Discussion King

Holt

#1 Ranker
MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted
Global Moderator
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
8,036
Reaction score
8,321
Gender
Male
Country
Nigeria
I don't really get the impression the red demon had a measly 1000 for power.
We were theorizing about the power levels and stats of regular fairies and the other clans (that participated in the war) not that the red demon had 1000 PL.
 

kkck

Waifu Slayer
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
46,276
Reaction score
24,913
Gender
Hidden
Country
Fire Nation
I don't think the Fairies have weakened, they are as strong as they were but got too used to peace. Only King was noted to be particularly powerful. Helbram is somewhat strong but he is nothing compared to King.



Ban had no trouble with the Red Demon at all. He appeared, he stole his hear in one move, dropped his guard, the Demon injured Elaine and injured Ban who was rushing at her.
Most of the fairies we have seen do not seem particularly powerful though. Safe for king only helbram, elaine and gerhard have shown some degree of power. Maybe now that they seem to have gone through some change we will see them grow in power in a relatively short amount of time.

Ban stealing the heart does not count, the demon was not even looking at him. Its not like ban overpowered the demon as he has done to other holy knights once he got serious.
http://manga.redhawkscans.com/reader/read/the_seven_deadly_sins/en/0/25/5/page/35
We can see how ban took significant damage through that. Of course, the damage did not matter because he was already immortal but still, the demon was able to land all those hits on him. And even then, the demon was able to land those hits on elaine and ban after it had its heart taken, even if they were distracted that is not something someone weak could easily do. And it took the demon an instant to burn down a magical forest which isn't supposed to burn to begin with. Its power well beyond most holy knights we have seen. And it makes sense a read demon would be that insanely strong considering the elite demons would still have at least 10 times that power...
 

HereNThere

Alive Ain't Always Livin'
MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted
Mangahelper
Joined
Jul 8, 2009
Messages
8,382
Reaction score
12,171
Gender
Male
Country
United States
^^ Hmm, giants creating golems able to match albion seems a bit too powerful. Well, if they could create lots of decently powerful ones so the golems gang up on albion, its a bit realistic I guess. Perhaps the goddess clan used enchantments on them as well.
I think if enough Giants put their powers together, they'd be able to just create one powerful enough to engage an Albion, but not defeat it. Enchantments probably buffed them up as well. Thinking about it now, it's possible that not a lot of demons even got killed. Maybe all the clans only fought to contain and seal them?
 

Demonspeed

The Bull
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Global Moderator
Joined
Apr 30, 2012
Messages
47,658
Reaction score
61,353
Gender
Male
Country
France
Most of the fairies we have seen do not seem particularly powerful though. Safe for king only helbram, elaine and gerhard have shown some degree of power. Maybe now that they seem to have gone through some change we will see them grow in power in a relatively short amount of time.

Ban stealing the heart does not count, the demon was not even looking at him. Its not like ban overpowered the demon as he has done to other holy knights once he got serious.
http://manga.redhawkscans.com/reader/read/the_seven_deadly_sins/en/0/25/5/page/35
We can see how ban took significant damage through that. Of course, the damage did not matter because he was already immortal but still, the demon was able to land all those hits on him. And even then, the demon was able to land those hits on elaine and ban after it had its heart taken, even if they were distracted that is not something someone weak could easily do. And it took the demon an instant to burn down a magical forest which isn't supposed to burn to begin with. Its power well beyond most holy knights we have seen. And it makes sense a read demon would be that insanely strong considering the elite demons would still have at least 10 times that power...
Oh, I had actually forgotten about this, he might have a PL around 3000 indeed but I doubt Ban was dodging, he rarely does it, especially when he is furious.

Since Humans were considered as the weakest and that 300 is the minimum to be a HK I guess an average Fairy has a PL of 500 or a little more.
 
Last edited:

overlordpringerx

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2015
Messages
852
Reaction score
311
Age
31
Gender
Male
Country
Spain
Most of the fairies we have seen do not seem particularly powerful though. Safe for king only helbram, elaine and gerhard have shown some degree of power. Maybe now that they seem to have gone through some change we will see them grow in power in a relatively short amount of time.

