One Piece Mega Convo Thread

[Demonspeed]

do folks like sabo and find him interesting ? He’s not bad but man oh man ace just felt more alive and interesting by a million

I loved Sabo before the time skip. The current one is just Ace's replacement. I don't care about him. I am curious about his fighting style though.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

I mean, how? Wano's borders are closed to the point where information is nigh impossible to send or receive.

At that point, Kaido was the only real link to the outside world. Oden only found out about Roger's death thanks to Orochi, who probably got the paper from Kaido.

As for Oden's inaction, he chose the path that kept his people safe. Even after discovering the hostage situation, Oden did intend to fight, before realizing that Orochi would've literally been fine with taking the whole country down with him since he saw everyone as responsible for his clan's demise. What's the point of fighting if the thing you're fighting for is going to be used as collateral intentionally by the opposition?

So he swallowed his pride to not only save the current hostages, 100 of which would be freed for each dance he did, but to protect the people who were not even kidnapped yet.

He literally kept the peace by doing his dance. And seeing as how Orochi seemingly kept that part of his bargain up, I can see why Oden eventually grew to believe he'd keep the other part up after 5 years.




Not really. The reveal was fun and hype, but the character himself is boring. Ace is indeed the better big brother.

I don't mind him, but he's not interesting. Just seems like a cheap replacement for Ace, but with no substance and all crying. Even though he only cried in what? two or three panels out of at least ten pages? We didn't need an Ace Jr, tbh

Yeah plus memory loss is kinda a lazy thing
It’s interesting that ace and luffy in the papers prior to then never jogged his memory

 

[M3J]

Yup. I remember when Amande's silhouette was first shown and I was all in on her before she even had a name.

Who?? Can't be from OP

Yeah plus memory loss is kinda a lazy thing
It’s interesting that ace and luffy in the papers prior to then never jogged his memory

I mean honestly, memory loss and regaining it work mysteriously, it wouldn't be farfetched for Sabo to remember his past from looking at the news of Ace's death. Different things can trigger different people.

 

[HereNThere]

Who?? Can't be from OP

Big Mom's Daughter with the giant fondant hat and fish sword.

 

[hokageji]

Big Mom's Daughter with the giant fondant hat and fish sword.

And the long neck... that's her trademark race....

She is surely cool as hell but never saw her in action.... but the same with smoothie, havent seen both of them.. clearly Oda is saving them for something

 

[HereNThere]

And the long neck... that's her trademark race....

She is surely cool as hell but never saw her in action.... but the same with smoothie, havent seen both of them.. clearly Oda is saving them for something

Amande at least has a meito and 2 named attacks. Smoothie has no named attacks and I don't think her sword has been named yet. Smoothie has gotten nothing, which sucks because her abilities look cool.

Maybe later down the line they'll do something more, but I doubt it. Too many characters already.

 

[M3J]

Big Mom's Daughter with the giant fondant hat and fish sword.

I still don't remember her, but yeah. The character doesn't need to appear for chapters for us to know whether we like them or not.

 

[kkck]

Something in the series I would like more context on.... Kaido during the great war. We know that during the war against WB kaido mobilized to attack WB. And was intercepted and stopped by shanks. But... why did kaido do any of this? By that time kaido had already been in control of wano for nearly 20 years, give or take.

During wano we have seen more or less kaido is... A warmonger and a lunatic but most of the stuff he does is premeditated and rather thoroughly planned. He has been in wano for over 20 years with purpose. He has patiently played an insanely long game. So... why risk it all at marineford? kaido was initially framed as suicidal, and in some ways he still is, but given how he has developed recently the framing seems weird.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

Something in the series I would like more context on.... Kaido during the great war. We know that during the war against WB kaido mobilized to attack WB. And was intercepted and stopped by shanks. But... why did kaido do any of this? By that time kaido had already been in control of wano for nearly 20 years, give or take.

During wano we have seen more or less kaido is... A warmonger and a lunatic but most of the stuff he does is premeditated and rather thoroughly planned. He has been in wano for over 20 years with purpose. He has patiently played an insanely long game. So... why risk it all at marineford? kaido was initially framed as suicidal, and in some ways he still is, but given how he has developed recently the framing seems weird.

Kaido's goal the entire time was to build up the greatest army at Wano and start the greatest war in hopes to die in glorious battle. All Kaido's been doing is setting things up.

In Marineford, you have the entire WG's military essentially, you have the Whitebeard Pirates and the strongest man in the world... Marineford was more or less the sort of battle he'd been looking for.

