Fantasy Jura vs Bluenote

[Coné]

It's not hype. It's logical reasoning. When you are fighting the Spriggans, your life is at hand. If Jura wasn't capable of defending the Eastern front, he wouldn't be placed there. You don't see a Max or Warren running around in front of August.

I assure you Jura is Spriggan level. No way 4th ranked TWS in Ishgar is not Spriggan level.

Bluenote has gotten stronger cuz you can see Wendy and Chelia struggling even after they have grown stronger. Otherwise, Wendy and Chelia would have been like Natsu and oneshot Bluenote..

So you also think that Erza is Spriggan level because she fought Ajeel? That's obviously a flawed argument. I can perfectly see GMG Jura fighting Ajeel because of his combat speed, defensive skill and Rumbling Mt. Fuji. Does that mean that he was Spriggan level? No, it doesn't.

Flawed argument. It's been stated that Spriggan level is equivelant to 1st WS.

And how can I exactly compare that to Tenrou Bluenote? First of all, they didn't even get that much stronger. Second, Bluenote's gravity has only shown to not work two times: with Current Natsu and with Tenrou Gildarts. Are Wendy and Chelia at that level? No, so it's not representative of any improvement.

 

[iDooom]

1) Bluenote high diff.
2) Jura mid diff.
3) Jura mid diff.

Bluenote doesn't have great feats, and was clearly weaker than Tenrou Gildarts.

 

[Vasgoko]

So you also think that Erza is Spriggan level because she fought Ajeel? That's obviously a flawed argument. I can perfectly see GMG Jura fighting Ajeel because of his combat speed, defensive skill and Rumbling Mt. Fuji. Does that mean that he was Spriggan level? No, it doesn't.

Flawed argument. It's been stated that Spriggan level is equivelant to 1st WS.

And how can I exactly compare that to Tenrou Bluenote? First of all, they didn't even get that much stronger. Second, Bluenote's gravity has only shown to not work two times: with Current Natsu and with Tenrou Gildarts. Are Wendy and Chelia at that level? No, so it's not representative of any improvement.

Erza isnt ranked 4 in TWS. That's the difference. She lost her battle against Ajeel.

Mavis and Makarov during GMG said Jura was comparable to Gildartz. That alone is pretty much Spriggan level. Also, Jura has the title of 4th TWS and is fighting alongside Draculos Hyberion, Wolfheim, and Warrod. Why would he stand there when he could be with Lamia scale? Its obvious cuz Jura is Spriggan level.

Idk why everybody here is so big on "Spriggan level" thing. To be on Spriggan level is not that hard, just best Ajeel in a match and you are good geez. Lol, you guys act like Spriggan level is on par with Acnologia.

Actually, it has not been stated that Spriggan level is equal to 1st Wizard Saint, otherwise, Draculos Hyberion wouldnt hold a candle to the Spriggans. And if Draculos Hyberion cant hold a candle, then Ishgar can start building their graves instead of a defense line.


Wendy has gotten a lot stronger since Tenrou....If Current Wendy was put down by Bluenote's gravity, then Bluenote has obviously got to be a lot stronger. Do you have any proof that Current Wendy is weaker than Tenrou Gildartz?

 

[Coné]

Erza isnt ranked 4 in TWS. That's the difference. She lost her battle against Ajeel.

Mavis and Makarov during GMG said Jura was comparable to Gildartz. That alone is pretty much Spriggan level. Also, Jura has the title of 4th TWS and is fighting alongside Draculos Hyberion, Wolfheim, and Warrod. Why would he stand there when he could be with Lamia scale? Its obvious cuz Jura is Spriggan level.

Idk why everybody here is so big on "Spriggan level" thing. To be on Spriggan level is not that hard, just best Ajeel in a match and you are good geez. Lol, you guys act like Spriggan level is on par with Acnologia.

