Discussion Natsu Dragneel/E.N.D Thread

[dark123]

I am posting it here because it fits topic
It was never stated lol. END is Natsu and there is no other personality. We should have already known that since Zeref's flashbacks. People think that way because in Tartaros arc it was said that END is evil but what does that mean to be evil? For one person you can be good for other evil. Someone with immeasurable power always can be considered evil but in truth he can be good. It is point of view. Are we evil because we eat chickens? I still think that Tartaros arc is bullshit now and Mashima changed his plans towards END. Especially after Zerefs flashbacks.

 

[Nizen]

Why are we considering one of the Yakuma Battle Gods to be on the same level as legit "gods". Remember, Erza tanked the arena nuke hit of the one Minerva used, and the one Natsu crushed is no different with Ih Rigoria. Besides, what can expect from a scrub summon? That character is of no relevance to the major plotline. What we need to consider atm is the reality behind Natsu's immense strength..
I will consider it to be a tattoo of some sort because we've seen a something manifest under his arm and that will be revealed next week. It reacts to stronger beings but did it react against Ikusatsunagi? No. Thats some trump card Natsu has and I doubt it to be END's powers because Natsu was developing it by himself (unless Zeref is involved behind the scenes). So thats something associated with his DS side, in my opinion.

 

[XXEliteXXAceXX]

I am posting it here because it fits topic
It was never stated lol. END is Natsu and there is no other personality. We should have already known that since Zeref's flashbacks. People think that way because in Tartaros arc it was said that END is evil but what does that mean to be evil? For one person you can be good for other evil. Someone with immeasurable power always can be considered evil but in truth he can be good. It is point of view. Are we evil because we eat chickens? I still think that Tartaros arc is bullshit now and Mashima changed his plans towards END. Especially after Zerefs flashbacks.

You are correct that it is hard to measure between good and evil, but make no mistake. In real life, that may be the case although there are certain scenarios that are obvious like killing, torturing, etc. Anyways, in mangas/animes like Fairy Tail, I think there is a fine line to which a character is portrayed as good or evil. Don't get me wrong, there are certain animes/mangas that are in the gray area like Deathnote. But for Fairy Tail, I think it is somewhat black and white. There has not been one character that I can't tell if they are good or evil. There has been changes in characters' personalities though, which is different. As for E.N.D, he is either good or evil. We don't know yet because he isn't released; however, I believe there will be no in between here.

 

[Vasgoko]

I agree with kkck here. The Ikatsunagi God or whatever his name is and the other Yakuma Gods are irrelevant and serve no purpose. They aren't real gods, just some ancient spell that probably created some sort of illusion, it looks like something Mystogan or Midnight would do.

In my opinion, Dragon Slayer can't slay war gods easily. The God slayers may not be able to either. It was more of a figurative art rather than a real one. Zancrow was the first only to give Natsu a challenge and Chelia for Wendy.

Natsu defeating the war God was barely a feat, it just showed that Natsu's sheer strength was incredible. Slaying magic had nothing to do in the fight.

To be honest, all slaying magic doesnt give you much advantage when it comes to fighting the Dragons, Gods, Demons etc. You would have to hone your skills like Acnologia and "bathe in their blood" if you want to see a difference in your slaying magic.

The only true God I believe to exist (maybe others like him if there are any) is Ankhseram. But when it comes to him, none of the slayers are really a match cuz Ankhseram isn't supposedly a physical being.

 

[Brandish μ]

Whatever is sealed in that book + Natsu = END. Anything could be in there, could be personality or curse power who knows. It's like a data stick with END stuff on it. Have to wait until Zeref brings that book out ch 464

 

[dark123]

Whatever is sealed in that book + Natsu = END. Anything could be in there, could be personality or curse power who knows. It's like a data stick with END stuff on it. Have to wait until Zeref brings that book out ch 464

For me it is like magic diary. There are memories of Zeref about how he brought back Natsu to life and so on. Against Natsu it would be mortal weapon.

END has a lot of meanings. It can mean that Natsu will end Zeref's life or he can crush whole darkness or just this sole book can destroy his own image and turn his friends against him. Memories like that would be mind blowing.

 

[Axiomus]

I disagree. Ikusa-Tsunagi was summoned. In that regard, he is as real as any of the Celestial Spirits. If anything, he resembles the Celestial Spirit King. Arlock summoned him with the intention of actually killing people, which it did. Natsu was able to shatter its body. Those are awfully tangible properties for an illusion. I don't see why God Slayer would have nothing to do with slaying gods, especially when there are targets around for them to slay.

Natsu oneshotted the war god. Which means that dragon slayers far weaker than him should be able to take down the god with more difficulty. Dragon Slayers like Laxus can probably also do what Natsu did. I can see Gajeel being able to take down Ikusa-Tsunagi with a bit more effort. Sting and Rogue as well, if they work together. Compared to fighting a dragon, I would definitely say Ikusa-Tsunagi would be easier. At the end of the day, I don't see Natsu being able to oneshot a dragon. Even if I do believe he could one-shot a dragon, I don't believe he would be able to blow it to pieces.