In a sense, it looks like he's really just trying to recreate the battle between Roger & Garp against the Rocks Pirate which essentially was comprised of the strongest pirates in the world.

Now that that's done, he's trying to acquire the Ancient Weapons, build the strongest army and initiate the greatest war known to man and hopefully die. It makes sense he'd head to Marineford.

Also, Crocodile did explain it all. He said this was also a 1 in a life-time opportunity to kill Whitebeard. Many tried and failed. For people seeking One Piece, taking out Whitebeard is a necessity which is why Blackbeard needed Whitebeard dead.

Why is there a bid for the Pirate King title once more? Whitebeard's gone, no one could have been Pirate King or found the One Piece because Whitebeard was the immovable force stopping every other Pirate.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

And the long neck... that's her trademark race....

She is surely cool as hell but never saw her in action.... but the same with smoothie, havent seen both of them.. clearly Oda is saving them for something

Tbf till big mum we barely get focus on high level female fighter in general
They’re few and far between

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 24, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 18, 2021 ---

@Hannibal Psyche you were right I was too harsh on oden
But man it just feels like he was too trusting of orochi and kaido
People willing to use such tactics and at the same time no incentive to actually leave the country
I dunno the possibility of them not upholding the agreement should have crossed his mind and he should have made plans

 

[Ellenate]

Tbf till big mum we barely get focus on high level female fighter in general
They’re few and far between

There have been plenty of high level female fighters.

There was a whole arc in pre dedicated to it- amazon lily. Their island "fodder" were casually using haki (...another reason why Boa losing versus Koby would be bs).

 

[Dabanagaga]

@Hannibal Psyche[/USER] you were right I was too harsh on oden
But man it just feels like he was too trusting of orochi and kaido
People willing to use such tactics and at the same time no incentive to actually leave the country
I dunno the possibility of them not upholding the agreement should have crossed his mind and he should have made plans

Obviously he was "too trusting", passivity changes a man, as he saw just how humble and gentle Whitebeard and Roger were
Oden was too young to fully grasp the reality of live, he was too young to be able to find an middle ground between his wildness, rashness and passivity, gentliness

A very good example, for me, and maybe some people here, is Mike Tyson
In his younger days, he was wild, strong, undominable
Later on, he became passive, humble
And now, he has reached the true wisdom of understanding who he is, how the world is and act accordingly, to not stick to one school of thought - he had this killer instinct, and now he has managed to control and sue it to an extent.

If the whole situation happened, let's say, now - Oden came back, being 20 years older, having accoumilated all this knowledge and world experience, being an +50 y/o - he wouldn't have listened to Orochi, or at least he would have pretended to untill he got all the forces he could, would have accepted that people WILL die regardless, and will do what he has to or suffer indeffinetily
But reality is often disapointing, rarely does everything fall on your road as it should.

Oden was too young and inexperienced as an man to do what he had to do.
He did what he thought was best, and he did, he understood that he should have went the other route, but what happened happened, and he left the goal for his samurai.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

But man it just feels like he was too trusting of orochi and kaido

This is what you don't seem to understand.

Huge difference between trust and being forced.

If a kidnapper tells you to do xyz, you have to do it.

I asked you before, if I held a gun to your head and told you to withdraw all your money and promised not to shoot you after? Did you withdraw the money because you trusted me, or because I forced you?

1. Obviously you don't trust me, you're simply doing what I say because it's the best way to ensure you aren't killed.
2. Secondly, unless you see evidence that I am lying, you won't take action (e.g. you see me put a bullet in the gun after you've given money)

Hostage situations aren't about trust.

Again, huge difference between trust and force.

You don't seem to understand Wano was taken hostage.

Unless you're a psychopath who hated their family, you wouldn't just disobey the demands of a hostage who has your entire family hostage, and you'd do whatever they asked to ensure your family is safe. Wano is the same, Wano is Oden's family, he doesn't want any of them to die, and does the best he can do to ensure they live.

I can genuinely say 9/10 of you really don't understand Oden's situation at all, it seems like you all really lack the empathy to really understand the perspective of a hostage. If you can't put yourself in his shoes, it's the only way anyone can call what Oden did... trust based.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 25, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 25, 2021 ---

Not sure why people can't understand Oden never trusted Orochi.

How people can't understand that Oden who was calling him a creep, and only lending him money because of Yasu... think Orochi was trusted? Don't think some of you remember much of Oden and just remember the conclusion and lack context.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

This is what you don't seem to understand.

Huge difference between trust and being forced.

