gun policy and if other people have guns, it's your constitutional right to get one for whatever reason. I don't criticize you or anybody just because you exert your right, I just state my overall view on guns and it's probably very optimistic for the current conjuncture. Strict gun laws are certainly for the better but it's difficult to stop guns from falling into the wrong hands, so they may not have the intended result IMHO.
Those who do their jobs properly do get some attention as well. A story of a cop who shot a Black man who lunged at him with a knife was spread around on Twitter or Facebook, but no one had an issue because it was nonlethal, and the man was actually the armed aggressor. You also have the news or people sharing cops doing good things like pulling over black people only to give them ice cream or whatnot. An example. Their public image is bad, at the very least, at least for the majority who are black and the whites who are aware.

It can be defense though, especially if the other side doesn't know about the gun and can't defend themselves or aren't going to attack because of the gun. A lot of these criminals aren't really under the influence of drugs though, where did you get that? Likely angry or normally volatile, but not necessarily under the influence. And for the record, I'm against arming people for defensive purposes for the reasons you stated, and a lot of defense for guns is stupid and illogical.

But it's also harder for the wrong hands to get guns if gun laws are stricter. Buying it illegally could increase their chances of getting caught by undercover cops or whatnot.
 

xi0

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I kinda do and I kinda don't. It's hard not to think something's up when the cops make the news for shooting unarmed Black people and even white people, or beating up an Indian elderly because he can't speak English, or planting evidence or whatnot.

And as I said, people who have authority the way the law enforcements do should be held to higher standards and be held accountable. One of the reasons why Black Lives Matter gained traction and started protesting is because cops have often been found not guilty and allowed to get away with murder or w/e crime, and they were able to keep their job or get a new job in law enforcement elsewhere.
You really think that's what is going on the majority of the time?

Yeah and many of those cases were completely mishandled by the investigators or prosecutors. It's not simply a case where cops can go around killing whoever they want with impunity.
 

M3J

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You really think that's what is going on the majority of the time?

Yeah and many of those cases were completely mishandled by the investigators or prosecutors. It's not simply a case where cops can go around killing whoever they want with impunity.
yeah and I've seen little reason to believe otherwise.

seems to be the case, for the most part. Hell, even Zimmerman got off for killing Trayvon despite all but admitting that Trayvon attacked in self-defense because Zimmerman was stalking him.
 

EternalWinter

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The thing about being a single issue voter, life is very simple
 

SharkBait

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although i get where she is coming from, i think certain guns dont need to be out there. there are recreational ones that hurt no one.
 

Reebi

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although i get where she is coming from, i think certain guns dont need to be out there. there are recreational ones that hurt no one.
She is the most whinny co-hosts on The View :notrust.

Seriously America, you need to sort out your gun problem.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I thought this article explaining "individual rights theory" and "collective rights theory" to be was interesting. I think anyone who can analyze text or has even a minimum university level education can agree the intent was collect rights to owning guns not individual rights. https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/second_amendment
 
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