Actually, it has not been stated that Spriggan level is equal to 1st Wizard Saint, otherwise, Draculos Hyberion wouldnt hold a candle to the Spriggans. And if Draculos Hyberion cant hold a candle, then Ishgar can start building their graves instead of a defense line.


Wendy has gotten a lot stronger since Tenrou....If Current Wendy was put down by Bluenote's gravity, then Bluenote has obviously got to be a lot stronger. Do you have any proof that Current Wendy is weaker than Tenrou Gildartz?

Because she's not even part of the WS. Laxus isn't a WS and he's stronger than Jura.

Proof that Gildarts is Spriggan level in the first place? Then, Jura's part of the Magic Council, so he'll logically fight with his fellow councillors.

And Jura can't win against Ajeel until shown that he has feats that put him at such a level. He doesn't have such feats, so saying he'd beat Ajeel is a baseless statement.

Hyberion described the Spriggan 12 as "12 mages who can fight toe to toe with Ishgar's mightiest mage". This alone puts them on par with God Serena. Then Brandish stated once again that there are another 11 mages as strong as her. This is more than enough evidence for us to conclude that they are indeed around God Serena's level. This is why Ishgar is outmatched in this war. This war has been portrayed as a stomp since the beginning and Hyberion might actually defeat one of the Spriggan 12 because he's just below Serena. However, the same can't be said for Jura, who's been portrayed since the GMG arc as someone considerably weaker than the GoI.

That doesn't say anything since he did the same to both. Tenrou Gildarts having massively better DC and speed feats than base Wendy is more than enough to prove my point.

 

[Vasgoko]

Because she's not even part of the WS. Laxus isn't a WS and he's stronger than Jura.

Proof that Gildarts is Spriggan level in the first place? Then, Jura's part of the Magic Council, so he'll logically fight with his fellow councillors.

And Jura can't win against Ajeel until shown that he has feats that put him at such a level. He doesn't have such feats, so saying he'd beat Ajeel is a baseless statement.

Hyberion described the Spriggan 12 as "12 mages who can fight toe to toe with Ishgar's mightiest mage". This alone puts them on par with God Serena. Then Brandish stated once again that there are another 11 mages as strong as her. This is more than enough evidence for us to conclude that they are indeed around God Serena's level. This is why Ishgar is outmatched in this war. This war has been portrayed as a stomp since the beginning and Hyberion might actually defeat one of the Spriggan 12 because he's just below Serena. However, the same can't be said for Jura, who's been portrayed since the GMG arc as someone considerably weaker than the GoI.

That doesn't say anything since he did the same to both. Tenrou Gildarts having massively better DC and speed feats than base Wendy is more than enough to prove my point.

Laxus was invited to be TWS, but Laxus declined because he was evil minded at one point during Fantasia. Erza was never offered cuz she wasn't strong enough. She'd have to compete on the likes of Jellal and Makarov.

Dude, seriously? You need proof on every single thing? Does somebody need to hold your hand while you walk? Lol xD.

Cmon dude, where have you been? Gildartz is FT's strongest and has to be Spriggan level otherwise why is Ishgar even bothering to fight Alvarez.

Lol and you believe Hyberion after seeing Ajeel being defeated by Erza + Jupiter.


LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!! Ahaha funny joke dude, but seriously.

Ishgar's mightiest Mage >>>>>>> Erza + Jupiter

Erza + Jupiter >>> Ajeel

Srry, but I think Hyberion was referring to a higher tier Spriggan.

No, Spriggan level is pretty weak. After seeing Ajeel, most people can be Spriggan level if they wanted to.

High-tier Spriggan level? No

But Spriggan level? All you need to do is beat Ajeel or Erza + Jupiter. Easy!

 

[Coné]

Laxus was invited to be TWS, but Laxus declined because he was evil minded at one point during Fantasia. Erza was never offered cuz she wasn't strong enough. She'd have to compete on the likes of Jellal and Makarov.