The way I see it, god slaying magics was probably created to fight gods like Ikusa-Tsunagi. Those are the gods that humans would likely have had any contact with. I am open to the idea of there being gods that are stronger than Ikusa-Tsunagi. However, keep in mind that there are also dragons as strong as Igneel. Igneel can pretty much go toe to toe with Acnologia. This puts the maximum potential for dragons at the top of the food chain. The only god that I would consider to be realistically stronger than the Igneel/Acnologia levels is Ankhseram. Ankhseram doesn't even seem to have a body though. He might literally be omnipotent and omnipresent, so it might not even be possible to fight him. He could just curse your lover in your sleep and you would be dead.

 

[Brandish μ]

We really don't know Master END's true power.Only instances we got were
1.Acnologia coming to destroy Master END before his revival It was said that Acnologia was afraid of Master END.
2.The Mural of DKF which shows Master END fighting Acnologia on equal terms.

1. In all fairness it was Igneel (I believe it was or maybe Mard Geer) who made that assumption. Acnologia seems to come when Zeref is involved for some reason, probably to fight something that he deems strong enough which would be Zeref or END in this case.
2. It is just a painting, but I get your point.

Anyways it's easier for me to put Acnologia at the top of the food chain because he has more feats and his hype is to conquer the world. The END hype to me is that he can kill Zeref.

---------- Post added at 04:01 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:53 AM ----------

For me it is like magic diary. There are memories of Zeref about how he brought back Natsu to life and so on. Against Natsu it would be mortal weapon.

END has a lot of meanings. I can mean that Natsu will end Zeref's life or he can crush whole darkness or just this sole book can destroy his own image and turn his friends against him. Memories like that would be mind blowing.

That's certainly within the realm of possibility. Igneel did warn about not opening the book, so it could be a memory album of sorts.

 

[milek]

King or he's is going to die. Maybe he is going to give his life to save Lucy or someone else.

 

[DemonKing888]

If Acnologia ever turns to the good side, I think he would be a fitting King and probably the most likely King for Alvarez and their GMG, Ragnarok

Could Natsu ever forgive Acnologia for killing Igneel? I doubt it.

 

[Fox666]

Acnologia didn't killed Igneel, he was already dead.

 

[SirSamuel016]

Acnologia didn't killed Igneel, he was already dead.

Well, he was in a half-dead state. It was stated that he'd previously removed the dragons' souls with his Dragon Slayer magic, so in a sense thats robbing them off life and then he basically finished off Igneel at the battle of Tartarus. Thats pretty much killing Igneel getting killed by Acnologia.

---------- Post added at 05:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:57 PM ----------

I'd say that Natsu won't become the Emperor of Alvarez, rather that Alvarez and Ishgar would get over their past quarries caused by Zeref and they'd then become continental allies. Someone close to Zeref from Alvarez could take over as Emperor, like August or Invel even, but I think there is greater potential for Alvarez to become a democracy rather than a dictatorship like it currently is. Natsu, although he has shown character grow in thinking more about how he goes about things, probably isn't the best person to lead an entire continent. Sure, he inspires the whole guild, but apart from that he wouldn't really be able to run things without an aide of some sort to keep things on track, like how Zeref has Invel when he's away.

 

[Kuroro]

1. Acnologia fearing END's revival
2. Igneel winning over Acnologia while only having around 30% of his usual strength
3. Igneel not being able to beat END (Source : Zeref)
4. Master of tartaros and created another type of magic (Curses)
5. And last but not least the fact he couldn't be beaten but only sealed back into his book (someone most likely gave his life in exchange for that)

 

[kkck]

1. Acnologia fearing END's revival
2. Igneel winning over Acnologia while only having around 30% of his usual strength
3. Igneel not being able to beat END (Source : Zeref)
4. Master of tartaros and created another type of magic (Curses)
5. And last but not least the fact he couldn't be beaten but only sealed back into his book (someone most likely gave his life in exchange for that)

Well, acknologia did say he did not fear end. And in this context strength just might be relative. End might have dragon slayer magic or curses in which case he does not need to match the raw power of acknologia to best him. Even with dragon slaying magic end would still need power immensely greater than what we have seen yet to actually match acknologia though.

We don't really know if igneel was at 30%. The manga made the point that igneel was weakened but not the extent. Also worth noting, igneel ended up blown to bits here while acknologia only lost an arm. It's not necessarily the case that igneel at 100% would have bested acknologia.

I am not sure that "master of tartarus" really is much of a feat here. Did they even know end at all? I kinda don't get the impression that they knew end. End is actually natsu and they did not recognize him. Tartarus probably knew very little about end altogether.

