One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

goldb

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Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

  • For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
  • Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
  • Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
  • We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

  1. Shanks v Mihawk
  2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
  3. Zoro > Luffy
  4. Zoro v Sanji
  5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
  6. Mihawk's rank within the story
  7. Law having CoC currently.
  8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.
 
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Brandish μ

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If not for the Hell's Memories, Sanjino would drop into the weaker half of the crew, below Robin.
Okay, you wanna bet this? If Sanji has better PL feats than Robin this arc, you will wear a Sanji avatar for a month.

If you win, I'll wear any avatar of your choosing for a year.

There's no way Sanji will drop below 3rd/4th, he's a primary and essential fighter.
 

Aki1991

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Okay, you wanna bet this? If Sanji has better PL feats than Robin this arc, you will wear a Sanji avatar for a month.

If you win, I'll wear any avatar of your choosing for a year.

There's no way Sanji will drop below 3rd/4th, he's a primary and essential fighter.
I am trying to ignore Niks post because he is triggering rational thinking people. He is living in his own world where swords >>> all...

However btt:

I can see Luffy earning a bounty of 3 billion after Wano. And Zoro 1,2 billion. Will be interesting. I am excited about the new bounties. ;)
 

Fox666

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I can see Luffy earning a bounty of 3 billion after Wano. And Zoro 1,2 billion. Will be interesting. I am excited about the new bounties. ;)
So far Zoro bounties have been a little bit ahead of Luffy's bounties, and slowing down

30,000,000 -> 60,000,000
100,000,000 -> 120,000,000
300,000,000 -> 320,000,000

Next one would be ahead of 400,000,000. And given Jinbe's bounty, that's more fitting... :\
 

nik87

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Okay, you wanna bet this? If Sanji has better PL feats than Robin this arc, you will wear a Sanji avatar for a month.
If you win, I'll wear any avatar of your choosing for a year.
There's no way Sanji will drop below 3rd/4th, he's a primary and essential fighter.
Hakuba, who is both faster and more lethal than Sanjino, was useless against Robin.
In her own words: "Power and Speed are useless against me." Not that she needs to bother with power because Sanji only has speed.
For now, the invisibility gives Sanji the edge but Robin learning basic CoO is not out of realm of likely development so invisibility goes down the toilet.
The only problem remains Hell's Memories, because her hands would get burned. That's the only reason Sanji stands a chance against Robin.

Her powers are literally broken that Oda needs to keep her out of fights or put her into situations which are impossible to win for her aka logia opponent but Oda's favorite is to keep her out of fights, she literally had one major 1vs1 - Yama in Skypiea... Hakuba who is far stronger than Sanji was no match for her at all.

Super tanky ex-Shichibukai, first son of the sea Jinbe will fall under Sanji? Only in case, Sanji pulls a nuke because his firepower is terrible. It didnt even leave a scratch on another Shichibukai - Doffy who isnt as durable as Jinbe. Jinbe with water nearby is an incredibly strong character, he has taken on both Admirals and Emperors by himself and walked away with a scratched/burned arm. In the water he is probably unbeatable.

Franky's firepower eclipses Sanjino's several times, he has Kizaru's laser in his arsenal and that's far above anything that Sanji can possibly offer even at EoS.
While Franky possibly cannot catch Sanji due to his speed, Sanji cant beat Franky either because he has nothing to go through the body of General Franky, however, Franky can beat opponents which Sanji cant, where movement speed is not an issue. Both offense and defense of Franky>Sanjino's.

When it comes to raw physical power, it wouldn't surprise me if Chopper's Monster Point can match Jack or even surpass his. Can Sanji match Jack in physical power? Idk... We will see. Regarding the bet, no thanks. Nothing to win there for me and my avatar is way too awesome to be replaced by pervy cook.:stare

Next one would be ahead of 400,000,000
Zoro's next bounty is 1.8Bil.:true
 

Brandish μ

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Her powers are literally broken that Oda needs to keep her out of fights or put her into situations which are impossible to win for her aka logia opponent but Oda's favorite is to keep her out of fights, she literally had one major 1vs1 - Yama in Skypiea... Hakuba who is far stronger than Sanji was no match for her at all.
By this logic, she could be above Zoro and Luffy?