Dude, seriously? You need proof on every single thing? Does somebody need to hold your hand while you walk? Lol xD.

Cmon dude, where have you been? Gildartz is FT's strongest and has to be Spriggan level otherwise why is Ishgar even bothering to fight Alvarez.

Lol and you believe Hyberion after seeing Ajeel being defeated by Erza + Jupiter.


LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!! Ahaha funny joke dude, but seriously.

Ishgar's mightiest Mage >>>>>>> Erza + Jupiter

Erza + Jupiter >>> Ajeel

Srry, but I think Hyberion was referring to a higher tier Spriggan.

No, Spriggan level is pretty weak. After seeing Ajeel, most people can be Spriggan level if they wanted to.

High-tier Spriggan level? No

But Spriggan level? All you need to do is beat Ajeel or Erza + Jupiter. Easy!

She was stated to be WS level several times throughout the manga. Laxus was never offered to be one, because the Council didn't like his personality.

Yes, I do need proof for everything. You can't just pull shit out of your ass and say it's true. What you're basically saying is that you're basing your entire argument on one character statement from someone who had just witnessed Jura cast his strongest attack. That would mean that Jura has as much MP as Gildarts, not that he's as strong as him. Makarov hadn't even seen Jura in a battle.

Yes, I believe Hyberion after seeing Ajeel. Sand World is pretty much something that only either physical monsters like Mard or magical geniuses like Hades can win against. There aren't many characters who have enough feats to beat Ajeel, who's probably one of the weakest Shields. Ajeel lost to Jupiter and Erza because of his cockiness, not because of his lack of abilities. If he hadn't been cocky and kept himself intangible, he would have easily killed Erza.

That's Ad Hominem, so stop it.

Erza + Jupiter aren't necessarily stronger than Ajeel just because they beat him. I already referred to Ajeel's cockiness, so now I'll refer to the fact that prepared Ajeel casually overpowered Jupiter and that serious Ajeel stomped Erza. Besides, that's a baseless statement because we've never seen God Serena fight.

Spriggan level is weak and that's why Ishgar is in danger. Because Alvarez has 12 fodder mages who can beat anyone in Ishgar. Not to mention that Brandish, probably a low-ranked Spriggan as well, casually reduced a small island to nothing and that Wahl has town-level busting spells with 3000km range. Care to explain how that's weak? Hyberion was clearly referring to the Spriggan 12 overall and that will remain like that until we actually see God Serena and Hyberion fight.

Spriggan level is not about beating Ajeel or Erza + Jupiter and I've already explained why. Besides, this is a useless discussion because it relies too much on speculation and I've created this thread to accurately compare jura and Bluenote.

 

[Mirage]

Jura wins all except maybe the first scenario.

 

[Arjuna]

Scenario 1 Bluenote
Scenario 2 Bluenote with difficulty Scenario 3 Jura With heavy difficulty

 

[Axiomus]

Is there actually any reason to assume that X792 Jura is vastly different from X791 Jura? The same with Bluenote. The way I see it, Bluenote and Jura are on the same level with Jura being the superior of the two. Bluenote was a match for Gildarts on Tenrou Island. GMG Jura was hyped to be a match for Gildarts, and was a match for Laxus (whom we assume was close to Gildart's level). There's not a monumental difference between the two, though I would say Jura has the edge.

Oracion Seis Jura vs Tenrou Bluenote, however, is a different story. At that time, Jura was the weakest of the wizard saint. Erza was considered a WS level by Jellal, and commended by Jose himself to having the potential of putting up a decent fight had she not taken a hit from Jupiter. I honestly had Jura ranked below Erza prior to the 7 year timeskip. Bluenote, being on Gildart's level, would have been superior to that version of Jura.