We don't know under what circumstances end was sealed. For all we know he was sealed as an act of mercy or love. End is in fact natsu, it is entirely possible that he was sealed simply because no one wanted to kill him. Can you imagine igneel trying to kill the guy he would eventually adopt as a son?

 

[Kuroro]

Well, acknologia did say he did not fear end. And in this context strength just might be relative. End might have dragon slayer magic or curses in which case he does not need to match the raw power of acknologia to best him. Even with dragon slaying magic end would still need power immensely greater than what we have seen yet to actually match acknologia though.

We don't really know if igneel was at 30%. The manga made the point that igneel was weakened but not the extent. Also worth noting, igneel ended up blown to bits here while acknologia only lost an arm. It's not necessarily the case that igneel at 100% would have bested acknologia.

I am not sure that "master of tartarus" really is much of a feat here. Did they even know end at all? I kinda don't get the impression that they knew end. End is actually natsu and they did not recognize him. Tartarus probably knew very little about end altogether.

We don't know under what circumstances end was sealed. For all we know he was sealed as an act of mercy or love. End is in fact natsu, it is entirely possible that he was sealed simply because no one wanted to kill him. Can you imagine igneel trying to kill the guy he would eventually adopt as a son?

It was stated that he only had little strength left by grandine, which means Igneel at full power is most likely stronger than Acnogolia by a large margin. Igneel also said that Acnologia dragon slayer magic extracted their souls a long time ago. You can interpret it however you want but to me it sounds like Acnologia is not the strongest dragon it's just that his magic is op as fuck.

Now what's the reason for Acnologia to come up there if he didn't fear END ? Also if Igneel said so himself, it's most likely true.

They did know END or at least Mard Geer did and talked to him frequently it seemed. It was also stated that Mard Geer was the master during the time END was sealed so yeah. Don't forget that he is a fire demon so it's not a coincidence he was raised by igneel. We'll find out sooner or later how everything is linked together.

 

[dark123]

It was stated that he only had little strength left by grandine, which means Igneel at full power is most likely stronger than Acnogolia by a large margin. Igneel also said that Acnologia dragon slayer magic extracted their souls a long time ago. You can interpret it however you want but to me it sounds like Acnologia is not the strongest dragon it's just that his magic is op as fuck.

Now what's the reason for Acnologia to come up there if he didn't fear END ? Also if Igneel said so himself, it's most likely true.

They did know END or at least Mard Geer did and talked to him frequently it seemed. It was also stated that Mard Geer was the master during the time END was sealed so yeah. Don't forget that he is a fire demon so it's not a coincidence he was raised by igneel. We'll find out sooner or later how everything is linked together.

Man have you read Zeref's flashbacks? Tartaros had been created before Natsu was brought back to life. Tartaros was just experiment which resulted in creating method to bring back Natsu to life. As we saw Natsu was brought back to life as child and was imprisoned inside artificial womb. And you are going to tell me that Zeref altered his own beloved brother's personality? NO FUCKING WAY!!! That is why i always tell that Tartaros arc is complete bullshit and completely does not connect with what has been shown in Zeref's flashbacks.

 

[MangerDan]

Man have you read Zeref's flashbacks? Tartaros had been created before Natsu was brought back to life. Tartaros was just experiment which resulted in creating method to bring back Natsu to life. As we saw Natsu was brought back to life as child and was imprisoned inside artificial womb. And you are going to tell me that Zeref altered his own beloved brother's personality? NO FUCKING WAY!!! That is why i always tell that Tartaros arc is complete bullshit and completely does not connect with what has been shown in Zeref's flashbacks.

No where does it say that tartaros was created before Natsu was resurrected as an etherious. All it says is that e.n.d was the last demon zeref created. I fail to see how the tartaros arc was complete bullshit as well.

It's clear the demons didn't know who e.n.d really was and the fact mard geers full name is mard Geer tartaros is highly suspicious as well.

 

[MangerDan]

What kinda memories would Natsu have sealed in the book anyways? When we saw he was a mere toddler when he was brought back to life.

 

[Kuroro]

Man have you read Zeref's flashbacks? Tartaros had been created before Natsu was brought back to life. Tartaros was just experiment which resulted in creating method to bring back Natsu to life. As we saw Natsu was brought back to life as child and was imprisoned inside artificial womb. And you are going to tell me that Zeref altered his own beloved brother's personality? NO FUCKING WAY!!! That is why i always tell that Tartaros arc is complete bullshit and completely does not connect with what has been shown in Zeref's flashbacks.

You got it all wrong. The demons were created before Natsu but END made a guild with THEM as their master. I never said he was created before any of them.

 

[Axiomus]

Acnologia didn't killed Igneel, he was already dead.

Yes he did. Acnologia was the one that stole Igneel's soul in the first place.