If a kidnapper tells you to do xyz, you have to do it.

I asked you before, if I held a gun to your head and told you to withdraw all your money and promised not to shoot you after? Did you withdraw the money because you trusted me, or because I forced you?

1. Obviously you don't trust me, you're simply doing what I say because it's the best way to ensure you aren't killed.
2. Secondly, unless you see evidence that I am lying, you won't take action (e.g. you see me put a bullet in the gun after you've given money)

Hostage situations aren't about trust.

Again, huge difference between trust and force.

You don't seem to understand Wano was taken hostage.

Unless you're a psychopath who hated their family, you wouldn't just disobey the demands of a hostage who has your entire family hostage, and you'd do whatever they asked to ensure your family is safe. Wano is the same, Wano is Oden's family, he doesn't want any of them to die, and does the best he can do to ensure they live.

I can genuinely say 9/10 of you really don't understand Oden's situation at all, it seems like you all really lack the empathy to really understand the perspective of a hostage. If you can't put yourself in his shoes, it's the only way anyone can call what Oden did... trust based.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 25, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 25, 2021 ---

Not sure why people can't understand Oden never trusted Orochi.

How people can't understand that Oden who was calling him a creep, and only lending him money because of Yasu... think Orochi was trusted? Don't think some of you remember much of Oden and just remember the conclusion and lack context.

this is the part I mean in trusting them tokeep their word

I agree on him being forced , but he actually did think orochi and kaido would leave and there was zero incentive for them to just do that
of course he didn't trust him per say , but he thought the deal would be honored, he thought there was a time limit to their wicked reign and I am like ehh
clearly oden thought that, it’s literally said that he trusted their promise to leave , and I’m like , why would they leave
His idea behind saving lives I never knocked but trusting them is so misplaced
the attack on hyogoro and him reneging on leaving with kaido , was what made oden take up arms

 

[minion]

About sword..
In my opinion, is like there is a disgruntled group in marine and this disgruntled group is setting up sword..
They don't want to be dictacted too much by ghorosei..
Like cobi, he have a history unfair treatment by marine.. while his dream is to become a marine to protect the comunity fairly, regardless of the ghorosei (WG) politics.. may be a lot of the other cobi in marine officer...

Just my opinion..

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

this is the part I mean in trusting them tokeep their word

I agree on him being forced , but he actually did think orochi and kaido would leave and there was zero incentive for them to just do that
of course he didn't trust him per say , but he thought the deal would be honored, he thought there was a time limit to their wicked reign and I am like ehh
clearly oden thought that, it’s literally said that he trusted their promise to leave , and I’m like , why would they leave
His idea behind saving lives I never knocked but trusting them is so misplaced
the attack on hyogoro and him reneging on leaving with kaido , was what made oden take up arms

You really don't get it.

You're so oblivious to the fact that every week Oden danced, 100 people were released from prison.

Orochi was honouring and keeping his word.

For 5 years, Orochi released a total of about 26,000 hostages.

He never trusted, honestly, just go read the arc again.

Ever seen a person lose a loved one? They will be in denial not because they don't believe they're dead, but in shock.

Traumatic experiences cause shock. Please, read between the lines, you really don't understand Oden at all.

How are you supposed to know Kaido was not going to leave in the first place? Does Oden know Kaido? No. All he could do was play along. Kaido was a complete stranger. How does he know Kaido and Orochi didn't have bigger plans outside of Wano?

Anyway, don't bother quoting me, I'm actually tired of this conversation, lol.

the attack on hyogoro and him reneging on leaving with kaido , was what made oden take up arms

No shit... lol, what did you expect?

After 5 years of 26,000 people being saved (Orochi and Kaido honouring their word) and Oden looking like a fool... this was the only evidence regarding their true intentions and is the only moment he could attack.

Just go watch a movie with hostages so maybe you'll actually understand the dynamics. You genuinely don't grasp what it means to be taken hostage and the power the kidnapper has.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

You really don't get it.

You're so oblivious to the fact that every week Oden danced, 100 people were released from prison.

Orochi was honouring and keeping his word.

For 5 years, Orochi released a total of about 26,000 hostages.

He never trusted, honestly, just go read the arc again.

Ever seen a person lose a loved one? They will be in denial not because they don't believe they're dead, but in shock.

Traumatic experiences cause shock. Please, read between the lines, you really don't understand Oden at all.

How are you supposed to know Kaido was not going to leave in the first place? Does Oden know Kaido? No. All he could do was play along. Kaido was a complete stranger. How does he know Kaido and Orochi didn't have bigger plans outside of Wano?