Ban stealing the heart does not count, the demon was not even looking at him. Its not like ban overpowered the demon as he has done to other holy knights once he got serious.
http://manga.redhawkscans.com/reader/read/the_seven_deadly_sins/en/0/25/5/page/35
We can see how ban took significant damage through that. Of course, the damage did not matter because he was already immortal but still, the demon was able to land all those hits on him. And even then, the demon was able to land those hits on elaine and ban after it had its heart taken, even if they were distracted that is not something someone weak could easily do. And it took the demon an instant to burn down a magical forest which isn't supposed to burn to begin with. Its power well beyond most holy knights we have seen. And it makes sense a read demon would be that insanely strong considering the elite demons would still have at least 10 times that power...
we're talking about those fairies that lived 3000 years ago
 

Holt

#1 Ranker
MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted
Global Moderator
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
8,036
Reaction score
8,321
Gender
Male
Country
Nigeria
I think if enough Giants put their powers together, they'd be able to just create one powerful enough to engage an Albion, but not defeat it. Enchantments probably buffed them up as well. Thinking about it now, it's possible that not a lot of demons even got killed. Maybe all the clans only fought to contain and seal them?
Yeah, it seemed quite a number of them survived considering Fraudrin was asked why the others weren't freed. Its possible that the plan was to seal and not kill. Killing was probably something they couldn't pull off. Hendricksen survived Mel's attack and a little of Fraudrin's blood revived him and he is just albion PL level.
 

lightningsha

Registered User
中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2013
Messages
133
Reaction score
120
Country
United States
I agree that the strongest arm of the fairy force hovering around 1000 wouldn't have been enough to withstand a war with the demons. Either powerful fairies around Helbram's level will show up from the Fairy Realm or the fairies inspired by King's recent showcase will get an amp-up in magical might. At least to a point where they are no longer laughably delicate as we've seen so far.

Same with the Giants. Especially the Giants from a narrative perspective. Considering how power levels keep escalating to to crazy proportions, in order for the introduction of the giants as a clan to be impressive, they would need to have at least some in the 3000s. I wouldn't be surprised if a clan leader of 5000 is introduced, probably one that would help train Diane in more giant techniques.
 

overlordpringerx

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2015
Messages
852
Reaction score
311
Age
31
Gender
Male
Country
Spain
I just thought of something. Is it possible that fairies might have regenerative abilities? Helbram and Elaine's wounds healed, even after death!
 

Amplitude404

Registered User
初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
Joined
Jun 28, 2015
Messages
40
Reaction score
2
Age
29
Gender
Male
Country
United States
Quick question
Does kings Ability (disaster) have to be considered something that creates a disaster?
Why can't it be something that prevents disasters?
I know these may sound far fetched but...
A spear is a weapon which can be used to defend.
Increase is like leaves which can protect a tree
The guardian form is like when trees move to a different spot to get either water or sun
The fossilization form of his weapon is similar to petrifaction in which wood turns to stone preventing deterioration.
The Sunflower is like when a tree releases heat, in winter to survive the release heat to melt snow.
Luminosity could be when a tree loses its leaves and sun light is able cover the tree without resistance from the leaves.
Pollen garden is pretty self explanatory with it being able to heal, the pollen could be considered the bark (a protective covering)
As for the healing, trees generally are able to regenerate to a certain degree.
 

kkck

Waifu Slayer
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
46,276
Reaction score
24,913
Gender
Hidden
Country
Fire Nation
^Well, the issue with that is that we kind of don't know with detail what role king's disaster plays into his spear forms. So far it kinda seems like the spear forms relate more to specific attributes of the sacred tree rather than king's disaster. To the point where even other fairies can distinguish the forms of chastiefol even though king only got chastiefol 10 years ago well after he abandoned the fairy kings forest. That said, we have seen one instance of king using disaster on someone and he caused him rheumatism. Which does go in line with disaster being a purely offensive ability.
 

Amplitude404

Registered User
初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
Joined
Jun 28, 2015
Messages
40
Reaction score
2
Age
29
Gender
Male
Country
United States
If it was purely offensive wouldn't it actually do damage?
If his ability is meant to prevent disaster then eliminating an opponent would fall under that category,
As for Cain He already had rheumatism, triggering it could have been any number of things from healing it to force it to act up.
If king was trying to push him out of the ring, couldn't Cains muscle memory activate due to him being a warrior for most of his life?
 

kkck

Waifu Slayer
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
46,276
Reaction score
24,913
Gender
Hidden
Country
Fire Nation
If it was purely offensive wouldn't it actually do damage?
If his ability is meant to prevent disaster then eliminating an opponent would fall under that category,
As for Cain He already had rheumatism, triggering it could have been any number of things from healing it to force it to act up.
If king was trying to push him out of the ring, couldn't Cains muscle memory activate due to him being a warrior for most of his life?
Well, only if you seriously limit your concept of offensive ability. It does not seem like the ability is meant to prevent disaster. In no form or context is triggering a rheumatism a prevention of a disaster. In this case the situation is that a physical disability basically activated at what presumably was the worst possible time. By all intents and purposes a "disaster".