I mean, in some ways, Perona is more broken than 99% of OP characters. Her PL/portrayal is not that high though.

I think we can reasonably ascertain that Robin is a good fighter who is egregiously underused in battles and hax - but is not in the top calibre with Zoro/Sanji/Jinbei/Luffy.
 

kcd

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1. Common sense that Enma is just a regular blade in hands of capable user. Oden has proved it, Zoro has proved it. They wear the pants in house, not Enma.
a mountain.
Unfortunately, the sword isn’t normal and Zoro will always have to restrain it else it shrivel his hands. Yea, it’s common sense as you said, not very hard to grasp.

As I said, Zoro's words can be true and nothing has changed. Yeah, Zoro is a character who actually thinks about haki, he isnt ink on paper...
Point a finger at what Zoro can do what he couldnt do before and use facts not mental gymnastics
So now you think Zoro’s words can be true, but the only give away is that nothing has changed?! Lol, sweet. Can you even hear yourself? So it can be true it made him stronger, but then he’s still the-same at the same time? I didn’t expect to read such nonsense. Thought after several hours of thinking you’d come up with something good.

Zoro who uses haki said enma will make him strong. What actual proof do you have to prove that Zoro is wrong? Do you have any guage that shows his strength (haki) before and after he got enma? Exactly, you don't have, and you haven't shown any thing that contradicts Zoro's words.

When you do find that proof, please do well to share it with the rest of us. Until then, stop quoting me with more of your mental gymnastics nonsense.
 

nik87

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By this logic, she could be above Zoro and Luffy?
I mean, in some ways, Perona is more broken than 99% of OP characters. Her PL/portrayal is not that high though.

I think we can reasonably ascertain that Robin is a good fighter who is egregiously underused in battles and hax - but is not in the top calibre with Zoro/Sanji/Jinbei/Luffy.
Sure, if she can overpower physical beast like Zoro. Even if she can, summoning Asura form would cut her hands up and free Zoro.
Luffy on the other side, is helpless against her but he can beat opponents which she cant. If he can pull off the FS up-time that Katakuri can, he could resist her powers but I dont think that level of FS will ever be the case for Luffy.

Yes, Perona's powers are broken that's why they are on an irrelevant side character who was paired with the only natural counter for her powers and with a Shichibukai who has even more hax powers than she has.
If Robin grabs Sanji, what can he do, HM aside?
Unfortunately, the sword isn’t normal and Zoro will always have to restrain it else it shrivel his hands. Yea, it’s common sense as you said, not very hard to grasp.
Yes, yes he has to restrain it, he literally did it on the first try when he saw what the sword does. Every use after that had 0 haki leaks which makes it into regular blade.
So now you think Zoro’s words can be true, but the only give away is that nothing has changed?! Lol, sweet. Can you even hear yourself? So it can be true it made him stronger, but then he’s still the-same at the same time? I didn’t expect to read such nonsense. Thought after several hours of thinking you’d come up with something good.

Zoro who uses haki said enma will make him strong. What actual proof do you have to prove that Zoro is wrong? Do you have any guage that shows his strength (haki) before and after he got enma? Exactly, you don't have, and you haven't shown any thing that contradicts Zoro's words.
When you do find that proof, please do well to share it with the rest of us. Until then, stop quoting me with more of your mental gymnastics nonsense.
As I said, they can be true and nothing has changed if it is a step towards the black blade so until the black blade pops up, Enma didnt change Zoro at all.
It seems a hard concept to grasp for you.