 

[Vasgoko]

Is there actually any reason to assume that X792 Jura is vastly different from X791 Jura? The same with Bluenote. The way I see it, Bluenote and Jura are on the same level with Jura being the superior of the two. Bluenote was a match for Gildarts on Tenrou Island. GMG Jura was hyped to be a match for Gildarts, and was a match for Laxus (whom we assume was close to Gildart's level). There's not a monumental difference between the two, though I would say Jura has the edge.

Oracion Seis Jura vs Tenrou Bluenote, however, is a different story. At that time, Jura was the weakest of the wizard saint. Erza was considered a WS level by Jellal, and commended by Jose himself to having the potential of putting up a decent fight had she not taken a hit from Jupiter. I honestly had Jura ranked below Erza prior to the 7 year timeskip. Bluenote, being on Gildart's level, would have been superior to that version of Jura.

Yeah, there is.

Bluenote still beat current Wendy and Chelia with ease. In order for him to beat both of them with ease, he must've gotten stronger. We know Wendy has definitely gotten stronger.

As for Jura, he is fighting alongside Draculos Hyberion, Wolfheim, and Warrod. He wouldn't be standing there if he hadn't change over the past year. Otherwise, Jura would be with Lamia Scale right now and not defending the Eastern Front.

Cmon man, quit acting like a smartass and use common sense and logic.

If you have been reading manga a lot you know how it goes and how it works. There is a reason for a timeskip. So that you don't see all the characters crushing a block of concrete everyday. Anything important during that time will be used in a flashback.

It's annoying cuz I know all of you guys agree with this. You guys are just BSing your points right now cuz of this reason:

- The guy with @Vasgoko's face already picked Jura and said that both Jura and Bluenote have improved. And since you guys don't like my opinions, then you just find the opposite answer and ask for proof. Then when I give it to you, you twist it and disregard it.


@Axiomus

Since you asked the question, you haven't exactly chosen any side yet. Don't fall into the trap and state that you believe Jura and Bluenote hadn't change, otherwise, you know you will be beat. You still have a chance to turn around cuz to me, all the proofs are there and my point will just be proved more as we get more chapters.

Same to you @Coné buddy. It's not too late to turn around yet buddy. Jk, but seriously, I know you actually believed that Jura and Bluenote have improved. Even if you have forced yourself not to believe it now, you almost certainly had the initial impression of it when you first read the chapter.

It cant get more obvious than this. If Jura and Bluenote didn't get stronger, there is no point of a timeskip and Jura shouldn't even be thinking about fighting the Spriggans at this point.

 

[Coné]

Yeah, there is.

Bluenote still beat current Wendy and Chelia with ease. In order for him to beat both of them with ease, he must've gotten stronger. We know Wendy has definitely gotten stronger.

As for Jura, he is fighting alongside Draculos Hyberion, Wolfheim, and Warrod. He wouldn't be standing there if he hadn't change over the past year. Otherwise, Jura would be with Lamia Scale right now and not defending the Eastern Front.

Cmon man, quit acting like a smartass and use common sense and logic.

If you have been reading manga a lot you know how it goes and how it works. There is a reason for a timeskip. So that you don't see all the characters crushing a block of concrete everyday. Anything important during that time will be used in a flashback.

It's annoying cuz I know all of you guys agree with this. You guys are just BSing your points right now cuz of this reason:

- The guy with @Vasgoko's face already picked Jura and said that both Jura and Bluenote have improved. And since you guys don't like my opinions, then you just find the opposite answer and ask for proof. Then when I give it to you, you twist it and disregard it.


@Axiomus

Since you asked the question, you haven't exactly chosen any side yet. Don't fall into the trap and state that you believe Jura and Bluenote hadn't change, otherwise, you know you will be beat. You still have a chance to turn around cuz to me, all the proofs are there and my point will just be proved more as we get more chapters.

Same to you @Coné buddy. It's not too late to turn around yet buddy. Jk, but seriously, I know you actually believed that Jura and Bluenote have improved. Even if you have forced yourself not to believe it now, you almost certainly had the initial impression of it when you first read the chapter.