I am not sure of what you mean by that last line.

Anyways, the situation regarding disaster right now is that we really have no explanation of how it works and only one specific time it was used which brought forth more questions than answers. Regardless, there is little to no context and at best nonexistent evidence that disaster has healing properties. Based on what we have seen for disaster to have healing properties the author would have to take a very liberal approach to what a disaster is and on what it works on. The sort of liberalness that would enable ban to snatch his own strength to add it to his already existing strength and grow infinitely stronger for instance. Kinda like king could cause a disaster on the germs infecting a wound to heal it. Or cause a disaster on the abstract concept of "wound" so that from that point onwards wounds are conceptually impossible. Now, I am not saying king can't heal with disaster, just that with the context we have and the explanations that have been given we really don't have anything to actually reasonably support that idea. Our facts regarding disaster are the following:

1.- It exists. Which I guess makes disaster slightly more of a thing than bigfoot.
2.- The ambiguous stuff guila said about it. Which given the ambiguous nature of the explanation does not make it an actual fact perhaps.
3.- It was used to trigger rheumatism.
 

Amplitude404

Registered User
初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
Joined
Jun 28, 2015
Messages
40
Reaction score
2
Age
29
Gender
Male
Country
United States
Are we to take the words of the author literally?
Though the name is disaster and we have Cain "claiming" that it triggered his rheumatism doesn't mean it's for the purpose of causing disaster.
However rheumatism isn't some vast illness, it's a form of arthritis.
Injuries being healed usually itch due to Histamine. If disaster were to start healing cain's rheumatism then it would be preventing injuries but from Cains perspective all he would feel is his joints feeling funny.
Cain of course not knowing what's happening just thinks his rheumatism is acting up and pushes king out of the ring.
 

overlordpringerx

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2015
Messages
852
Reaction score
311
Age
31
Gender
Male
Country
Spain
Are we to take the words of the author literally?
Though the name is disaster and we have Cain "claiming" that it triggered his rheumatism doesn't mean it's for the purpose of causing disaster.
However rheumatism isn't some vast illness, it's a form of arthritis.
Injuries being healed usually itch due to Histamine. If disaster were to start healing cain's rheumatism then it would be preventing injuries but from Cains perspective all he would feel is his joints feeling funny.
Cain of course not knowing what's happening just thinks his rheumatism is acting up and pushes king out of the ring.
But it was King who said that he wanted to trigger the rheumatism and cheat. Not Cain. Also, all abilitys so far have had a fairly literal sense so far. You could argue that it may control disasters, enabling it to enhance or erase them.
 

kkck

Waifu Slayer
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
46,276
Reaction score
24,913
Gender
Hidden
Country
Fire Nation
Are we to take the words of the author literally?
Though the name is disaster and we have Cain "claiming" that it triggered his rheumatism doesn't mean it's for the purpose of causing disaster.
However rheumatism isn't some vast illness, it's a form of arthritis.
Injuries being healed usually itch due to Histamine. If disaster were to start healing cain's rheumatism then it would be preventing injuries but from Cains perspective all he would feel is his joints feeling funny.
Cain of course not knowing what's happening just thinks his rheumatism is acting up and pushes king out of the ring.
Generally the name thing has been remarkably straightforward. Also, it wasn't cain who claimed the rheumatism bit. King specifically said he used his ability for that purpose. Cain never even spoke of the matter. He merely reacted to the effect it had on him and beat up king.
 

Amplitude404

Registered User
初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
Joined
Jun 28, 2015
Messages
40
Reaction score
2
Age
29
Gender
Male
Country
United States
If we're talking about names
He is called the grizzly sin of sloth...
Why would the sin of sloth(laziness) have an ability that would actively aide disasters?
Wouldn't his ability when tied with his name indicate him preventing disasters as they happened rather than go out and cause them?
He didn't prevent disasters in the past (could be considered laziness) thus he got the name sin of sloth
Why would his ability actively do what he previously failed to prevent rather than prevent what caused the trouble in the first place?
We see each ability do something very close to the name but they also relate to their wielder,
Creation by envy aka the one who wants something they can't have so they create something else
Snatch by greed Aka the one who always want something else and is never satisfied
Full counter by wrath aka the one who will enact revenge(of sorts) on those who did something to them

Have we ever seen king actively try to cause a disaster/ harm for no reason ?