What proof do I have? Nothing except that Zoro is doing things the same way he was doing them before. What proof do you have that anything changed?
What gauge are you using to prove that Zoro's words are true the way you think it is? Exactly, nothing. I am not the one who needs to show proof.
Point a finger at what is different about Zoro. What can he do that he couldnt before Enma. I'll wait until you come up with more headcanon.
 

kcd

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What proof do you have that anything changed?
What gauge are you using to prove that Zoro's words are true the way you think it is? Exactly, nothing. I am not the one who needs to show proof.
Point a finger at what is different about Zoro. What can he do that he couldnt before Enma. I'll wait until you come up with more headcanon.
What I have is his words and the fact he's a haki user. He knows what haki is and understands it better than you and I. He's the one that held and saw what Enma is capable of, and he's the one that declared he will be stronger.
What do you have going on for you? Nothing except mental gymnastics.
I'll wait until you come up with more headcanon.
You can have the last words after this if you want, but those are Zoro's words, not mine. So apparently, you are arguing with a character in the manga. I can't function at this level. Adiós.
 

nik87

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What I have is his words and the fact he's a haki user.
So nothing? I thought so. His words are not proof that his words are true in the way you think of power-up.
you are arguing with a character in the manga.
Yes, Beast Pirates numbers have been reduced. Do not dare to argue with a character in the manga.
 

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1. Luffy/Zoro
2. Sanji (with the power-ups that I expect him to already have, that haven't been shown yet)
3. Jinbei
4. Franky
5. Robin
6. Brook
7. Nami
8. Usopp
9. Chopper
 

kcd

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1. Luffy/Zoro
2. Sanji (with the power-ups that I expect him to already have, that haven't been shown yet)
3. Jinbei
4. Franky
5. Robin
6. Brook
7. Nami
8. Usopp
9. Chopper
Last time I checked, vivre card states otherwise. Zoro is clearly the second strongest after his captain, unless he has been pushed down by Jimbei.
 

McNuss

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Okay, you wanna bet this? If Sanji has better PL feats than Robin this arc, you will wear a Sanji avatar for a month.

If you win, I'll wear any avatar of your choosing for a year.

There's no way Sanji will drop below 3rd/4th, he's a primary and essential fighter.
Actually Sanji should have been weaker then Robin up till the Diable Jambe power-up.

There is absolutely no reason to believe that this version of Sanji could have one-shot Pell, which is what Robin did. Pell should absolutely be stronger than most of Sanji's previous foes (the East Blue ones) and comparable to the rest (which is basically just Mr. 2), and Sanji didn't one-shot any of them.

Robin also just outclassed Sanji in the following Skypea Arc, where she kicks ass and Sanji doesn't.

I don't really want to engage in this discussion here, I think we have this discussion ongoing for a very long time now and it never changes. But I think the static "trio" concept is just wrong.

Robin being stronger than Sanji is also quite important for the setup of of the Water 7 arc. The entire mystery plot with her going rogue, wouldn't have worked. Kuzan's dialogue raising the suspicion about her would have fallen off had she not been a powerhouse (by the standards of that time) on her own.

It is not without reason that she is the only Strawhat not to get a power-up during Enies Lobby. With the Water 7 plot and her backstory resolved, Oda is essentially fixing the hierarchy up by also significantly promoting Sanji throughout the entire Water 7 Saga and a total of three full fights (Jerry, Wanze, Jabra).

However imho Oda then goes on to make it pretty clear how large the difference between Zoro and Sanji is via Zoro's insane feat against Kuma during Thriller Bark, something so absurd that it should have been clear for every reader that Sanji could have never pulled this off.

I consider myself not biased towards any character, if anything I would consider myself a Luffy fan as that is how the story works.