It cant get more obvious than this. If Jura and Bluenote didn't get stronger, there is no point of a timeskip and Jura shouldn't even be thinking about fighting the Spriggans at this point.

I haven't forced myself to anything and I don't necessarily disagree with the notion that Jura and Bluenote have gotten stronger because of the portrayal they got. My problem with saying that is, have they really become stronger? Is there any way to confirm it? No, there isn't, so we can't say that they've indeed become stronger.

 

[Axiomus]

Yeah, there is.

Bluenote still beat current Wendy and Chelia with ease. In order for him to beat both of them with ease, he must've gotten stronger. We know Wendy has definitely gotten stronger.

As for Jura, he is fighting alongside Draculos Hyberion, Wolfheim, and Warrod. He wouldn't be standing there if he hadn't change over the past year. Otherwise, Jura would be with Lamia Scale right now and not defending the Eastern Front.

Cmon man, quit acting like a smartass and use common sense and logic.

If you have been reading manga a lot you know how it goes and how it works. There is a reason for a timeskip. So that you don't see all the characters crushing a block of concrete everyday. Anything important during that time will be used in a flashback.

It's annoying cuz I know all of you guys agree with this. You guys are just BSing your points right now cuz of this reason:

- The guy with @Vasgoko's face already picked Jura and said that both Jura and Bluenote have improved. And since you guys don't like my opinions, then you just find the opposite answer and ask for proof. Then when I give it to you, you twist it and disregard it.


@Axiomus

Since you asked the question, you haven't exactly chosen any side yet. Don't fall into the trap and state that you believe Jura and Bluenote hadn't change, otherwise, you know you will be beat. You still have a chance to turn around cuz to me, all the proofs are there and my point will just be proved more as we get more chapters.

Same to you @Coné buddy. It's not too late to turn around yet buddy. Jk, but seriously, I know you actually believed that Jura and Bluenote have improved. Even if you have forced yourself not to believe it now, you almost certainly had the initial impression of it when you first read the chapter.

It cant get more obvious than this. If Jura and Bluenote didn't get stronger, there is no point of a timeskip and Jura shouldn't even be thinking about fighting the Spriggans at this point.

Why would Bluenote needed to have gotten stronger to beat Wendy and Chelia with ease? He's not really doing anything that he couldn't have done pre-TS. It's not like Wendy was using dragon force against him or anything. And even if she were, is there really a reason to think Wendy is stronger than Sting or Rogue?

Jura's decision to stand with the rest of the Wizard Saints has more to do with the fact that the 10 Wizard Saint are now the new magic council than anything else. They have a duty to defend Ishgar, and the Eastern front is the biggest threat. I don't see this as being proof that Jura has grown tremendously over the past year. I can see there being minor improvements over the year as always, but nothing major or earth-shattering.

 

[Sinister Spirit]

Situation 1: I'd say Bluenote is close to Zero's level, and Zero is stronger than Midnight, who is stated to be stronger than any other Oracion Seis member (including normal Brain), we even saw how easily he defeated Hot Eye, and Hot Eye seems close to Jura's level. I think Bluenote's victory is quite obvious on this one, due to the big power-level difference, his gravity should crush anything Jura can do with his Earth magic.

Situation 2: Now that Jura reached Laxus' level, the fight seems more even (in fact Jura has probably a bit more raw power than Bluenote now). This would be interesting since they both have advantages the other doesn't. Bluenote's Gravity would ensure his superiority in hand-to-hand combat and speed, plus it'd cripple Jura's Earth magic since his rock constructs might crumble. However Jura could still use some spells like raising spikes from the ground, wich has more range than any of Bluenote's attacks (unless he can throw his Black Hole, if he can then he definitely wins). Still, I doubt these spikes would be enough to win, so Jura's only chance is the mega-attack he used on the Magic Finder device, but it doesn't seem to have much range and if Jura gets too close, he might get swallowed into Bluenote's black hole. Sure, Jura could raise a rock wall to protect himself from the black hole's gravity, but that'd leave him aiming blindly when he casts his ultimate attack. This could go either way, mostly depending on Jura's luck VS Bluenote's speed, but I personally think Bluenote has slightly better chances of winning.