Anyway, don't bother quoting me, I'm actually tired of this conversation, lol.



No shit... lol, what did you expect?

After 5 years of 26,000 people being saved (Orochi and Kaido honouring their word) and Oden looking like a fool... this was the only evidence regarding their true intentions and is the only moment he could attack.

Just go watch a movie with hostages so maybe you'll actually understand the dynamics. You genuinely don't grasp what it means to be taken hostage and the power the kidnapper has.

Again I’m saying oden trusted them to keep Their promise and leave wano , of course he didn’t trust orochi as a character , I’m saying there was no reason for him to expect them to leave and just drop the power , that was naive of him
I’m saying not even having a contingency at all
The trust for him to believe to hold unto that promise seemed dangerously naive to me
I’m not knocking oden for even the dancing or hostage which is what I’ve been saying for ages but it doesn’t seem to click with you
Trusting oden and kaido to relinquish the power they have in wano is what I said was naive

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

gain I’m saying oden trusted them to keep Their promise and leave wano ,

I’m saying there was no reason for him to expect them to leave and just drop the power , that was naive of him

You have no scintilla of an understanding of the situation.

K I D N A P, can you read that? Oden went to kill Orochi and Kaido after he returned, they had thousands of hostages to force Oden's hand.

Oden just came back from an expedition and all the people of Wano were looking for him to resolve problems once he returned.

Imagine what people would say if Oden came back, killed Kaido and Orochi, but all the people of Wano lost loved ones because Oden fought.

Again, it's absolutely dumb to take action in a hostage situation, and you don't understand that.

Like I said, you're absolutely clueless because we're explicitly told that Oden taking action at that time would mean a lot more would be lost. The battle won't just be a battle that lasted 1 day.

• There would be constant kidnappings.

If you actually read, kidnappings results in death and torture, it's like you can't grasp this.

Victory or defeat was out of the question and you can't grasp this for whatever reason.

Orochi decided if Oden stopped fighting, they'd release 100 people weekly.

This happened for 5 years.

Maybe you need to do some maths.

• A month has 4 weeks.
• 4 dances a month/4 weeks = 400 people saved per month.
• 12 months in a year.
• 60 months in 5 years.

60 x 400 = 24,000 innocent people.

• So, Oden was a fool... for saving 24,000 people.
• Oden was a fool for stopping people being kidnapped for 5 years by not fighting.
• Oden was a fool for stopping people from being killed for 5 years.

The idea that Oden was stupid, is a stupid conclusion. Imagine being regarded as a fool for saving almost 25,000 people by having the humility, patience and compassion to go through humiliation for 5 years straight despite being destined to be royalty. You have no comprehension of what sort of man Oden was from a narrative perspective is.
You'd literally have to be a psychopath.

This has nothing to do with trust.
Orochi made a deal with Oden.

• Orochi actually committed to his promise for 5 years.

So again, tell me, how is Oden supposed to know the intentions... of someone he doesn't know personally? Not even someone, 2 people working together which means you're not just battling the intentions of 1 person, but 2 people. How do you know they had no intentions to leave Wano?

Someone you don't know makes a promise to you and for 5 years, they keep their promise. How are you supposed to know they're actually intending to screw you over after 60 months of actually fulfilling their promises?

How do you know you can't trust someone that has kept their promise for 5 years? Apparently, you're psychic.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

You have no scintilla of an understanding of the situation.

K I D N A P, can you read that? Oden went to kill Orochi and Kaido after he returned, they had thousands of hostages to force Oden's hand.

Oden just came back from an expedition and all the people of Wano were looking for him to resolve problems once he returned.

Imagine what people would say if Oden came back, killed Kaido and Orochi, but all the people of Wano lost loved ones because Oden fought.

Again, it's absolutely dumb to take action in a hostage situation, and you don't understand that.

Like I said, you're absolutely clueless because we're explicitly told that Oden taking action at that time would mean a lot more would be lost. The battle won't just be a battle that lasted 1 day.

• There would be constant kidnappings.

If you actually read, kidnappings results in death and torture, it's like you can't grasp this.

Victory or defeat was out of the question and you can't grasp this for whatever reason.

Orochi decided if Oden stopped fighting, they'd release 100 people weekly.

This happened for 5 years.

Maybe you need to do some maths.

• A month has 4 weeks.
• 4 dances a month/4 weeks = 400 people saved per month.
• 12 months in a year.
• 60 months in 5 years.