So for me the rankings of the Strawhat Pirates up to Jinbe joining are:


Up till the end of Alabasta:

1. Luffy
2. Zoro

The gap between Luffy and Zoro is rather large at the beginning of the series, but Zoro catches up with new swords and an ever increasing amount of blood loss tolerance (as featured in the Red Databook). By the time of Whiskey Peak I would consider them to be almost equal and this does not change much

3. Sanji

The gap between Zoro and Sanji is significant from the start. Sanji beats Arlong's strongest officer underwater yet Arlong has only eyes for Zoro, who is already a bleeding wreck at that time. Bentham just can't compare to Daz Bones, the Alabasta fights clearly place Zoro ahead of Sanji and the recent Vivre Card databook's Baroque Works bounties reinforces just how far, with Bones being worth twice as much as Bentham, and on par with the Zero pair's bounties.

4. Chopper

Chopper at that time is significantly stronger then Usopp and Nami but honestly the gap to Sanji is not that large, both are physical fighters with a quite comparable amount of physical strenght. That is not to downplay Sanji but rather it is Chopper that gets a lot of fighting action early on.

5. Usopp
6. Nami

It should be worth mentioning that the cyclone attack makes Nami a temporary #3 as it is actually quite radical and stronger then anything that Sanji has at that time, but it was a one-time use only and didn't seem to have been repaired by the time of the then following Skypea Arc so it is not that important.

7. Vivi

Yeah just to be accurate


From Skypea till the start of Water 7

1. Luffy
2. Zoro

Luffy, Zoro and Viper are portrayed as somewhat comparable during Skypea Arc.

3. Robin

I explained above why I think that way. The gap between Robin and Luffy/Zoro is not as large as Sanji's gap is to them.

4. Sanji

The gap to Robin is significant. Not hurting women aside, Sanji really does not have feats on par with Robin at that time. The Devil Fruit is a huge factor here, as Devil Fruits provide significant power at that time, much more than later on where alternative powers get introduced to compete with them.

5. Chopper

After Skypea, Chopper starters falling off, seemingly lacking the confidence to keep up. Understandable considering his young age.

6. Usopp
7. Nami

Not much development from those two.

Water 7 till start of timeskip:

1. Luffy

With the Gear techniques Luffy pulls ahead of Zoro, as they are just a straight forward upgrade in terms of speed and power.

2. Zoro

Out of all the power-ups presented, Asura seems like straight up the weakest, it is not even clear what it actually does. Due to that the difference between him and Luffy increases.

3. Sanji

Sanji gets a massive power-up here, even bigger then Luffy's. This puts him well above Robin. However as I said earlier, Thriller Bark puts Zoro far ahead of Sanji.

4. Chopper (Monster Point)

Unable to keep up, Chopper had to resort to this during the Enies Lobby raid. Very strong, but because we have similar characters to this (Minotaurus etc.), I can safely place him below Sanji.

5. Franky/Robin

Franky gets introduced as very strong, winning his fights confidently. It's actually very hard to compare him and Robin because this is the time where Robin essentially loses her role as a fighter, being the only one who doesn't power-up during Enies Lobby. By the time of Thriller Bark she is kind of support only.

6. Brook

Brook is kinda weak before the timeskip. Somehow just too frail, he doesn't achieve much. The gap between him and Franky/Robin is huge but the gap between him and Nami is not.

7. Nami

The Enies Lobby climate tact is a significant power-up, finally defining her fighting style. The gap between her and those below is huge. Nami defeated her CP9 opponent with moderate difficulty, whereas neither Usopp and Chopper couldn't do so, at least not without serious sacrifice (Chopper).

8. Chopper

At this point in time Chopper stops keeping up and has to resort to Monster Point. I think Thriller Bark is the first arc where Chopper starts strongly identifying with Usopp and Nami.

9. Usopp

Just can't pull it together. Despite a power-up, he doesn't defeat anyone during Enies Lobby and even becomes a burden to Zoro. Lacks so much confidence that only he could defeat Perona ;)
 
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Brandish μ

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There is absolutely no reason to believe that this version of Sanji could have one-shot Pell, which is what Robin did. Pell should absolutely be stronger than most of Sanji's previous foes (the East Blue ones) and comparable to the rest (which is basically just Mr. 2), and Sanji didn't one-shot any of them.
I meant this current arc, Sanji will have better feats.