Situation 3: I won't answer that one since I stopped debating about Current characters. Avatar and Alvalez broke WAY too much logic for me.

 

[Eclopse]

. Do you have any proof that Current Wendy is weaker than Tenrou Gildartz?

I swear power inflationists are weird sometimes. "Do you have any proof that the little 12 year old girl didn't surpassTHE WORLD'S STRONGEST MAN by training for like a year?"

 

[grey matter]

I swear power inflationists are weird sometimes. "Do you have any proof that the little 12 year old girl didn't surpassTHE WORLD'S STRONGEST MAN by training for like a year?"

That's the logical answer.
But FT isn't dictated by logic. The powerups that the relevant characters get are weird AF. Espeically, our 20-25 year old characters just flying past highly experienced mages in power level, with 1-2 year trainings.

Three main examples of retarded power scaling:
1. x784 Gildarts in around 40 years old. And he's around Jura level, according to Makarov. Stronger surely, but he would have about the same difficulty or more difficulty as he had defeating Bluenote, for Jura.
At best, he was GOI 4 (Warrod) tier. But, in just one year, this wandering mage that barely trains anymore, jumped up tiers to reach on or above God Serena tier. Does this make any sense? He jumped up tiers that he didn't in 40 years of his lifetime.

2. x784 Jellal was around x784 Laxus level. And was above x784 Jura with his illusion (higher ranking WS).
In 6 years (1 year in prison) timeskip, and with 2nd origin (presumably); he reached only around x791 Jura level? This means that he got a LESSER powerup than what Jura himself got. WTF ?? And Laxus trained for just 3 months to have same powerup Jellal got in 6 years and with 2nd origin?
To make matters worse, Jellal jumped up tiers in 1 year to reach high Spriggan tier, while Jura remained stagnant (at least as far as we know).
Yeaaa, very logical there, Mashima

3. Mira stopped using magic and became a bartender 3 years prior to the start of main series. While Erza trained. And in x784, even after Mira potentially got weaker or at the very least stagnant (because of not using magic for 3 years), she was still somewhere close to Erza in her Satan Soul (at least mid diff range). And, that was her without using her Sitri and Halphas.


Point being: Mashmia just makes our characters as strong as he wants them to be, irrespective of any logic or respect to the verse.

 

[Aurelius]

Point being: Mashmia just makes our characters as strong as he wants them to be, irrespective of any logic or respect to the verse.

I was actually gonna write something similar and post on the power ranking thread, lol. But was just too lazy. Long story short it's complete bullshit how the main cast/FT wizards jump tiers only because either the situation requires it or hype needs to be maintained. While the few characters who actually put effort to get stronger never close the gap because what I said last sentence. Then there's the side characters who are implied to stay stagnant bc they're irrelevant.

 

[grey matter]

I was actually gonna write something similar and post on the power ranking thread, lol. But was just too lazy. Long story short it's complete bullshit how the main cast/FT wizards jump tiers only because either the situation requires it or hype needs to be maintained. While the few characters who actually put effort to get stronger never close the gap because what I said last sentence. Then there's the side characters who are implied to stay stagnant bc they're irrelevant.

Yep, exactly!
According to Mashima, hard work, dedication and talent means absolute jack lol. As long as portrayal/hype or friendship demands it, his 'relevant' characters WILL jump up several tiers without any training.

Just think about it. Meledy was > Juvia (without POF) as a freaking 10 year old (x784). And in x791, she's still the same level, if not weaker.

 

[Sinister Spirit]

According to Mashima, hard work, dedication and talent means absolute jack lol. As long as portrayal/hype or friendship demands it, his 'relevant' characters WILL jump up several tiers without any training.