60 x 400 = 24,000 innocent people.

• So, Oden was a fool... for saving 24,000 people.
• Oden was a fool for stopping people being kidnapped for 5 years by not fighting.
• Oden was a fool for stopping people from being killed for 5 years.

The idea that Oden was stupid, is a stupid conclusion. Imagine being regarded as a fool for saving almost 25,000 people by having the humility, patience and compassion to go through humiliation for 5 years straight despite being destined to be royalty. You have no comprehension of what sort of man Oden was from a narrative perspective is.
You'd literally have to be a psychopath.

This has nothing to do with trust.
Orochi made a deal with Oden.

• Orochi actually committed to his promise for 5 years.

So again, tell me, how is Oden supposed to know the intentions... of someone he doesn't know personally? Not even someone, 2 people working together which means you're not just battling the intentions of 1 person, but 2 people. How do you know they had no intentions to leave Wano?

Someone you don't know makes a promise to you and for 5 years, they keep their promise. How are you supposed to know they're actually intending to screw you over after 60 months of actually fulfilling their promises?

How do you know you can't trust someone that has kept their promise for 5 years? Apparently, you're psychic.

You’re ignoring and not addressing the panel where it’s stated where oden trusted orochi and kaido to leave wano in 5 years
That’s the part that made no sense
Why do you argue like this ? Ignore and just say someone is clueless
I never said what oden did had no value or had much choice
The belief where of trusting kaido and orochi to leave is scarily naive is what i have consistently said
He believed they would be gone in 5 years , the idea of making a contingency or at least planning they wouldn’t should have crossed his mind , the trust in them to leave is what I’ve said made zero sense
Orochi and kaido were in no position to leave the country , it made little sense to believe it , why would they leave in 5 years, you keep answering this with something else not addressing which again is why I didn’t engage with you on this alot

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

You’re ignoring and not addressing the panel where it’s stated where oden trusted orochi and kaido to leave wano in 5 years

No, the thing is you're delusional and ignorant.

The belief where of trusting kaido and orochi to leave is scarily naive is what i have consistently said

Why wouldn't you have some level of trust for someone who maintained their part of a deal for 5 years?

He didn't even trust Orochi blindly. He made sure Orochi was doing his part, it wasn't like he wasn't getting anything in return. Again, you're clueless. Try reading, your understanding is comical at best.

How do you build trust? By making a promise and fulfilling it.

Why do you trust anyone? Naive is believing someone without evidence. Yet, there's this nonsensical idea that Oden just blindly trusted Orochi as if Orochi wasn't doing what he promised Oden for 5 years.

He believed they would be gone in 5 years , the idea of making a contingency or at least planning they wouldn’t should have crossed his mind

Do you know how stupid this is? Lol.

What contingency plan?

Who could he call for help?

Wano is a closed country to the world.

What is this plan? Sorry, but that's absolutely stupid.

There's literally no plan that could be made in this situation other than risk it all and be willing to risk the lives of others.

On top of that, there's a spy in his place... what plan was he meant to make? lol?

You're not using any intelligence at all considering the situation.

Like I said, unless you're some psychopath who didn't care about the lives of others, there's literally nothing any moral human being can do. Clearly, you're not quite wired that way since you can't grasp that lives are at stake.

He couldn't even speak to his most trusted confidants, why? Because if they saw Oden was ready to humiliate himself, they might otherwise take premature action which will lead to....

More kidnapping meaning more tortures and death.

Not sure what this genius plan you have in mind is, but it's easy to criticise, call out a problem, and then not even give an intelligible plan. What exactly is your intelligent resolution to this issue?

Every problem is always easy to resolve after the fact.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 25, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 25, 2021 ---

The belief where of trusting kaido and orochi to leave is scarily naive is what i have consistently said

What is also consistently stupid is this.

Maybe you have a job, or just assume you do. Maybe you've been there working for 10 years. They pay you exactly as promised monthly for 10 years.

When exactly do you stop trusting that your employer will stop paying you after 10 years worth of building the trust that they will pay you next month?

How do you know Orochi and Kaido had no intention to ever leave? What evidence do you have?

When exactly do you know someone who has shown they can be trusted, can't be trusted?

Imagine all those people who found out their spouses were cheating on them. They had kids, they paid the bills, they took their spouse out to dinner, they had yearly holidays. At what point do you think they find out not to trust their partner? Most likely when they find them cheating or evidence of it.

Similarly, where's this evidence that Orochi and Kaido never had intentions to leave Wano at all?