Sanji can oneshot a Pacifista now, in comparison to Pell (A pacifista Robin helped in defeating, iirc, I can remember her doing something substantial against it)
 

thedude

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Robin was never stronger than Sanji. Robin's power allowed her to beat characters easily because they had no defense against it, including Zoro. One clutch and she could debilitate a character.

The static trio is basically manga canon. Even as recently as Dressrosa, Sanji acts as the defacto leader of the crew going to Zou. The "Swirly Brow crew", and Luffy trusts him to attack Big Mom's ship, and when the rest of the SH's arrive and see the devestation, it's Zoro who says "Swirly brow wouldn't let anything happen to them".

Robin's power is great, and I wish Oda wrote fights for her and every SH. But she was never actually stronger than Sanji or Zoro. Just had a better fruit that would make her beat them early on (both of them, not just Sanji).
 

albertwv

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Straw Hat Power Ranking:
Luffy
Jimbei
Zolo
Sanji
Franky
Robin
Brook
Chopper
Usopp
Nami (without Zeus)

Honestly it is kinda hard to rank Robin and Below because they shows feats that can outclass some characters/villains. For example, Robin seems pretty powerful because of her DF but Chopper and Brook may be able to handle her physically. An attack from Monster Point or a slash from Brook may take damage her badly. I still believe Robin is stronger tho.
Now Brook vs Chopper... Brook seems to be a little stronger and faster since he cut down Zeus really quick. But maybe a couple hits from Monster Point and Chopper would win, but thats if he lands an attack on Brook
I still see Chopper as the strongest of the Weak Trio. Usopp may have CoO but unless he fights Chopper from a really far distance he wont win.
Finally Nami... So she is 50/50 weak/strong. With Zeus she can deal plenty of damage maybe even defeat Franky, but her regular fighting skills dont put her above Chopper. It's hard to gauge her vs Usopp, but I want to give the benefit of the doubt to Usopp. I think Nami can knock him out with one right hit but Usopp was able to give Base Luffy a small hard time in Water 7, when everyone thought he was going to lose right away so yeah.

Keep in mind Robin and below characters are nearly equal in strength from the person on top. Also Jimbei is obviously stronger than Zolo and Sanji but Im certain Zolo will pass Jimbei after Wano and Sanji might be equal to him.

I do hope to see more 1v1 fights from ALL the Straw Hats like Enies Lobby.

One more thing THANK GOD we finally got past the Zolo arguments! Please ignore Nik do not respond to him.
 

M3J

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Why are we only talking about Zoro? It's getting boring imo.

I am rereading one piece again and for me it's more than clear that Zoro > Sanji. I love Sanji, but Zoro is stronger. This is a fact like it is also a matter of fact that Luffy > Zorro.

How would you rate the SH crew? I think it is difficult, since they are having different strength and weaknesses.

However, I will give it a try:

1. Luffy (clearly the strongest)
2. Jinbei
3. Zoro (maybe he will be second after Wano)
4. Sanji (can be third in the future)
5. Frankie
6. Brook
7. Robin (5 - 7 are close imo)
8. Lysop
9. Nami (because of Zeus)
10. Chopper (he was strong before time skip, but now he is only a sweet mascot unfortunately...)

Carrot would be mid tier, if she joins.
1. Luffy
2. Jinbei
3. Zoro
4. Sanji
5. Franky?
6. Robin?
7. Brook?
8. Chopper
9. Usopp
10. Nami

Okay, you wanna bet this? If Sanji has better PL feats than Robin this arc, you will wear a Sanji avatar for a month.

If you win, I'll wear any avatar of your choosing for a year.

There's no way Sanji will drop below 3rd/4th, he's a primary and essential fighter.
pls I beg, stop entertaining his posts, I don't want to scroll past more silly debates on Zoro or Sanji. It's gotten way too repetitive and for the most part, stupid.
 
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