For triggering the rheumatism he was in a fight
Thus disabling an enemy can be considered preventing harm/disaster to one self.
 

kkck

Waifu Slayer
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
46,276
Reaction score
24,913
Gender
Hidden
Country
Fire Nation
If we're talking about names
He is called the grizzly sin of sloth...
Why would the sin of sloth(laziness) have an ability that would actively aide disasters?
Wouldn't his ability when tied with his name indicate him preventing disasters as they happened rather than go out and cause them?
He didn't prevent disasters in the past (could be considered laziness) thus he got the name sin of sloth
Why would his ability actively do what he previously failed to prevent rather than prevent what caused the trouble in the first place?
We see each ability do something very close to the name but they also relate to their wielder,
Creation by envy aka the one who wants something they can't have so they create something else
Snatch by greed Aka the one who always want something else and is never satisfied
Full counter by wrath aka the one who will enact revenge(of sorts) on those who did something to them

Have we ever seen king actively try to cause a disaster/ harm for no reason ?

For triggering the rheumatism he was in a fight
Thus disabling an enemy can be considered preventing harm/disaster to one self.
So.. semantics? I could as easily make the point that laziness causes disasters. Which is literally what has happened to king (though he is not lazy).
no, his ability when tied with his name does not necessarily indicate anything regarding preventing disasters.
We have never seen a sin cause disasters for no reason. Well, perhaps gowther but I think that is kinda irrelevant to the discussion.

Or it can be a disaster for the one that has to receive an attack. Except of course that king was unable to deliver on the beatdown he meant.
 

overlordpringerx

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2015
Messages
852
Reaction score
311
Age
31
Gender
Male
Country
Spain
If we're talking about names
He is called the grizzly sin of sloth...
Why would the sin of sloth(laziness) have an ability that would actively aide disasters?
Wouldn't his ability when tied with his name indicate him preventing disasters as they happened rather than go out and cause them?
He didn't prevent disasters in the past (could be considered laziness) thus he got the name sin of sloth
Why would his ability actively do what he previously failed to prevent rather than prevent what caused the trouble in the first place?
We see each ability do something very close to the name but they also relate to their wielder,
Creation by envy aka the one who wants something they can't have so they create something else
Snatch by greed Aka the one who always want something else and is never satisfied
Full counter by wrath aka the one who will enact revenge(of sorts) on those who did something to them

Have we ever seen king actively try to cause a disaster/ harm for no reason ?

For triggering the rheumatism he was in a fight
Thus disabling an enemy can be considered preventing harm/disaster to one self.
Of course King hasn't caused harm for no reason, he isn't a sadist. But he has beaten and even killed people in the past. Your logic is unbelievably flawed.
 

Amplitude404

Registered User
初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
Joined
Jun 28, 2015
Messages
40
Reaction score
2
Age
29
Gender
Male
Country
United States
All I'm saying is that everyone seems to be saying disaster is meant for causing disasters, while this may be true there is no proof stating that disaster isn't meant for preventing disasters.
 

HereNThere

Alive Ain't Always Livin'
MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted
Mangahelper
Joined
Jul 8, 2009
Messages
8,382
Reaction score
12,171
Gender
Male
Country
United States
If we're talking about names
He is called the grizzly sin of sloth...
Yes.

Why would the sin of sloth(laziness) have an ability that would actively aide disasters?
Wouldn't his ability when tied with his name indicate him preventing disasters as they happened rather than go out and cause them?
Not really, as that would go against the simple naming convention. His power would be called Prevention most likely if that were the case.

He didn't prevent disasters in the past (could be considered laziness) thus he got the name sin of sloth
Why would his ability actively do what he previously failed to prevent rather than prevent what caused the trouble in the first place?
Quick question, where do you read the manga? Because it sounds like you haven't read King's backstory. Suffice to say, that first line isn't the reason he was arrested as the Sin of Sloth. We only have a surface level idea of what Disaster does, so it's possible there is more to it than we think.

We see each ability do something very close to the name but they also relate to their wielder.
As I said before, we only have a surface idea of what Disaster can do. But if we are to take it's ability literally, then Disaster's ability is to cause harm. However, we don't know how it causes harm, which could relate to his Sin in the end.
 
Last edited:
Top