Luckily, this problem mostly happens in recent arcs (wich is why I refuse to even TALK about current characters) but I can still find a few old exemples: Jellal > Oracion Seis while Midnight could've reflected his attack back at him and single-handedly won. X782 Mirajane was powerless against Elfman's Beat Soul, yet only 2 years later, she's TOYING with it!? Demon Jiemma > Kyoka >> Erza > Natsu > Sting + Rogue... and yet the twin dragons could still beat Demon Jiemma!? Come on, Erza needed so much POF to beat Kyoka she could break logic and KNOW where Kyoka was while being completely blinded and deafned, how the hell could THEY gather enough POF if this concept is still new to them!?

 

[grey matter]

Luckily, this problem mostly happens in recent arcs (wich is why I refuse to even TALK about current characters) but I can still find a few old exemples: Jellal > Oracion Seis while Midnight could've reflected his attack back at him and single-handedly won. X782 Mirajane was powerless against Elfman's Beat Soul, yet only 2 years later, she's TOYING with it!? Demon Jiemma > Kyoka >> Erza > Natsu > Sting + Rogue... and yet the twin dragons could still beat Demon Jiemma!? Come on, Erza needed so much POF to beat Kyoka she could break logic and KNOW where Kyoka was while being completely blinded and deafned, how the hell could THEY gather enough POF if this concept is still new to them!?

Yes, exactly.
100 YQ arc is pretending like Alverez didn't even exist lol. 100 YQ power levels are very wacky IMO, almost as bad as Alverez. (but at least plot seems good/decent so far, so I don't mind too much :P)

As for Jellal vs OS, I think that is fine.
In x784, Oracion Seis arc, Jellal was heavily injured and low on MP (due to casting self destruction on himself), which was why Midnight rekt him. I consider Midnight's ability as a hax, it won't work on spells much stronger than himself. For eg, you wouldn't assume that Midnight can be immune to Acno's roar....an extreme case but proves the point.

For Mira and Elfman case, 100% agree! Logically, Mira shouldn't even be base Natsu level, after 3 years of stagnation/nerf....considering the amount that our MCs have grown in JUST ONE YEAR. Though, one thing to be noted is that Elfman's takeover is weaker than the original. The original beast was freaking HUGE, while Elfman's takeover was much smaller. Maybe, the original form is uncontrollable by Elfman, hence he remains in smaller form (note Phantom lord arc).

Sting and Rouge, they got huge powerups in GMG. Sting got powerup from his cat 'dying' (to the point where he one shotted Jeimma). Rouge got powerup from his future self, where he was much stronger than base Gajeel.
Also, the narrative regarding twin dragons, since GMG, was that they got strong once they realized the power of bonds (IK, bullshit). By themselves, they're not on the level of Natsu, Gajeel, Erza etc. But collectively, they can possibly be above Erza and Natsu (unless he does DF or maybe FDKM). We see this again in Alverez arc, where they defeated a top Spriggan. This is Mashima's way of showing us that twin dragons, collectively, are up there at the top. And that, them defeating demon Jeimma was no fluke. This is similar to Elfman's portrayal. Him (with Lissana'a help) defeated Ajeel (who would've defeated Erza, if not for Bisca), and many eyebrows were raised. But now, he managed to stalemate Madmole, who gave trouble to Natsu. Elfman, like twin dragons, don't have much hype and screentime....but in Mashima's eyes, they're not to be underestimated.

 

[Eclopse]

Point being: Mashmia just makes our characters as strong as he wants them to be, irrespective of any logic or respect to the verse.

Yes, but he more or less respects their standings in doing so.
Gildartz was always at the top and remained at the top, whether his powerlevel was 100 000 or suddenly raised to 150 000, it's basically "what a monster".
Wendy was a 12 year old who couldn't even throw a punch, she doesn't suddenly get to this level by training for a year.